I am looking at the down time post today and I can not tell if the game will be down for 4 hours or 16.
Please say Noon or Midnight, know one knows what 12 pm is
12PM is night time to me.
Is the game down all day?
Or just 4 hours?
Printable View
I am looking at the down time post today and I can not tell if the game will be down for 4 hours or 16.
Please say Noon or Midnight, know one knows what 12 pm is
12PM is night time to me.
Is the game down all day?
Or just 4 hours?
Noone knows what 12pm is- I do, it's NOON!Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddora
12pm has, and always will be - Noon.
Heres a little refresh of how to tell the time incase you missed it in little school :)
12AM,
1am,
2am,
3am,
4am,
5am,
6am,
7am,
8am,
9am,
10am,
11am,
12PM,
1pm,
2pm,
3pm,
4pm,
5pm,
6pm,
7pm,
8pm,
9pm,
10pm,
11pm,
12AM,
Please bookmark this incase you ever forget how to tell the time ;)
Yup gotta love people who can't tell time. If they can't tell time using standard twelve hour periods then just imagine them using military time where midnight is 0000. lol :pQuote:
Originally Posted by peachykins
I can agree that request sounds ridiculous, but still would be a nice addition to give time also in other time zone (GMT for example). Somobody was already asking for that. And yes, I know I can check it, thats what I doing now, still for me it would be more comfortable just to see it, and after all there is no much effort needed from ppl to do that.
Use time conversion sites such as http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/converter.html . It would be a pain to have several times listed for people which is why they list their time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliford
What about:Quote:
Originally Posted by legablaze123
00:00
01:00
02:00
03:00
04:00
05:00
06:00
07:00
08:00
09:00
10:00
11:00
12:00
13:00
14:00
15:00
16:00
17:00
18:00
19:00
20:00
21:00
22:00
23:00
00:00
FUN FACT! PM actually stands for "Post Meridiem" which means after midday, which is that case from exact noon onwards.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddora
So... according to this expert diagram pictured in the meme below.
http://img.ifcdn.com/images/6de0f2f5...fa70ba49_1.jpg
What time is 12pm? Most certainly High Noon.
?This thread is a joke right... I mean I know they dont teach basic time in school anymore but really?
There is no officially acknowledged time standard for the AM / PM system.
The 24 hours system is based off: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_8601
The AM/PM system is obsolete and its usage being removed from significant US entities: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_a..._United_States
Quote:
The ISO 8601 date notation YYYY-MM-DD is popular in computer applications because it reduces the amount of code needed to resolve and compute dates. It is also commonly used in software cases where there are many separately dated items, such as documents or media, because sorting alphabetically will automatically result in the content being listed chronologically. This format may be considered less of a break with tradition by U.S. users, since it preserves the familiar month-day order. Two U.S. standards mandate the use of ISO 8601-like formats: ANSI INCITS 30-1997 (R2008); and NIST FIPS PUB 4-2 (FIPS PUB 4-2 withdrawn in United States 2008-09-02), the earliest of which is traceable back to 1968. The ISO 8601 format is also used within the Federal Aviation Administration and military because of the need to eliminate ambiguity.
'I'll be back this way on Monday! We'll settle this then... right there... out in the street... in front of the Palace Saloon!'Quote:
Originally Posted by OMG_PEANUTS
'Yeah, right. When? High noon?'
'Noon? I do my killin' before breakfast! Seven o'clock!'
'Eight o'clock. I do my killin' after breakfast!'-Back to the Future III
Remind me to bring my McGuffin Ned Kelly bullet-proof armour, Tin-foil hat and 20-sided die.Quote:
Originally Posted by bambubambubambu
They does at my skool.Quote:
Originally Posted by kickman77
i don't see the reason, why some countries still use a time-system, where you count 12,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11, repeat.
it is much more logical to count 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12, repeat. or just 0->23:59 like its done where i live.
it does not matter, if you can learn it in some schools in some countries.
it is not taught everywhere and it does not make any sense.
in germany, we have different systems to talk about time and if you hear someone saying the actual time, you can guess, where he comes from.
for example, for 11:45, many people from eastern germany say 'dreiviertel zwölf', while most germans say 'viertel vor zwölf'.
for 10:15, eastern say 'viertel elf', while most say 'viertel nach elf'.
Some people make jokes with this system and extend the eastern system to tell you ALL times in fractions. like 09:48 would be 'fünf sechstel zehn'. nearly nobody understands it, although its totally logical.
Still, logic systems can be understood by thinking about it. Thats a nice thing.
For knowing, that some people count 12,1,2,3,4... instead of 1,2,3...11,12, you have to know it. no way to get it by thinking about it because its ridiculous.
