It's on their radar in multiple ways.
http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...64#post4122764
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It's on their radar in multiple ways.
http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...64#post4122764
I'll just add that I would support this feature, and use it occasionally.
I think LOTRO is the perfect game for it, because it is such an amazing world with role playing opportunities. What to play a Hobbit who never leaves the shire, but still finds a challenge in fighting the bears across the Brandywine? You don't have to worry about fighting too many and making it easy...you can just permanently play a character who finds that a challenge.
It unlocks the ultimate role-playing opportunities. You can be a level 10 hobbit that, through low level crafting, eventually earns enough money to buy your own house and be so excited for that. I could think of dozens of other examples.
However, I think the 2 biggest things of all that supports this idea are:
1. How would it hurt anyone else?
We aren't competing in this game, and staying a low level isn't going to make you more powerful later on. Regardless of whether you turn off xp, you still need to take the time to do the slayer deeds etc... In fact, it would just be HARDER to do those because you are not allowing yourself to out level the deeds. This feature would have NO EFFECT on anyone who didn't want it, but would have a HUGE EFFECT on those who do.
2. Is it really that hard to do? I mean seriously...I can't imagine there is THAT much coding involved in making a button somewhere that just shuts off all experience gain. maybe later if people want they can spend a little more time to make an option to just shut off combat exp OR quest exp (one or the other, so you can level from killing but not from quests, or vice versa). But to stay, just a "NO EXPERIENCE" button in the options would be fine. How hard is that? I admit I have little programming experience, but I just can't imagine it being as complicated as an emote, or some gear, or even balancing skills etc... I imagine it may just be as simple as changing a "1" to a "0" in some code about gaining experience (We already don't gain experience from white mobs...so there is something in the code that sets a threshold of no experience...so you just have an option to change that threshold so that NOTHING gives us experience).
Emphasis added. Some people enjoy the quests and find questing and completing deeds to be almost mutually exclusive. Not quite the same situation I'm in (find quests to be almost mandatory, whether I like them or not), but same basic result, solvable by same basic solution.Quote:
Originally Posted by auximenes
I think it's more about how people cringe at the tone and sense of entitlement to this requested feature. Despite being told repeatedly that it's a "niche" feature that is unlikely to ever be developed, we still know that every time there's an announcement about bonus xp, there will be an explosion of the same voices screaming bloody murder that they can't turn xp off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lohi
The truth is, we don't get to decide how this game works. We can only hope that things we like are judged to be worthwhile. To turn this concept on its head and repeatedly demand (ad nauseum) the same feature despite having it explained over and over again why it won't happen. . . well, that just demonstrates a lack of pespective. And eventually people chaffe at reading the same pointlessness over and over again. Especially when there's that tone of entitlement attached.
This is brilliant. A gedankenexperiment carried out "in real life" (real lotro life, anyhow) to gather data.Quote:
Originally Posted by floon
I now have a new challenge for me & my kinmates -- the level 1 weapon challenge: what's the toughest mobs you can take out with your max'd character using min'd equipment.
Let the games begin. (Thanks, Floon!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by floon
This does not in any way address my concerns or the concerns of most of the people i've read & talked to about this issue.
User defined XP gain is about much more than that. You are focusing in on one carrot on a large feasting table of food.
I want to control my XP for entirely different reasons than challenging myself in combat. To keep this simple, I will list two:
1. To keep pace with friends / spouse / kin.
The number one reason my friends have left this game is it wwas too ahrd to adventure together on level without one person getting too far ahead or another falling way behind - rendering the big fun adventure nights a trivial in challenge for some, and/or a power drag along for others that simply side kick their way through what should be a thrilling time.
2. To play a character who has a role helping others in a specific area.
Say you wanted to play a character who was a Bounder, or a Watcher in Bree, or a merchant who makes desperate runs to Trestlebridge, etc for a time (or forever). Many people try to do this to enrich their servers community and bring this world truly to life. It is an important feature for kins. It is not possible without XP control - you outlevel the area in the blink of an eye and you can no longer play escort/guard. As it is there are deterrents for helping / fellowing with others who are not on the same quests as you, since you know you'll outlevel your own content by helping. If you could remain at a level of your choosing (when and where you wanted) you could do as you wished.
By-the-way, does anyone know how forum suggestions and dialog about ideas and suggestions get back to the powers-that-be, who decide on what is a good feature to include and why it would be?
I'm just curious as to how that whole process works (assuming there is one).
Seems we have at least one Dev who is following this particular discussion, however I get the impression that not only does he not truly comprehend the need and the desire for this feature, but may be personally opposed to it as well. If that's the case, and if he is the only Dev closely following this topic, then how can we be reasonably assured that not only is the feature idea being properly communicated, but is also being properly represented?
