The Ruined City - Feedback

[Dark-Rebel]

It is also about mob damage : in T2, trash mobs damage is largely > and I cannot go AFK...
All classes can solo T1 instances on live since U12 (I tested with my Hunter, a weak class, not top geared (even some 12-man content is soloable in T1 (some skraids) in Yellow).

In Red, with ~35.5K Morale, Mitigations = 60% & 58%, Crit. Def. = 61.6%, most of received hits are around -500/600 (many weak, minor or moderate hits), it is a lot too low. No danger and no need of a Healer =>

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The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially blocked hit with a minor melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially parried hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 390 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 819 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 592 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a minor ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially evaded hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a moderate ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
The Half-troll Executioner scored a hit with a melee double attack on Christianx for 585 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
The Half-troll Executioner scored a partially evaded hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 498 Common damage to Morale.
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If t1 go harder t2 go much more harder. T1 should be easy it should not give good things.
I can solo some t1 on my hunter, but we know this new 3-man is much harder than old 3-man at t1... You was with a survival gear/traits, i'm able to solo some in red line with my normal gear/traits, i mean try solo this one with a "normal" gear, it will be harder i think.

I was receiving a good damage on my warden in t2.

[Castorix]

If t1 go harder t2 go much more harder. T1 should be easy it should not give good things.

T1/T2 damage/stats are not linked (U14 buffed only T2 instances)
I agree T1 instances must be easy, but I think they are a lot too easy with too low damage and don't prepare for T2 (and it will be worse with the new slotted gear)
I would like tank classes to need a healer (or another class as off-tank to aggro some mobs) to avoid soloing so easily.

[Vulcwen]

T1/T2 damage/stats are not linked (U14 buffed only T2 instances)
I agree T1 instances must be easy, but I think they are a lot too easy with too low damage and don't prepare for T2 (and it will be worse with the new slotted gear)
I would like tank classes to need a healer (or another class as off-tank to aggro some mobs) to avoid soloing so easily.

U14 buffed the T2 multiplier.. stats on T2 are basically that of T1 multiplied by a constant, which is then potentially specifically tweaked for specific situations..
Although the multiplier doesn't seem to be applied to everything in this cluster, it's definitely the case that T1 and T2 are linked.

The T2 multiplier is currently set at roughly x3 (before U14 it was x1.5).

[Dark-Rebel]

I agree T1 instances must be easy, but I think they are a lot too easy with too low damage and don't prepare for T2

T2 mobs just do more damage, i've not done this one in t2 but if have a real difference in buff/debuffs tell me.
I mean if only the damage is the difference yes you can use t1 to learn about the t2.

I don't think turbine will do like in ToO, ToO is a hard instance, even with 12 lvl 100, ToO t2 have different things in the instance not only more damage.

[Thrifkori]

Hi there,

yesterday we (Rk, Rk, Guard) did Ruined City T2 and we discovered a few bugs.

• The challenge says: "Harrowing Fell-Spirits in palace must no be defeated", but if one of the spirits before the palace is defeated, the challenge fails.
  --> Change the challenge description or remove the kill counter on the spirits before.
  
  
• The second boss was defeated by his own adds, before we entered the arena.
  Then we cleared the arena, but the adds kept respawning.
  
  
• So we ran directly to the third boss, yes you can enter the palace while being in combat.
  After the brief talk the mysterious figure froze and we left the instance.
  When we entered the instance again on our way to the boss, we noticed that the second boss respawnt and we could fight it as normal.
  At this time the adds didn't respawn.
  
  
• If one of your fellowshipmembers is not in the arena while fighting (second boss) and the boss is trying to give this member a hit.
  It is running against the wall and you can easily farm it, so please address this.

[Castorix]

I mean if only the damage is the difference yes you can use t1 to learn about the t2.

The damage in T1 is so low that many effects are broken (like poison in Library for example, which could kill my heavy classes several years ago, or lightnings in Sammath Gul (Alagossir) inoffensive now, etc...)

[Castorix]

A quick test in T1, in Red, with only a few skills used, showing that it is as easy as School/Lib =>
Any Guardian/Warden/Champ/... can do the same thing, I just replaced some stats (like Tact. Mit, useless here) by several Morale essences.
(tested in D3D9 because in D3D10 (32-bits/4Gb RAM), it crashes nearly immediately)

[Vulcwen]

I decided to record a solo run at T1 as well.. As I was too lazy to edit the videos together, I made it a playlist.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...rfrfgJS5lDgX-Z



Anyway, it looks a lot harder than what Castorix shows (which is understandable as guards are OP in AoE situations), it's definitely harder than most T1 instances, I'd say it's on par with the easier T2 instances (like iorbar's peak.. for a group).
Also note that the first boss doesn't use his bleed when you solo, and that bleed makes the boss a lot harder.

