I'm not sure why you guys want to nerf/delete Bombastic, the best attunement building, heal-on-the-run skill RKs have.
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I'm not sure why you guys want to nerf/delete Bombastic, the best attunement building, heal-on-the-run skill RKs have.
I agree that the skill is great for these two things (I use it a lot while kiting) but it is lacking as a capstone skill because skill delay and the expiration big payoff heal. I dont want it nerfed or removed. I think it just needs tweaking to make it effective but not overpowering. When I am desperately needing the big heal I have to stop using the BI so that it will expire. During that 8 seconds, I often die before the big expiration heal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leixy
I would suggest one of two options.
1) Have the expiration heal time lower as BI tiers up. Something like Tier 1 - 8 seconds, Tier 2 - 5 seconds, Tier 3 - 2 seconds.
Or
2) Have the big heal on a threshold trigger but only on tier 3. On tier 1 and 2 it expires for big heal at 8 seconds. On tier 3 it expires at 8 seconds unless morale hits 35% - 50% and the big heal immediately occurs.
Or it could scale according to how long BI has been ticking on the target before a second BI, the trigger, is applied. I actually quite like the sound of that. Heck, it might even make it a worthwhile capstone, as well as keeping it as an effective, mobile heal attunement builder.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leixy
Yeah, it's good for that I agree, but basically the healing capstone is an attunement builder with an oft wasted burst heal. Needs reworking IMO.
Yes, you're absolutely right. I've lost count on the number of times I've used it solely for that purpose, though the animation delay is tiresome. For a capstone, it needs to be re-worked as Radbug mentioned however. Do I want the tweaks to come at the expense of its mobility? Definitely not! I'd almost rather continue to have the skill as is if that's the case. We have so little mobile healing as it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leixy
So remove current BI's stacking mechanic, increase the HoT duration a bit and apply the burst on second application or when the HoT expires?Quote:
Originally Posted by Radbug
I like this idea.
This would also remove the slightly confusing bit in stacking BI, since Bombastic Inspiration, Writ of Health and the HoT from EftA all use the Writ of Health icon when stacked on the target...
I find this an interesting idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
Could not be exactly like that, but it could be something related to for example only writ of health tier:
Remove expiration heal on the base skill if no writ of health is on your target. And tiering bombastic inspiration tier should only increase HoT, not burst. So then:
Writ T1: Added expiration heal to bombastic 8 seconds after it's used.
Writ T2: Expiration heal heals 20% more and have 2 second less time to burst applied.
Writ T3: Expiration heal heals 20% more and has only 4 second till burst heal.
An idea I liked back in beta forums, was about it being an skill that modify writ. So if bombastic + writ active at the same time, writ would heal twice as fast (each 2 seconds).
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly, but it sounds like you want BI to get better AND WoH to heal faster if both are applied at the same time. It seems like a tricky concept to explain and to manage properly. I'm not saying "make it easy" but I don't know if this complexity will be a benefit or a headache (Read further, I end up agreeing that I like the idea).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kander
So far it sounds like everyone wants some sort of trigger in place to fire off the big heal early if in a dire situation. Also we all seem to want to keep this skill as a mobile, attunement builder. I'm liking the idea of some sort of Tiered effect, whether it be like my original suggestion of having the Big Heal build up over time adding tiers and you have a way to trigger it (mobile) if your tank takes a big hit OR the suggestion I quoted here.
I REALLY LIKE the idea of having WoH affect other HoTs and such. Especially BI, it would be cool to increase complexity of this class to match that of the warden. The warden is difficult to use until you understand gambits and what order is best. I feel like the RK has the ability to become just as complex and yet powerful with tiered skills affecting other mobile heals and channeling skills. It's a really great idea.
EDIT: I do feel that this would in turn require a nerf to the RK skills so that these benefits from the increase in complexity would balance with other healing classes. I also think that maybe this idea should also, if it works well, cross over into the red and yellow paths somewhat. So writs of fire would help out with other skills and make them more potent and possibly increase certain DoTs. The writ of lightning could increase crit chance (?) or something, I'm not sure.
Honestly, I think BI should be scraped. Terribad skill design conceptually!!! Sure, as a HoT-on-the run attunement builder, it works fine. But that's all it really is, and that does not meet the standards of what a healing capstone skill should be. Remember back a few years ago when EftA had a 4.5 second induction time untraited and 4 seconds traited. Devs said we should be using this skill because the heals were so awesome. The problem is, when your target needed a big heal, they were dead before you got through the EftA induction. Most healing RKs simply didn't use it until the induction time was reduced.