A myriad of well articulated and perfectly reasonable and understandable benefits to individual players (and player types), and to the game in general have been put forth in these threads on XP reduction options. As well as methods of implementation, and various ways to address particular concerns that could arise from including such a feature. What assurance do we have that these points are actually being adequately expressed and represented in whatever meetings that Turbine has to discuss various additions or changes to include?
Also, are the forums the only method by which to make suggestions directly to Turbine? Do we have to rely on the Mods (and Devs who stop in) to get ideas and suggestions to the decision makers? What if the Mods or Devs have a personal bias against an idea; are they duty bound to bring it up and provide the same argumentation for that idea that the players put forth in the forums?
As I understand it, the community reps peruse the forums, gather information, and present that to the dev community at large in a meeting. Then the producers would decide on what makes sense, what doesn't, and so on.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFire
Individual devs may make comments on suggestions and other such items, as they see fit, although no devs are required to post (for Turbine games anyway). Some have thicker skins than others (Orion has barkskin, I would bet), and feel more comfortable posting.
But, the last time they explained the process (which was a few years ago), that's how it worked.
Really? I don't remember any hardcore/casual divide in AC. I played from 2001-2004, and I've been dropping back in on the community ever since. So, unless that's something that only existed in pre-DM AC, I'm not sure where you're coming from.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beldacar
(I played on HG, FWIW. And, before you say that it was relegated to message boards: I now have over 55,000 posts on VN. I was always a message board fiend, and I doubt you'd find anyone from the HG or AC General boards on VN during that period who didn't know me. Sure, they knew me as an obnoxious kid, but I was still in the community a lot.)
Some suggestions get forwarded to team members by the CR people or by other developers - and many of them lurk. They have a process for prioritizing all of the potential additions to the game based on a large set of factors, balancing them in with all the bigger stuff on their roadmap.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFire
Posting positive responses to stuff in the Suggestions forum tends to get treated like doing it's a sure thing, that it's "promised". They basically never do that, because even if they plan on doing one of the suggestions here, it could be in a very different form, might not happen for a year, or might get bumped for a more important feature later. So basically, the only posts they'll do here are either purely informational, or else to say "no". Floon seems to have the thick hide and patience to do both.
No. They have an entire NDA testing program going on, and they periodically do other things like surveys or focus groups.Quote:
Also, are the forums the only method by which to make suggestions directly to Turbine?
Khafar
Yes oh high and mighty pompous one, i have called you on your own eliteist drivel. But oh, wait, you are so great it really isnt that when it comes out of YOUR mouth, only others and only if YOU are the one pointing fingers?Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFire
I don't think so. I misinterpereted NOTHING. It's YOU that has the problem.
I think some of you are taking this way too seriously. What it comes down to is that this is just a feature that is missing from a computer game. That's it. A game.
That's like me being mad because the devs won't put in a ingame notepad to make my crafting requests easier to track.
It's just a game.
I think the people who are mad, as in angry, have already quit the game and/or the forums. I know some of them from both camps.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymphonic
You are welcome to be mad as you want about a missing notepad, calculator, player note, and automated price/unit in the auction hall, but it won't help. I know because I want those things too but not nearly as much as I want to control my own destiny.
Personally, I still talk about it because it would make the game complete for me. I don't feel like I can buy the game for anyone I would want to play with, or even get a second account for myself just yet, but it's a close call.
I too have read things too seriously or personally at times, and the big beast of flames as a background above doesn't help either but I'm learning about this 'thick skin' idea everyone talks about.
Bad thing is there so many ways they could put this feature in with out hurting other people. Even if you are able to set your own level cap from level 10 to 65. It could help in other friends and members. Mostly for Family that play together.
Not really talking about "hardcore/casual divide" but the "whiner/anti-whiner" divide: basically, some people are fairly prolific providers of "feedback," sometimes constructive, sometimes not; these folks are often perceived as "whiners" by those who disagree with them. The true irony is that these "anti-whiners" expend an enormous amount of effort whining about the "whiners" when, in fact, the best way to kill an idea you don't agree with on a message board is to ignore it; eventually the proponents will drop the topic (or moderators will enforce anti-bumping rules) if no one is responding to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Porlock
As for my AC forum experience: I was on TD and mostly used the CoD message boards because I always found their threading layout more useful than VN's flat layout; much easier to figure out who was replying to what without all the quoting and such.
Yes, there are some no doubt, for me it's not the fact that Turbine 'waste' time on things I don't want it's whether or not they're pandering to a very small minority and consuming a large amount of time to do so, time which IMO could be better spent on work that interests many more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lohi
I don't PvP but if Turbine were to actually DO some work on that part of the game I'd be perfectly happy, it wouldn't benefit ME but many others would dearly ove it, no matter how much effort Turbine had to expend and what else I may have got that interested me.