12 PM is noon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddora
12 AM is Midnight.
It's confusing, yes, but the 12 hour clock starts with 12 AM, then 1 AM, 2 AM and so forth and for noon its 12 PM, then 1 PM, etc.... They should just use the 24 hour clock and use 12:00 for noon, and 0:00 for Midnight, problem solved for those who are clock-illiterate. ;)
Reddora,
I cannot imagine the time will change. It would require that the automatic time-stamp used and perhaps some internal systems would have to be changed as well. I cannot see Turbine being willing to make that change.
Everyone Else,
Let me get this straight... some of you folks want to change the time system used in the USA? Are you crazy? The Elderly & AARP won't stand for it - their mail carrier won't come on time!
(Yes, that is kind of a joke - but only 'kind of'. 'Cause you know it's true.)
Where I live we use 24 hour clock :)
And no, they didn't teach us in little school how people in a country far far away tell time, and that doesn't mean that I can't tell time. I can. I can tell time in the way we tell time where I live :)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-hou...n_and_midnight
Quote:
Confusion at noon and midnight
It is not always clear what times "12:00 a.m." and "12:00 p.m." denote. From the Latin words meridies (midday), ante (before) and post (after), the term ante meridiem (a.m.) means before midday and post meridiem (p.m.) means after midday. Since strictly speaking "noon" (midday - meridies (m.)) is neither before nor after itself, the terms a.m. and p.m. do not apply.
The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language has a usage note on this topic: "By convention, 12 AM denotes midnight and 12 PM denotes noon. Because of the potential for confusion, it is advisable to use 12 noon and 12 midnight."[18]
E. G. Richards in his book Mapping Time provided a diagram in which 12 a.m. means noon and 12 p.m. means midnight.[19]
Many U.S. style guides, and NIST's "Frequently asked questions (FAQ)" web page,[17] recommend that it is clearest if one refers to "noon" or "12:00 noon" and "midnight" or "12:00 midnight" (rather than to "12:00 p.m." and "12:00 a.m."). The NIST website explicitly states that "12 a.m. and 12 p.m. are ambiguous and should not be used."
The Canadian Press Stylebook (11th Edition, 1999, page 288) says, "write noon or midnight, not 12 noon or 12 midnight." Phrases such as "12 a.m." and "12 p.m." are not mentioned at all. Britain's National Physical Laboratory "FAQ-Time" web page[20] states "In cases where the context cannot be relied upon to place a particular event, the pair of days straddling midnight can be quoted"; also "the terms 12 a.m. and 12 p.m. should be avoided."
Likewise, some U.S. style guides recommend either clarifying "midnight" with other context clues, such as specifying the two dates between which it falls, or not referring to midnight at all. For an example of the latter method, "midnight" is replaced with "11:59 p.m." for the end of a day or "12:01 a.m." for the start of a day. That has become common in the United States in legal contracts and for airplane, bus, or train schedules, though some schedules use other conventions. Occasionally, when trains run at a regular intervals, the pattern may be broken at midnight by displacing the midnight departure one or more minutes, such as to 23:59 or 00:01.[21]
The 24-hour clock notation avoids these ambiguities by using 00:00 for midnight at the start of the day and 12:00 for noon. From 23:59:59 the time shifts (one second later) to 00:00:00, the beginning of the next day. In 24-hour notation 24:00 can be used to refer to midnight at the end of a day.
In Britain, various conventions are employed. For instance, on 17 December 2005 The Sun (London) newspaper's TV magazine used "noon (12.00)" and "midnight (0.00)" in individual listings. Sequential listings started with a.m. or p.m. as appropriate, but these indicators were not used again, although in sub-listings "12midnight" was sometimes employed. On the same date, London's The Daily Telegraph used "12.00noon" and "12.00midnight" in individual listings. In sequential listings the first programme to start after 12.00 was marked "am" or "pm" as appropriate.
Yes there is some level of confusion, however it is well established that Ante Meridiem is 0:00 - 12:00 and that Post Meridiem is 12:00 to 24:00. For during Ancient Rome where the Latin terms originate, time was told using Sundials and the shadow of the sun's path long before the invention of the clock (dismissing the discovery of the Antikythera Mechanism). One key fact that establishes Meridiem is its sibling the Meridian which is better known as the vertical North - South line. These two terms Meridiem and Meridian worked hand in hand as both would signify the presence of the other as when a Sundial's shadow is along the Meridian (North/South) it means that it's the Meridiem (Midday/Noon) and vice versa.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silmelin
The argument that the Meridiem cannot be midnight, because..... well.... there's no sun.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marancil
Um, yes there is, at least for astronomy. AM is ante-meridian and PM is post-meridian. Way back when, you looked up or at the ground at a shadow, to tell time. Noon (and thus the meridian) is the point where the apparent sun is at its highest point above the southern horizon for the extra-tropical parts of the Northern Hemisphere (for the Southern Hemisphere, that's the northern horizon). For the tropical parts, it is probably best to use lowest zenith angle facing the sunlit horizon except on the day the sun passes overhead. On that day, the overhead sun is Noon, or on the meridian. AM means the daylight time before the sun crosses the meridian (noon) and PM means the daylight time after the sun crosses the meridian. Today, the prime meridian is Greenwich, England's meridian. From that we get GMT/UTC. Astronomers still use this system to convert to *local* time (not just time zone time) for celestial observations.