Interestingly, the orcs have Orc-craft damage attacks, so that means in general PvE builds, you wont have capped mits against these mobs (33% for me). Perhaps they can get an armour/mitigation debuff to make it a bit more interesting as well.

The troll can get dangerous for a lot of groups, he does 8k damage with his aoe on me, with fire-lore.. so this can easily get into the 15k range, which is a lot for squishies in a lower morale build... Some people would get oneshotted by it if they fail to dodge it.

I had to quit while doing the last boss because of dinner (4th video), but his Great Cleave is pretty manageable with fire-lore.. without fire-lore it's going to be hard to run this without a tank (16k+ hits), although I guess you can use CC and kite him forever (he's not immune).

EDIT:
I decided to roll a BR guardian, to test it with.. It's indeed pretty easy up to the 2nd boss (first boss being A LOT easier on guardian than it's on LM), but I couldn't get past that point because the defilers keep running away from you, running out of power (should've brought power pots, and getting stunned with that poison on me, then taking the AoE).. I got hit for 20k on my first attempt, after a stun + 2 poisons applied after it. Note: I don't play a guard at endgame on live, but I have a lvl 50 one (XP disabled), it's just VERY easy to play guard XD.
Stats (DA essence set + full gold BB jewellery + purple bow/cloak):
29.5k morale, 29.4k PM, 55.7% crit def, 13k crit, 7.4k finesse, 5.6k inc healing (elf, so no 5% bonus), 9.9k parry, 8.8k evade (block N/A as I used a 2H), 59.8% common mits, 33.8% OC mits (similar to what my LM has.. so the hits are actually higher :P). I used a TA 2H and TA belt which I imbued, but didn't do anything with it except replacing a few legacies and maxing the IXP.
Oh, and 62 trait point build (no Honerable Combat).
So castorix, if you can do it (I know you have memory issues), also test the 2nd boss :P.

[Castorix]

EDIT:
I decided to roll a BR guardian, to test it with.. It's indeed pretty easy up to the 2nd boss (first boss being A LOT easier on guardian than it's on LM), but I couldn't get past that point because the defilers keep running away from you, running out of power (should've brought power pots, and getting stunned with that poison on me, then taking the AoE).. I got hit for 20k on my first attempt, after a stun + 2 poisons applied after it. Note: I don't play a guard at endgame on live, but I have a lvl 50 one (XP disabled), it's just VERY easy to play guard XD.
Stats (DA essence set + full gold BB jewellery + purple bow/cloak):
29.5k morale, 29.4k PM, 55.7% crit def, 13k crit, 7.4k finesse, 5.6k inc healing (elf, so no 5% bonus), 9.9k parry, 8.8k evade (block N/A as I used a 2H), 59.8% common mits, 33.8% OC mits (similar to what my LM has.. so the hits are actually higher :P). I used a TA 2H and TA belt which I imbued, but didn't do anything with it except replacing a few legacies and maxing the IXP.
Oh, and 62 trait point build (no Honerable Combat).
So castorix, if you can do it (I know you have memory issues), also test the 2nd boss :P.

Ok, I'll try if I can technically (it took me several attempts to find that switching back to D3D9 was better, but I must set all options to minimum)
I see indeed on your videos that it is not as easy with your LM : I'm surprised because I saw some instances that you did more easily than with my Guardian (like First of the Heirs", where there were also (big) mobs to heal myself).
But I still think it is too easy (ok, not as easy as School/Lib for non-tank/heavy classes), because you could do it alone nevertheless and except maybe RK/Hunters (and for bosses only, because trash mobs are easy to manage in Yellow Hunter) all classes should be able to solo it in T1.

[Castorix]

So castorix, if you can do it (I know you have memory issues), also test the 2nd boss :P.

I just tested it entirely (with several crashes).

The 2nd boss, Thrug the Troll, cannot kill me (biggest hit = ~9700 with 51.6% Crit. Def.), but it took time because of its healing buff and the power debuff (I did not see what causes it)
I should have done it in Full DPS gear.

The last boss Lúmithil is ridiculous : done semi-AFK (healed by adds), biggest hit = 10130, but too rare to be dangerous (3 during all the fight (a few minutes), done with 38K Morale))
And I only saw -9312 on your LM in your last video...
Some damage are useless :
"The Lúmithil reflected 13 Shadow damage to the Morale of Christianx."
"The Lúmithil reflected 31 Shadow damage to the Morale of Christianx."

