'Free Camera Mode' for better screenshots of amazing higher placed structures!

Within some limits of course so people can't raise the camera too high and see what they're not supposed to see
Or move too far away from the character so it's not like we're doing something potentially performance-intensive or 'eagle scouting' as cheating

LOTRO is so big right now with so many amazing places that you just want to take a better shot of but *just can't* That's frustrating especially in this lore-oriented game with attention to detail

I see a cool place in Cape of Belfalas with mighty statues on archways above, with the tower looming in the distance? All I can do is take that awkward shot from skewed angle looking upwards and it doesn't even look moderately impressive! But it's just there... just a little bit above my head if I only could put my camera a bit higher...

Wanna catalogue all of the Kings in Minas Tirith? You'll always end up with that awkward camera angle... and so on and so on I could list many examples of how frustrating it is and how it doesn't give justice to the amazing landscape done if we want to capture it for posterity and spread the word online about this amazing game

Btw, another problem camera mode could solve - wider perspective shots without my character getting in the way. Though you could also make the character taggable as visible/invisible while in the camera mode if thats feasible

/signed. A Photo Mode in LOTRO would be great to have! I remember trying out Black Desert Online and how you could move the camera around to take screenshots, be nice if we had same here in lotro.

What hurts the most is the fact that such a camera probably literally already exists in the game except it's the one devs use in dev mode of the game (you can even look up the commands for it under shortcut configuration file). The only reason why it's not available to us is the lack of limits in it which obviously is not acceptable... but if introduction of such limits is considered an 'unfeasible task,' by any chance, that's BRUTAL and I would say just release the unlimited camera to us screenshot geeks we won't abuse it :P

There used to be a bug whereas you could fly above the landscape and many folks took advantage to take some stunning shots.

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Originally Posted by TearMaker

There used to be a bug whereas you could fly above the landscape and many folks took advantage to take some stunning shots.

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Wild...

We really need a camera mode though. Flying not required... unless there is an eagle willing :)

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Originally Posted by Pontin_Finnberry

/signed. A Photo Mode in LOTRO would be great to have! I remember trying out Black Desert Online and how you could move the camera around to take screenshots, be nice if we had same here in lotro.

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You can manually adjust the view angle of the screen by dragging with the mouse. Also you can get the bird eye view effect in movement if you use some very strong hard drink consumable or 1 of the house decoration kegs, & set the camera to look from distance (use the scroll on mouse) then port to the desired place to screenshot or take a short video. I do these things a lot to take my screenshots.

This has been on my personal wish list for years, but the main roadblock has been the amount of engineering and other time required to establish the system, and the need to manage the impact it would have on a public server. If I am on an +admin character in an specific administrative client I have the ability to detach the camera and move it around using the num pad. The reason we can't bring that specific tech to the public, though, is that it is untethered, so if I chose to just start moving into the atmosphere I would fairly quickly cause server issues, and eventually it would cause a server crash. So, any kind of "Free Camera Mode" would have to be on something like a 30-foot tether, and that is the engineering task that has so far not been able to get serious consideration within the mix of more important work they have to do. Still, I suspect some folks might even be willing to buy a package that would allow them to access a Free Camera Mode, and we could expand the offering to include some things like overlays, transitions, etc. and turn it into a "Creative Kit". Sort of a personal brainstorm wish list item of mine.

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

This has been on my personal wish list for years

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Mine too, in fact I've suggested several times a way to do this would be to allow users to engage in 'eagle session play', where we can fly around Middle Earth as eagles with the purpose being to view the beautiful game world. Unfortunately the point has always been lost and reduced to "flying mounts have no place in this game", which is true and also not at all what I'm suggesting.

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

I suspect some folks might even be willing to buy a package that would allow them to access a Free Camera Mode

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I love this idea, I personally would pay for the ability to do this.

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

This has been on my personal wish list for years, but the main roadblock has been the amount of engineering and other time required to establish the system, and the need to manage the impact it would have on a public server. If I am on an +admin character in an specific administrative client I have the ability to detach the camera and move it around using the num pad. The reason we can't bring that specific tech to the public, though, is that it is untethered, so if I chose to just start moving into the atmosphere I would fairly quickly cause server issues, and eventually it would cause a server crash. So, any kind of "Free Camera Mode" would have to be on something like a 30-foot tether, and that is the engineering task that has so far not been able to get serious consideration within the mix of more important work they have to do. Still, I suspect some folks might even be willing to buy a package that would allow them to access a Free Camera Mode, and we could expand the offering to include some things like overlays, transitions, etc. and turn it into a "Creative Kit". Sort of a personal brainstorm wish list item of mine.

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Yes please release this tool also for non +admins, I would immediately, by that I mean really immediately pay 50-100£ for it. :D

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

This has been on my personal wish list for years, but the main roadblock has been the amount of engineering and other time required to establish the system, and the need to manage the impact it would have on a public server.

