Dev Diary Feedback: Rise of Isengard: Captain Developer Diary

[Clover]

To me, the buffing “role” of the Captain is inherently part of the class and shouldn’t be restricted to any one trait line. Therefore, a major part of these changes is making the Leader of Men trait line focus more on tanking. Read more in the latest Developer Diary from Tim 'Raskolnikov' Lang and post your comments here!

[Travisimo]

Overall, I'm very pleased with these changes.... Only thing I can think of is something I'll have to put some minimal focus on over the coming months: the will/might stat changes.

[Chroner]

no mention of the increased cooldown on inspire and strength of will? I seem to recall that being mentioned in previous cappie related dev posts. Currently the cooldowns are less than their durations which is helpful, especially if inspire misses (no effect is applied on a miss). Having the CD on strength of will as it is now is convenient since you dont have to re-apply the buff immediately.

hopefully the lack of a mention means the cooldowns are not being changed.

[be0wulfe]

"The Captain now receives all of their Tactical Offence Rating and Outgoing Healing Rating from Might (instead of Will)." - please tell me this is JUST for LoM ... ? If it's a class change ... argh. I've spent considerable effort capping out my Fate\Will because I can O/T well enough with ~450 Might, but I need the Fate\Will because I'm spamming heals\buffs as they come up.

#donotlike

[opurt]

Captain tanking/off-tanking ... prepare to get flamed\trolled\laughed at

And we can block without a shield? As the Champ dev said, I guess we can block with our face!

[ErandarTheFirst]

Turbine is doing a really good job here. They certainly now how to improve the game for the players. I'm looking forward to this. Keep the good work on turbine!

[blazo]

YAY blocking with all 2handers and YAY mights gives us tactical ofence and outgoing healing
but i think our DPS will be poor again

[Fuin]

*clap clap* well done, solid update for captains:

• major tanking update(I really like how it was done) will easily suit captain for 3 and 6 mans(with proper gear of course). Handy when no tank is around + You still get all buffs and some heals.
• healing which was already fine was tweaked a bit and rezzing became major role.
• personal dps should be more than fine with those tweaks and skill updates. This will be huge for leveling, soloing and some 3-man action.

Kudos to Raskolnikov and whatever other devs that was brainstorming about this class for NOT tying buffing to some line and freeing Leader of Men line. While one trait line for main role works fairly well for other classes, it was really bad for captains, limiting them to it for any group content. After all everyone loves us for the buffs in 1st place, but it's not the most interesting thing to do as it's quite static unlike healing. So buffing + some major role to do was a perfect direction to head for. Thank You!

[Almagnus1]

While the bulk of the changes were already known, it's nice to see captains become might centric.

Once again, thank you Rask, you rock =)

Edit: Is Shield of the Dunedain still a fast skill, or did it go back to normal?

[Shags2dope12121]

Only thing im worried about is power problems again. In SoA captains were the biggest power suckers around but then Moria came and started adding Will/Fate to armor which gave us a big enough power pool along with decent ICPR that power still had to be managed but wouldn't burn out 30 seconds into a fight. With the stat changes I can see them pushing Might on our gear which means our power pools will drop again and put us at SoA levels.

[RtrnofdMax]

You all missed something very important here: Blade-brother at level 74. That is Horrible!!! This means that a +25% damage To Arms is not only unavailable to us at the start of RoI, but it means that the Captains leveling up will not get this bonus either. If anything, this change is a huge reduction to Captain DPS. Why? We should be able to choose between the -brother's as soon as we get Shield-Brother. What use is reducing threat on an ally for levels 22 to 74? Not a lot.

I understand you need to provide new filler skills between now and 75, but I would much rather you release Improved Blade and Song-Brother rather than restrict them until the 70's. Have the improved version provide the critical hit bonus passive and the threat from healing reduction.

You need to realize that you have made leveling a Captain even harder with this change. Not all of the goodies should be available only at End-game.

