Update 17 Beta 1 Release Notes & Known Issues - PRELIMINARY AND NON-FINAL - BULLROARER ONLY

The following release notes are for the Bullroarer public test server only and may not reflect the final list of changes or updates included at release.

These notes are not final and should be viewed as a work in progress and subject to change.

The Eyes and Guard Tavern is now open!
Your live characters may be copied to Bullroarer. In your normal game launcher, access the transfer service, select your server, select characters, select copy to Bullroarer. Copies via the transfer service CANNOT currently be accessed from the Bullroarer launcher.

Important Note: Please be aware that the build you are seeing here is a work in progress and is by no means the finished Update 17 product. There are items that are not yet complete. There may also be items missing from this initial list, this is not intentional and will be added as we progress.

Known Issues:

1. German and French localization for this beta build is missing in many many places.
2. The Epic book quests are not available during this open beta.
3. The Epic Battle: Hammer of the Underworld is not available during this open beta.
4. In the Epic Battle: Defence of Minas Tirith, the secondary quest "Despair in the Streets" is not fully implemented, and the portcullis doors currently interfere with soldier movement. Additionally, difficulty balance is not complete for the epic battles.
5. In Minas Tirith, Bergil's quests are not completable.

Release Notes:
Update 17 includes Old Anórien with three new regions (Talath Anor, Pelennor Fields, and Minas Tirith), two new epic battles, a new crafting tier, and an extension of the imbued legendary item system. You can also see a beta version of our new Store.

Cosmetic Weapons:

• You can now turn off your weapons when they are sheathed by clicking the new eye icons in the cosmetic outfit page. In combat, the weapons will reappear.
• Cosmetic weapon visibility rules have been loosened. We have set up a number of categories of items that can be interchanged with each other: all one-handed weapons (including cosmetic-only items), all shields, two-handed clubs/swords/implements, and two-handed hammers/axes/halberds. All other categories (such as Staff, Spear, etc) can only be interchanged with other staffs, spears, etc.You can no longer waste a dye trying to dye shields in the wardrobe.
• Shields and weapons should again appear at their normal size.

Crafting:

• Crafters now have access to a tenth crafting tier: the Anórien crafting tier. Crafters of this tier can use Poplar, Anórien Skarn, Zircon, and Tattered Anórien Parchments to craft items for level 100 characters.
• All crafting nodes can now be harvested while mounted.
• All crafting materials stack to 500.
• There is no longer a distinction between Vegetable, Grain, and Pipe-weed Farmlands. There is now only one kind of Farmland.
• East Gondor craft nodes have been replaced with the tier 10 craft nodes also found in Old Anórien.

Imbued Legendary Items:

• DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
• Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
• All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

Burglar

Burglar's Gamble Chance Legacy now gives Cash Out Damage after tier 35.

Captain

Muster Courage Fear Resist now grants Shield/Song/Blade-brother Critical Defence after Tier 35.

Champion

Swift Strike/Swift Blade Power Cost has a maximum tier of 38.

Guardian

Guardian's Pledge Cooldown now gives Retaliation Damage after Tier 35.

Guardian's Pledge Magnitude now gives Shield Swipe Damage after tier 35.

Turn the Tables Cooldown now gives Turn the Tables Damage after tier 35.

Hunter

Strength Quick Shot Slow now gives more chance to get extra Focus after tier 35.

Quick Shot Critical Chance now gives more Quick Shot critical damage after tier 35.

Loremaster

Signs of Power Durations now grants Signs of Power Debuff Rating after Tier 35.

Minstrel

Cry of the Chorus Cooldown now grants Ballad Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Triumphant Spirit Cooldown now grants Triumphant Spirit Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rally Cooldown now grants Major Ballad Healing after Tier 35.

Anthem Duration now grants Melee Skills Critical Rating after Tier 35.

Still as Death Cooldown now grants Song of Distraction Cooldown after Tier 35.

Call to Ioreth Cooldown now grants Call to Ioreth Healing Skills Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rune-Keeper

Healing Attuned Power Cost now grants Revive Morale and Power Restoration after Tier 35.

Battle Attuned Power Cost now grants Chill of Winter Target Resistance penalty after Tier 35.

Steady Attuned Power Cost now grants Armour of the Elements Tactical Mitigation after Tier 35.

Class changes:

• Beornings now have access to Bows.
• The Beorning Club-damage trait now applies to axes as well.
• Beornings with more than 100 Wrath should gain +15% Crit Chance from the Wrathful trait, instead of +0%.
• Champion Horns can no longer miss. They can still be resisted.
• Minstrel - Call to Ioreth now grants +5% critical magnitude to healing skills, in addition to making the next healing skill automatically a critical hit.
• Wardens will now animate properly when using the Taunt skill when unarmed.

Other stuff:

• Hope Tokens now have a 3-minute cooldown, instead of 15 minutes.
• All 6-man and 12-man Roving Threats now have a chance to drop Morgul Crests.
• The Dome of Stars, The Ruined City, and The Sunken Labyrinth now all give 1 Morgul Crest upon completion of the tier 2 instance. This is in addition to any Morgul Crests from the tier 2 Challenge chest.
• Epic Battles - fixed merit progress display for some of the secondary quests which used to not show any progress at all.
• There's a new option that allows you to control the opacity of floating names on the UI Settings options page.
• Added an audio option to disable combat music. When checked, landscape music plays uninterrupted by combat.
• A handful of tweaks have been made to the player music system: Bagpipe notes should no longer clip, the Misty Mountain Harp has had its note lengths slightly shortened, and the Theorbo's seven highest notes should now sound more like a Theorbo.
• Level-scaled players should no longer lose their scaling buff when teleporting between Ettenmoors and Osgiliath.
• In the Battle for Osgiliath, Creep NPCs have less Morale and Freep NPCs have more.
• The store now has a minimum width of 600px to prevent the scrollbar from disappearing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Crafting:

• All crafting nodes can now be harvested while mounted.
• All crafting materials stack to 500.

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Looking forward to everything here, but THANKS YOU SO MUCH for this!

also, Beorning bows!

How many TPs this map will cost?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by floccari

How many TPs this map will cost?

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795tp OR 29 million bottle caps, since we are allowed to pay with bottle caps now :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Imbued Legendary Items:

• DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
• Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
• All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

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One question and one statement:

Question: Will there be a new Scroll of Empowerment introduced or will Anfalas Scrolls of Empowerment continue to work to increase legacies? I suspect Anfalas will still work since I can't quite get my head around how they'd suddenly require a newer type.

Statement: As predicted, those who thought imbuement would be the end to the LI grind were kidding themselves. You may not be destroying your LI (hooray!), but you're still going to suddenly need to grind out another 42 Scrolls of Empowerment and four star-lit crystals. That's more grinding than we had to do to replace an entire LI under the prior system. Gee, I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls of Empowerment and Star-lit Crystals in the Store?

In Turbine's defense: They had to find some way of continuing to generate revenue from LIs in an era of no level-cap increases. And at least we can grind out Scrolls of Empowerment a bit easier now (via Training Exercise instance, assuming it's still a valid means post-update). Still, I have a hard time believing the system would look like this or be incremented so rapidly under a subscription model (though the game might not still exist under a subscription model).

I realize that the update is a pretty major content addition, but is there any chance of getting the bowstring bug fixed as part of U17? Still there as of 16.5, which replaced the original 16.5, which became 16.4.2. :)

-Thundertrain

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

One question and one statement:

Question: Will there be a new Scroll of Empowerment introduced or will Anfalas Scrolls of Empowerment continue to work to increase legacies? I suspect Anfalas will still work since I can't quite get my head around how they'd suddenly require a newer type.

Statement: As predicted, those who thought imbuement would be the end to the LI grind were kidding themselves. You may not be destroying your LI (hooray!), but you're still going to suddenly need to grind out another 42 Scrolls of Empowerment and four star-lit crystals. That's more grinding than we had to do to replace an entire LI under the prior system. Gee, I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls of Empowerment and Star-lit Crystals in the Store?

In Turbine's defense: They had to find some way of continuing to generate revenue from LIs in an era of no level-cap increases. And at least we can grind out Scrolls of Empowerment a bit easier now (via Training Exercise instance, assuming it's still a valid means post-update). Still, I have a hard time believing the system would look like this or be incremented so rapidly under a subscription model (though the game might not still exist under a subscription model).

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A new type would be better if it comes with a significant discount on already existing scrolls. Not everyone would have their LIs fully upgraded, and there are still new alts to come.. the grind would need to be reduced at the lower end to not create a huge gap between players.

And btw.. I find it concerning that Turbine now has to rely on P2W models to gain money, and that while the opportunity to get more income out of cosmetics is ignored.

This all looks amazing, especially the Beorning bows, axe bonus, & cosmetic weapon options... Gotta go update Bullroarer now.
Thanks.

Never understood why beornings need a bow, well I guess more stats is nice but bow is totally useless.