I did not notice anything about this in B5 release notes :
Ruined City:
Haradrim mobs have more skills they can use against players

Some debuffs are not scaled for lvl 100 (same thing in skraids for a long time)
For example, from Archers =>



200 damage every 3 seconds is nothing.

So, if 3-manned, impossible to fail in T1 with an heavy class.

[Vulcwen]

I just tested it entirely (with several crashes).

The 2nd boss, Thrug the Troll, cannot kill me (biggest hit = ~9700 with 51.6% Crit. Def.), but it took time because of its healing buff and the power debuff (I did not see what causes it)
I should have done it in Full DPS gear.

The last boss Lúmithil is ridiculous : done semi-AFK (healed by adds), biggest hit = 10130, but too rare to be dangerous (3 during all the fight (a few minutes), done with 38K Morale))
And I only saw -9312 on your LM in your last video...
Some damage are useless :
"The Lúmithil reflected 13 Shadow damage to the Morale of Christianx."
"The Lúmithil reflected 31 Shadow damage to the Morale of Christianx."

I did not notice anything about this in B5 release notes :
Ruined City:
Haradrim mobs have more skills they can use against players

Some debuffs are not scaled for lvl 100 (same thing in skraids for a long time)
For example, from Archers =>



200 damage every 3 seconds is nothing.

So, if 3-manned, impossible to fail in T1 with an heavy class.

Yep, I take less damage from individual melee hits than you do (note, ranged attacks are a lot more dangerous for LMs).. 40% mits + -40% melee damage debuff = 0.6 * 0.6 = 0.36, so effectively 64% mits. On the other hand, I have like 13% avoidances instead of 40-70%, so I take a lot more hits in general. Also that last boss has that 25% reflect against fire damage (idk what caused you to take reflect damage).

Anyway, nice that you got past the 2nd boss.. On the guard, I just couldn't keep my power up, and actually, I was having some problems staying alive normally as well as all the mobs got spread out. And as I said, on my first attempt I got a rather unfortunate combo of: stun (turn the tables on cd) + 2 defilers use poison on me (2x +60% incoming damage...) + boss uses his AoE, resulting in 20k damage.

I agree that that poison needs to be scaled up (2k would be fine I think).

The last boss also uses that A Cut! attack on random players, although they nerfed the random version because it was too much in T2 I think (remember that T1 and T2 are still connected by a multiplier). Still, 10k at T1 would mean about 30k on T2, so that's a significant hit, especially considering at T2 you also have a spirit that does nasty incoming healing debuffs, and you're not allowed to kill it for challenge.
Maybe he should get a 150% reflect for 15s at every 25% of his morale, could make it interesting.

Further, I do think the first boss still has a nasty bleed on T1, which doesn't seem to work if you solo.

Finally, T1 should still be possible without a heavy/LM, so a combo like hunter + RK + mini, and you don't want to have the damage set so high in T1 that they just get oneshotted in 17k morale builds.

Btw, I'd like to test a run with you in a group..

[aaparadoxaa]

T2 BUG
First mini boss Jukotor.
When boss dies one archer bugged in the tent. Near the right tent from the entrance to boss, we are running all instance in war mod. Also my teammates all fight died from wound(poison) that can't be cured. 9k damage or 5% morale, don't know. In my case that poison was curable,but for them no.


Second boss. Can you explain tactics? Why orks attacking troll? How to tank him?Need tips. I'm playing for warden.
T2 BUG
When our group was wiped, it's teleport you to place where first mini boss was. And guess what, there is our old fellow - archer in the tent and we are in combat again. So when we finally get back to second boss - there waiting for us another bug. Troll is not activated, orcs stand on their places, but orcs don't stop spawning from last fight. Dozens of orks, so that's was enough - we are gave up

Challenge quest now only fails on death of Harrowing Fell-Spirit within the Palace of Eldacar - seems working fine

[Dark-Rebel]

The last boss also uses that A Cut! attack on random players, although they nerfed the random version because it was too much in T2 I think (remember that T1 and T2 are still connected by a multiplier). Still, 10k at T1 would mean about 30k on T2, so that's a significant hit, especially considering at T2 you also have a spirit that does nasty incoming healing debuffs, and you're not allowed to kill it for challenge.

(t2) I received a critical hit for 30k on my runekeeper, i was alone people needed to leave, i started the battle just to see how strong he was and second hit was 30k


40% mits 50% crit def.

[Castorix]

Further, I do think the first boss still has a nasty bleed on T1, which doesn't seem to work if you solo.
Finally, T1 should still be possible without a heavy/LM, so a combo like hunter + RK + mini, and you don't want to have the damage set so high in T1 that they just get oneshotted in 17k morale builds.
Btw, I'd like to test a run with you in a group..