The Meridian is different to the *Meridiem, although same argument still stands. When it comes to *Ante-Meridiem and Post-Meridiem, Meridiem literally just translates to "Sun's Peak."Quote:
Originally Posted by cdq1958
https://grandpappy.org/ysundia2.jpg
The Meridiem is when the shadow path of the sun crosses the Meridian North/South line, when the sun reaches its highest position in the sky.
Another fun little tidbit - In Southern Hemisphere countries like my own, Australia, the path of the sun is inverted and the shadow points South at the Meridiem.
Is there literally a legitimate argument going on in this thread about how to tell time, and whether the way some countries do/don't is completely wrong?
I learnt how to tell the time in little school, because its just something everyone get's taught - obviously your parents also teach you at home, but you get a more clearer understanding in school.
12am = Midnight
12pm = Noon
What is so difficult about that?
Theres no difficulty with counting, because, 12am is also the same as 0, because its the start of the new day - So for those who its difficult to understand, think of the day like this;
0, 1, 2... 11, 12, 1, 2... 11, 0, 1, 2... Not so very difficult is it?
The only reason its 12 is because it would be too complicated for those who already struggle to tell the time, if we put both a 12 and 0 on the analog clocks..
And.... Its got nothing to do with learning how to tell the time because different countries tell the time in different ways.
EVERYONE should know what AM/PM means, and everyone should recognise what the time is when they're used. I live in England and generally we operate on a 24hour system, but I can still tell the bloody time in AM/PM!
This game servers are based in the US. They have been using EST or ESD forever. Do you really think they are going to a 24 hr clock? Do you really think they are going to recode at this point? We use a 12hr clock for most things in the US. Not to sound rude or argumentative but if you do not you are just going to have to make due or google it. Some things are not going to change and would be a waste of the few resources they have left.
Just because it is like that in the US or the UK does not mean it is like that in other countries.Quote:
Originally Posted by legablaze123
While you probably get it taught in most countries (especially once English is taught in school) you never use it in every day language. Never - ever.
I would never say 1 p.m. in my native language however I would say either 13.00 or "1 in the afternoon".
While that is the equivalent for p.m. it will not work for 12 p.m. or 12 a.m. which are always referred to as "noon" or "midnight" never as "12 before noon" or "12 after noon".
Just pointing out that something that is obvious for a lot of people might not be obvious at all for others.
Those guys are about 10% of the planet anyway so we can just ignore them , hmm, not sure about India though, but India or US, meh. We have ISO standards in the civilized world.Quote:
Originally Posted by monk_tbd
I was confused about this a while back. Then I had the thought what time is 12:01 AM? Why, it's in the morning. And 12:01 PM is in the afternoon. Of course 12:00 AM is midnight! And of course 12:00 is noon! The hours for 12 AM and 12 PM run a full hour. They don't have some strange identity crisis twice every day one minute into that hour. Pick any other minute in that hour and it's absolutely clear which is which.
This is how I remember it, in case I forget. Each slot of time between 12 and 1 clearly has an am or pm. The 12:00:00 time slot simply takes the same indicator as the following time slots, for consistency.Quote:
Originally Posted by MathKnight
Boy, a lot of condescension in this thread. I will admit to sometimes having to think a moment when someone says "12 PM" whether if it's noon or midnight. After all, "12:00 PM" is coming right after "11:59 AM" and in some ways it seems the 12 should be PM too (and the 1:00 should represent the "turnover" to AM). I know it makes MORE sense to do it the way it is, but I understand that it's not necessarily intuitively obvious that 11:00 AM is followed by 12:00 PM.
LoTRO:
"Come for the Hobbits, stay for the discussion about how time works"
The arbitrary designations and nomenclatures used in the measuring of time, perhaps, but not the workings of time itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by robbie1435
“...All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.” - Gandalf
Problem is: Where Turbine lives, they do not. And just like we should have gone to the metric system about a 100 years ago, and we really should have dumped Fahrenheit along with it, we Americans are inherently stup..... I mean stubborn, and we won't change a thing, just like we won't use the 24 hour clock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silmelin
It works the other way around too, most Americans have trouble understanding the 24 hour clock, unless you have been in the military where NATO members used the same standard throughout all countries.