In BI, we have a skill design that's even worse! It's a terribly designed skill conceptually! Let's scrap it, replace it and move on. And devs, please think twice before you ever give us a skill again where the timing/delivery of the big heal is such that your target is dead 4 seconds before the big heal goes off. That's just not gonna cut it.
So some big direct heal with a short induction makes us a minnie. RK healing has been more proactive with some emergency utility built in. As a capstone what type of skill would you suggest? (I know this post might sound argumentative, not the case, I agree with alot of your comments)Quote:
Originally Posted by Nouri
I like the idea of reducing induction based on attunement for EFtA. For BI/Capstone, maybe the skill provides a buff instead, I do like the extra hot and also, in pve and pvp raids the skill is out of place. I'd love the skill to be available in dps spec(s) though just the way it is, for soloing, unbelievably op, never happen :)
I understand your disdain for this skill. I hardly use EftA in my normal rotation, I generally build pips until I can throw down a large bubble and then use EftA (which is still stupid because all the HoTs do a great job healing by the time the EftA hits and I over heal). But there has to be some way to control big heals. I don't mind the inductions and the wait, I just think that we should be allowed to call upon some sort of heal to get out of tight spots quickly at the cost of how potent a heal may be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nouri
Another idea is keep BI, just add a skill that is an instant/mobile heal with no HoT that could carry a tank long enough until the big heal of BI hits.
I am only new to RK healing (my mains are minis) but as a new to class player I really like this idea for the reasons oulined in the other positive posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
Just floating an idea here. There are probably lots of potential issues with it, so please be gentle with your objections :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
Could EftA become an large incoming damage reduction skill with a small HoT tail or even small PoT? So, even combined the New BI proposed change, it would not be obsolete. (It could even use the same attunement and animation mechanic as it has now, so it would require some planning to use. edit: I'm thinking it would be useful for spike damage, but rather than burst healing or bubbling, it would be an aoe felllow wide skill that increased effect with attunement. I'm thinking something like Inspire Fellows or the old symphony of hopeful heart (glowy circle) on minstrels but better scaled buffs to reflect it's epic nature. Being an over time tiered skill it would reflect RKs unique healing style. ie that of anticipating and planning for big healing but more crucially, by mitigating the amount of healing needed. . Thereby making the RK /Minstrel combinationin groups, really synergetic (is that a word? ) *through their differences.
edit * i think synergistic is the word. maybe
Not sure how it would play out in PVP though. It could be too much, or still too slow.
.
It is not the Healing RK or Captain that is OP.Quote:
Originally Posted by papafhill1
Making EftA a damage reduction skill would mean we could sort of have our old Wondrous Foreshadowing back, which I would like a lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Calta
However, EftA is available to all Rune-keepers, regardless of spec. We don't really want to give such a strong utility skill to, for instance, Fire RKs, given the insane amount of damage they can pull off nowadays.
Just like with Mending Verse, buffing EftA is dangerous cause you're not just buffing the blue line, but all the traitlines.
Doesn't mean you couldn't put a damage reduction buff on EftA on a trait or in the blue traitline setbonus somewhere though.
On the topic of BI, I think changing it to good old TWDNKU would make us a bit more pro-active again, and gives us the damage utility that's completely disappeared from the healing line. Just don't make it a ground targeted I-buff-everyone-in-range skill, that would be way too strong.
Another possibility would be to have Bombastic Inspiration act like Concession & Rebuttal.
The skill could provide a groupwide damage reduction aura (All Fates Entwined :)) scaling on the amount of stacks available, and consume stacks for:
- Epic for the Ages, making it a guaranteed crit
- Word of Exaltation, while bubble active, bubbled target is immune to crits
- Essay of Exaltation, while bubble active, outgoing damage increased by a small amount.
- Mending Verse, instant cast and usable on the move.
edit: I'm aware of Calta's edit, but I think my initial points about EftA are still valid :)
Thanks for the reply. Forgot about how awesome my fire RK is with the current epic. I understand now about the dangerous implication of buffing epic for the ages as a general skill. I was only thinking of it being more a blue line passive effect thing. Guess I still think in stances too much. I am very new to RK healing. But i still like the damage reduction idea ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
kind of like the RK equivalent to old yellows mini's anthem/coda combintions or warden's gambits? Sounds cool. But wouldn't the general forums erupt into tears at the 'complexity'?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
edited : I'm down for TWDNKU. with Triumphant Spirit's CD and an equivalent legacy.:D
edited again Heya Kortaan, sorry we cross posted. I agree your response is valid. Thanks again for the explanation.
