Non-PvP Monster Play in Helm's Deep?

I know, there won't be any new PvMP content in the expansion or likely ever. I get it, PvP isn't popular.

Still, I can't be the only one that thinks it is a mistake to not include any sort of Monster Play in one of the most famous, exciting, downright epic moments in the books and films.

I definitely am not the only one that would want to experience the Battle of the Hornburg from both sides. Assaulting the Deeping Wall would be just as much fun as defending it, even if it's against NPCs. In fact, a MPvE version would be a boon for the game in several ways:

1) It would encourage many people to try out Monsters that otherwise wouldn't have, potentially increasing the number of people that play them overall.

2) It would allow people that would enjoy playing Monsters but don't enjoy PvP at all to get their chance to play them.

3) It would help flesh out the battle overall, making it feel more like the moment it is meant to be.

Likely too late to add any sort of Monster content, but Ido think Turbine is missing a massive opportunity here. An MPvE part of the Battle of the Hornburg would be a fantastic way to make everyone happy--both current Monster players and those of us who would like to play an Orc or Uruk, but don't want to PvP.

I find this a nice idea, although I don't expect to see it (i.e. I don't think it was designed in advance to be part of HD, and now it's probably too late).

One of the few things I enjoyed in the new zone is playing with Narzum. And that last moment when the session is over but you log still with Narzum on the landscape... among few other players in front of the ents... priceless :) Once even a kinnie was there at that moment. Although this is probably a bug. Now the bugs in the game can give you more fun...
I also liked the few creep sessions through the Epic (play as Angmarim, etc.). I agree that for those who want to see things from the opposite perspective, but are not keen on PvP, such possibilities are quite nice and there should be more of them.

It's an interesting idea, though given the composition of forces involved, I'm not sure that a general creep vs. Rohirrim instance would really work. The thought does open up other possibilities as well as a problem or two...

One possible thing that could be done would be creep session play. I'm not sure how that would sit with people that play creeps generally, but it would be something new--or nearly so.

If my hypothesis about how the Battle of the Hornburg is going to be done, it ought to be possible to do a creep version of it.

The real problem is...Saruman's forces are going to lose, no matter how skilled, clever, or lucky the creep players are. The NPC attackers don't know that, but players running Team Saruman characters will. I'm not sure how many people that play creeps would be very happy with a known to be doomed effort.

No monsterplay in the Hornburg. Sorry.

Besides, you do know what happens to all the Orcs right? Not sure I'd want to play something that is 100% assured of getting squashed by an Ent.

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Originally Posted by Sapience

No monsterplay in the Hornburg. Sorry.

Besides, you do know what happens to all the Orcs right? Not sure I'd want to play something that is 100% assured of getting squashed by an Ent.

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Actually, now that you mention it, Id liken it to the "we cannot get out" instance. One last fighting stand of the Uruks! Or, more like last sprint for the hills lol.

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Originally Posted by Sapience

No monsterplay in the Hornburg. Sorry.

Besides, you do know what happens to all the Orcs right? Not sure I'd want to play something that is 100% assured of getting squashed by an Ent.

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You say that, but we still log into the moors even when that's pretty much our fate on the live server as is ;p

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Originally Posted by Sezneg

You say that, but we still log into the moors even when that's pretty much our fate on the live server as is ;p

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I was wondering if any of you had read ahead and figured out you lose in the end. :)

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Originally Posted by Sapience

I was wondering if any of you had read ahead and figured out you lose in the end. :)

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We're taking as many with us as we possibly can.

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Originally Posted by Sapience

I was wondering if any of you had read ahead and figured out you lose in the end. :)

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Well we at least know the descendants of Ungoliant live on.

They're living behind my radiator. >_>

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Originally Posted by Sapience

I was wondering if any of you had read ahead and figured out you lose in the end. :)

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In the end, sure. But every day up untill then? Can we at least give freeps a challenge? The heros don't seem very heroic when they can faceroll, yawn, and win.

I thought this was supposed to be a struggle? lol

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Originally Posted by Sezneg

You say that, but we still log into the moors even when that's pretty much our fate on the live server as is ;p

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Playing the victim as a godmode Weaver?

L0L

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Originally Posted by Nyrion

Well we at least know the descendants of Ungoliant live on.

They're living behind my radiator. >_>

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Heh... You should see the tarantulas that live in New Mexico.