I prefer military time and I've never been in the military or been close to someone who is. My story is pretty basic.Quote:
Originally Posted by maartena
I accidentally got my watch set in military time and couldn't figure out how to change it. The need to know time is an incredible motivator to teach yourself. :)
I do like *F and inches, feet, etc. The metric system is more confusing to me.
Sounds like a simple request. Wouldn't bother me an ounce (sigh, there went the metric out the window, again).
Clarity in announcements is appreciated. Why do folks on the forums like to have the festival times clarified... which day, so we can make plans to burn ourselves out on token stomping, and get our turn-ins on time? *a little guilty here...* The load screens have been known to be wrong, so we end up having to question it on the forums, again.. a little clarity, firm times and dates posted ahead of time. It goes a long way to makin' things "useful". Especially if you cannot get it released to the game launcher blurb. I couldn't thank Frelorn enough for the "Tentative calendar of events", and hope Cordovan can keep that going.
Ever since Nintendo DS came with time settings etc. I decided to acquaint myself with the 24-hour clock. And it really helped with the, "which 12 is it?" confusion that I had while gaming on them. (ie: when resetting the clock to speed up/down a game.) Since I live in an area that has a clear 24 hour cycle of light outdoors, any normal clock is easy to read if it is midnight or noon.
PS. At least until (H?)Armageddon comes, then the clocks will be the least of our worries. Or will they...? *insert dramatic groundhog meme here*
My facetious comment....
Technically, there is no 12:00 am, it is MIDNIGHT and there is no 12:00 pm, it is called NOON.
12:01 pm is one minute after NOON.
Convention has 12:00 pm as noon/12:00 am as Midnight but PM = Postmeridian which means AFTER NOON. So *technically* Noon cannot be AFTER NOON!
If you are going to list/start/stop at these times in schedules, you should use the terms Noon and Midnight, however most people versed in modern timekeeping know which 12 o'clock is AM and which is PM.
Good point, and speaks strongly in defense of the OP's request.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dotlbeme
As has been brought up a number of times in this thread already, modern timekeeping doesn't use quaint stuff like the 12 hour clock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dotlbeme
SCNR
SNy
If only Swatch's beats had taken off...
I'm okay with decimal time :) Go for it :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Cordovan
its not used commonly, but should, as its even more simple than the 'good old' 24hours clock.
... I reckon people are allowed to be condescending when someone is complaining about something as simple as time-telling. "No one knows what 12 PM is"? SERIOUSLY? I've known that since I was a young child. It is very basic knowledge that any moderately-functioning adult should know.Quote:
Originally Posted by daneyul
since we talking about time i not sure if my end or forums on different time, last post says 09:04 PM but should be 5:04PM? or what clock we run on?
We could do UNIX time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cordovan
"The servers will be brought down from 1468566000 to 1468580400. See you in game soon!"
Go to: Forum Actions (under the light grey bar at the top of the page) > General Settings > Date & Time Options > Time Zone. Select your own time zone. Voila!Quote:
Originally Posted by friendsofthetooks
Thought i went there before guess not well its fixed now thanks :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
1km = 10hm = 100dm = 1,000m = 10,000cmQuote:
Originally Posted by Mar-Evayave
Although hectometer and decameter aren't used often, the way the metric system steps up/down in magnitude is a whole lot easier to remember than....
1mile = 1760 yards = 5,280 feet = 63,360 inch
And then...
1 yard is 3 feet.
1 feet is 12 inches.
Therefore 1 yard is 36 inches.
And if that wasn't bad enough, its different on water!
1 mile on land = 0.289 leagues.
1 nautical mile is not 1760 yards.... NO, if you are rowing a boat on the river, its 2,025 yards!
http://i.imgur.com/bzDImXc.jpg
The BEST thing ever however is how NASA lost a many-million costing Mars Orbiter probe because someone used English measurements in 1 of the several thousands of calculations used to bring the Orbiter in orbit of Mars, causing it to crash on the surface instead. Ooops.
