Learn to play

[Nifroth]

*edit* Some information is bound to be outdated, but basic principles tend to retain their value.

I personally enjoy a good fight. Good players are capable to bring good fights (more often than others anyways)
I feel like the skill level on crickhollow, just as any other server honestly, has dropped significantly. (*edit* wow, talk about being pretentious.)

The only real way to improve is to learn from both trying new things and using resources such as videos online.
In an attempt to help the community gain more success I make this thread hoping it will be useful now and maybe after u13 hits and (lets pray) more people test the moors.

Movement

This is something that the games introduction doesn't teach anyone too well, but in pvp this is really, really important.
I find this video gives a good amount of information on mouseturning
*old video removed [/video]

While this player definitely has a good style for himself, there's a lot of factors you can change while mouse-turning. E.G. He mentions the way he would stop is letting go of the right mouse button, but that leaves you with only camera being turned if you move the mouse, I personally let go of the left mouse button to be able to turn my character as well.

*edit*So the video appears to have been removed by the user. I'll try to describe the basic mouse turning principles. */edit*
Holding down the left mouse button allows to change just the camera angle without turning your character, holding down the right mouse button turns both your character and your camera. There are a couple options how to utilise mouseturning, I'll describe the usable tools.
WASD+QE(strafing keys that let you move just left or right. A and D do the same when right mouse button is pressed )
Holding down both mouse buttons at the same time moves your character forward the same as pressing W would. When you release the second button you pressed your character stops moving. If utilising this I recommend pressing down the right button first and then the left one so when you release the second button pressed (LMB) you can turn your character and the camera not just the camera.
Personally I prefer to combine WASD movement with turning my camera and char with the RMB pressed to turn my character as it allows for more controlled movement than just using the mouse buttons to move.
The idea is to minimise damage you take by staying out of the line of sight ( being behind them) or out of range of the enemy if they are melee and you have a longer skill range or are capable of kiting. Against induction based enemies you tend to run through them to deny line of sight and them moving accordingly to try and stay behind them as long as possible, with melee enemies it depends on the fight. If they are keyturning and not too great at it, chances are you will probably stay behind them the whole fight and not really take any or much damage.

Generally watching videos of players that mouseturn is a good way to get an idea how to utilise the mouse turning tools.
The videos made by this player have great examples of movement starting with the videos at level 75




Remember to toy with your mouse sensitivity in the options. in time a higher sensitivity might become viable, allowing for even quicker movement, but this is personal preference.

Another thing that very much depends on the person is how you press different keys. I personally don't use ctrl at all, I press shift and alt with my right hand thumb, same with the bottom row letter keys :z,x,c,v (linking say alt and c I will use my index finger for the c key)

Variety is always good, combining mouse movement with WASD+q/e is always helpful for example when you want to do a 180°turn

Pressing left and right mouse button at the same time makes you move forward
Holding down only the left mouse button allows to control the camera angle, so if you were going forward with W and turning by 180° with the left mouse button and then press right mouse button you'd do an instant 180° turn.

alternatively to Q and E you can use right mouse button+A and D, in that case the Q and E become bind-able already without combinations such as shift+q.




Positioning

Undoubtedly, "good movement" can bring many benefits to a fight, especially one fought entirely in melee range (increased outgoing damage, reduced incoming damage).
In general, during a fight there are few reasons not to try to get behind an opponent as it gives you several advantages:

1)Being out of their line of sight - you can still use your skills, but as they are not facing you the opponent can not use their skills (with some exceptions, major ones being several lore-master skills as well as any 360° aoe ) If you manage to keep this up, your damage taken in a fight can potentially become 0.

2)Negating avoidances - [Unless anything has changed] players still can not parry or block skills while being attacked from behind (same applies for NPCs) under normal conditions as a result your attacks are more likely to hit the target.

3)Positional damage - Burglar, Stalker, (to some extent Guard afaik) and for Blade toss even Reaver gain increased damage just for starting the skill while facing the back of an enemy. The damage increase usually is very noticeable and should not be ignored when possible.


You are regarded as being in positional (receiving positional damage buffs) if at the time of the skill starting its execution you were facing their back, during longer animations you can move out of position but the damage is applied with the appropriate calculations of a positional hit.