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OK, got it. Consider this as cheap alternative then, without lots of extra engineering needed -> remember the Halloween costumes? So like when we can turn our character into Amarthiel or Saruman etc? Add a disguise that lets us take control of the model of the giant or other 'higher height' mob from the game (so the camera would be in the fixed position as always but higher), but to avoid the "lots of giants running around across Middle-earth" problem put some debuffs on it to discourage such usage, like extreme slowness or something, so nobody in their right mind would try and waste their time trying to run like this around the map but to take on such disguise just to take a screenshot when you're already near the right spot? - it wouldn't be a bother and would come handy. Also, you can make the model/texture transparent too, so it's not really a "giant" disguise (which would look weird in public if lots of people could turn into giants) but fake disguise that can be called a "Higher Camera Mode" or something, I guess you could even add a couple of such disguise skills, so like one using a troll model for a bit higher placed camera, one using a giant for even higher placed camera, or perhaps even a rat model for near-ground camera, taking shots from such angles would be cool too. Recently, you also added these giant flying bats with goblin raiders on them in Gundabad, not sure how high is their default position but perhaps you could use those as well for this "invisible disguise used as a camera mode for screenshots" purpose.


If the camera restriction/tethering that's needed for an actual camera mode requires such a big amount of engineering done that it hadn't even been seriously attempted yet (even though on the wish list already) it indeed sounds hopeless but perhaps one day... In the meanwhile, do consider the alternative! Because literally, sometimes all that's needed is just *a bit higher* position above ground. All of the cool stuff, like being able to completely detach the camera from a character in a true camera mode and freely fly around to find a perfect spot... well, leave it on the wish list if feasible/there is more time for proper engineering someday. But I think the disguises idea makes sense? Since it's already a system that's in the game? Also, the disguises wouldn't even need animations attached if the models are made invisible or something. So probably less work than putting together those actual disguises that need at least some of the basic animations attached to them, like walking, jumping, swimming. Let the invisible model move awkwardly, sort of what my Karazgar disguise does when I try to battle with him on, legs and hands streched and unmovable, the camera's model would be invisible anyway and no one will ever notice nor realize what's happening under the hood :P The invisible model of the disguise would also solve another screenshotting problem I mentioned - which is the character getting in the way of some scenery sometimes if we want to zoom out but don't want our character in the screenshot.

Case in point, Cord - I just realized we were able to play as Nurzum in a session play in Wildermore! Unfortunately 'Nurzum's Wrath' doesn't appear to be replayable in any reflecting pool/chronicle of events so cannot take a closer look at the camera position and how high it stays if I zoom all the way in into the first person view. But from Youtube walkthrough of that session play it does appear considerably higher. So you already have a functioning model right there, with a camera that's attached higher than our regular character's camera! The 'bizarre' idea above really seems like a golden solution with a minimal amount of work and no testing/bug fixing required most likely because it wouldn't really have any effect on the server, same as Halloween disguises

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Originally Posted by TesalionLortus

OK, got it. Consider this as cheap alternative then, without lots of extra engineering needed -> remember the Halloween costumes? So like when we can turn our character into Amarthiel or Saruman etc? Add a disguise that lets us take control of the model of the giant or other 'higher height' mob from the game (so the camera would be in the fixed position as always but higher), but to avoid the "lots of giants running around across Middle-earth" problem put some debuffs on it to discourage such usage, like extreme slowness or something, so nobody in their right mind would try and waste their time trying to run like this around the map but to take on such disguise just to take a screenshot when you're already near the right spot? - it wouldn't be a bother and would come handy. Also, you can make the model/texture transparent too, so it's not really a "giant" disguise (which would look weird in public if lots of people could turn into giants) but fake disguise that can be called a "Higher Camera Mode" or something, I guess you could even add a couple of such disguise skills, so like one using a troll model for a bit higher placed camera, one using a giant for even higher placed camera, or perhaps even a rat model for near-ground camera, taking shots from such angles would be cool too. Recently, you also added these giant flying bats with goblin raiders on them in Gundabad, not sure how high is their default position but perhaps you could use those as well for this "invisible disguise used as a camera mode for screenshots" purpose.