[ANewMachine]

"The Captain now receives all of their Tactical Offence Rating and Outgoing Healing Rating from Might (instead of Will)." - please tell me this is JUST for LoM ... ? If it's a class change ... argh. I've spent considerable effort capping out my Fate\Will because I can O/T well enough with ~450 Might, but I need the Fate\Will because I'm spamming heals\buffs as they come up.

#donotlike

Like you're going to have the same gear, LIs, or... well, just about anything after the next 10 levels? The only permanent thing you could have are the stat tomes, and that's only +50. Fate will still matter, especially with crits being much, much bigger for heals. You'll instead stack Fate, Might, and raw Power, which is more efficient than stacking Will anyway.

[DelgonTheWise]

Overall looks very nice to me. I think the block with any 2-H weapon will allow some diversity of weapons choices.

I too am a bit concerned about the power issue. Will has now become a trash stat for Capts far as I can see, so power pools will dwindle somewhat. And we'll be able to spam big attacks ever faster. Song Brother and Blade Brother Power over Time from inspire will help, as will Now for Wrath, but still may find ourselves sucking wind pretty quickly. Time will tell there, but the power cost legacies may become even more important than they are now...

I agree with the upthread comment that Blade Brother would very nice at a lower level.

I think the 10% CJ chance on Kick remains a trash bonus. To get the most out if it you'd have to spam Kick ever 30 seconds. Most of us reserve Kick for an interruptable event and don't want to do that. I'd MUCH rather see LOM give a -15s Kick cooldown. Interrupting is often expected of tanks anyway, and this would help with that aspect.

[Nyrion]

You all missed something very important here: Blade-brother at level 74. That is Horrible!!! This means that a +25% damage To Arms is not only unavailable to us at the start of RoI, but it means that the Captains leveling up will not get this bonus either. If anything, this change is a huge reduction to Captain DPS. Why? We should be able to choose between the -brother's as soon as we get Shield-Brother. What use is reducing threat on an ally for levels 22 to 74? Not a lot.

I understand you need to provide new filler skills between now and 75, but I would much rather you release Improved Blade and Song-Brother rather than restrict them until the 70's. Have the improved version provide the critical hit bonus passive and the threat from healing reduction.

You need to realize that you have made leveling a Captain even harder with this change. Not all of the goodies should be available only at End-game.

Are you kidding? The change to the red capstone alone will boost Cap DPS by a hefty amount, the extra DOT at level 68 increases it further.

I honestly have no idea how you can think Captain DPS will be reduced because Blade brother is available near the level cap. +25% damage for a few seconds is not much really in the scheme of things, with the other boosts I probably won't notice.

I'm rambling now, but my main point is I can't fathom how this a 'huge' DPS reduction.

OT: Everything looks fandabydozy thankee. Soloing should be a lot quicker and more fun now. Much props devs.

[gorma_eu]

Hey i like most of the updates buuuut....

Who had the idea of blocking with a 2h weapon, lol seriously this is ridiculous. Don't wanna be rude but this sounds really stupid to me. There is a reason why you can't parry ranged physical attacks, no need to explain k? There's also a reason why avoiding attacks with your weapon is called parry. To block something, you want to use a shield instead. So your giving captains a third avoidance although it makes completly no sense. Why not boost parry instead?

Don't like this at all.

But good thing is, that i'll lmao everytime my captain is blocking some arrows with his greatsword, because i'll think of someone who decided that this makes perfect sense.

[RtrnofdMax]

Look at it this way. What can't you do now at level 65 that you could before? It's nice for us level 65 folks to think the world is just 10 levels away, but there is a lot before that. To Arms legacies are available at level 45. This means that you will be going through Urugarth, Carn Dum, Helegrod, The Rift, All Moria Instances, BG, and OD all without being able to give To Arms to your DPS. You may think of your DPS as what number pops up when your sword hits something, but your DPS is actually your contribution to the group DPS.

[dietlbomb]

Stat Changes:
The Captain now receives all of their Tactical Offence Rating and Outgoing Healing Rating from Might (instead of Will). Further information can be found in the New Stat Updates Dev Diary.

It ain't pretty, but this seems like the only way to balance the stat changes for captains.