The advancement of some of the legacies is being rendered virtually meaningless, which is a very welcome change. The less legacy tiers we have to unlock, the better.

Also, the fact that no useless legacies are being made useful with the additions is a good thing, as I'm not sure anyone would want to change legacies based on these alterations.

You can drop another 42 Empowerment Scrolls into your LI to help beat the new EBs... oh wait.. you don't need gear for EBs.

Looks like a challenge-free update sadly.


I really hope this new update is not an epic battle fest, last time that happened - central gondor - I quit for 3 months, and when I came back so had all my in-game friends.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by siipperi

Never understood why beornings need a bow, well I guess more stats is nice but bow is totally useless.

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In The Hobbit (book), Beorn gives Thorin and Co. a bunch of bows and arrows, meaning he had some and could probably use them, so it makes sense that his descendants would also be trained in archery.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

• You can now turn off your weapons when they are sheathed by clicking the new eye icons in the cosmetic outfit page. In combat, the weapons will reappear.
• Cosmetic weapon visibility rules have been loosened. We have set up a number of categories of items that can be interchanged with each other: all one-handed weapons (including cosmetic-only items), all shields, two-handed clubs/swords/implements, and two-handed hammers/axes/halberds. All other categories (such as Staff, Spear, etc) can only be interchanged with other staffs, spears, etc.You can no longer waste a dye trying to dye shields in the wardrobe.
• Shields and weapons should again appear at their normal size.

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Really really nice!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Crafting:

• Crafters now have access to a tenth crafting tier: the Anórien crafting tier. Crafters of this tier can use Poplar, Anórien Skarn, Zircon, and Tattered Anórien Parchments to craft items for level 100 characters.
• All crafting nodes can now be harvested while mounted.
• All crafting materials stack to 500.
• There is no longer a distinction between Vegetable, Grain, and Pipe-weed Farmlands. There is now only one kind of Farmland.
• East Gondor craft nodes have been replaced with the tier 10 craft nodes also found in Old Anórien.

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Like it all. Yehaw

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Imbued Legendary Items:

• DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
• Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
• All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

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Oh, really? 8/9 new tiers for legacies? Isn't that a bit much for one normal upgrade?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Minstrel

Cry of the Chorus Cooldown now grants Ballad Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Triumphant Spirit Cooldown now grants Triumphant Spirit Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rally Cooldown now grants Major Ballad Healing after Tier 35.

Anthem Duration now grants Melee Skills Critical Rating after Tier 35.

Still as Death Cooldown now grants Song of Distraction Cooldown after Tier 35.

Call to Ioreth Cooldown now grants Call to Ioreth Healing Skills Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

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Melee critical rating as minstrel? What is that good for? They have only one melee skill and are not considered to be melees...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Class changes:

• Beornings now have access to Bows.
• The Beorning Club-damage trait now applies to axes as well.
• Beornings with more than 100 Wrath should gain +15% Crit Chance from the Wrathful trait, instead of +0%.
• Champion Horns can no longer miss. They can still be resisted.
• Minstrel - Call to Ioreth now grants +5% critical magnitude to healing skills, in addition to making the next healing skill automatically a critical hit.
• Wardens will now animate properly when using the Taunt skill when unarmed.

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Nice fixes, especially Beornings getting ranged weapons with stats :)

I would still really like to know, if there will ever be a higher levelcap and if, what will happen to inspired legendary items then.
And: when will it be possible to inspire legendary items below lvl100? Leveling toons and trashing items all the way up for 50 levels is still bad. One cant even really play with the system, as one levels faster than the weapons. If we could inspire since lvl60, we could work with the system from the beginning and there would be a reason to put efford in weapons from there on. Not just trash everything and have a closer look at it when finally reaching lvl100.

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All 6-man and 12-man Roving Threats now have a chance to drop Morgul Crests.

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Why would you do this? The Morgul Crests should drop only from T2C chests in Osgiliath instances, not from these Roving Threats (while not always a faceroll, are significantly easier that even the 3man Osgiliath instances, when not exploited).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Morfinniel_Elvellon

Why would you do this? The Morgul Crests should drop only from T2C chests in Osgiliath instances, not from these Roving Threats (while not always a faceroll, are significantly easier that even the 3man Osgiliath instances, when not exploited).

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It has a "chance" to drop morgul crests, knowing turbine this % will be very small and probably not worth the time to go do RTs instead of the Osgiliath instances. I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Quote:

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Rally Cooldown now grants Major Ballad Healing after Tier 35.
Anthem Duration now grants Melee Skills Critical Rating after Tier 35.

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These are both 110% useless. Think of another bonus.

Quote:

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Added an audio option to disable combat music. When checked, landscape music plays uninterrupted by combat.

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Very good addition.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Morfinniel_Elvellon

Why would you do this? The Morgul Crests should drop only from T2C chests in Osgiliath instances, not from these Roving Threats (while not always a faceroll, are significantly easier that even the 3man Osgiliath instances, when not exploited).

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I don't know. It's been quite a while since Osgilliath was the new 'best' gear, and a large amount of people who have the gear currently exploited in one form or another to get it anyway. It's a random chance, so, is just a random 'extra' way to get the crests. Provided it's still significantly faster to do T2C instances I'm not sure it's a huge issue that there are other very extreme ways to acquire the currency. So long as this is a very limited drop and doesn't start constant Roving Threat farm trains I don't see an issue with another small avenue of acquiring the currency.

Hopefully there's a similar instance cluster coming in U18 after Minas Tirith. That would make Osgilliath gear becoming more accessible have even more sense to it.

Looks great!

Is there a new crafting rep tier? I need to start making emblems if so...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Statement: As predicted, those who thought imbuement would be the end to the LI grind were kidding themselves. You may not be destroying your LI (hooray!), but you're still going to suddenly need to grind out another 42 Scrolls of Empowerment and four star-lit crystals. That's more grinding than we had to do to replace an entire LI under the prior system. Gee, I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls of Empowerment and Star-lit Crystals in the Store?

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No, you don't "need" to grind out anything. If you want to have the highest powered LIs, you will certainly have to put forth the effort. But maxed out LIs are by no means necessary for any content in this game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gildhur

No, you don't "need" to grind out anything. If you want to have the highest powered LIs, you will certainly have to put forth the effort. But maxed out LIs are by no means necessary for any content in this game.

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It's amazing to me that people don't get tired of making this specious, spurious argument every time someone points out that not only is there an egregious grind, but that the Store has likely caused the grind to be more egregious than it otherwise would have been.

Nobody "needs" to play this game at all. So we can probably stop playing pedantic, semantic games with the word "need." A certain playstyle enjoys playing this game and maximizing their characters. Those players have every right to weigh in on what level of grind seems appropriate. Especially when there's reason to believe that the amount of grind is artificially increased by the present business model.

As for this arbitrary standard of "you don't need it to complete content". . . that's been addressed and been demonstrated to be so utterly irrelevant so many times that it just boggles my mind that people continue to use it as some bizarre benchmark for determining what feedback is legitimate and what feedback is not.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Cosmetic Weapons:

• Cosmetic weapon visibility rules have been loosened. We have set up a number of categories of items that can be interchanged with each other: all one-handed weapons (including cosmetic-only items), all shields, two-handed clubs/swords/implements, and two-handed hammers/axes/halberds. All other categories (such as Staff, Spear, etc) can only be interchanged with other staffs, spears, etc.

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Can we please have Spear - Staff cosmetic interchangability?

I'm sure you have a reason for it not being so, but depending on what that reason is, I'd very much like this reconsidered. If it's a technical issue with clipping or how it is wielded in combat (graphically) then I can understand and would resignedly accept it. If it's a reason determined by a person's preferences I'd vehemently ask for this to be reconsidered and approved. From the moment I made my LM and saw the spear cosmetics I've wanted to use them instead of the many rather horrible staff cosmetics (especially Legendary cosmetics). Real world weapon techniques for spears and (Lotro style) staffs are very similar in how they are used, with the only difference being the sharp pointy end on the spear.

So once again, please let Lore Masters look as badazz as everyone else!

Dont mean at all to be ungrateful for the crafting item stack size changes, but would it be possible to get a similar raise for the following items?

• Task Items (250-500)
• Crafting Recipe Scrolls (250-500)
• Consumables (100-250; crafted stuff can be 100 for example, if needed (pots are a big issue though with capping stacks easily), but at least Premium Perks should be 250)

Would be a great help, mainly for management. I hate needing more than one slot of space for any one item type, and 250-500 is great for being able to really not worry about that. 50 is just too small for most occasions. Anyways, thanks soooo much for adding it even for crafting items, cut down my required storage space for them in total by about 2/3, and over 300 slots of space.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

It's amazing to me that people don't get tired of making this specious, spurious argument every time someone points out that not only is there an egregious grind, but that the Store has likely caused the grind to be more egregious than it otherwise would have been.