When facing a Warg or Burglar it is a good idea to try and prevent them from gaining positional damage bonus to reduce incoming damage. A good method to deny position is by incorporating strafing into your movement and just being quick to react to the opponents movement.




The only way to improve is to practice and keep at it
A decent way to practice mouse turning is to do it even while pve-ing against npcs, just to get the muscle-memory working.







P.S. Feel free to reference to this thread for anyone who might be interested, since most people don't read forums on a regular basis or at all.

[Nifroth]

Keybinding

Using your mouse to turn and move in general removes the option to click the skills - what do we do?
We use different keys to activate these skills
By default the 1st 4 quickslot bars are bound in a very generic and honestly uncomfortable manner for most
bar 1= 1 to =
bar 2= c+1 to c+=
etc

Generally it's hard to reach any key beyond 6 or 7 quickly for most people, thus changes to the original keybindings should be made to become more effective.


You can access keybinds in the options(c+o) in the keybinds tab.

There are lots of great key-binding options people don't think of at first.
The keys near wasd like r;t;y;f;g;h;x;v;b;space;mouse scroll button - are all easy to access and you can combine them with all of the combination bind keys (alt, shift, ctrl and windows, which are used by pressing both keys at the same time for a+1 - Alt+1)

It is a good idea to have the quickslots that get used in combination often to be comfortable to jump between with minimal physical movement of the hand.
Say I want to use brutal strikes+riposte+clobber. It wouldn't make any sense if I had Brutal bound to 1, Riposite to f10 and clobber to the v key.

Keeping skills organised on your quickslots as well is a way to help yourself think of keybinds that would make sense being physically close on the keyboard/mouse.


Obviously there's a lot of options with buying special keyboards and mice - they are definitely nice, but there's way more than enough keys to bind for skills on the keyboard alone - if you like having say a razer naga like a lot of people I know do - go for it, otherwise keeping the same comfortable gear you have should be fine.


Settings

The game options allow for several modifications that make your life easier.
First thing's first
Show selections target vitals - this enables you to see your targets target.
Directional selection indicator - shows a dotted line towards your target. Might be considered less valuable with map selection now, but it still has its benefits and it's a neat thing to have either way.
Target assist - in groups the leader can set up target assists so taht everyone can see those players targets right away for easier focus firing.

For people lagging in groups it might also be a great idea to go to social options and enable
Show dispelable effects only
Show only effects cast by you
This reduces lagging in groups by a ton.
There has been an added option to hide most buffs/debuffs now somewhere in social, just look for show in search tab probably should be able to find it. Only disadvantage of this is that you might not be able to see spider reflect or who has cappy buff and is thus in the group, but probably mandatory to even play in group v group action not to mention raid size action.
Lastly for all the clickers either transitioning or just unable to learn mouse-turning due to unwillingness or other reasons - there's an option to lock your quickslot bars so that you can't drag skills off of them by accident.


1v1

Etiquette
The 1v1 are nowadays on Crickhollow(and a lot of other servers) are held at good grimwood map-in area. Ganking someone here while it's easy to tell that a 1v1 is happening will generally result in bad repuration in the 1v1 community and ofc being killed on sight, similar results come from initiating combat without a player wanting to fight due to various circumstances.
A 1v1 usually is initiated by one player jumping in front of another while targeting them if there's several people around to indicate who they wish to fight, if the target agrees with the idea of a 1v1 taking place he shall then jump as well after the opponent jumps you may start the fight.

Often it might be a good idea to wait a bit after the other party has jumped to let them prepare for the fight especially if it is a class like the hunter who needs to focus up or a burglar/warg that might want to stealth.

Use of longer cooldown skills in 1v1s is often considered bad practice and will often result in lack of interest to fight against the cd spammer though some fights may warrant use of cooldown skills (especially if both players want a cd fight) sometimes only one player using several cooldowns and other using none may be okay if the fight is still close, but the better practice is to start with less cooldowns and increase as needed rather than use all you can (limiting yourself in 1v1s allows you to function better in cases when you dont have any cds left not to mention it is the only way of making fights more balanced since the classes are not mirrored)

in fights between warg and burglar, it is a custom for both players to start out of stealth to both reduce time of just searching and reduce the big advantage one can get by starting form stealth. Stun as well are generally avoided in these fights, mainly due to burglars gaining a huge advantage if played right in a stun scenario.