The English measurement system needs to go.......
when i went to school, i was told that dm stands for decimeter, which is 10cm / 0,1m. but seldom used, too. this makes decameters even more confusing. good, that both don't get used :PQuote:
Originally Posted by maartena
btw, you made a little metric mistake when going from m to cm ;) 1m is 100cm ;)
nice pic btw. totally fits to the whole system of measuring anything back then hundreds of years in the past... or in the USA/UK :P
Being a bit older and well trained in both; no, the English system shouldn't go. That's why many Americans will reject the notion of being forced into a decimal system. I'm old enough to remember when they tried it. It failed. Measuring systems using familiar objects as references and using bases with a large number of common divisors simply is easier to work with without computational aids. Let something happen to modern civilization such that electronics don't work and won't work for an unknown period of time, people will get by just fine looking up and around. Yes, I was one of those who made my own sundial. Sure, it wouldn't give you sub-second resolution; but it sure was entertaining telling time by it estimating the 'analemma' effect.Quote:
Originally Posted by maartena
This reminds me. I have seen a clock with military time and civilian time markings on it. That must have been 50 years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by legablaze123
One thing that does puzzle me, is why in recipes, Americans tend to use volume instead of weight, mostly for solids. I enjoy making hotsauce as an example, and granted, the yanks know how to make the goodstuff! But 3 cups of red chillies, are they whole, chopped? Mushed? Just tell me how many ounces or grams please! :)
Being from the UK, any recipe that calls for a stick of butter has me weeping openly at my scales. lol
Anyway, on topic.
24 hour clock, IE 9pm = 21:00. Just use that, it's easy, unless for some unknown reason you can't count to 24
Not me of course. But this is why I tend to use 11:59 PM (or AM) or 12:01 AM (or PM) to avoid such confusion. (Especially with "midnight" because what do you mean when you say "Sunday at Midnight"? Do you actually mean "Monday morning", as in 1 minute after 11:59 PM on Sunday night? or do you mean "Sunday morning", 1 minute after 11:59 PM Saturday? I've had people tell me both, so I usually clarify with them. But I digress...)
Of course, if Cordovan had done that, and the worlds did not reopen exactly at 12:01 PM, he'd be barbecued for not opening "on time". There is no winning (only whining).
;)
If only...Quote:
Originally Posted by SNy-lotrolinux-EU
;)
Then try making an appointment in Thailand. They use 6 hrs. So 2 o'clock can acctually be 2 afternoon, 8 evening, 2 night or 8 morning. The year is now 2559 and not 2016 as they go after Buddhist calendar. Thai also call their Songkran Festival New Year which is 13th April but their holiday also includes 14th and 15th April.
Then we have Chinese New Year which is not between December 31 and January 1st but the first day of the year can be anything between January 21st and February 20th.
I totally agree 24 hr system is superior. 1 o'closk can only be 1 night while 1 afternoon is 13.00. No misundertsandings then at all.
Same with metric system as it's logical. Same with kilogram. All superior systems compared to Farenheit, inch, feet, miles etc. Don't even get me started on when people says the weight is in "stones". :rolleyes:
When America wanted to revolt and be free of The English crown/opression they should have freed themselves from all those systems as well and joined the metric, kilogram, celisus etc systems.
When someone says "as you learned in school" when reffering to am/pm system they obviously do not realize that huge parts of the world did not learn that at all in school as they have other systems.
Hahaha! I can't help it! The American system just is easier for me to think in terms of, compared to the metric system. The road I have grown up and lived on is almost exactly one mile. It makes it easier to measure things with when there is a great example right outside. Kilometers are harder to wrap my mind around.Quote:
Originally Posted by maartena
The metric system for the most part is easier. However, there is one flawed portion, temperature. Celsius has good reasoning for measuring temperature from freezing to boiling water in a lab, but as a daily tool for a normal person it is much less useful. In Fahrenheit people can see a number of degrees near 100, and tell that it will be a hot day, or a temperature near 0 , and know that it will be cold outside (oh, look 0-100, sounds like the metric system!). Celsius isn't as useful, because that same range is -17 to 37.Quote:
Originally Posted by maartena
The normal person, I'd say 90-99% of the population of the earth, doesn't need the convenience of having freezing water temperatures be 0 and boiling be 100, as much as they need a simple measurement to know what the weather outside is like.
I like it! Too bad that didn't catch on like some of the rest of the French Revolution's improvements. Apparently their time setup ran into trouble with leap years and got dumped by Napoleon in 1805.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cordovan
I lost track of what the second largest country is that still uses the Imperial system for measurements after Myanmar and Liberia both announced they were switching to metric.
If Pokemon GO keeps GOing with anywhere near its current energy, a large number of American gamers will gain a very visceral idea of how long a kilometer is!
I have never heard anyone say "halb nach 10" or "halb vor 11" when Germans want to express 10:30. They all say "halb 11" so at least there both groups have something in common. The group that says "Viertel nach 10" and "Viertel vor 11" actually uses a mixed system that counts starting from one hour towards half an hour and then from half an hour towards the next hour whereas the others use a straightforward system that counts only within the next hour.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oelle
Both systems are logical and understood by most people (or at least those willing to learn).