Nobody "needs" to play this game at all. So we can probably stop playing pedantic, semantic games with the word "need." A certain playstyle enjoys playing this game and maximizing their characters. Those players have every right to weigh in on what level of grind seems appropriate. Especially when there's reason to believe that the amount of grind is artificially increased by the present business model.

As for this arbitrary standard of "you don't need it to complete content". . . that's been addressed and been demonstrated to be so utterly irrelevant so many times that it just boggles my mind that people continue to use it as some bizarre benchmark for determining what feedback is legitimate and what feedback is not.

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A) You're the one who said you NEED to, not us.

B) I don't know if we ever said "Well, that's it, 35s across the board, will never need to do anything again. I know they never said that...in fact, I think I remember something to the extent of exactly this...instead of having to make new LIs, the alternative would be in the form of unlocking additional tiers...some to be given out, and then more that could be acquired through Empowerment. Of course, if Imbuement didn't exist and you had L105 or L110 LIs, would you say "Well, time for new LIs," or would you object that now you have to buy new Empowerment Scrolls, and new Starlits, and new Rememberances, and new Delving Scrolls, and it's all P2W grind for the store...basically, what you're saying now.

That having been said, they probably are adding too many tiers at once. I'd be happy to have them spread out over two updates, to be honest.

The performance in this instance is horrible.

http://i.imgur.com/N27De5x.jpg

I rest my case.

PS. in before someone try to teach me about graphics and smooth gameplay. 2015 vs 2009 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vUtSE4gKUk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ride_the_Train

I realize that the update is a pretty major content addition, but is there any chance of getting the bowstring bug fixed as part of U17? Still there as of 16.5, which replaced the original 16.5, which became 16.4.2. :)

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A dev said it's been fixed, should come out with a future update. Given the testing cycle, plan for it coming out about this time next year.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by siipperi

Never understood why beornings need a bow, well I guess more stats is nice but bow is totally useless.

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When boernings first came out, it was really annoying for them to try to pull a group of ranged mobs. They get bows for the same reason that bows were added to champions.

Out of curiosity, why isn't the cross-weapon cosmetics open to halberds as swords? Is there some issue with skill animations, perhaps?

Still no Mighty armor for Beornings in Dol Amroth? These swan-knights must really hate beary people D:

But with the change in Morgul Crest dropped by Roving Threat and Crafting, I guess developers try to goad players to these options instead.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TKH

Still no Mighty armor for Beornings in Dol Amroth? These swan-knights must really hate beary people D:

But with the change in Morgul Crest dropped by Roving Threat and Crafting, I guess developers try to goad players to these options instead.

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Crafted armor and faramirs armor are always options.

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Originally Posted by siipperi

Crafted armor and faramirs armor are always options.

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Two out of three for other classes. Only two for Beornings.

Anyway, I like shiny new things, so I can just shrug about DA Might essence armor set and strive for whatever new set in new regions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laerien

The performance in this instance is horrible.

http://i.imgur.com/N27De5x.jpg

I rest my case.

PS. in before someone try to teach me about graphics and smooth gameplay. 2015 vs 2009 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vUtSE4gKUk

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It's been clear since the release of Riders of Rohan that Turbine are willing to release graphic content that their game engine can't display smoothly (ie somewhere close to 60fps) and that they are unable/unwilling to upgrade the engine to handle the graphics.

It's just another part of Lotro that we have to accept that Turbine won't fix.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

The following release notes are for the Bullroarer public test server only and may not reflect the final list of changes or updates included at release.

These notes are not final and should be viewed as a work in progress and subject to change.

The Eyes and Guard Tavern is now open!
Your live characters may be copied to Bullroarer. In your normal game launcher, access the transfer service, select your server, select characters, select copy to Bullroarer. Copies via the transfer service CANNOT currently be accessed from the Bullroarer launcher.

Important Note: Please be aware that the build you are seeing here is a work in progress and is by no means the finished Update 17 product. There are items that are not yet complete. There may also be items missing from this initial list, this is not intentional and will be added as we progress.

Known Issues:

1. German and French localization for this beta build is missing in many many places.
2. The Epic book quests are not available during this open beta.
3. The Epic Battle: Hammer of the Underworld is not available during this open beta.
4. In the Epic Battle: Defence of Minas Tirith, the secondary quest "Despair in the Streets" is not fully implemented, and the portcullis doors currently interfere with soldier movement. Additionally, difficulty balance is not complete for the epic battles.
5. In Minas Tirith, Bergil's quests are not completable.

Release Notes:
Update 17 includes Old Anórien with three new regions (Talath Anor, Pelennor Fields, and Minas Tirith), two new epic battles, a new crafting tier, and an extension of the imbued legendary item system. You can also see a beta version of our new Store.

Cosmetic Weapons:

• You can now turn off your weapons when they are sheathed by clicking the new eye icons in the cosmetic outfit page. In combat, the weapons will reappear.
• Cosmetic weapon visibility rules have been loosened. We have set up a number of categories of items that can be interchanged with each other: all one-handed weapons (including cosmetic-only items), all shields, two-handed clubs/swords/implements, and two-handed hammers/axes/halberds. All other categories (such as Staff, Spear, etc) can only be interchanged with other staffs, spears, etc.You can no longer waste a dye trying to dye shields in the wardrobe.
• Shields and weapons should again appear at their normal size.

Crafting:

• Crafters now have access to a tenth crafting tier: the Anórien crafting tier. Crafters of this tier can use Poplar, Anórien Skarn, Zircon, and Tattered Anórien Parchments to craft items for level 100 characters.
• All crafting nodes can now be harvested while mounted.
• All crafting materials stack to 500.
• There is no longer a distinction between Vegetable, Grain, and Pipe-weed Farmlands. There is now only one kind of Farmland.
• East Gondor craft nodes have been replaced with the tier 10 craft nodes also found in Old Anórien.

Imbued Legendary Items:

• DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
• Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
• All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

Burglar

Burglar's Gamble Chance Legacy now gives Cash Out Damage after tier 35.

Captain

Muster Courage Fear Resist now grants Shield/Song/Blade-brother Critical Defence after Tier 35.

Champion

Swift Strike/Swift Blade Power Cost has a maximum tier of 38.

Guardian

Guardian's Pledge Cooldown now gives Retaliation Damage after Tier 35.

Guardian's Pledge Magnitude now gives Shield Swipe Damage after tier 35.

Turn the Tables Cooldown now gives Turn the Tables Damage after tier 35.

Hunter

Strength Quick Shot Slow now gives more chance to get extra Focus after tier 35.

Quick Shot Critical Chance now gives more Quick Shot critical damage after tier 35.

Loremaster

Signs of Power Durations now grants Signs of Power Debuff Rating after Tier 35.

Minstrel

Cry of the Chorus Cooldown now grants Ballad Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Triumphant Spirit Cooldown now grants Triumphant Spirit Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rally Cooldown now grants Major Ballad Healing after Tier 35.

Anthem Duration now grants Melee Skills Critical Rating after Tier 35.

Still as Death Cooldown now grants Song of Distraction Cooldown after Tier 35.

Call to Ioreth Cooldown now grants Call to Ioreth Healing Skills Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rune-Keeper

Healing Attuned Power Cost now grants Revive Morale and Power Restoration after Tier 35.

Battle Attuned Power Cost now grants Chill of Winter Target Resistance penalty after Tier 35.

Steady Attuned Power Cost now grants Armour of the Elements Tactical Mitigation after Tier 35.

Class changes:

• Beornings now have access to Bows.
• The Beorning Club-damage trait now applies to axes as well.
• Beornings with more than 100 Wrath should gain +15% Crit Chance from the Wrathful trait, instead of +0%.
• Champion Horns can no longer miss. They can still be resisted.
• Minstrel - Call to Ioreth now grants +5% critical magnitude to healing skills, in addition to making the next healing skill automatically a critical hit.
• Wardens will now animate properly when using the Taunt skill when unarmed.

Other stuff:

• Hope Tokens now have a 3-minute cooldown, instead of 15 minutes.
• All 6-man and 12-man Roving Threats now have a chance to drop Morgul Crests.
• The Dome of Stars, The Ruined City, and The Sunken Labyrinth now all give 1 Morgul Crest upon completion of the tier 2 instance. This is in addition to any Morgul Crests from the tier 2 Challenge chest.
• Epic Battles - fixed merit progress display for some of the secondary quests which used to not show any progress at all.
• There's a new option that allows you to control the opacity of floating names on the UI Settings options page.
• Added an audio option to disable combat music. When checked, landscape music plays uninterrupted by combat.
• A handful of tweaks have been made to the player music system: Bagpipe notes should no longer clip, the Misty Mountain Harp has had its note lengths slightly shortened, and the Theorbo's seven highest notes should now sound more like a Theorbo.
• Level-scaled players should no longer lose their scaling buff when teleporting between Ettenmoors and Osgiliath.
• In the Battle for Osgiliath, Creep NPCs have less Morale and Freep NPCs have more.
• The store now has a minimum width of 600px to prevent the scrollbar from disappearing.