If the camera restriction/tethering that's needed for an actual camera mode requires such a big amount of engineering done that it hadn't even been seriously attempted yet (even though on the wish list already) it indeed sounds hopeless but perhaps one day... In the meanwhile, do consider the alternative! Because literally, sometimes all that's needed is just *a bit higher* position above ground. All of the cool stuff, like being able to completely detach the camera from a character in a true camera mode and freely fly around to find a perfect spot... well, leave it on the wish list if feasible/there is more time for proper engineering someday. But I think the disguises idea makes sense? Since it's already a system that's in the game? Also, the disguises wouldn't even need animations attached if the models are made invisible or something. So probably less work than putting together those actual disguises that need at least some of the basic animations attached to them, like walking, jumping, swimming. Let the invisible model move awkwardly, sort of what my Karazgar disguise does when I try to battle with him on, legs and hands streched and unmovable, the camera's model would be invisible anyway and no one will ever notice nor realize what's happening under the hood :P The invisible model of the disguise would also solve another screenshotting problem I mentioned - which is the character getting in the way of some scenery sometimes if we want to zoom out but don't want our character in the screenshot.

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I did want to maybe provide a bit of context that I don't know that the actual scope of such a project has been properly scoped; I don't know that the idea has even really gotten that far in terms of the agenda as it were. There is a lot to fit into that agenda, after all, and so far it hasn't been able to be genuinely considered.

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

I did want to maybe provide a bit of context that I don't know that the actual scope of such a project has been properly scoped; I don't know that the idea has even really gotten that far in terms of the agenda as it were. There is a lot to fit into that agenda, after all, and so far it hasn't been able to be genuinely considered.

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Because "there are other things on the schedule" yes the usual *I know.* But that's why I shared this thought/idea - it would probably be far more easier/less time consuming hence more likely to be genuinely considered than a full-fledged free camera detached from the character that - indeed - *will* require some more work done no doubt.

Not sure if that's you who sometimes approaches devs with feasible/desired features that can be considered or someone else, but yeah, in any case - maybe hit them with that camera disguises idea first when push comes to shove when you have an opportunity to discuss with someone who might have an idea of how feasible that is ;) Probably better option than waiting for that big 'far-away opportunity' and huge allocation of dev time that's needed for this full fledged camera mode

So you may have noticed that while on a warsteed the distance which you can move the camera back is farther than when on foot or a regular steed. If you rotate the camera to being above you it's actually quite high up. If the camera was able to be 'disengaged' and allow it's focus to turn away from your character this I think would provide the camera view being requested here without seemingly requiring a lot of additional work.

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Originally Posted by Cordovan

This has been on my personal wish list for years, but the main roadblock has been the amount of engineering and other time required to establish the system, and the need to manage the impact it would have on a public server. If I am on an +admin character in an specific administrative client I have the ability to detach the camera and move it around using the num pad. The reason we can't bring that specific tech to the public, though, is that it is untethered, so if I chose to just start moving into the atmosphere I would fairly quickly cause server issues, and eventually it would cause a server crash. So, any kind of "Free Camera Mode" would have to be on something like a 30-foot tether, and that is the engineering task that has so far not been able to get serious consideration within the mix of more important work they have to do. Still, I suspect some folks might even be willing to buy a package that would allow them to access a Free Camera Mode, and we could expand the offering to include some things like overlays, transitions, etc. and turn it into a "Creative Kit". Sort of a personal brainstorm wish list item of mine.

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Add in a tourist mode legendary server, no combat no mobs, no swift travel etc.

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Originally Posted by auximenes

So you may have noticed that while on a warsteed the distance which you can move the camera back is farther than when on foot or a regular steed. If you rotate the camera to being above you it's actually quite high up. If the camera was able to be 'disengaged' and allow it's focus to turn away from your character this I think would provide the camera view being requested here without seemingly requiring a lot of additional work.

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It would be funny if the camera rubber-banded too lol.

Sometimes I get the feeling people chime in and don't even read these threads or what the devs had to say... disengaging the camera would be exactly the kind of roadblock Cord mentioned, devs would need to do the whole engineering work to put some limits on it and then make sure it works/doesn't cause server issues etc. While introducing a whole new server just for camera... doesn't even solve the original issue of the player camera mode not existing/requiring more work in the first place and puts even more strain on SSG resources.

Which is why I suggested that alternative 'disguises' solution above, even though sounds kind of 'complex' and like lots of explaining is needed... technically speaking... could be much MUCH easier since all systems are already there in the game, nothing new needs to be engineered. And maybe we wouldn't need to wait for years on end just to be able to take better-looking screenshots of some slightly higher placed statues etc

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Originally Posted by Maggwin

Add in a tourist mode legendary server, no combat no mobs, no swift travel etc.

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You can already do that! Pay to get the highest valar level possible. You will be able to wander everywhere you want without get enemies agro. :p

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Originally Posted by YamydeAragon

You can manually adjust the view angle of the screen by dragging with the mouse. Also you can get the bird eye view effect in movement if you use some very strong hard drink consumable or 1 of the house decoration kegs, & set the camera to look from distance (use the scroll on mouse) then port to the desired place to screenshot or take a short video. I do these things a lot to take my screenshots.

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Could be an interesting ultimate fan bundle perk as well.