World Chat Negativity

Prefacing this by saying I have quite a few characters on regular server as well as one of the LS now, and I do not engage in World Chat on either of them. But I do watch it since I leave it open for instance calls and such.

I - was – enjoying playing on the LS quite a bit until about two weeks ago, when I noticed a repeated pattern in World chat that literally happens every.single.day: the same people come on and gripe about the server population being too low and that no one runs anything. These same people spend inordinate amounts of chat time also trash taking other players, particularly anyone who says there are plenty of people playing or anyone who asks them why don’t they just go back to the regular servers if they are unhappy. They seem to consider themselves elite players, though I fail to grasp how “elite” they actually are since they seem to be anon.

I confess I have long considered World chat in most games to usually be a cesspool discussion, and it seems that yet again there are people who have made it that way on the LS, which is too bad. Had hoped for a little friendlier vibe there. I don’t know about their game skills and killing mobs, but these folks definitely know how to kill a good mood.

I have noticed this picking up a bit on Laurelin too. Until recently I have found the chat to be very friendly, and most people are very nice. The couple of players people call “trolls”, I have viewed more as “jokers” as their comments haven’t been offensive. However recently I have noticed a couple of individuals cropping up in WC and actually being quite mean to people and rude. I actually put someone in my ignore list for the first time ever last week because they started making nasty comments about someone’s wife (who presumably they don’t even know), which is just wrong. All this poor guy did was ask a question about the AoV, I think, and instead of help he got abuse. I mean, I’m ready for trash talk about the game to some extent, but why get personal? You’re right, it spoils the mood.

Dang, that's in the legendary servers now? That's sad.

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Originally Posted by TheArtilleryman

I have noticed this picking up a bit on Laurelin too. Until recently I have found the chat to be very friendly, and most people are very nice. The couple of players people call “trolls”, I have viewed more as “jokers” as their comments haven’t been offensive. However recently I have noticed a couple of individuals cropping up in WC and actually being quite mean to people and rude. I actually put someone in my ignore list for the first time ever last week because they started making nasty comments about someone’s wife (who presumably they don’t even know), which is just wrong. All this poor guy did was ask a question about the AoV, I think, and instead of help he got abuse. I mean, I’m ready for trash talk about the game to some extent, but why get personal? You’re right, it spoils the mood.

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It really does, so for the time being I have closed the tab.

Sorry to hear about your experience on Laurelin with this. My regulars are on Gladden and I have honestly rarely seen this level of individual there. The server tends to be pretty helpful and friendly. Trolls here and there always pop up but this is a different tone, especially when you consider that it's a legendary server. The people there value the game to the extent they are willing to entirely re-roll everything and enjoy the ride from scratch, supposedly among a little more like minded people. Have seen only a few really friendly kins there so far. I suspect that is because they are staying out of the chat and using Discord or something similar. Will plan to do the same.

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Originally Posted by Prialyss

They seem to consider themselves elite players, though I fail to grasp how “elite” they actually are since they seem to be anon.

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None of my characters are anon


k-thanks,

bye

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Originally Posted by DavidmeetHal

Dang, that's in the legendary servers now? That's sad.

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It's all of maybe 6 or 7 people, but they've really poisoned Anor. And most of those came as a kin from a live server and immediately started trashing players. They had been practicing 65 and 75 content on live for a while, and they finally had their chance to be "elite" when LS were launched.

Same on the server where I play. Most of the time chat is fine and people are generally helpful. Then there are 2 or 3 "players" who show up in chat with the single-minded purpose to disrupt and get everyone talking about them or arguing. Every so often they will vanish for a stretch and there is speculation that temporary suspensions have happened, but it could also be they just took a break from the troll life or maybe have other games to troll, too.

I do report the behavior when it gets obviously toxic, but they don't care and even encourage the reporting. One claims to be reporting everyone back for harassment even though all the comments start with the trolling in the first place. Another goes on and on about how the game is trash and everyone in chat is weak-minded.