---

Some nice things i particularly like the idea of bieng able to hide sheathed weapons. No more walking around with your bow and sword sticking out of you cloak.

Quick shot boost...again? Is Hunter now named Red Line Hunter? I find that extremely bad. All we ask for is a boost to blue and yellow.

Bah.

It's not a little oopsie. It's a big, bad oops.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Imbued Legendary Items:

• DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
• Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
• All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

---

Can we get a revamp on Stats (Vitality, Might, Agility, Will, Fate) along with a proper rating to % formula. Some are useless others are not desired over raw Mastery.
Keep the same legacies for pre-/post-imbument so there is no reason to not imbue or a have a non-imbued swap LI.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Burglar

Burglar's Gamble Chance Legacy now gives Cash Out Damage after tier 35.

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Gamble Chance is too high to begin with and makes the RNG factor of this traitline pointless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tybur

Captain

Muster Courage Fear Resist now grants Shield/Song/Blade-brother Critical Defence after Tier 35.

---

Minimal benefit...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Champion

Swift Strike/Swift Blade Power Cost has a maximum tier of 38.

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So whats the point of imbued LI?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Guardian

Guardian's Pledge Cooldown now gives Retaliation Damage after Tier 35.

Guardian's Pledge Magnitude now gives Shield Swipe Damage after tier 35.

Turn the Tables Cooldown now gives Turn the Tables Damage after tier 35.

---

Too random & pointless. Why not combine Pledge CD with Magnitude(minimal increase)?
Add a new legacy: Parry Response Skill Damage or Melee Skill Critical Multiplier
Guardians Area of Effect Skill Damage should also increase targets. (+5 like pre-Imbument)
Shield Damage legacy (Belt) gives same amount pre-/post imbuement (25%)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Hunter

Strength Quick Shot Slow now gives more chance to get extra Focus after tier 35.

Quick Shot Critical Chance now gives more Quick Shot critical damage after tier 35.

---

Replace QS Slow legacy with Focus Bow Damage(1.5x/2x of what Induction Bow damage gives). (60% slow is broken in PvE/PvP and not needed along with Champions Duel Slow)
There are too many Induction Bow legacies, traits, BB-set that will eventually make Focus Bow skills obsolete.
I like the second one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Minstrel

Cry of the Chorus Cooldown now grants Ballad Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Triumphant Spirit Cooldown now grants Triumphant Spirit Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

Rally Cooldown now grants Major Ballad Healing after Tier 35.

Anthem Duration now grants Melee Skills Critical Rating after Tier 35.

Still as Death Cooldown now grants Song of Distraction Cooldown after Tier 35.

Call to Ioreth Cooldown now grants Call to Ioreth Healing Skills Critical Magnitude after Tier 35.

---

Some are pointless, minis dont needs any buffs to healing. They could use some improvement to yellowline/anthem buffs.

"Increase CD of Bolster Courage to 1.5s and remove AoE heal passive from blueline
Increase Power Costs on healing skills
Remove CD of Raise the Spirit
Slightly buff Inspire Fellow, maybe lower CD by 1-2s.
Increase CD of Triumphant Spirit, Cry of the Chorus and Still As Death."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Rune-Keeper

Healing Attuned Power Cost now grants Revive Morale and Power Restoration after Tier 35.

Battle Attuned Power Cost now grants Chill of Winter Target Resistance penalty after Tier 35.

Steady Attuned Power Cost now grants Armour of the Elements Tactical Mitigation after Tier 35.

---

They are too random but whatever...

Good Suggestions:
https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...ated-for-16-2)
https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...balance-update

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Casilune

A) You're the one who said you NEED to, not us.

---

Yes, and you (plural, since you said "us") are the ones who take that word, seize upon it, attach all sorts of pedantic, silly, and inappropriate ramifications to its usage, and use those to as an excuse to ignore the overall point: The LI grind has gotten worse (ie., more egregious, steeper, and "reset" more often) not better, under Imbuement. In the end, these are all just pixels on a screen that we spend our time maxing out and it matters not one whit by the time we get them there whether we had to destroy them and start all over or we merely "added" On to existing ones. . . we still end up with the same pixels on our screen representing a "maxed out" LI under that can go no further. And in the end, we're putting far more time into the post-imbuement LI grind than we ever had to do under the pre-imbuement grind. It's just disguised better.

But, again, I don't hold this against Turbine. They had to figure out a way to monetize the system in the era of no level-cap increases after all. Under their adopted business model, they pretty much have to do this. And it's our fault for making the business model so lucrative (being willing to indulge a business model that allows us to buy our way through/around game systems we don't enjoy incentivizes the creation/perpetuation of game systems we don't enjoy).

Quote:

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That having been said, they probably are adding too many tiers at once.

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Lovely, so take issue with the word "need" and pretend to make a counter-argument only to come back and agree with me overall. *sigh*

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Guardian

Guardian's Pledge Cooldown now gives Retaliation Damage after Tier 35.

Guardian's Pledge Magnitude now gives Shield Swipe Damage after tier 35.

---

These don't make sense to me. If you don't want the legacy to grow past 35 as-is, why introduce a DPS buff to a mostly tanking skill? Why not introduce a buff >35 that's related to the original legacy we picked upon imbuement?

Perhaps others see this differently, but as a tanking guardian, I see no reason to invest in the new tiers for these legacies.

Well, I just imbued my belt as I see no reason to invest in ILI for tanking purpose.

That means I will have less work to do ^^

can anybody help me? i m geting this ... they didn't open the server?
http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...arhsa/fail.png

Bows for beornings and not for burglars? Been wanting them for so long :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Feandir_86

Bows for beornings and not for burglars? Been wanting them for so long :(

---

For bear it will actually serve a purpose. They're adding a new trait to yellow line called Scented Arrows, iirc. It's a stacking HoT that bolsters the morale of allies standing around the target the arrows are hitting.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Morfinniel_Elvellon

Why would you do this? The Morgul Crests should drop only from T2C chests in Osgiliath instances, not from these Roving Threats (while not always a faceroll, are significantly easier that even the 3man Osgiliath instances, when not exploited).

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Morgul Crests already drop on live servers from RT. Did Mirkwood, Esteldin and Tinnudir Roving threads on tuesday, and one player in the group did get one morgul crest - so it was for us about 1% chance.

Related to U17 - no new raid. I find it disappointing.
And 9 new levels on legendary items, without any upgrade on creep-side... My hunter will like it, my warg will definitely hate it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Warmutkan

These don't make sense to me. If you don't want the legacy to grow past 35 as-is, why introduce a DPS buff to a mostly tanking skill? Why not introduce a buff >35 that's related to the original legacy we picked upon imbuement?

Perhaps others see this differently, but as a tanking guardian, I see no reason to invest in the new tiers for these legacies.

---

I would, over time, definitely invest in these legacies. While they aren't strictly tied to the legacies before them they are marginally useful. Extra damage when tanking = more threat. Though I think perhaps retaliation damage is a bit underwhelming.

The issue I am having with these new legacies is adding bloat to the legacy/skill pool.

That and the fact that Turbine didn't even touch Warden legacies, or the class at all, other than adding a useless new shield.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by siipperi

Never understood why beornings need a bow, well I guess more stats is nice but bow is totally useless.

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It brings beornings inline with other classes in having something to slot. Rks have chisels and riffliers, minis instruments, bugs signal, Capps banners, etc. Why bows? Easier to wave a wand and say beornings can use bows which already exist than to create a beorning specific item then have to make crafting recipies, world drops, quest rewards etc for it.

Probably because halberds aren't usually wielded exclusively with one hand like swords are -- they're more of a two-handed polearm, except for Captains. Must be different animations.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

One question and one statement:

Question: Will there be a new Scroll of Empowerment introduced or will Anfalas Scrolls of Empowerment continue to work to increase legacies? I suspect Anfalas will still work since I can't quite get my head around how they'd suddenly require a newer type.

Statement: As predicted, those who thought imbuement would be the end to the LI grind were kidding themselves. You may not be destroying your LI (hooray!), but you're still going to suddenly need to grind out another 42 Scrolls of Empowerment and four star-lit crystals. That's more grinding than we had to do to replace an entire LI under the prior system. Gee, I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls of Empowerment and Star-lit Crystals in the Store?

In Turbine's defense: They had to find some way of continuing to generate revenue from LIs in an era of no level-cap increases. And at least we can grind out Scrolls of Empowerment a bit easier now (via Training Exercise instance, assuming it's still a valid means post-update). Still, I have a hard time believing the system would look like this or be incremented so rapidly under a subscription model (though the game might not still exist under a subscription model).

---

Yeah this update solidifes my fears of the imbuement system just being a flashy way to generate store sales, which is fine as the entire LI system has always been that. But to blatantly give your customers something with the words of :To lessen the LI Grind" and than make the grind much much more than it was is a slap in the face and aor a joke to those same customers.