For those that do not understand the second system here is a simple example. Take an hour as a pie and cut it into 4 pieces then start eating:
10:15 is "Viertel 11"
10:30 is "halb 11"
10:45 is "drei Viertel 11"
11:00 is "um 11" or "the pie has been eaten up" ;)
Still I prefer the 24 hour system because it cannot be misunderstood by anyone on this planet unless he cannot count yet.
That is just a question of how used you are to the system. If I see a temperature in Fahrenheit I will have to do a lot calculations to figure out if it is warm or cold, while if I see the temperature in Celcius I will immediately be able to tell if I need to put on a jacket or not before I head outside. And having the freezing point of water at 0 is useful since it makes a BIG difference for roadconditions etc. if the temperatue is below freezing/zero or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufkin
in addition to that, its MUCH better to reproduce.Quote:
Originally Posted by ertr
you can tell anyone anywhere in the universe to take water at 1bar and look for when it boils and smelts and fit a linear curve and he has the same measurement.
If i remember it right, the 0 for farenheit is 'its so cold outside, that it wont get colder anytime soon' and 100 'little fever body temperature'. for both points, you have to be a man/woman and on earth. you cant just reproduce it whereever you want.
the only reason for non-metric system is, that people use them for longer time and are used to them. besides that, theres nothing good with them. same for a non-decimal clock.
It's somewhat like this "summer time" nonsense that is artificial, expendable and has no practical use. It only causes confusion and negative effects on peoples health but politicians still won't get rid of it despite peoples demand because politicians are cowards and don't give a damn about peoples will.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oelle
I don't know... I kind of like having more daylight hours during summer evenings and fewer mornings in the winter where I have to get up before the sun - at least one of which I would lose if we did not switch between summer and winter time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fratonia
Ah, so you see the fallacy of the metric system. It is simpler to understand when doing math or science, but that doesn't matter, because it is quite simply easier for the population to remember what they were taught than it is to use a new more convenient system.Quote:
Originally Posted by ertr
You see, Fahrenheit is more convenient, but metric users won't budge on it because they were taught Celsius, so they are just as unwilling to change for that sake as english users are to change away from the foot. The foot is about the length of my forearm, the inch is pretty much the length of the tip of my finger. A mile is also easier to judge than a kilometer. The metric system means nothing to me in everyday life (unless I'm running a 'k' race), and are only convenient if you are doing measurements and math.
All of that aside, I'd much rather see time in a 24 hour clock than am/pm. If you can't count to 24 what business do you have telling time anyway? I also have no interest in doing away with daylight savings. I can't imagine trying to sleep with the sun still up at 10pm.
This part is true. Then you state something that's opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufkin
There is no reason Fahrenheit is more convenient. It is simply easier for people to remember what they were taught. That is why Celsius means nothing to you. Not because it is less convenient overall, but because you weren't raised to it. Neither was I, actually, and I also have problems judging a kilometer. Maybe it'll be easier the more I play Pokemon GO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufkin
Random examples for metric lengths include the thickness of a plastic card is a millimeter. The width of a fingernail is a centimeter. A meter is about a long step by an adult, five steps up a staircase, the depth of the shallow end of a pool, half the length of a bed, the width of a large fridge. A kilometer is roughly twelve minutes' walk (assuming you don't stop to catch Pokemon). English measurements are not more convenient. You and I are simply accustomed to them.
This. Metric is a system of tens; it's much easier to use if you need to make conversions of any kind (which, yes, is often necessary in every day life -- see cooking, for instance). If the rest of the developed world managed to switch to metric, why can't the United States?Quote:
Originally Posted by MathKnight
A waistline in cm seems gruesome to me. HOW big is my waist?? A teaspoon is something you can use to stir your tea. Gasp, you can measure, with uncertain accuracy, how much sugar to put in the cup.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oelle
mph vs kph. Kilometer is too small but thats what the metric people use. Guess a Gigameter would be too large. The imperial system has measurements that fit what is being measured. Some of them are archaic. It does take more thought to change feet into miles... or inches into feet I suppose.
Btw: with an analog clock you can anticipate the minutes and hrs more by watching the hands move. I would have hated to have a digital clock in my class room. Oh and, in the interests of accuracy, non-decimal (digital?) is called analog. Its a technical term.
I've been using a 24hr clock since boot camp. ohdarkthirty comes around pretty early as does 1930hrs when you want to do something other than go to bed. yeah zero dark thirty has been around at least since the 1960's
I don't know about your working hours but in the winter I get up when it's still dark and come home when it's dark again. Some weeks when I'm working in a data center I don't get to see the sun at all. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ertr
The sun going down sooner during summer had the nice side effect of the temperature also going down sooner so people that actually have to sleep during the night have an easier time doing so. It wouldn't really affect those that like to party.