The common theme here seems to be that world chat disruptions often happen because of a small number of individuals (maybe even one with multiple accounts sometimes played simultaneously) who have that as their end goal. That is their game, not LOTRO. I know many will say that "ignore" exists for exactly this reason and, to some extent, that is true. the problem with ignoring the trolls is that they then only have the new players to target. Players who don't know to have them on ignore yet and who, without more experienced players seeing the chat to counter the trolling, can be negatively influenced or driven away altogether.

I have not yet come up with a solution for any of this. Even if SSG were to permanently ban these accounts, I'm sure they'd be back with more. As I said, that is the point for them. They don't care about the game itself, just what trouble they can cause in chat.

It's an online game.. If people harass report and they will get banned. If players say the servers are dying and the game is trash those two are related. Anor and ithil are almost dead I would say. Ofc people will react when they only see 100 players online. Both Anor and Ithil had queues at launch, and people left because yeah the content was pretty much trash. Mostly because SSG didn't care to do any balancing and work on itemization. That's how it goes:)

Population seems rather low on all servers. Even hard to get groups going for new instances on the most populated one, Evernight.

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Originally Posted by Paytowin

It's all of maybe 6 or 7 people, but they've really poisoned Anor. And most of those came as a kin from a live server and immediately started trashing players. They had been practicing 65 and 75 content on live for a while, and they finally had their chance to be "elite" when LS were launched.

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Yeah, I spent a whole hour and a half facerolling OD t2c 6 man for 65 content on a server I didnt even know was gonna exist!


But real talk, they need to merge the LS, the servers have populations of 100. I'm aware Minas Morgul just dropped, but what was the excuse during 65 cap when the servers were sitting at 150 players a day? Thats not a healthy community. Mostly the trolling just comes from being bored with little to know talk in World chat. Literally, I can play for an hour and sit at the same tab with little to no chat going by.

We have an update and many raider or storyplayer have a look on it on the common server.

atm is look like farming the instances in different tiers for the actual ash.
The German Raid Community lacks on players while the players, that still have to farm on the common server are mostly bound with the many dailies per char.

Crying loader and loader in each thread becomes very annoying. The very small Ithil community had explained ever and ever again, why they prefer to stay on a less populated server - respect their choice !!!
We had a very long time the option to switch the server and they do not take it, with reasons.

You set up a cry for PvMP on an other Thread too, and i grant you to play in this area in addition. But with what goal?
Rankfarming, Flaming, ..... e.g.?
Some PvMP Player raid some different servers. They rush arkenstone, that had the reputation to be an active PvMP Server. And now its becomes more inactive. That is what i heard, by the rushers.


I see the Chats also, but we have Thorii* on Belegaer _in_ the Boarfountain and you can laugh with or about him. Is a game and a part of the fun.
What does someone that logs on OUR server and ask how bad something is? Let him..... he does not play with us and looks not have any own goals except to bring bad mood to us.
(* hope you are well, and if i come back. hope i can see you with a smile at the common place - do not pee in it !!!)

When i play with mates and we start the easier raids, we have seldom problems fill up fast.


I am very Thankful with all of you, if we have only 100 Players online and we finish Orthanc and start with the rest of the Raid, that do not want to rush in bed some BG Run, or Thorog that you with me :-)
In the Sum i then played the whole night with around 50% of the inhabits of Anor.
Thank you all, that you hear the call to arms and joining the Train.


If you want to get players to play with you, then start something in that are many interested.
I read so often the Kin advertising that nice people want to get nice people to play with, and of course offer an island with this and that on it.
Why do i not see advertising for Instances that are carried by a Kinship?


btw we have Christmas in Germany (Think word wide) it is very strong bound with Christmas market and Christmas party (Sportclub (each), Company, Friends,...) and in addtion we have the 4 Advents, where the families often meet up.
A very nice time for friends, family but a very bad time to set up raids :-)


It is OUR Server. We have to option to lead it to be a place we like.

(cu on Anor in 10min)

What, do snowflakes and ignore filters not mix?

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Originally Posted by Seglord

What, do snowflakes and ignore filters not mix?