Imbuement could have been much much more. Turbine, we should only have to use 2 or 3 scrolls of empowerment on each legacy with each update. 3 starlight crystals with each update. Any more is overkill and pushes people away

• Morgul Crest should not drop at level 50 T2 dungeons.... ( but they do )
• Stattomes up to 20? Please dont make this more Pay2Win then it already is.... Its just to signifikant in the endgame... (Well what endgame actually xD)
• up to 8-9 Tiers on legendary weapons? Thats WAY to high! Make it 3 or 4 at max...

Other then that i feel then concept of the patch is alright. But just 2 big battles and no dungeons or at least bugfixes to the current endgame dungeons? Thats kinda sad..

Edit: Do you guys have at least one Person in charge who play the game and thinks about balancing? I feel its just people who do not play making decisions on a gut feeling.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Macroscian

Quick shot boost...again? Is Hunter now named Red Line Hunter? I find that extremely bad. All we ask for is a boost to blue and yellow.

Bah.

It's not a little oopsie. It's a big, bad oops.

---

I think you really need to revisit your skilltree panel and read everything carefully there and rethink your hunter's playstyle.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kickman77

Yeah this update solidifes my fears of the imbuement system just being a flashy way to generate store sales, which is fine as the entire LI system has always been that. But to blatantly give your customers something with the words of :To lessen the LI Grind" and than make the grind much much more than it was is a slap in the face and aor a joke to those same customers.

Imbuement could have been much much more. Turbine, we should only have to use 2 or 3 scrolls of empowerment on each legacy with each update. 3 starlight crystals with each update. Any more is overkill and pushes people away

---

This don't surprise me any, this is classic Turbine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Macroscian

Quick shot boost...again? Is Hunter now named Red Line Hunter? I find that extremely bad. All we ask for is a boost to blue and yellow.

Bah.

It's not a little oopsie. It's a big, bad oops.

---

lol yellow is a laughably overpowered line with that stupid chain root and only thing it needs is being entirely removed from the game.
Same for blue's laughable 60% slow with 0s cd and usable on the move without movement restriction.
Things who can't even come melee, yeah sure they need a buff ./sarcasm

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Oelle

Melee critical rating as minstrel? What is that good for? They have only one melee skill and are not considered to be melees...

---

I imagine it's because it's on an anthem legacy. Anthems are used to buff the whole group, not just the minstrel. It's not really any different than Anthem of War, buffing melee/ranged damage or +phys mastery. None of those are useful for a minstrel either.

That being said, I think the Major Ballad Healing is worthless, as someone else mentioned. Who heals with their major ballad? When I'm in resonance I might spam that to build to my coda, but I certainly don't use it for any valuable healing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Yes, and you (plural, since you said "us") are the ones who take that word, seize upon it, attach all sorts of pedantic, silly, and inappropriate ramifications to its usage, and use those to as an excuse to ignore the overall point: The LI grind has gotten worse (ie., more egregious, steeper, and "reset" more often) not better, under Imbuement. In the end, these are all just pixels on a screen that we spend our time maxing out and it matters not one whit by the time we get them there whether we had to destroy them and start all over or we merely "added" On to existing ones. . . we still end up with the same pixels on our screen representing a "maxed out" LI under that can go no further. And in the end, we're putting far more time into the post-imbuement LI grind than we ever had to do under the pre-imbuement grind. It's just disguised better.

But, again, I don't hold this against Turbine. They had to figure out a way to monetize the system in the era of no level-cap increases after all. Under their adopted business model, they pretty much have to do this. And it's our fault for making the business model so lucrative (being willing to indulge a business model that allows us to buy our way through/around game systems we don't enjoy incentivizes the creation/perpetuation of game systems we don't enjoy).


Lovely, so take issue with the word "need" and pretend to make a counter-argument only to come back and agree with me overall. *sigh*

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Because I don't. The only part I concur with is putting them all at once. I saw nothing from you that suggested that you had no issue with splitting them up, only issue that you had to do it at all. Now if that WAS your point, then fine.

By the way...would it interest you to know that I have bought zero Empowerment or Delving scrolls from the store since Imbuement? Very P2W on my end, indeed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aleziana

can anybody help me? i m geting this ... they didn't open the server?

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If you type "unable to decrypt" LOTRO in Google, you will find many threads were some people resolved this bug (client_highres_aux_1.datx, ...)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mar-Evayave

I imagine it's because it's on an anthem legacy. Anthems are used to buff the whole group, not just the minstrel. It's not really any different than Anthem of War, buffing melee/ranged damage or +phys mastery. None of those are useful for a minstrel either.

That being said, I think the Major Ballad Healing is worthless, as someone else mentioned. Who heals with their major ballad? When I'm in resonance I might spam that to build to my coda, but I certainly don't use it for any valuable healing.

---

Reason I'm not sure about the Anthem aspect is that it doesn't suggest there that the crit buff is being added to an anthem, because if it is, it doesn't say which one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Casilune

Because I don't. The only part I concur with is putting them all at once.

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Don't look now, but saying they shouldn't be "putting them in all at once" and "the grind is more egregious than it should be" are the exact same thing.

Try this. . .

They raised it by 42 legacy tiers increases this time. And they raise it by 42 the next time. And they raise it by 42 the time after that.

Now, you say they should have done half now, and half the next time. Which results in. . .

21 legacy tier increases this time. And they raise it by 21 the next time. And they raise it by 21 the time after that.

That's the difference between an egregious grind and a not-so-egregious grind.

So, yes. You are agreeing with me. And it's sad that it needs to be explained how what you are saying is exactly what I'm saying. But that's what you have to do when arguing on the internet.

--H

Would it be possible to get the mounted looting for chests/corpses/backpacks? Pretty much last thing, other than early-game quest items, that break being mounted.

Incidentally, the need for 42 scrolls of empowerment to max out an LI again really should be seen as 84. Unless you don't care to max out your Class Item.

84 Scrolls each time the system is incremented? Nah, I'm sure that has nothing to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls in the Store. :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Incidentally, the need for 42 scrolls of empowerment to max out an LI again really should be seen as 84. Unless you don't care to max out your Class Item.

84 Scrolls each time the system is incremented? Nah, I'm sure that has nothing to do with the fact that they sell Scrolls in the Store. :rolleyes:

---

I threw up my hands and decided to only do 1 LI for each character but have 2 at max so thats still 84 scrolls.

My question is - I left my stat legacies at 33 on my 2nd character. Will they gain the new availability or would I need to raise them to 35 to get it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mar-Evayave

I imagine it's because it's on an anthem legacy. Anthems are used to buff the whole group, not just the minstrel. It's not really any different than Anthem of War, buffing melee/ranged damage or +phys mastery. None of those are useful for a minstrel either.

That being said, I think the Major Ballad Healing is worthless, as someone else mentioned. Who heals with their major ballad? When I'm in resonance I might spam that to build to my coda, but I certainly don't use it for any valuable healing.

---

It all depends how big the boost of major ballad legacy is. If its 50-100% it could actually be interesting. If its just 10% its totally useless.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

So, yes. You are agreeing with me. And it's sad that it needs to be explained how what you are saying is exactly what I'm saying. But that's what you have to do when arguing on the internet

--H

---

A) Whether you intended it or not, I'm getting an impression from you of 'Why should we have to do this at all?' as if Turbine said 'Guess what? No more grind ever.' Something they never said, just some players inferred.

B) Tell me...is there a reason you're coming across as so rude?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Casilune

A) Whether you intended it or not, I'm getting an impression from you of 'Why should we have to do this at all?' as if Turbine said 'Guess what? No more grind ever.' Something they never said, just some players inferred.

---

Nope. Always expected the Imbuement system to be incremented. I'm on record as such both here on the forums and in the video I posted explaining the system. But 84 Scrolls of Empowerment (weapon + class item) upon every increase? As you said, that's egregious. Indeed, it's ridiculous. And whether we "need" to do it is totally, utterly, completely irrelevant. We don't need to do anything in this game. But when we set goals for ourselves in this game, it would be nice to think that what's needed to achieve those goals are being determined by what's considered fun and compelling gameplay. Instead, the F2P/Store business model is intended to cause you to despair of ever reaching your goal(s) through gameplay, and instead just pay to get there. That's no longer an enjoyable game to me and many others.

Quote:

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B) Tell me...is there a reason you're coming across as so rude?