Healspam builds in general will yield bad rep and most likely close to no fights.

Morale pots should also be avoided, especially due to their magnitude on creepside since update in Helms Deep.
Traiting
It is often a good idea to change your build for 1v1 fights, maybe even change it for different classes depending on what is used.
For creeps this is less of an option as all they can change are a few class tratis and corruptions, but if you know you'll be fighting a guard you might want to consider not traiting tactical mitigation...or stealth track

As a freep there's the choice to boost your tactical of physical mitigation accordingly to opponents damage type by playing around with virtues.
Keeping in mind how much you plan to limit yourself you may want to re-spend your class trait points as well to get rid of skills definitely not used and maybe increase damage of others.

[MrBoom]

And for those who are Super Lazy like MrB and/or who tried/hated mouse-turning, try this tip I got from Bane (the beloved warg, not Batman villain) to improve your movement:

In your Documents->The Lord of the Rings Online->UserPreferences file, search for TurnKeySpeed. And set it equal to something higher! Mine is at 400 apparently now. Bane I think said he used 600. Save the file and then relaunch lotro.

Looks/feels almost like mouse-turning without having to go through the chore of learning it ^^

[AlmontRaider]

I feel like the skill level on crickhollow, just as any other server honestly, has dropped significantly.

Perhaps plenty of players have found out that having a job, real social life or family gets you further than PvP. Gotta give you props, in the land of the low, you are king.

[wretchesandkings]

Perhaps plenty of players have found out that having a job, real social life or family gets you further than PvP. Gotta give you props, in the land of the low, you are king.

yup, because this game takes so much effort to play

[Nifroth]

Perhaps plenty of players have found out that having a job, real social life or family gets you further than PvP. Gotta give you props, in the land of the low, you are king.

And because of that people who enjoy playing should not have access to advice?
Also a bunch just went over to other games they enjoyed more.
Not to mention insulting someone for playing a game in the games forums doesn't really make you seem all too victorious...

P.S. Keyturn speed - I didnt mention it because people always assume it will do more than it will, but if you do pick the short path, make sure you aren't logged in the game while you make the changes or it will not work.

[1nTruDeR]

Show us how its done Thorfie.

[Pochis]

If I start to use key turns and mouse wraps and yada yada yada, then I cant do my patented moonwalking battle tactics. So I guess I will stay the noob player that I have been while having crazy funny moments and bumpin some tunes in raids, and listen to the sound of.."My miiind is telling me nooo!!! But my Body!!! My Body!!!! Is tellin me ye heaaa!!!!

And let the pros do what the pros do, in which I really dont know what the lotro pvp pros do...But seems like something cool to learn if you got the time...So Go learn to freakin play noobs and try your best trying to kill MJ >... And if you aint down with that well I got 2 wooorrrrddzz for ya!!!! SUCK IT!!!

But in all seriousness, this would be more a 1 vs 1 type of thing to learn. Me personally find 1 vs 1 freakin boring to the maximum.. Instead of learning how to 1 vs 1 like a pro, teach the greeny freeps how to raid and use teamwork. Im sure they would benefit just as much that way than just 1 vs 1 skills. But I might be wrong, I know nothing of keyturning and such, it might help in raids too..

The Ultimate Creep,
MJ

[TeromMoret]

I for one have thrived because of that very exact same vid. It was that exact vid that started my Revolution from ####ty no good pos burg to a Seemingly Decent Burg! If you were to put in the time aside from your job/social life that all people may or may not have and learn to do what Thorfinn has just listed at the top of the thread here and even what Mr. Boom said about keyturn speed i think the amount of good players would increase on this server which would not be a bad thing believe me. The more good players a server has the better the fights are. Just Give it a try! Dont knock it till you try it! (Both of the given ideas of course) Better movement does not just effect 1v1s it also effects soloing/grouping!

SOLO:
Will be able to out move your opponent and Hopefully not take much damage do to lack of the opponent having no line of sight (Melee Or Ranged).
Will be able to get more positional damage on your opponent for a better chance for getting the kill.
Key binding also enables you to hit skills faster whilst paying attention to your movement for more positional damage.

