BR30.3 - Red Captain

[Omen_Kaizer]

Red captain dps, definitely down. Here's 3 parses on live and on BR 30.3 build 2. Doesn't appear like nothing changed between build 1 and 2 for us, and I was parsing about the same on BR build 1.

My weapon dps rating on live is 3385, and on BR is 4517.2, so use that to get to apples to apples as best you can when comparing parses on live and BR right now.



Live, 3 parses no buffs


BR30.3 build 2, 3 parses no buffs. this is on par with what I had for build 1. Oathies at minute 2 just to be consistent with how I do it live, but since we can't stack GW dots anymore it's definitely better to throw it right off the bat now.



traits and LIs viewed in BR. On live, I use halberd + 3rd age emblem for bleed, and halberd for Routing Cry, and greatsword otherwise. Looks like I still had my stun traited instead of extra light damage--oops.




Divide BR damage by live damage, multiply by 0.75 to normalize for the different weapon base dps. This is like a ~10% or so nerf. While others are getting a bit of a buff (except champs).

We could use some of our bleed pulses back I think. +9 pulses probably would've added 20M to 25M extra damage to my 3-parse cluster on BR. Split the difference, add it to the BR damage totals, repeat weapon dps normalization and compare to live: then this LI change would've made about a 15% buff to my red cappy single target damage if we retained +9 pulses. Maybe give like, +3 all-bleed pulses to the gold/epic Grave Wound tracery and another +3 all-bleed pulses to the gold/epic Cutting Attack tracery, or put +6 bleed pulses on a new tracery if you want to make us make harder choices for our LIs. (Or replace Noble Mark damage)

Another thing to note is our AoE damage is going to be even more impacted w/o bleed pulses than single target, necessarily so.

I do want to see how it's working out for the rest of yall, the before and after.

[Kaeneth]

Think you may have posted the wrong image by accident on the 3rd one unless your Captain has a set of claws.

Pretty sure we now have less overall bleed bonus % damage from LIs, and then you combine that with the lack of pulses and yeah it's quite a bit of lost damage.

[Omen_Kaizer]

Thanks I fixed it!

[Fresuvi]

Red Cappy legit out parsing yellow champ by 10-20k and out parsing red champ by like 30-40k. Big sad

[Omen_Kaizer]

This is from week 2. Dev Blow, Grave Wound, and possibly Sure Strike nerfed. Inspire probably buffed. Too hard to tell from the others, I'm just comparing saved CA parse clusters, don't have tooltips of either build.

Overall parsing like what I do on live, oof. This nerf is unwarranted, the status quo of being half the damage of mainline dps was totally balanced and fine.

Without the new light craft traceries, deliberately. I put them on later, it's just like 20% of our damage boosted by 14-15% or so given that +25% light damage is an additive modifier on top of certain existing skill modifiers (not mastery, similar concept though). SL tooltip went from like 65k-96k to 74k-109k.




Why? What is your vision for red captains, and how were they even overtuned before?

[Khluzainn]

Red captain and guardian both need some live. Both have lost I feel like overall with nerf to bleeds, bleed pulses, and loss of crit mag.

[Zaheer]

Yes, I think our DPS went down due to us losing our bleed pulses

Vastin once had adjusted the bleed duration from 38 to 28 seconds (with swap)

Now we lost this swap, thus we lost +9 pulses and the nerf is still there and unchanged. This will need to be addressed and I'll work on it.

[Omen_Kaizer]

Out of town for work--y'all just let me know if you find more changes.

[Hephburz-2]

I took off my Captains weapon on Live/BR and we can see more readily how skill damage has changed;

• Battle Shout buffed from 515% to 586%
• Sure Strike buffed from 296% to 355%
• Pressing Attack, not buffed, but damage redistributed, -30% damage taken off the first attack and added to the second
• Shadows Lament no change from live
• Devastating Blow nerfed 991% to 952% (completely unnecessary ??)
• No change to Cutting Attack or Grave Wound
• Routing Cry buffed 419% to 678% (???)
• Blade of Elendil buffed 687% to 837% (???)

• Rallying Cry has a 20% increase over live
• Words of Courage, Gallant Display, Muster Courage self-heal and the HoT on Inspire all have a 10% increase over live

=

Something really needs to happen to Cappy damage, Grave Wound needs more pulses and greater damage, or add a 'tiering' effect to the skill, to compensate for the loss of the bleed skills magnitude legacy and the loss of the additional pulses.

[Omen_Kaizer]

Nice, wish I'd have thought to look at %based tooltips. Would be interested to see what they all were on build 2

[Omen_Kaizer]

I've got it saved if anyone really wants to see, but build 4 is about the same as build 2. Parsed w/o light damage craft traceries again. IF the point is to sorta make all the numbers roughly similar to live and like wardens and hunters and all that will be brought down to level, it's not bad. But with two-hander baseline weapon dps rating on live being 3XXX and BR weapon "of legend" baseline dps being 4XXX even here on BR4, I'm not sure what the goal is. And there's no guidance for us folks on beta. Up a creek here.

[Khluzainn]

I am going to start a thread in the main part of the forums too. I have already made myself known on Red Guard. My second most played character is Red Captain. In my opinion, with all of the bugs issues aside, captains need 3 things.

1. Please make motivating speech last like 30m or 1h PLEASE

2. Now for the real red cappy needs... They need one of two things(maybe even both honestly) The first is bleed damage. Not only did we lose ~100% bleed damage but we also lost ability to swap for pulses. Pulses effectively tripled the damage our bleeds would do over a fight. We need some kind of compensation here... I mean seriously. This could be fixed by adding 1 (ONE!!) legacy that would give +X captain bleed pulses and cap it at 5 or 9. The legacy would also have +XX% captain bleed damage. That frickkin simple....

3. Now hear me out here. I have always seen the captain as a patient, slow paced, perfect the setup, and then NUKE EM class fantasy for Red Cappy. So if SSG wont give captain back its bleed damage I would be ok with that as long as we then buffed Shadows Lament and Blade of Elendil by a large amount as well as a small buff to Dev Blow. Maybe guarantee a way to crit SL?

So there are several ways we can fix the abysmal state of Red Captain dps and it just needs to happen one way or another. Overall it just needs higher dps. Bleeds were the path before but I would be ok as a frequent nuker playstyle too. Please just do somthing. You nerfed the support of the red captain massively an update or two back. So there is no longer this 'support tax' to be used as an excuse anymore for us doing 50-60% of the dps that even the lower dps classes are doing LOL. Or at least let us know class balance isnt a priority with this new LI system which seems insane to me.