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The word “snowflake” in an internet context is just like the word “snitch” - it is only used by people who want to deliberately upset or cause harm to others to make the victim feel bad for speaking out. You get bullied, or a crime committed against you and you report it, you get called a snitch. You complain about people trolling, or about something said or done that is inappropriate, you get called a snowflake. But ONLY by the trolls, because they want to perpetuate that negative experience.

Just grow up and let everyone else get on with enjoying the game without offending each other. Seriously, what’s the point?

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Originally Posted by TheArtilleryman

The word “snowflake” in an internet context is just like the word “snitch” - it is only used by people who want to deliberately upset or cause harm to others to make the victim feel bad for speaking out. You get bullied, or a crime committed against you and you report it, you get called a snitch. You complain about people trolling, or about something said or done that is inappropriate, you get called a snowflake. But ONLY by the trolls, because they want to perpetuate that negative experience.

Just grow up and let everyone else get on with enjoying the game without offending each other. Seriously, what’s the point?

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A whole page of complaints over 6 people who talk stuff you all don't want to hear, so instead of putting 6 people on ignore, and being done with it, You all think your special and unique, hence snowflakes. who apparently would rather complain than fix your problem.
A whole page of complaints, and I offer the only solution. and am told to grow up. okay Snowflake.

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Originally Posted by TheArtilleryman

The word “snowflake” in an internet context is just like the word “snitch” - it is only used by people who want to deliberately upset or cause harm to others to make the victim feel bad for speaking out. You get bullied, or a crime committed against you and you report it, you get called a snitch. You complain about people trolling, or about something said or done that is inappropriate, you get called a snowflake. But ONLY by the trolls, because they want to perpetuate that negative experience.

Just grow up and let everyone else get on with enjoying the game without offending each other. Seriously, what’s the point?

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They put people down because it makes them feel bigger. Kill them with kindness, it drives them crazy, lol.

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Originally Posted by Starliteyes

They put people down because it makes them feel bigger. Kill them with kindness, it drives them crazy, lol.

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Can you provide some examples how to do this kindness killing thing? ;)

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Originally Posted by Seglord

A whole page of complaints over 6 people who talk stuff you all don't want to hear, so instead of putting 6 people on ignore, and being done with it, You all think your special and unique, hence snowflakes. who apparently would rather complain than fix your problem.
A whole page of complaints, and I offer the only solution. and am told to grow up. okay Snowflake.

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And there it is. Just the kind of thing we’re talking about. I knew it wouldn’t be long before someone came out of the woodwork.

The solution should not simply be to ignore, the solution is for people who behave in an offensive manner to stop. Ignore only works on a per character basis. So if you have ten characters, and several people who are a problem, who also have multiple alts, you are quickly looking at dozens of individual characters to keep track of having to ignore, or even more than that. Not great, when you could otherwise just get on and enjoy the game. Sure, you could filter out world chat altogether, but then that alienates you from the social experience of interacting with the 95% of players who are friendly and responsible, and that isn’t right. It is inevitably the victims of trolling that become excluded that way, and the trolls, unfairly, just get to keep doing what they’re doing, just like bullies in a playground. There is no justice in that.

The people you call “snowflakes” are not unique. Far from it, they are significant chunk of the population and rather than melting into the background (see what I did there) they are actually having the guts to stand up and say what they think. I commend the OP for bringing this up, because the low toxicity of LOTRO has been a great selling point for the game in the past and it would be a real shame to see it degenerate to the level of other games. Why should people who don’t want to be called names, have their wives insulted or other similar comments be labelled snowflakes for standing up to it? None of these trolls would dare to insult someone’s wife face to face - the only reason they do it online is because they know the other person isn’t going to leap out of the screen and punch them. This is the issue with the internet - people forget how to behave in civilisation. It’s bad enough on social media, but it is even worse when they know nobody can tell who they really are.

Yes, I am telling you to grow up because you are behaving like a child, as is anyone who thinks it is funny to troll someone for their own enjoyment. Go do it somewhere else.

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Originally Posted by Echoweaver

Once I gave myself permission to ignore folks who pissed me off, I discovered I could really enjoy the community! Even if each troll has 25 accounts, it doesn't take that much time to ignore.