GROUP PLAY:
Basically everything Listed for Solo but the lack of the opponent being able to hit you because of line of sight with heals.
Makes it easier to not form a giant zerg and kill action for everyone.

~Terom Moret~

[Nifroth]

I for one have thrived because of that very exact same vid. It was that exact vid that started my Revolution from ####ty no good pos burg to a Seemingly Decent Burg! If you were to put in the time aside from your job/social life that all people may or may not have and learn to do what Thorfinn has just listed at the top of the thread here and even what Mr. Boom said about keyturn speed i think the amount of good players would increase on this server which would not be a bad thing believe me. The more good players a server has the better the fights are. Just Give it a try! Dont knock it till you try it! (Both of the given ideas of course) Better movement does not just effect 1v1s it also effects soloing/grouping!

SOLO:
Will be able to out move your opponent and Hopefully not take much damage do to lack of the opponent having no line of sight (Melee Or Ranged).
Will be able to get more positional damage on your opponent for a better chance for getting the kill.
Key binding also enables you to hit skills faster whilst paying attention to your movement for more positional damage.

GROUP PLAY:
Basically everything Listed for Solo but the lack of the opponent being able to hit you because of line of sight with heals.
Makes it easier to not form a giant zerg and kill action for everyone.

~Terom Moret~

LoL, it's not about taking extra time really. Playing, being online there's not much difference how you do, but this is a way to improve what you get out of a game you spend time on. This is less about actually "learning" and more about doing.

[Carnin84]

See what kinda bites me is you guys want people to get better but you won't teach them and I am not saying not teaching them is a bad thing because I think more then one creep will agree with me on this one if all the freeps were to improve their skill up to wai's skill level then I am pretty sure we would go unraided all day everyday, because it takes alot to kill you over skilled group of people ffs terom beats people with frying pans.... thorfinn beats people without armour. Yea crick skill level is lacking greatly I agree with you there but seriously if these bonehead freeps were to actually unlock their inner potential as freeps and actually know how to play their class pfft freeps would faceroll because of the lack of good creeps. Not saying there aren't any on the server saying its lacking now you creeps depending on who you think I consider good (which doesn't matter) is up to you. This update u13 or whatever in april will be a feast to remember just saying. I mean I am just saying if people achieved wai skill level (and yes that is the bar now) we'd have no chance since majority of the freeps don't run without a group

[Jousimies]

...because of the lack of good creeps. ...

You think what is the purpose of this thread

[TeromMoret]

Hail the frying pans of justice!!!!!!!

[Carnin84]

Do you think it matters if they are good or not? I will farm you all to rank 11 son

[Nifroth]

Just adding additional information/bump

[Derpon]

Sure these are nice, but you won't grab an audience like this. You need to talk to them in a way they'll understand.

[Nifroth]

Sure these is sick yo, but you won't grab a crew like all dis bull$hit. Yo a$$ need ta rap ta dem up in a way they'll understand.

Can't argue wit dat :P

[Dernudan]

This is a really good thread. I am recommending it to a lot of newbies in my kin, even though it is on Withywindle.

[Straego]

Such a legend. Much wow very skill.

[Nifroth]

*BUMP* This thread might not be too well made, but I think it might be useful to keep at the top of the page in case anyone ever wants to get some suggestions or find it to link to someone that might benefit from reading it.
Don't play too much anymore really, but might edit it a bit since it's somewhat fun.

[Sizz_the_sock]

Kthxbai

squalo

[Yianni]

*BUMP* This thread might not be too well made, but I think it might be useful to keep at the top of the page in case anyone ever wants to get some suggestions or find it to link to someone that might benefit from reading it.
Don't play too much anymore really, but might edit it a bit since it's somewhat fun.

I need some lessons of how not to give positional Thorfie. I still remember that day in galtrev at the skirm camp practising with our burgs lmao.


~ Gos

[Nifroth]

I need some lessons of how not to give positional Thorfie. I still remember that day in galtrev at the skirm camp practising with our burgs lmao.


~ Gos

I should be possible to find in discord if that was a hint that you wanna catch up ^^

[Yianni]

I should be possible to find in discord if that was a hint that you wanna catch up ^^

Pm sent ^^

[floccari]

I gave up trying to learn.