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Originally Posted by PoeticNightmare

Actually, now that you mention it, Id liken it to the "we cannot get out" instance. One last fighting stand of the Uruks! Or, more like last sprint for the hills lol.

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Yes, that instance was wonderful because it broke the triviality of 'must always win'. If I remember well, the 'Angmarim soldier' session also ended with his inevitable death. He was actually ordered to stay and die there. Compared to the general build of all other quests in the game, this gave me a nice surprise and chill.
So, it's not like such situations never occurred.

I'll take it as there is no technical possibility for such a thing to be introduced in HD at this point, but this is definitely something to be considered for the future. A nice story doesn't always need a happy ending.

I do believe Pvmp in Lotro is in a cryo-chamber state waiting to be revamped and revitalized at some future date that may be part of the next great LoTR development under the direction of WB?

"Shadow of Mordor"

Welden

Oh, come on, we all have wanted to play whack-a-mole with hobbits. I want to play hide and seek with elves, jousting with the rohirrim, or even a drunken brawl with dwarves. Different zones for monsters with rewards would make it way more enjoyable. I just feel like the moors are a bit of a cage, and the scenery gets boring and less challenging.

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Originally Posted by PoeticNightmare

Actually, now that you mention it, Id liken it to the "we cannot get out" instance. One last fighting stand of the Uruks! Or, more like last sprint for the hills lol.

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They could title it "We cannot get up!".

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Originally Posted by Danchir

Yes, that instance was wonderful because it broke the triviality of 'must always win'. If I remember well, the 'Angmarim soldier' session also ended with his inevitable death. He was actually ordered to stay and die there. Compared to the general build of all other quests in the game, this gave me a nice surprise and chill.
So, it's not like such situations never occurred.

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Except that, as you go through the Epic Quests, when you get to that one, you've already done the other side, both killing the gatekeeper troll, and slaughtering all the orcs and Angmarim then rescuing Laerdan (the Elf who couldn't think straight). So when you do that one, the end really isn't a surprise.

You don't need to stare in the detail so much. Besides, any similar action in HD could also be organized in such manner (do both sides).

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Originally Posted by Sapience

I was wondering if any of you had read ahead and figured out you lose in the end. :)

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Wait a second ... You mean ... Sauron doesn't win ?

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Originally Posted by Zombielord

Wait a second ... You mean ... Sauron doesn't win ?

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Should have put a Spoiler Alert tag on my post, huh? Sorry.

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Originally Posted by PureWorgNakh

Playing the victim as a godmode Paper?

L0L
-Rock

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fixed for ya

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Originally Posted by Sapience

No monsterplay in the Hornburg. Sorry.

Besides, you do know what happens to all the Orcs right? Not sure I'd want to play something that is 100% assured of getting squashed by an Ent.

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Been there. Done that.

Had just hit 85, starting to help rebuild Hytbolt. Enter instance to kill orcs and collect pond scum. See Ent, See Ent has 1,000,000 Morale. See Ent is targeted on me. Turn to run. SPLAT!

Sadly that wasn't my first defeat in the new RoR area. That came from my War-steed. Forgot it drove different from a normal steed and went over a cliff screaming like Yosemite Sam. "Whoa mule! Whoa!" SPLAT! "War-steeds is sooo stupid!"

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Originally Posted by Sapience

No monsterplay in the Hornburg. Sorry.

Besides, you do know what happens to all the Orcs right? Not sure I'd want to play something that is 100% assured of getting squashed by an Ent.

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Sure the Orcs lose in the end, but that isn't the point. People still re-enact the Alamo, the US Civil War, etc; it's not about the end result, it's about the fight. Until the last minute, its the Free Peoples that are being overrun. Throughout the books, film and game the Freeps are just barely hanging on by a thread, only to turn things around at the last minute. I for one think it would be fun to do things the other way around--since we know the outcome, the defeat wouldn't be a disappointment.

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Originally Posted by Jetfan007

Still, I can't be the only one that thinks it is a mistake to not include any sort of Monster Play in one of the most famous, exciting, downright epic moments in the books and films.

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Why would they spend resources for PVE play for PVMP creeps?

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Originally Posted by Deyjarl

Why would they spend resources for PVE play for PVMP creeps?

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the op is saying developing PVE content for creeps though...that would be using PVE resources for PVE