So why not just nerf the Mini?Quote:
Originally Posted by JeauxLOTR
Honestly, I keep an eye out for how the mobs attack and if I see an incoming attack that will deal spike damage I bubble the tank. It's a proactive class so you have to know the ecology of your mobs.
I get the idea behind BI though. You place it on everyone and it NEEDS to expire to be useful. The only thing that is absolutely moronic with it is the stacking of this ability. The more I think about it the more I like the idea of having WoH stacked tiers affecting this skill. Seriously I think a good solution is:
-Get rid of BI stacks
-Add another moderate instant heal (mobile) or make EftA a mobile instant cast (maybe have it require 5 pips of healing attune?)
-Have BI increase in potency with each stack of WoH
I don't think BI needs to be canned, just needs to be reworked along with a lot of other things with this class.
I'd like to see us get Wondrous Foreshadowing back as a replacement for BI. The distinctive, defining characteristics of RK healing are proactive healing and damage reduction/prevention. Wondrous Foreshadowing fit the RK model absolutely perfectly with regard to damage reduction abilities with an awesome incoming healing modifier to boot! Just think about how many times that skill saved players near death or saved wipes because you were able to keep a tank, on the brink of death, on their feet. That skill was a difference maker! Now think about how many times BI has made a difference like that. Personally, I'd trade BI for WF in a heart beat!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghosttaker
While not a heal, WF fills the need here perfectly.Quote:
Originally Posted by papafhill1
What does WF do? Do you have a link for me?Quote:
Originally Posted by Nouri
Wondrous Foreshadowing used to be a single target damage reduction on a 60 second cooldown.Quote:
Originally Posted by papafhill1
It provided the target with a 40% damage reduction, and simultaneously gave the target a +50% incoming healing buff.
(Source: http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Wondrous_Foreshadowing)
It gave the target a +50% incoming healing modifier (made the HoTs that you already had on target that much more effective) and it reduced the damage your target took by 40% for the skill's duration. It also increased your outgoing healing by 5% for the skill's duration. That, my friend, is a capstone worthy skill.Quote:
Originally Posted by papafhill1
http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Wondrous_Foreshadowing
Does that stack with Rune-sign? That would be awesome to have and definitely better than BI. If that came back I would say get rid of BI. I mean you could use that, use a bubble on the hurt tank, then crank out EftA for the big heal. That makes more sense than having to deal with BI's laggard big heal and I totally agree that it fits the RK class style more than BI and the big heal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
Wondrous Foreshadowing the skill didn't do that, slotting the Legendary trait gave you a passive 5% increase in healing. This would work with or without WF active, just like the 4-set bonus used to do for the amount of blue traits slotted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nouri
Apart from that you're absolutely right ofcourse :)
Rune-sign didn't reduce damage the way it does now, back when old WF was around. But in all honesty, they might aswell stack, you're just using all your defensive buffs on one target. We can justify extra damage reduction by saying all the spike damage has gone up to compensate for those pesky overpowered minstrels!Quote:
Originally Posted by papafhill1
Good point!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kortaan
I liked 2 more ideas here:
Having all fates entwined equivalent group wide similar to yellow capstone could be a good idea with those stacks, but depending on the magnitude...either it could be just too OP or almost useless. So how exactly would that work in magnitude and buffs? Maybe it's a bit hard to manage and balance.
About WF, it was one of the most important skills on a rune keeper for single target healing along with old mending verse. I just think it could be a true capstone. Also TWDNKU would work fine, but with bubbles for whole raid each 40s...maybe it would not make a huge difference.
I would like something similar to do not fall to x, better than TWDNKU, but a toggle skill or something, let's say damage reduction aura of 20m for -30% inc damage of the chosen elemental damage (fire, frost or lightning). At a high cost of power to mantain maybe (like 30 power per second or so) so you could not use it always unless you're spamming PtH on yourself. And would only be too good for so few fights, since most raid bosses attack with acid, shadow, light damage, and so few with fire or lightning.
Now if only Jinjaah would pop back in................