However, I have yet to see any evidence this feature has anything other than a very small support, and clearly that's Turbine's view.
Yep, me too. I played first on Morningthaw, then moved over to Wintersebb with friends from both MT and CoD to form a new allegiance there. Back in those days, I went by "Kryloc the Gray", and was pretty much a fixture at CoD the first few years :).Quote:
Originally Posted by Beldacar
Khafar
But there's something to be said for doing things ON LEVEL. Sure, using a starter weapon & armour set is going to be harder. But it's not the same, and it's a poor substitute.Quote:
Originally Posted by floon
Also... Your point about having more skills isn't entirely accurate. If we do any attacks other than auto-attacks, it becomes trivial again. So yeah, as a Minstrel I'll have access to my Spirit of Soliloquy... But I can't use any ballads, and few anthems. So once you do the math, I actually have FEWER skills (as using them will trivialize the fight).
You can't take a poor substitute and say, "If you don't like this, I don't believe you'll like the real thing." That's just silly.
There was a poster in this thread who seemed most concerned with the "CHALLANGE" level (to use that poster's term) - I think floon's post was more directed at that particular aspect than the idea as a whole.
I'd be very much interested in slowing down the XP gains on my characters! There are sooo many quests in each region, but by the time I get to most of them, they're already green and blue and no longer a challenge. The whole easy leveling is a big turn off for me. I pretty much dumped WoW way back when they changed their leveling requirements (among many other reasons.) My best friend that I play with on here is always wanting to level up so we can use the next latest and greatest gear, but I'd rather level slowly and enjoy the challenges of the quests at levels that match them! Sure the higher level instances sound like fun, but there's a LOT of story going on through the lower levels that is easily missed when surging on ahead! And while I do enjoy the nifty new gear and abilities, I play more for the lore and the (rare) challenges than the frills!
Increasing the challenge level is certainly part of the equation, but not all of it. For example, the reason most people don't do the level 50 raids anymore is because it's pointless: you outgrow the rewards very rapidly. If there were a way to level-lock at 50, =I= would certainly be more willing to spend some time working on all that content. Unfortunately, given the current rapid levelling scheme, I'll probably do what 99% of players do: go to Moria as early as possible and never see the level 50 raids and instances.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lomeloth
And as for increasing the challenge, I'm sure those looking for a challenge have already found ways. For me, that generally means pushing on to the next red-orange area, as that's the only way I've found that doesn't involve A. grouping or B. silly suggestions like using lower-level gear (silly because 1. it goes against the integral MMO concept of character progression and 2. it involves wasting that most precious of commodities, storage space).
I didn't read all 23 pages but I'm all for this and would use it often with some of my characters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonzia
Hi Sonia, yeah unfortunately your line of reasoning doesn't seem to fly with the nay-sayers here, nor apparently Turbine either.
You see, while although Turbine likes to tout things like "100s of new quests" for its upcoming expansion, you're REALLY only supposed to pick and choose a small handful of them to do at any reasonable challenge level (and either do the rest at below level, or leave a few for each of your 8 Alts that you've leveled through the first 60 levels again - And since you can do that in a couple weeks it shouldn't take too much of your time!).
Yeah it seems a rather absurd design philosophy, but that's apparently what we're supposed to enjoy. :rolleyes:
This is just silly. The only place where you have that sort of content overloading is levels 1-15, and that's because they're racially distinctive starting areas. There's no way you're going to play only a "small handful" of the quests in Mirkwood and still hit level 65, not unless you do one horrendous amount of grinding on MOBs.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFire
Even if you want to do that sort of horrendous grinding, simply sequencing the content first (with the grinding done at the level cap) means that you aren't going to have that problem.
Could an XP switch help with that? Sure. But you already know it won't be done for the expansion, and probably won't be done for the first Book update either (since they tend to plan those out a fair ways in advance). So do your own planning, and do the quests you want to do first, so you'll do the ~80% or so of them you'll probably need to get to level 65 at level.
Khafar
A "small handful" of quests? Really? That's really stretching it.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFire
Those hundreds of new quests are designed to give you options. Many of us play alts, and that gives us a slightly different path the 2nd and 3rd time through. It also allows you to be more selective with the quests you do choose; rather than follow one pre-determined course, you can pick the sort of things you enjoy. The end result is a game that feels slightly less linear.
I realize you're trying to make a point with the whole XP toggle concept, but steering clear of that level of hyperbole may actually help your cause. You lose credibility when you go that far off the deep end.