We’ve also made quite a few quality of life improvements:

“Time of Need” has had its cooldown reduced from 20m to 5m.
“Shield of the Dunedain” has had its cooldown reduced from 10m to 5m.
“In Defence of Middle-earth”:
Is now a toggle (with no cost).
Continues advancing in magnitude after level 50.
“War-cry” has had its magnitude changed from -10% Attack Duration to -15% Attack Duration.
Note: This is because the trait “Captain of War” has been repurposed, see below.
The buff from “Herald of War” continues advancing in magnitude after level 50.
Heals, Heal-over-Time effects, and Damage-over-Time effects have had their Critical Multiplier changed from 1 to 1.5


A large change has been made to the Legendary Trait “Defy Corruption”:

This Legendary Trait is now “Fellowship-brother”: Your Brother skills (“Inspire”, “Strength of Will”, and “To Arms”) now affect your entire fellowship with lesser versions of those effects.

This all gets a thumbs up.

Leader of Men:
“Improved Kick” has been moved from the 3-set bonus to the 2-set bonus.
There is an additional 3-set bonus which reduces the Cooldown of “Threatening Shout” by 10s.
The trait “Adherent of Elendil” has been moved to the “Lead the Charge” trait line, replacing “Focused Strikes”.
NEW trait “Echoing Shout” allows the skill “Threatening Shout” to affect up to 3 targets.
The trait “Captain of War” has been changed to “Alert Guard” which gives “Defensive Strike” an increase to Parry Chance.
The trait “Composure” has been changed in two ways:
Reduces the Morale Cost of Time of Need by 50%.
No longer reset the cooldown for “Cry of Vengeance”.
The trait “Blood of Numenor” has been moved to the Hands of Healing trait line (replacing the trait “Subtle Command”).
NEW trait “Improved Routing Cry” adds a Force Taunt to the skill.
The Legendary Capstone Trait “Leader of Men” now has the following abilities:
When using “Shield-brother”, the Captain also receives the full benefits of the Shield-brother skills (“Inspire”, “Strength of Will”, “To Arms”).
Routing Cry no longer requires a Defeat Event.
The Captain is able to Block when wielding a 2-handed weapon.

Although I haven't really been clamoring for a boost to tanking skills, this seems like it should help.

Hands of Healing:
The trait “Relentless Optimism” has had its magnitude increased from +10% Critical Heal Magnitude to +50% Critical Heal Magnitude.
The trait “Subtle Command” has been replaced by “Blood of Numenor”.
The trait “Blood of Numenor” has received several improvements:
Decreases the induction time of “Escape from Darkness” by 2 seconds.
“Escape from Darkness” has its cooldown reduces by 10 minutes.
The target of “Cry of Vengeance” revives with +50% Morale and Power.
The trait “Strength from Within” no longer prevents the summoning of Heralds and Archers.
The Legendary Capstone Trait “Hands of Healing” has an additional ability:
When using Song-brother, the Captain also receives the full benefits of the Song-brother skills (“Inspire”, “Strength of Will”, “To Arms”).

Thumbs up! All this looks useful.

The Legendary Capstone Trait “Master of War” has been improved in several ways:
There is no longer a +15 second Cooldown penalty on Shadow’s Lament.
Shadow’s Lament now provides the Battle-readied effect on a successful hit.
When using “Blade-brother”, the Captain also receives the full benefits of the Blade-brother skills (“Inspire”, “Strength of Will”, “To Arms”).

This sounds like a nice dps boost for high-level captains.

Level 66: Improved Sure Strike – On a successful hit, reduces the active cooldown of “Battle-shout” by 2 seconds.
Level 68: Improved Grave Wound – When hitting a target affected by “Cutting Attack,” adds a second damage-over-time effect to the target.
Level 70: Song-brother
Inspire (Song-brother) – A melee attack which provides a power-over-time effect to your Song-brother.
Strength of Will (Song-brother) – A buff which reduces the Power Cost of your Song-brother’s Healing skills by 10%.
To Arms (Song-brother) – A buff which increases the Outgoing Healing of your Song-brother by 25% for 10 seconds.
Level 72: Improved Cutting Attack – Reduces the Movement Speed of your target by 25% for 20 seconds.
Level 74: Blade-brother
Inspire (Blade-brother) – A melee attack which provides a small heal-over-time effect and a small power-over-time effect to your Blade-brother.
Strength of Will (Blade-brother) – A buff which reduces the Attack Duration of your Blade-brother by 5%.
To Arms (Blade-brother) – A buff which increase the Outgoing Damage of your Blade-brother by 25% for 10 seconds.
Note: The Shield-brother version of “To Arms” now provides -15% Incoming Damage for 10 seconds.