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To me, it's more rude to post un-(self)-examined, specious arguments and leave it to the person with whom you're feigning disagreement to explain why the argument is specious. That's what we get all the time when people fall back on all the tired, debunked "you don't need this to finish content". . . "the Store doesn't affect you if you ignore it". . . "if you don't like it, quit" excuses for the Store business model corrupting the integrity of the game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Nope. Always expected the Imbuement system to be incremented. I'm on record as such both here on the forums and in the video I posted explaining the system. But 84 Scrolls of Empowerment (weapon + class item) upon every increase? As you said, that's egregious. Indeed, it's ridiculous. And whether we "need" to do it is totally, utterly, completely irrelevant. We don't need to do anything in this game. But when we set goals for ourselves in this game, it would be nice to think that what's needed to achieve those goals are being determined by what's considered fun and compelling gameplay. Instead, the F2P/Store business model is intended to cause you to despair of ever reaching your goal(s) through gameplay, and instead just pay to get there. That's no longer an enjoyable game to me and many others.


To me, it's more rude to post un-(self)-examined, specious arguments and leave it to the person with whom you're feigning disagreement to explain why the argument is specious. That's what we get all the time when people fall back on all the tired, debunked "you don't need this to finish content". . . "the Store doesn't affect you if you ignore it". . . "if you don't like it, quit" excuses for the Store business model corrupting the integrity of the game.

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I like the store, I like being able to buy things that lessen the grind for me. Good thing I have a nice job that allows me to do this. Plus, it puts money back into the game so they can create more content. So, I say put more stuff in the store so I can buy it!!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Macroscian

Quick shot boost...again? Is Hunter now named Red Line Hunter? I find that extremely bad. All we ask for is a boost to blue and yellow.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CaerArianrhod

I think you really need to revisit your skilltree panel and read everything carefully there and rethink your hunter's playstyle.

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I just can't see the utility of a qs leg on a yellow bow.

*accidental extra post instead of edit*

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gildhur

Is there a new crafting rep tier? I need to start making emblems if so...

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From what I saw in another thread, no, but it would be nice to get confirmation, since I'd like to start marking guild rep items as well if that's happening.

In the future, can we expect a peaceful version of Minas Tirith, with blue skies?
Could be after we're done with Sauron, not necessarily right away. Just might be nice for RP and screenshots.

Also, is there a release date for U17?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

But 84 Scrolls of Empowerment (weapon + class item) upon every increase? As you said, that's egregious. Indeed, it's ridiculous.

---

Agreed. This is a lot of grind; even though I don't plan to upgrade all of my legacies, I have 3 imbued LI's on my main (and one on my alt but at this point I just don't have the time), so I'm looking at 13 legacies I'd want to upgrade...78 scrolls.

What we need is a way to exchange Gold Dol Amroth tokens for Silver DA tokens. That or a more reliable way of earning the Silver DA tokens.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rwraith

I like the store, I like being able to buy things that lessen the grind for me.

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Which of course undermines the game as a game to be played. By buying your way around grinds, you incentivize the creation of an ever-more-grindy game. A game not intended to be played, but instead a game intended to annoy you into buying your way around vast swaths of it. Which harms not only the game's integrity, but also tends to make goals all the more difficult to achieve for those laboring under the quaint assumption that games are intended to be fun and to be played.

Quote:

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Good thing I have a nice job that allows me to do this.

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As do I. As do most people. It's not a question of money. It's a question of perverse incentives and conflicts of interest inherent to the business model. To which you seem oblivious or, at best, indifferent.

You're why we can't have nice things. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

Cosmetic Weapons:

• You can now turn off your weapons when they are sheathed by clicking the new eye icons in the cosmetic outfit page. In combat, the weapons will reappear.
• Cosmetic weapon visibility rules have been loosened. We have set up a number of categories of items that can be interchanged with each other: all one-handed weapons (including cosmetic-only items), all shields, two-handed clubs/swords/implements, and two-handed hammers/axes/halberds. All other categories (such as Staff, Spear, etc) can only be interchanged with other staffs, spears, etc.You can no longer waste a dye trying to dye shields in the wardrobe.
• Shields and weapons should again appear at their normal size.

Crafting:

[*]All crafting materials stack to 500.


Class changes:

[*]Beornings now have access to Bows.[*]The Beorning Club-damage trait now applies to axes as well.


Other stuff:

[*]Hope Tokens now have a 3-minute cooldown, instead of 15 minutes.

---

Very happy to see these (highlights above)!

Especially cosmetic weapons being interchangeable for all one-handed ones, and shields finally appearing the size they should be. No more having a huge-a** shield on my hobbit mini. And no more hard choice between mace/club/sword, now I can have their appearances anytime.

Crafting mats stacking to 500 is wonderful QOL enhancement, and very generous since storage space does sell in store. Love it.

Beornings having a ranged pull will actually make me want to try out a beorning again. Melee-only was such a pain.

Reduced cooldown on Hope tokens is a relief... for a perpetual noob like me who dies a lot in instances/raids lol (but seriously, great change).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kickman77

Yeah this update solidifes my fears of the imbuement system just being a flashy way to generate store sales, which is fine as the entire LI system has always been that. But to blatantly give your customers something with the words of :To lessen the LI Grind" and than make the grind much much more than it was is a slap in the face and aor a joke to those same customers.

---

Do you have a link for this claim?

My recollection is that they never said anything about "lessening the grind". The selling point was that you would no longer have to destroy and recreate your LI at every level cap increase, which was viewed as contrary to the idea of a "legendary" item.

Having said that, the amount of grind they're forcing on us in this update is excessive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Solien

From what I saw in another thread, no, but it would be nice to get confirmation, since I'd like to start marking guild rep items as well if that's happening.

---

No new crafting guild tier. I checked the Tailor guild.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rainshade

In the future, can we expect a peaceful version of Minas Tirith, with blue skies?
Could be after we're done with Sauron, not necessarily right away. Just might be nice for RP and screenshots.

Also, is there a release date for U17?

---

No, but history suggests release 4 to 6 weeks from now.

Does anyone know if the virtue cap was increased?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Casilune

Reason I'm not sure about the Anthem aspect is that it doesn't suggest there that the crit buff is being added to an anthem, because if it is, it doesn't say which one.

---

Good point. That does beg the question of what the buff is actually being applied to. The user, or the anthem(s), and if the latter, all or just one/some.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by siipperi

It all depends how big the boost of major ballad legacy is. If its 50-100% it could actually be interesting. If its just 10% its totally useless.

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I'd be surprised if it was on the magnitude of 50-100%. I'd actually be somewhat surprised if it got as high as 25%. Really, any lower than 25% and it would pretty much be useless.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SjsharksBoy

Does anyone know if the virtue cap was increased?

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Not in this build.

"Wardens will now animate properly when using the Taunt skill when unarmed."

Can wardens learn Karate? :-P

Will Guardian Bleeds ever get fixed? Guards can steal bleeds from each other and I've sent in multiple tickets with combat logs showing Prey on the weak is the culprit. Guards can't group and all stack bleeds to tier 10 they just bounce back and forth.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Morfinniel_Elvellon

Why would you do this? The Morgul Crests should drop only from T2C chests in Osgiliath instances, not from these Roving Threats (while not always a faceroll, are significantly easier that even the 3man Osgiliath instances, when not exploited).

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They're always exploited lol. I've only ever been in one Osg run where people were willing to do the whole thing. Probably why I haven't got the 5 slot gear yet, nobody ever runs it properly = boring and frustrating. I'd rather kill whole RT's than grind 1/10 of an instance, even if the drop rate is minute in comparison. That said, maybe people will do both now.

A problem item

Somehow my Beorning ended up with a bound loremaster staff in the inventory. It can't be deleted from the bag; it can't be sold; it can't be deconstructed; it does not appear in the deconstruct item list; it can't be dragged and destroyed out of the bag. While of no use, it can be moved to the vault.

Store

The redeem code does not work. I can only conclude that coding for this command is not yet finished, so my feedback might be premature; or it was never intended to interact with the live store giveaway while still in beta.

will the crafted gear be getting a new appearance? or will we be reusing the 90 crafted look? *hopefully not*

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laerien

The performance in this instance is horrible.

http://i.imgur.com/N27De5x.jpg

I rest my case.

PS. in before someone try to teach me about graphics and smooth gameplay. 2015 vs 2009 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vUtSE4gKUk

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Even since Rohan,game does not have good optimization and because of that fps sucks.Just look at da for example,my cpu uses only 2 cores about 40%,gpu below 20% and because of that is hard to get 30fps+ and let's not speak about WIldermore

Just some thoughts that came up. It's first beta, so I know, there will be a lot of changes.


Minas Tirith/ Landscape Build:
My first impression of Minas Tirith definetly met my expectations. Beautifully done. The fields of Pelennor give the right impression of the upcoming siege and the war. Considering the time of the storyline, it's really getting exciting, now.



Crafting:
Great, to see a new crafting tier and nice to craft essence pieces myself.


Some points here:

Please reconsider the amount of 252 might/ will for the light and 252 agility for the Warden shield. The heavy shield only gives 218 vitality.
The shields from Osgiliath instances right now give 252 as biggest stat. Kind of disapointing to run an instance x-times to get a shield (RNG included), when a crafted one gives out the same amount.