If you say the bleed is not on T1 when we are alone, they must fix this bug.
About difficulty, maybe they could do something like (for T1 only, but for all instances/raids/skraids) :

if (ClassType == "Heavy" OR Class == "Warden")
Damage = Damage * 2;

Even with double damage, I think the first boss would still be easy for tank classes, but probably I could not do the 2 other bosses, which would be a lot better. (and maybe I could not pull anymore all the trash mobs in a T1 instance, which should not be possible (although it is also possible in some T3 skraids))

(and difficult for me to test this instance in group with so many crashes. Painful.)

[Vulcwen]

If you say the bleed is not on T1 when we are alone, they must fix this bug.
About difficulty, maybe they could do something like (for T1 only, but for all instances/raids/skraids) :

if (ClassType == "Heavy" OR Class == "Warden")
Damage = Damage * 2;

Even with double damage, I think the first boss would still be easy for tank classes, but probably I could not do the 2 other bosses, which would be a lot better. (and maybe I could not pull anymore all the trash mobs in a T1 instance, which should not be possible (although it is also possible in some T3 skraids))

(and difficult for me to test this instance in group with so many crashes. Painful.)

In that case you could also say:
Finesse = 70%
Which in turn renders BPE nearly useless.

I think the real issue is the amount of self-healing tank classes can get while also having high mitigations AND avoidances. Additionally, guardian, as a class is just stupid easy to play.. I've been testing with that guardian a bit.. and in any AoE stuff I basically faceroll through stuff that my LM has no chance at. I also ran this instance in blue line, and you're right you can (almost) afk stuff.. that passive block heal is just OP (I still had to use a few skills as I don't have 40k morale, and since b5 you get stunned by half-trolls occasionally, unless you interrupt them). Based on this testing I feel like for guardians it's often either a you can't do it, or it's easy.

While the mechanic of self-healing on guardian can definitely be fun, I do think they need some nerf in terms of survivability in their DPS line, before HD it was a mitigation penalty (-30%, putting them at 40% at most), and I think that even with 30%-40% mits, a guard can still survive pretty decently. Champs used to have to sacrifice all their avoidances in order to deal extra damage. In blue, I already suggested, make bolstering blocks a toggle skill that costs quite some power to keep up, so you can't have that effect for all eternity, unless you have a cappy/LM to keep the power up. This increases difficulty for guards quite a bit, without any change to content would be needed.

[Padraic]

beta 5, T1

rk, hunter and me, on decked out champ tank build.

1st boss went OK but archer bugged in tent as reported by others.

2nd boss....ugh.

I have nfi what happened with The Thrug, he seemed to get stuck with a centimeter of health left.
Is this a bug or were we not doing enough damage to get past healing he was getting?

What is a working way to take him out now?

I did this at lvl 50 and 100 a few builds back and do not remember having such difficulty.

Are adds respawning out of thin air and agro'ing on dps / healer at crazy long / impossible distances?
What is going on with them attacking Thrug then turning around and running off to attack dps/heals when tank is standing right THERE pounding on Thrug?

</whine>

so confused.....
will try again later.

P.S. I am being stunned too often, it does not make sense.

[Castorix]

2nd boss....ugh.
I have nfi what happened with The Thrug, he seemed to get stuck with a centimeter of health left.
Is this a bug or were we not doing enough damage to get past healing he was getting?
What is a working way to take him out now?
I did this at lvl 50 and 100 a few builds back and do not remember having such difficulty.
Are adds respawning out of thin air and agro'ing on dps / healer at crazy long / impossible distances?
What is going on with them attacking Thrug then turning around and running off to attack dps/heals when tank is standing right THERE pounding on Thrug?

You certainly have enough DPS as I did it alone with my Guardian and low DPS (I lost time when I was out of power and I could not hit him => his morale was increasing)
Vulcwen did it faster as LM (video 3, B4.1, but same thing in B5), so it shoud be quick with 2/3 DPS.
I did not understand either why he was fighting against adds.

[Vulcwen]

I did not understand either why he was fighting against adds.

That troll is a "wild" troll, the orcs captured him, and he breaks free and goes on a rampage when you get there (attacking both you and the orcs).
If you read the tooltips, you see that the buffs say something like "hatred of orcs". Ofc, the orcs don't like having a troll going rampage, and probably would want to capture him again. This is basically the same idea as with dargnack unleashed.

[Castorix]

Debuffs/effects not fixed on live
In Labyrinth I still get ("Serious Wound")



Not really "serious"...
(even for the weakest classes)