There are a couple of nice dps skills here, especially Strength of Will (Blade-brother) which if combined with the legacy (if the legacy remains unchanged) might be overpowered.

The removal of the damage buff from To Arms (Shield-brother) is a serious decrease to captains' usefulness before they reach level 74. I'm not happy about that. But if the current Shield-brother skills (damage buff, incoming healing buff, and heal-over-time) were so overpowered that they can no longer be used simultaneously, then so be it. I don't plan on spending much time below level cap with my captain, but the journey to level 75 for a new captain will be long.

An earlier dev diary proposed increasing the cooldown for Inspire to the duration of its heal-over-time effect. Since the skill currently doesn't provide the heal if it misses, this could be a significant downgrade. Since outgoing healing will now be bolstered by might, it would be fun if Inspire's heal were correlated to the damage from the attack instead of outgoing heal rating, but only if the cooldown remained the same as it is now.

[Aphasial]

Hey i like most of the updates buuuut....

Who had the idea of blocking with a 2h weapon, lol seriously this is ridiculous. Don't wanna be rude but this sounds really stupid to me. There is a reason why you can't parry ranged physical attacks, no need to explain k? There's also a reason why avoiding attacks with your weapon is called parry. To block something, you want to use a shield instead. So your giving captains a third avoidance although it makes completly no sense. Why not boost parry instead?

Don't like this at all.

But good thing is, that i'll lmao everytime my captain is blocking some arrows with his greatsword, because i'll think of someone who decided that this makes perfect sense.

I'm not so sure this is as rediculous as you make it out to be. I think of a block as a deflection as well, and it's certainly the case that a greatsword or something else could have a chance to deflect a ranged attack. A close physical attack could certainly be blocked by a two-handed weapon as well -- think to any of the movies (or fighting movies in general) where a two-handed staff or pole type weapon blocked a sword or batted away a blow.

I think it's a great example of creativity on the part of the devs, and gives us a reason to bring back the halberd and other 2-handers for our captains

[Omen_Kaizer]

I am very excite!

With the confirmation that we have a "main" stat, my apprehensions with the RoI changes are largely satisfied. And all these new traits and trait consolidations look positive and well thought-out. I especially love that it doesnt seem as if there is one captain traitline to rule them all. All three have a purpose and each will probably be called for in different situations or groups with a buncha pubs. If I were assured that there would be a little breathing room for the Brother skill cooldowns (inspire and SoW), I'd say I was fully satisfied.

Thanks, devs!


PS

I'm not so sure this is as rediculous as you make it out to be. I think of a block as a deflection as well, and it's certainly the case that a greatsword or something else could have a chance to deflect a ranged attack. A close physical attack could certainly be blocked by a two-handed weapon as well -- think to any of the movies (or fighting movies in general) where a two-handed staff or pole type weapon blocked a sword or batted away a blow.

I would agree that block with 2-handers is a useful game mechanic for us. I'd like to see it. Makes about as much sense as attributing our ability to raise the morale of our compatriots to our physical might as opposed to our forceful will--which is to say, it makes practical gameplay sense.
But what your describing there--blocking an attack with your weapon--is pretty much the definition of a parry.

[Lydil]

I am happy to see a full on diary for Captains stating all the changes. While I know not everyone will be happy that Might is our primary stat for damage and healing, I think consolidating to one stat will be better for Captains in the long run.

