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Thread: TerrainMap

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    38

    TerrainMap

    I have TerrainMap version 1.31 installed. When I try to use it in Azanulbizar update 30 area the Breeland homestead is on the map. I get the following in my general chat box:
    ...Rings Online\Plugins\GaranStuff\Terr ainMap\Main.lua:1227: attempt to index field '?' (a nil value)
    It's not working in that area when I click on the red location icon at the top right of the map nothing happens.
    I reinstalled the plugin and logged back into the game but that did nothing as well.
    Just wanted to report because version 1.31 said update 30.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    1,590
    Quote Originally Posted by Felix_Piper View Post
    I have TerrainMap version 1.31 installed. When I try to use it in Azanulbizar update 30 area the Breeland homestead is on the map. I get the following in my general chat box:
    ...Rings Online\Plugins\GaranStuff\Terr ainMap\Main.lua:1227: attempt to index field '?' (a nil value)
    It's not working in that area when I click on the red location icon at the top right of the map nothing happens.
    I reinstalled the plugin and logged back into the game but that did nothing as well.
    Just wanted to report because version 1.31 said update 30.
    Azanulbizar is an instanced version of the landscape that does not exist at the regular world coordinates. This is because Azanulbizar is shown as T.A. 2799 while there is a real world version of that terrain in the regular game time line. The world builders dealt with this by placing the terrain far west and north of where it actually exists, outside the bounds of any actual terrain in Rhovanion. For instance in the normal game world, the center of Mirrormere lake is at roughly 11.6S, 77.3W but on the Azanulbizar map, the center of Mirrormere is at 67.4N, 134.7W. There is no practical way to resolve this discrepancy in TerrainMap. Because of this, you will not be able to see the T.A. version of Azanulbizar in TerrainMap. Basically this is the same issue that arose with the first age version of Mordor Besieged (Mordor Besieged coordinates are far, far to the west and slightly south of where the landscape actually exists in Dor Amarth) as well as War of Three Peaks (WoTP coordinates are far, far south and slightly east of the real Elderslade). Basically, all of the instanced exteriors exist somewhere on the map outside the legitimate bounds of their regions' maps.

    The error message you are getting in chat is another matter. That is an actual bug (probably due to the invalid coordinates not being trapped correctly) and I will have to track that one down, so thanks for reporting that. I should probably add a message to the position function to indicate to users when their coordinates are not displayable in TerrainMap, I'll look into that as well.

    FWIW, I just realized I never published the MoorMap update with the Azanulbizar and new Nud-Melek maps. Yikes, how'd I forget to do that?!
    Last edited by Garan; Sep 29 2021 at 06:07 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    38
    Quote Originally Posted by Garan View Post
    Azanulbizar is an instanced version of the landscape that does not exist at the regular world coordinates. This is because Azanulbizar is shown as T.A. 2799 while there is a real world version of that terrain in the regular game time line. The world builders dealt with this by placing the terrain far west and north of where it actually exists, outside the bounds of any actual terrain in Rhovanion. For instance in the normal game world, the center of Mirrormere lake is at roughly 11.6S, 77.3W but on the Azanulbizar map, the center of Mirrormere is at 67.4N, 134.7W. There is no practical way to resolve this discrepancy in TerrainMap. Because of this, you will not be able to see the T.A. version of Azanulbizar in TerrainMap. Basically this is the same issue that arose with the first age version of Mordor Besieged (Mordor Besieged coordinates are far, far to the west and slightly south of where the landscape actually exists in Dor Amarth) as well as War of Three Peaks (WoTP coordinates are far, far south and slightly east of the real Elderslade). Basically, all of the instanced exteriors exist somewhere on the map outside the legitimate bounds of their regions' maps.

    The error message you are getting in chat is another matter. That is an actual bug (probably due to the invalid coordinates not being trapped correctly) and I will have to track that one down, so thanks for reporting that. I should probably add a message to the position function to indicate to users when their coordinates are not displayable in TerrainMap, I'll look into that as well.

    FWIW, I just realized I never published the MoorMap update with the Azanulbizar and new Nud-Melek maps. Yikes, how'd I forget to do that?!
    Ok thank you

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    1,590

    Response to Skohgar's Question from Adventuring in Middle Earth thread

    Skohgar asked a good question in another thread in the Adventuring in Middle Earth forum. It seemed more appropriate to answer here since the other thread wasn't really about TerrainMap and a lengthy discussion could derail that thread. So, the original question:
    Quote Originally Posted by Skohgar View Post
    ...I would like to ask why Mordor Besieged and Azanulbizar arnt included?
    Is it just because they arnt apart of the main map or because you class them as the same as war of three peaks and other small copied lands like the helms deep variants
    The first thing to remember is that there are actually four distinct regions with three separate coordinate systems. Gondor and Mordor actually share the same origin but the other two are very different with some significant overlaps. So, the origin for coordinates in Eriador is different from the origin in Rhovanion which is also different from Gondor/Mordor. TerrainMap basically ignores these discrepancies since it only shows one region at a time, but there are limits to what can or should be ignored. For instance, Moria and Gundabad occupy part of the Rhovanion map that is on the western border. This works pretty well in TerrainMap because those areas are fairly close to the main map so they can be displayed without leaving an ocean of blank space. Mordor besieged unfortunately does not make sense to attempt to display this way because the western border is so very far away from the actual location in the Mordor region.

    For instance in Dor Amarth, we have Lûghash at 43.2S, 16E but in Mordor Besieged, the same location is occupied by Amon Fuin, but the coordinates are 93.4S, 123.9W. If we were to look at the corresponding coordinates, they would be so far off the left side of the screen that they would actually be past the next region, Gondor, all the way to somewhere in southern Ered Nimrais (using the Mordor origins). For the record, the western most border of Mordor is at 0.6W, the western most border of Gondor is at 61.3W. The eastern most border of Mordor is at 63.1 (far east of Lithad which we don't even have on the map yet) so all Mordor is only 63.9 units wide and the map only displays about half of that. So, Mordor Besieged is placed more than twice the width of the entire Mordor region west of the existing map. That is just wayyyyyy too far to display on the Mordor map in any reasonable fashion. Azanulbizar wound up being a similar situation only slightly worse since it exists in the mysterious "Region 14", not even placed out of bounds in one of the existing regions, but its very own bizarre region only reachable by Tardis (the instance Fall of Khazad Dum also exists in this nebulous region).

    That said, does that mean that there will never be a display of Mordor Besieged, Azanulbizar or even Second Age Black Root Vale (A huge swath of western Gondor depicted in one of the instanced epic quests) in TerrainMap? Nope. There are plans to attempt to add one or more "Instanced" region map(s) that can display these areas. It would be really fun to see all of the instanced terrain, like areas used for missions or skirmishes or just existing for epic quests. There are some really detailed areas that have magnificent maps that currently are only displayed on the 'Junk' region of my MapMaker plugin. Some of them are from raids that I (and I suspect many other players) never got a chance to join. It just needs to support multiple coordinate systems, etc. in a scrollable/zoomable map, kind of how I resolved the coordinate issues in the Google map - in case you never checked, as you move the mouse around the Google map from region to region, the coordinates will jump when you cross between regions, automatically adjusting to the origin of the correct region. As it happens, that script is actually much simpler than it would be to implement in TerrainMap, especially with so many different map pieces to account for, so, it is on the ToDo list, it just may take a while. A long while.
    Last edited by Garan; Dec 22 2021 at 05:35 PM.

 

 

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