So please, either raise the amount of vitality on the crafted heavy shield to match the others, or raise the amount of the main stat on the Osgiliath drops. And please add a vitality version of the Warden's shield.


It's great to finally see a shield with might as main-stat.


Really like the new cooking recipes.




Classes/ Changes to LI's:
Nice changes for the Beorning

I have to agree with others here, regarding the additions to Guardian Legacies: IMO a tanking build is not about damage. So why add damage to purely defensive Legacies?



Grinding out LI's:
So far, I have gone, where the grind took me. After imbuement was implemented, I was ok with the amount of work you had to put into an LI. And of course, people needed something to do and something to work on. With the raise of tiers with U17 it feels the same way as before, though. Rinse and repeat. So far, in almost 7 years, with several alts on level cap, I have not minded the grind. You finally got me there. With no raid and only three instances to work with, there is (again) no real reason to put in the work.

I am not calling for a raid here, since I do have an impression of the amount of work and stress going on right now (U17, new store, new hardware, server transfers and all the small things that have to be done).

Just, please, reconsider either the cost for Empowerment-Scrolls, or lower the amount of tiers added to LI's.

First: the new shop looks much more tidy than the current one. Is faster and much cleaner.

One thing that do not work well:
After a transaction, i have to go back to the start page of the shop and click through again to the category and to the page where i was before. I.e. if i buy a base stat like vitality XIII, i need to click down through the path to the stats' page again to be able to buy vitality XIV.
If would be better to offer two links in the confirmation page: one to the start page and one to the category page where the user was coming from.

And what about privacy and legal issues?
Why are the purchase confirmation emails coming from Xsolla <mailer@xsolla.com>? Make sure you got a Turbine email for sending that confirmation.
Albeit now we know, that you are using some cloud service from xolla, i have concerns about how you make sure, that xolla is not usig the collected data [e.g. credit card information] (through payment- and game analytics) for other purposes as for fulfill my requests for your services?
How can i be sure that in case of a problem with a shop transaction Turbine is the responsible organisation and not xolla?

Quote:

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Imbued Legendary Items:

DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

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This is just way too much too soon. I understand this system needs to be monetized because of the way it's been marketed in the past, but this is insane. Folks, you need to be careful with this. If this continues in this manner I know for one I just won't be bothered with it any more. I'm not doing DA dailies and Mark/Med farms for ever.

I would suggest halving these numbers at least.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CaerArianrhod

First: the new shop looks much more tidy than the current one. Is faster and much cleaner.

One thing that do not work well:
After a transaction, i have to go back to the start page of the shop and click through again to the category and to the page where i was before. I.e. if i buy a base stat like vitality XIII, i need to click down through the path to the stats' page again to be able to buy vitality XIV.
If would be better to offer two links in the confirmation page: one to the start page and one to the category page where the user was coming from.

And what about privacy and legal issues?
Why are the purchase confirmation emails coming from Xsolla <mailer@xsolla.com>? Make sure you got a Turbine email for sending that confirmation.
Albeit now we know, that you are using some cloud service from xolla, i have concerns about how you make sure, that xolla is not usig the collected data [e.g. credit card information] (through payment- and game analytics) for other purposes as for fulfill my requests for your services?
How can i be sure that in case of a problem with a shop transaction Turbine is the responsible organisation and not xolla?

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I have both of these concers as well and waas going to start a thread this mrning about it, until I saw your post.

The constant having to click over and over is insane, and not having a vart or option to purchase multiples (like bag saces or inventory or character slots) means you have to click over and over and over to get 3 things.

Than the back to game is so tiny and not coclored well enough, and if you dont click it, the game / store does some wonky stuff, like purchase the item again without confirmation

We hae tje option to turn off the confirmation screen, but noo option to turn it back on>

Because a lot of items dont give us the option to purchase multiple items and since no cart we get SPAMMED with emails. I made 12 purchases yesterday in the new store. In the old, I could use multiples and the cart and get 1 e-mail. Now I get flooded with 12 from an as mentioned above untrusted source. I did not agree to use xalta or whatever it is, and it seems shady . scary to me that my info like CC and paypal are up in the cloud. I personally avoid the cloud because its been proven to not be safe for data time and time again

The best part of this update is how freeps are getting stronger and creeps are getting nothing. That's pretty awesome!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pittcrew1

Dont mean at all to be ungrateful for the crafting item stack size changes, but would it be possible to get a similar raise for the following items?

• Task Items (250-500)
• Crafting Recipe Scrolls (250-500)
• Consumables (100-250; crafted stuff can be 100 for example, if needed (pots are a big issue though with capping stacks easily), but at least Premium Perks should be 250)

Would be a great help, mainly for management. I hate needing more than one slot of space for any one item type, and 250-500 is great for being able to really not worry about that. 50 is just too small for most occasions. Anyways, thanks soooo much for adding it even for crafting items, cut down my required storage space for them in total by about 2/3, and over 300 slots of space.

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Would love to see higher stack sizes for all the above items!

I don't think lowering the amount of unlockable legacy tiers (atm) is a step in the right direction, these said tiers will just keep piling on and on over the updates anyway, as most people (if not all) are just sick of this scroll grind (if costs remain the same, the time required for this grind will remain the same, the only thing that'll change is that we'll do a portion of it now and portions of it later on, and it'll be the same old grind, only worse). The better move would be to cut mark/med cost by more than half of what it is now. It should not be costing more than 200 meds per scroll. It's still going to be a ridiculous grind anyway, but at least it'll be a bit more comforting than what it is now. Also, as suggested by someone else earlier, trading gold DA tokens for silvers is also much needed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by avengingbananaslug

The best part of this update is how freeps are getting stronger and creeps are getting nothing. That's pretty awesome!

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That's been happening for as far as I know, but before there was at least something for the creeps, like a small fix or some kind of random treat, but at least something was there. Now, not even that.

No point in rushing updates out to please just a few, while alienating many others.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Which of course undermines the game as a game to be played. By buying your way around grinds, you incentivize the creation of an ever-more-grindy game. A game not intended to be played, but instead a game intended to annoy you into buying your way around vast swaths of it. Which harms not only the game's integrity, but also tends to make goals all the more difficult to achieve for those laboring under the quaint assumption that games are intended to be fun and to be played.


As do I. As do most people. It's not a question of money. It's a question of perverse incentives and conflicts of interest inherent to the business model. To which you seem oblivious or, at best, indifferent.

You're why we can't have nice things. :p

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The best thing about this game is you have choices. If you don't wish to buy things in the store you are not forced to and can get them on the landscape. If you wish to buy them you can. As far as I can tell this game is not a competition. There is no prize for getting first. So if someone is fully decked out, great for them. If it came to the point where you could only get things from the store (beyond some cosmetic items) then I would have an issue with it. But, it's good for the store to exist in it's present form because it is what allows Turbine to pay for maintaining and updating the game. Instead of condemnation, those who chose to buy from the store should be praised for helping the game to continue. Without store purchases, this game closes in a heartbeat.

So, bottom line, no new dungeons or raids?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tybur

[*]Hope Tokens now have a 3-minute cooldown, instead of 15 minutes.

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But they still stack only to 20. :(

Any possibility to increase the stack size for hope tokens?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rwraith

The best thing about this game is you have choices. If you don't wish to buy things in the store you are not forced to and can get them on the landscape. If you wish to buy them you can. As far as I can tell this game is not a competition. There is no prize for getting first. So if someone is fully decked out, great for them. If it came to the point where you could only get things from the store (beyond some cosmetic items) then I would have an issue with it. But, it's good for the store to exist in it's present form because it is what allows Turbine to pay for maintaining and updating the game. Instead of condemnation, those who chose to buy from the store should be praised for helping the game to continue. Without store purchases, this game closes in a heartbeat.

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Wow. . . you managed to pull out just about every myopic, repudiated trope ever used to speciously defend the business model and willfully ignore all the damage done to the integrity of the games that embrace it (which is now nearly all of them).

Quote:

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The best thing about this game is you have choices. If you don't wish to buy things in the store you are not forced to and can get them on the landscape.

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This willfully ignores the fact that what I earn on the landscape is often much harder to obtain because the design has been altered to increase the scarcity of what is available on the landscape. When Turbine sells you x, it necessarily has incentive to adjust the landscape availability of x so that it is more scarce. Or, increase the demand for x (eg., 84 Scrolls of Empowerment). So, even those who choose not to purchase things in the store and instead would prefer to earn them face hardships (that are intentionally annoying and onerous) they otherwise would not face because others are throwing their cash at Turbine to obtain what they did not earn.

Quote:

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As far as I can tell this game is not a competition. There is no prize for getting first.

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Irrelevant to the concerns people have with the business model. See above.

Quote:

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Instead of condemnation, those who chose to buy from the store should be praised for helping the game to continue. Without store purchases, this game closes in a heartbeat.