Two things from the Dev Diary that I did not like:

A) Improved Routing Cry - Can we please please PLEASE get a better name for a trait than this? Especially if it could be something more Captain-esque like our other trait names (my suggestion would be Now for Ruin or Cry of Anger, but anything is better than Improved)

B) Song-Brother at level 70, Blade-Brother at level 74 - I think having these only come into play in near the new level cap is unfortunate. Leader of Men, Hands of Healing, and Lead the Charge all have capstones which augment the three Brothers, and those legendaries can be obtained by level 60. However only Leader of Men will get to use the Captain getting the full bonus of the Brother at level 60. Hands of Healing and Lead the Charge have to wait 10-14 levels to do the same. Not to mention Captains who are leveling up will not get to increase the damage of their herald (or group members) using To Arms. It is going to take people a while to get down the concept of the Three brothers and which to use. Isn't it better to let Captains use them as they level up, so they can be better versed in them when they finally do reach the cap? I'd hate for the reason we have to get these at 70 and 74 be due to all classes have to get X new skills so those are being thrown in to appease that, despite the downsides it has to our class at lower levels.

[BotLike]

Hey turbine , you couldnt make me any happier than you did.

I wont say much , peeps above covered everything , just 1 thing.

Give us a gear EXACTLY like DN !!!!!!!!!!!!
With that i mean : Might-Agility-Vitality-Fate boosts and MOST important : BIG power pools. ( Adding death-event minus CD again wouldnt be bad either hehe : P : P : P )

Dont make us build a decent power pool (3-4k at least ) through will/fate caster jewels now that will is useless.

Changes/improvements are all great , what we only need right now is a DN gear number 2 . Cheers again turbine <3

[Almagnus1]

Hey i like most of the updates buuuut....

Who had the idea of blocking with a 2h weapon, lol seriously this is ridiculous. Don't wanna be rude but this sounds really stupid to me. There is a reason why you can't parry ranged physical attacks, no need to explain k? There's also a reason why avoiding attacks with your weapon is called parry. To block something, you want to use a shield instead. So your giving captains a third avoidance although it makes completly no sense. Why not boost parry instead?

Don't like this at all.

But good thing is, that i'll lmao everytime my captain is blocking some arrows with his greatsword, because i'll think of someone who decided that this makes perfect sense.

And how many times have you seen mobs without shields, or animals, block your attacks? It's not without precedence in the game.

Plus, captain with a heavy shield would be ridiculously OP - high threat and crazy good survivability. Enough survivability to make a warden look like a fervor champ that just agroed 30 mobs and started to tank them still in fervor..

[gorma_eu]

I'm not so sure this is as rediculous as you make it out to be. I think of a block as a deflection as well, and it's certainly the case that a greatsword or something else could have a chance to deflect a ranged attack. A close physical attack could certainly be blocked by a two-handed weapon as well -- think to any of the movies (or fighting movies in general) where a two-handed staff or pole type weapon blocked a sword or batted away a blow.

I think it's a great example of creativity on the part of the devs, and gives us a reason to bring back the halberd and other 2-handers for our captains

I doubt that anyone could block arrows neither with a 30-40 pound war hammer or halberd, or simply any polearm weapon nor with a greatsword. This only happens in ninja movies but not in middle earth :> and not on a regular basis.

[RobinThorp]

And how many times have you seen mobs without shields, or animals, block your attacks? It's not without precedence in the game.

Plus, captain with a heavy shield would be ridiculously OP - high threat and crazy good survivability. Enough survivability to make a warden look like a fervor champ that just agroed 30 mobs and started to tank them still in fervor..

While I completely agree with you, I have to say it's bugged me to no end that a captain archetype can't use a large shield. From a fantasy perspective, it makes no sense. I could rationalize a champion archetype not being able to use a shield over a captain type. It just aggravates me that I can't have a sword/shield cappy.

/rantoff

[gorma_eu]

And how many times have you seen mobs without shields, or animals, block your attacks? It's not without precedence in the game.

Good point, and how many classes, captains excluded, you saw blocking arrows with their weapon? All mobs can block, regardless of whether they visually wear a shield or not, because they simply dont wear any equip(just try monsterplay). Its just a decission that all mobs can block.