But don't worry. I doubt that anything will change in that regard. Summer time was introduced with false expectations and we both know that politicians hate to admit mistakes.
I think the US likes to be separate from the rest of the developed world in some ways. Seems like their health care system is a prime example of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
Fahrenheit uses the same system of 0 (cold) to 100 (hot) that most of the metric system uses. Saying that Celsius is more useful is only true when limited to a lab or classroom. In terms of weather, a thing that every person on the planet is subject to, knowing that it is cold closer to zero and hot closer to one hundred is much more simple from a non-biased standpoint. If you claim that -17 to 37 is simpler to understand, you are biased.Quote:
Originally Posted by MathKnight
But... no one who regularly uses metric uses those values as their benchmark?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rufkin
0C = freezing point. We know that if we're driving, and the temperature outside has hit the freezing point, we have to be particularly careful as the roads may be icy.
40-50C = hot as hell. near or exactly halfway to the boiling point of water.
In Canada (or other countries that regularly dip below zero):
-10C = a moderately cold winter day
-20C = a pretty cold winter day
-30C = an extremely cold winter day
-40C = holy moose poop, where's my Arctic-strength Canada Goose jacket?
See...? Like I said, a system of 10s. Fahrenheit is not any more simple to use than metric when it comes to weather.
Condescension is NEVER appropriate. Not that I expect someone like YOU to be able to grasp such a concept. Hrmpf.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
Yes, let's not condescend; let's go ahead and hold the hands of adults who do not how to tell time. What next? "Wah, Turbine, give me update notes in pretty pictures! There are too many big words!"Quote:
Originally Posted by daneyul
Nope. AM and PM for midnight and noon (or vice versa) are ambiguous and deprecated in English-speaking countries. References: NPL (National Physical Laboratory), Wikipedia, and NIST (National Institute of Science and Technology).Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
Funnily enough, I've gone through thirty years of life without ever encountering any confusion over the distinction between 12am and 12pm (except for that time when I learned about the distinction in school -- I can recall some classmates struggling with it at first). The lack of an "official" designation between the two does not obviate the fact that it is generally accepted that 12am = midnight, and 12pm = noon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuco
I've gone through 70 years of life, and am frequently annoyed at the whole AM/PM thing. Either that trumps your 30 years, or I can be discounted for incipient senility. While I don't want to discount your own experience unfairly, personal experience is by definition anecdotal, and the three references I gave demonstrate that neither choice is "generally accepted."Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
On my first day with each new OS I switch it to 24 hour clocks.
And don't get me started on month/day/year, day/month/year or year/month day!
I live in Finland. We use here 24 hour clock. My teacher might've mentioned that US uses am / pm when she was teaching me the basics of clock but probably didn't. At some point in my life I ran into am/pm and first wondered what that is. I probably figured it out pretty quickly, but when someone says 12 am, I must think hard what that means. It is not automatic since the next time I need to know what 12 am means, could very well be in next year or year after that. That's how frequently I need to know how ap/pm clock works.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freawaru
Altho this thread has now probably made me need less time to think what 12 am means. Or so I would imagine. ;)
lol, hmm, I did not touch a clock before I was like 7-8 and never heard of am/pm before I was 17-18 or so (early 1980's) so when you say 70 years I pull 10-15 from them. Without a doubt. As for the AM PM confusion, I don't get it. Yes I read all the reasons above. It is so obvious even me who hardly use it get it, when you know what the words actually mean in Latin. Which many of you obviously don't seem to do. Ante Meridiem = AM equals before and up to noon. Ante means literally "before". Post means literally "after".Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuco
In any case this whole discussion is irrelevant. Follow ISO standards. Period. And if anyone has issues making out what time the servers will go down, well just look at the French or German translation since there you have the ISO GMT time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Elevenses!Quote:
Originally Posted by Fratonia
It failed because congress passed a federal mandate called the Metric Conversion Act, and NONE of the 50 states were held accountable to introduce said mandate. Some states outright refused. Thing is, it wasn't a LAW, it was a "mandate" or a "act" without any time line, without any repercussions, without any firm plan. States could just say: "whatever", and they did. Of course the Democrat who introduced the bill was accused by the Republicans of spending time on useless projects, and it was indeed mostly Republican governed states (at the time in 1975) that said: We ain't changing a thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdq1958
The end result is this:
There are 194 countries that use the metric system.
There are 2 countries that use the English system.
And no, that 2nd country is NOT England, they officially changed over to metric in 2000.