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You know what else would help the game to "continue" even without the Store? If more people were willing to play the game and pay a decent subscription fee for a game with integrity. As I've always said, the reason we can't have a decent game under the subscription model and why the Store model is more lucrative (thus Turbine isn't doing anything wrong by embracing it) is because of the players. They would rather have the game modified so that what would have clearly been considered cheating prior (getting things in the game you did not earn) is allowed in exchange for cash than play a game with integrity. And then they tell themselves it's all about choice and no harm is being done to the game (even as the game itself, its target audience, and the structure of its systems are all transformed into something unrecognizable), and indeed, ask for praise because they're "keeping the lights on" for a game that's now designed to annoy and frustrate you into handing them money.

Thanks, but I'd rather pay $15/20 per month and purchase expansions as they come out. And if more people felt that way, we'd still be getting quality MMOs. But because too many people think so shallowly about the business model, and therefore believe the tropes you posted above, we get games that are literally designed to be frustrating and annoying as a means of generating revenue. And you think you deserve "praise" for your enthusiasm in both sinking money into that model and spreading the spurious rationalizations used to justify it. :rolleyes:

Again, it's not Turbine. They're doing nothing wrong. It's the players/customers who can't suss out the plain repercussions of what they're "choosing" to do, the inherent conflicts of interest and perverse incentives in the business model, and the damage done to the integrity of the game that are the reasons the industry is headed in the direction it is. And why we can't have a new MMO with integrity.

--H

Edit. . . a good explanation of why F2P games are literally designed to be "barely fun." Which doesn't even consider the penumbra effects on those who labor under the quaint notion that we should earn what we obtain in the game through playing it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2luhwy3KAE0

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CaerArianrhod

And what about privacy and legal issues?[/SIZE]
Why are the purchase confirmation emails coming from Xsolla <mailer@xsolla.com>? Make sure you got a Turbine email for sending that confirmation.
Albeit now we know, that you are using some cloud service from xolla, i have concerns about how you make sure, that xolla is not usig the collected data [e.g. credit card information] (through payment- and game analytics) for other purposes as for fulfill my requests for your services?
How can i be sure that in case of a problem with a shop transaction Turbine is the responsible organisation and not xolla?

---

made about a dozen purchases and my inbox had over 40 emails from xsolla. Quite a few were duplicates. Seems like each purchase got 3-4 emails. And i just can't wait to see the affiliates emails start showing up. At least this is the beta store format and I didn't use my CC# for purchases. Somehow I just don't see the CC# being safe in xsolla's cloud. So for now-NO store purchases on live until my privacy and CC# security can be assured.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pittcrew1

Dont mean at all to be ungrateful for the crafting item stack size changes, but would it be possible to get a similar raise for the following items?

• Task Items (250-500)
• Crafting Recipe Scrolls (250-500)
• Consumables (100-250; crafted stuff can be 100 for example, if needed (pots are a big issue though with capping stacks easily), but at least Premium Perks should be 250)

Would be a great help, mainly for management. I hate needing more than one slot of space for any one item type, and 250-500 is great for being able to really not worry about that. 50 is just too small for most occasions. Anyways, thanks soooo much for adding it even for crafting items, cut down my required storage space for them in total by about 2/3, and over 300 slots of space.

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/Seconded on all counts. My dedicated Cook is certainly gonna enjoy the extra backpack elbow room with the new craft item stack limits.

Will cookable fish count as crafting items? He has a LOT of fish stored in his vault. :o

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Devolved

/Seconded on all counts. My dedicated Cook is certainly gonna enjoy the extra backpack elbow room with the new craft item stack limits.

Will cookable fish count as crafting items? He has a LOT of fish stored in his vault. :o

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Considering the increase in stack sizes will likely cost them storage sales in the Store, I'm shocked we even got that. Kudos to Turbine!

(I hope you get your wish too!)

I've tried four times to take copied level 100's into West Gondor and four times I've failed. Read the account here:

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...de-Unavailable

Is it me? Or is it just this beta test? I have NEVER run into anything like it since starting to play back in beta, nor have I seen anything like it since, even in the forums (except maybe long ago, when it first launched).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tasara

I've tried four times to take copied level 100's into West Gondor and four times I've failed. Read the account here:

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...de-Unavailable

Is it me? Or is it just this beta test? I have NEVER run into anything like it since starting to play back in beta, nor have I seen anything like it since, even in the forums (except maybe long ago, when it first launched).

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I have had no problems getting into West Gondor with my copied character and have seen several others there also. Maybe the BR patch didn't install correctly for you. Did you try un/re-installing BR and see if the same problem exists? If beta was always working for you and this is a new problem then maybe a file or two got corrupted during the latest patch to the client.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hurin

Considering the increase in stack sizes will likely cost them storage sales in the Store, I'm shocked we even got that. Kudos to Turbine!

(I hope you get your wish too!)

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I expect it will to, but I'm of the mindset that if they take the time and effort and chance to be nice and generous to us, I will reward them on top of what I would have to pay them just to get by (buying char slots/space), because they are, in good faith, being generous, and I want to reward that because I think it's a good model for games to take - which is taking care of their player's complaints without any expectation of immediate gain, other than happiness of customers.

Quote:

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DPS / Main Item Legacies have been granted 4 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 4.
Imbued stat Legacies have been granted 6 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 3.
All other imbued legacies have been granted 3 more available tiers and can unlock an additional 6.

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Wow, it's so cool. Can't wait to do glingfest ~100 more times, it's so exciting! A really new challenged PvE experience. Turbine, could you please double the unlockable tiers? Wanna do more glinghant runs! Please!

A few thoughts on U17.


Its the best Minas Tirith I have seen in game or film - my favourite interior space is the Dome of the Sun.


A few changes I would like to see include:


Adding reputation-gated stablemasters to Minas Tirith (eg Acquaintance to swift-travel to level 3, Friend to swift-travel to level 7 from the 1st level)


Adding guards suggesting the way to the back of the citadel is blocked on the 6th level


Removing damage from swimming in the Anduin in Osgiliath


Remove the barrier blocking the Gates of the Sun in Osgiliath and put some 1-shotters there instead


Remove invisible walls along the river banks in South Ithilien

Have to say it, not happy with what I saw on Beta.
the critted food, Superior Feast of Anorien, should be nerfed. I think it's odd that you made a captain buff in food form, that stacks.
The morale on some of the new crafted items should be nerfed as well. I've seen people running around with 40k morale, 80k mastery and capped crit and mits. Don't think that is really fair to the creeps either unless you plan on buffing them as well.
The crafted jewelry should be guilded, with the stats a bit lower. 800 morale and 120 odd main stat will end up replacing most peoples jewels they got from Osgiliath, which will make a lot of people not wanting to run them anymore, unless they want crests or a cloak.
Disappointed about no new instances (I don't count BBs as instances when I can afk plat them). Also, a suggestion would be to add empowerments to the stars of merit trader. Most people hate big battles, and as much as i dislike them, getting empowerments from stars of merit would make me run them more often.
Also, would like to see more items drop from the Osgiliath instances. Considering you now need 10 crystals per LI, Anfalas Star Lits should have a drop chance from Dome, RC, and SL.
I've also seen my champion friend now has a 96% Critical Multiplier legacy...OP much?
Invisible walls should be added, I ended up getting lost in Minas Tirith, got stuck and somehow fell all the way to the bottom, under the city and died. Only difference between me and Denethor is, I was not on fire :)
http://i.imgur.com/E1uFjMC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/MxNDJDm.png
My champion friend who has everything capped, plus aud. IMO you should have to lose a little of one to gain more of another, not have every single thing capped. There has to be some form of balance. Someone on my server even said they don't creep because it's underpowered, and like to play freep because it's easy. Adding all this new stuff, and having max cap on the essential stats just make it even easier and requires most people to have no skill. And honestly if it doesn't change, then to give myself a challenge i'll resort to creeping only, because most people won't after this lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by draconis-halberd7

Can we please have Spear - Staff cosmetic interchangability?

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I've had similar ideas about staff and spear being the same technique from some m-a I did half a lifetime ago. I'd go a step further and would LOVE to see 2H spears (esp. for my Beorning) and a 2H staff that is actually a weapon more broadly useful than just for lore-masters. Lore-masters using spears seems a little odd to me, but less odd than fighting bosses with fish and flowers as weapons.

Just recently I was reading the transcript for the u16 developer stream... In it was a request for Imbued legacy replacement scrolls to have an availability outside the 1 time bound to character quest line and the store...

still waiting on that...

we were also told that crystals (star-lit and remembrance) would be more available in game...

still waiting on that too...

sounds like to me that store availability takes priority over the old slogan "Convenience not Necessity"


On top of that, this update coming is requiring another significant LI grind that compares to the u16 grind... with no new content to get the items required for that grind...

New Big Battles? great.... does that mean I can get crystals for doing it? oh no huh? guess ill have to settle for doing the same old content on all my alts every day that I have been doing for well over a year already...


/sarcasmon YAY! /sarcasmoff