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Bingo, someone who gets it. it is the only solution to the problem that you all spent time bellyaching about . I mean if the point of this thread was to sit around and have a pity party, then Iv'e overstepped, as it was mean't to be a Winter wonderland.
I am offended by all the Russian alphabet scrolling across the screen, worse then Caps lock. It really didn't take long to black them out. and that's saying a lot on Arkenstonestan.
Sorry to the guy whos spirit got broken, really wasn't my intention. but that's what happens when you enter the fray without logic. people suck = ignore button. simple, out.

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Originally Posted by Seglord

Bingo, someone who gets it. it is the only solution to the problem that you all spent time bellyaching about . I mean if the point of this thread was to sit around and have a pity party, then Iv'e overstepped, as it was mean't to be a Winter wonderland.
I am offended by all the Russian alphabet scrolling across the screen, worse then Caps lock. It really didn't take long to black them out. and that's saying a lot on Arkenstonestan.
Sorry to the guy whos spirit got broken, really wasn't my intention. but that's what happens when you enter the fray without logic. people suck = ignore button. simple, out.

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Ignore is fine for someone who has been playing the game for a while and can just continue on. My concern is for the new players. People who come in and see your brand of "free speech" spammed in world chat. Because those who are there with the intent to disrupt and cause problems tend to also try to dominate chat, talking much more than anyone actually trying to play the game. Two or three people can make it seem like all of chat is toxic even when that is far from the case, as is evidenced when those people are not present.

So ignore is a great tool. It is not, however, a solution.

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Originally Posted by Thornglen

...My concern is for the new players. ...

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I don't think spammy or toxic world chat pushes people away. When I first joined lotro, world chat was so spammy... "loL dudz ned hep n Forenosst" "bye mye awktions plz" etc. really took me out of the world/game. Within 5 minutes I silenced world chat and never have enabled it again for any of my characters.

Especially on Anor and Ithil the players are going to know the real community already. Really a waste of time for the trolls to even try. /shrug

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Originally Posted by Echoweaver

Yeah, and they're clearly enjoying it. There's no point in replying. It really is feeding the trolls. Code words like "snowflake" are signals to ignore.

Toxic gamer culture is legendary. LOTRO is better than a lot. I don't talk much in World chat, though I've been monitoring it more recently. I participated in my first PUG recently, and while it's not my favorite way to group, I learn a lot, and I don't know enough people at my level to do the amount of grouping I want. I've found that ignore lists are really the only way to function here on the forum or in world chat.

Once I gave myself permission to ignore folks who pissed me off, I discovered I could really enjoy the community! Even if each troll has 25 accounts, it doesn't take that much time to ignore.

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I find this approach very counterproductive. Why would I seclude myself in a public space? I also found when someone who is tagged as a troll if engaged in a sensible manner can and are often decent people. I've tested this out 100s if not 1,000s of times and all but very rare cases have found the vast majority of those encounters productive to bare fruit which last far longer than many average types of contact. Isn't odd that those who demand tolerance in society are the most prone to set limits of tolerance?

I choose to empower myself not to deny myself of a potential friend in a game or in my real life.

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Originally Posted by sapienze

... Isn't odd that those who demand tolerance in society are the most prone to set limits of tolerance?

I choose to empower myself not to deny myself of a potential friend in a game or in my real life.

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I applaud you for seeking out the good among the bad. But your comment about tolerance is pretty intolerant- it seems you also seek out the bad in the good. Maybe it's not surprising you're able to make friends with trolls...

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Originally Posted by Thornglen

So ignore is a great tool. It is not, however, a solution.

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Its funny you want a solution to people like me who troll a little bit and have some fun messing with the community. You can simply add my toons to ignore, but banning myself and some other players (who are spending money on the game) is just ridiculous. First off, there's nothing in the CoC ever broken in the 'toxic' chat that occurs. Its mostly simple discussion most of the time that gets a little heated/trolly. Its very simple to piss people of on Anor, in fact, just pugging a run can do it occasionally.


Now if you want a solution that isnt banning, then what would it be? Muting me?

As a kin recruiter and someone who either joins pugs or leads pugs daily, that would be incredibly unfair. Lotro does have free speech, so why can't I use it?