That 2nd country is Liberia. Of course Liberia has strong ties with the United States as it was founded by free slaves in the 1820s, and was for all intends and purposes a "colony" of the US until 1847 when it declared independence.
Birma (Myan-Mar) was the 3d country that still used the English system, but is currently in the process of converting. It is said that Liberia is also making progress in converting, so that would leave the United States as the only country left in the world still using the English system of measurements.
A changeover will always take a generation. The older generation in Canada still talks miles and fahrenheit, while those who have been born in the last 50 years or so have either converted at a younger age or were born in a metric society.
Enlightening thread. :D
Noon has been twelve o'clock and mid-night has been twelve o'clock. "Twelve Noon?" "Twelve Mid-Night?" The remedy is to place the word 'Noon' or 'Mid-Night' next to the reference. This has been done for as long as I can remember. Assuming an oversight or heck, not even thought about. /shrug They are eastern time zone so ALWAYS assume it's during business hours which then would be NOON. Thanks! Now let's dance!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k62T4tY0eow
Which is it? "Before and up to noon" or "Before noon"? I don't speak Latin, admittedly, but I've only ever seen Ante as "Before" and Post as "After" which does not in any way support your thesis that it's obvious, as 12:00 "PM" is neither before or after noon, is it? It IS noon. Please tell me why, of the designations AM or PM, "PM" is the obvious choice (not traditional, not learned, but intuitively obvious) to use for the exact time of noon again?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marancil
As I mentioned above, while there are of course sound reasons PM is attached to 12:00 noon, there are also logical reasons for one to assume otherwise--foremost among them is the unbroken sequence of numbers before -- 8, 9, 10, 11 -- all are AM, and one might logically think that the next in line -- 12:00, is AM as well, with the PM popping in at the rollover to 1:00. Not saying that would be good---it wouldn't, and 12:01 is obviously PM (after noon) but there is a basic intuitive logic to 12:00 AM following 11:00 AM nonetheless.
Again, the condescension on this thread regarding someone honestly stating a small point of confusion is amazing.
It's 2016. If it bothers you so much and you can't do simple google of: "boston time" or google what's difference between AM and PM and do math that takes 0.5s maybe you should check your priorities and focus more on educating yourself. And this is coming from someone who's used 24h clock all my life.
The issue is somewhat like somebody telling you that he is on holiday until 25th of July. Does that include the 25th or not? I usually assume that it includes that date but I have been mistaken from time to time.Quote:
Originally Posted by daneyul
From the terms "ante" or "post" alone nobody can tell if the 12 means noon or high noon. It's not obvious at all because neither "ante" nor "post" include anything. You may be able to tell if you already know that Americans count time from 12, 1, 2, ... but in that case you probably know as well what am and pm means in that regard. 12pm is illogical to begin with. 12 is not post meridiem. However people can figure it out easily by asking or looking it up on the web but it's funny to see how Americans assume that the rest of the world should know about their ancient systems while Americans themselves are reluctant to learn/adopt new or foreign things. :D
Fun fact? You get asked to a lot of parties, don't you? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by OMG_PEANUTS
Heh, well, there is a bit *more* to that story. Anyway, I *am* old enough to remember it and I *am* old enough to recall the response, especially to a Federal 'mandate', where highway signs with both greatly increased costs that the Feds didn't cover. Heck No! was the response. Metric is only good for decimals. It is a horrid system if you need to do calculations where limited precision fractions complicate things. I was taught both. Metric/ISO is great in my chem lab. In day-to-day life, not so much, especially if you need to do these *without* aids. Bases that have a large number of common divisors simply works better then.Quote:
Originally Posted by maartena
Plenty. Although I'd find it worse to be the host and not have anyone turn up, than not being invited. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by donxavier
Pro tip: if you want your guests to turn up at your 12:00 party, be sure to specify noon or midnight.Quote:
Originally Posted by OMG_PEANUTS
Have we come full circle yet?
Please use:
Starpeak
Moonsettle
Dewfall
Cricketquiet
Firstchirp
Dawn
First BreakFast
Toesunning
Morntea
Second Breakfast
Krumpetmawth
ThirdBreakfast
FirstLunch
Tallowblathers
Clengarden
Second Lunch
Mailredding
Third Lunch
FirstSupper
Candlewicken
Cricketsong
Second Supper
Hearthredden
Sconetasters (a.k.a. Third Supper in Tookland)
Candlesnuff
Pillowwend
Thank you.
Midnight - the middle of the night - constantly changes depending what time of year it is. However, 3am is always the Witching Hour year round. Except on Christmas Eve.
Although an amazing list and I would not aspire to know a lot about Hobbit Habits, but isn't "Elevensies" missing? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Duxx741