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Originally Posted by Rimenuir

Its funny you want a solution to people like me who troll a little bit and have some fun messing with the community. You can simply add my toons to ignore, but banning myself and some other players (who are spending money on the game) is just ridiculous. First off, there's nothing in the CoC ever broken in the 'toxic' chat that occurs. Its mostly simple discussion most of the time that gets a little heated/trolly. Its very simple to piss people of on Anor, in fact, just pugging a run can do it occasionally.


Now if you want a solution that isnt banning, then what would it be? Muting me?

As a kin recruiter and someone who either joins pugs or leads pugs daily, that would be incredibly unfair. Lotro does have free speech, so why can't I use it?

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https://www.lotro.com/en/content/lor...e-code-conduct
"28. You may not restrict or inhibit any other user from using and enjoying the Game or related services. For example, disrupting the flow of chat in chat rooms with vulgar language, abusiveness, hitting the return key repeatedly, inputting excessively large images so the screen goes by too fast to read, use of excessive SHOUTING (all caps) in an attempt to disturb other users, “spamming,” or “scrolling” (continuous posting repetitive text), are prohibited."

And no, I don't want you banned from the game. If you actually have fun playing rather then just trolling chat, I would not take that away from you for this. But I would maybe institute a mute from global channels, penalties starting with a day and working up from there with repeat offences.

"Free speech" does not now and has never meant you have the right to say whatever you want wherever you want with zero consequences.

You yourself admit it is intentional trolling and messing with the community. That is not part of the game.

Now, I don't know you or what kind of trolling you get up to. It may not rise to the levels I have seen in chat. Because some of the people I have seen have no interest in playing LOTRO at all. Chat trolling is their game, period. that is how they have fun and that seems to be their only goal. Taking that out of world chat is, in my opinion, no loss and a big gain.

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Originally Posted by Thornglen

https://www.lotro.com/en/content/lor...e-code-conduct
"28. You may not restrict or inhibit any other user from using and enjoying the Game or related services. For example, disrupting the flow of chat in chat rooms with vulgar language, abusiveness, hitting the return key repeatedly, inputting excessively large images so the screen goes by too fast to read, use of excessive SHOUTING (all caps) in an attempt to disturb other users, “spamming,” or “scrolling” (continuous posting repetitive text), are prohibited."

And no, I don't want you banned from the game. If you actually have fun playing rather then just trolling chat, I would not take that away from you for this. But I would maybe institute a mute from global channels, penalties starting with a day and working up from there with repeat offences.

"Free speech" does not now and has never meant you have the right to say whatever you want wherever you want with zero consequences.

You yourself admit it is intentional trolling and messing with the community. That is not part of the game.

Now, I don't know you or what kind of trolling you get up to. It may not rise to the levels I have seen in chat. Because some of the people I have seen have no interest in playing LOTRO at all. Chat trolling is their game, period. that is how they have fun and that seems to be their only goal. Taking that out of world chat is, in my opinion, no loss and a big gain.

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Funny part about what you listed is I do none of that. I don't disturb chat flow 99% of the time, because Im the one starting the discussion. Never curse in World chat, I dont believe Im abusive or malicious, dont hit the return key repeatedly, and I dont wall of text/caps lock/spam the same thing over again. I keep to the CoC.

You might not want me banned, but other people in this thread believe I should be lol.

Its a global chat with few rules, if you dont want to participate in the discussion don't, and what most of this discussion pertains to is how the server population is low, which I comment on a lot, especially when people bring it up.

Normally for me to troll, someone has to say something real dumb to me in game that has 0 facts backing it up. As an endgame player who has tested stuff, its annoying when these so called know it alls bring something wrong.

Also, 90% of the trolling on Anor is just a simple "Your opinion is wrong" and boomers get annoyed at that so I have my fun.

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Originally Posted by Halphast

I applaud you for seeking out the good among the bad. But your comment about tolerance is pretty intolerant- it seems you also seek out the bad in the good.

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Dude. You win the Internet.

I was concerned you were going to get sucked down into the "Someone is wrong on the Internet" flamewar hole, but I'm no longer concerned. You know what you're doing. Carry on.