Dev Diary Feedback: Volume I Revised Edition

[JeanCarlo]

Thank you!

To say that this literally breaths new life to the game for me is Definitely an understatement!


Couple of questions tho:

1. As someone already asked, how does the IG work with pets? Would my LM pet or capt companion or even RK stone also benefit from IG?

2. What does IG do to consumable items? From one of the pictures, a L51 had 9K+ morale, mostly due to the addition of 450% (which means his base was around 1,700???). Using a Infused Athelas Extract (Crit, L51 minimum) that can give 720-760 sounds a LOT less when you're comparing it to a "base" morale of 4000 than when looking at 22,000 (with the +450%).

3. Does the outgoing increase in healing also affect Power? (thinking of Guardian's traited CaB, for example, or RK's power skill, or Warden's power gambit). How about LM power leech?

[sirwillow]

Reading through the replies I'm amazed at how many are asking questions which have answers right in front of their noses.

Patch notes, announcements, and the Dev Diary all state that this is going live for ALL of the Volume 1 book quests with the next content update- which is Monday, March 1st.

If you bother to read the diary, you'll see that Orion openly says that the buffs in the already live book 2 are to powerful and they have been adjusted with a new system. That's what the whole entirety of the dev diary is about! Saying it's all going to be like book 2 was shows that you didn't bother to read much of anything. It's going to scale differently, and will also adjust for other people being in your fellowship as well. It shouldn't be a cake walk at all.

And for those that are saying it is- have you tested it and played it through on Bull roarer? Or are you saying that just based on your book 2 experience, which is what I'm seeing. It always amazes me when people start complaining and bashing something that they haven't even bothered to really check out or test yet.

As for me personally, I can't wait to log in on Monday on my main and finally start getting the rest of Volume 1 done. It's been well over a year and I am so looking forward to experiencing the full story and finishing up parts that I've never seen or done. I've very excited about this.

[PhilippaSomerville]

I, too, am very excited about the prospect of doing the entirety of volume 1 solo. Several of my alts never finished it because, like so many others, I found it difficult to put together full fellowships to do several critical chapters.

Great work, Turbine! I'm really looking forward to this!

[Braelyineron]

Immense improvement to the game. Congrats to Orion and team for the work on this!

[CaptainSnark]

I was fortunate enough to get my main through the entirety of the epic volume 1 storyline in its original run - it was a tremendous amount of fun, experiencing it all the first time, and often with groups.

But once the action primarily moved to volume 2, it's become tough as nails to get my alts through the volume 1 quests - my kin goes back and does them sometimes, but my schedule often doesn't allow me to join them, so the farthest any of my alts has gotten has been maybe book 10.

So personally, I am very much looking forward to being able to go through and do it all again - solo, at my own pace, and on-level! Thank you very much for doing this.

[knowfere]

My main character has done all of the epic story and completes each new part as it comes out. I have 6 alts that are all at various stages and none have completed VOL 1. I love that now I can go back and complete everything up to the points where each character is. Matter of fact, I can't wait to get in there and do this. My next most played character is up to book 10 and I've been wanting to complete it all this time. And the sound of being able to get marks for Annuminas gear sounds splendid!! None of my characters fully experienced those instances and none have any pieces of that gear.

[Lohi]

Do you really need to nerf the rewards for solo versions when they'll be outleveled in 5 levels anyway?

I used Laerdan's ring at level 60 for a long time :-) But I do agree, with Eregion and early Moria, a lot of the really great epic quest rewards are outgrown quickly now.

[Lohi]

Does this mean we can replay solo instances to get marks of triumph to trade for the annuminas/gf/helegrod gear? if so, woohoo!!!!!

Helegrod anyway; more expensive but you can get it just with the marks. The other gear require additional items that aren't so simple to get (bosses in CD/Uru) or need a lot of grinding (Annuminas armor bits). And I had plenty of marks for a piece Helegrod gear for when I hit 50 on a couple of characters, and what looked like amazing gear at level 45 was pretty ho-hum at 50. What makes it shine are the set bonuses, whereas it's easy to find better gear at 50 if you ignore the bonuses. The Annuminas and GF gear did not impress me at all, though some of it does look nice for use as outfits.

[Lohi]

[QUOTE=Feybobiam;4443495] or Captains in Lead the Charge. Neither of those specs benefit group play./QUOTE]

I don't know, I did captain with Lead the Charge for a long time, and did very well in groups. Front-lines and off-tanking is a valid place for a captain to be, they don't have to spec healing to be a backup healer. Especially in simpler instances and fellowship quess (not everyone does end-game instances only). It is nice for a hybrid class to be able to do more than one thing instead of fitting into someone else's mold.

[Lohi]

I did some of book 10 before the last bullroarer patch and it was extreemly overpowered.

Well, book 10 was nearly soloable at level 50 anyway for some classes, definitely it can all be done in a duo with the right tactics. So even a small buff could go a long way to making it easily soloable.

[Lohi]

2. Get a gandalf. This is probably the most common method. Again, no learning expereince, they are just along for the ride.

Or option 2a, get a Gandalf who makes you pull your own weight. I hated this in WoW because someone would say "just stand back and try not to attack or you will get aggro, but go ahead and loot everything". That was a ridiculous approach, and just emphasized the gear-oriented approach in that game. Here though I make sure people I group with are having fun and will pass out some pointers at low level. Ie, take my minstrel into Great Barrows, but then make sure I do nothing but heal; it's not perfect, but it gives the guardian a chance to try and hold aggro, or to let the other healers heal me, etc. If a hunter is in strength stance I'll let them off tank for awhile, then later point out the other stances they could use instead (politely of course). I do try to get a character that's lower level to help if I can.

Of course, now and then I run into a player who just wants to be power leveled. It's rarer here because the power levelers don't bother with the lower level instances or fellowship quests.

[HylianHero9]

I am very excited about this!

As a level 45 who is still stuck on Volume I, Book III, chapters 4,5, and 6 (or 3, 4, and 5, call to men, dwarves and elves, whatever it is), it will be wonderful to finally finish these quests. I can't wait.

[Fredelas]

I am concerned that this system continues to be implemented now, when its lead designer continues to express that it has serious shortcomings.

If, just as one example, a solo player is required to go through an impossibly unsafe landscape area before being able to activate the buff, wouldn't it make more sense to continue developing the system until this limitation can be overcome?

Why not wait 3 or 6 more months and address some of those shortcomings first? Why is it so crucial for Turbine to deploy this feature in this particular update?

[KouklaGirl]

I think I would have toned down the XP on the end boss(es) for solo instances instead of buffing up the XP on the player, that way the player wouldn't know the difference unless they ran the instance solo then did it with a fellowship, which would be impossible to do on the same character.

I still don't like IG. Still seems like a "cheat mode" to me.

And regarding Hunters in Strength stance, I rarely use it on my Hunter. The 10% damage bonus isn't worth the extra 15% power it costs...you'll burn through power like butter, especially in a large crowd situation. I generally use Precision stance unless I am in a skirmish or something where mobs are attacking non-stop. I'll use Endurance when that happens.

[Old_Man]

I'm a first-time MMORPG player. I've been playing a little over two years now. I came to the game because my preferred multi- and single-player game content was in a lull. MMORPG seemed to be where the audience was. Well with the exception of The Sims and Second Life sorts of games. This must be where the leading edge is. I have two level 60+s on Brandywine and one level 65 on Windfola both servers having a full set of all crafts Guild Kindred and Supreme Mastered all in the level 40s. And all missing most group epic content. I'm 61 years old and retired from computer applications all aspects and even if I did have my own business that allowed me to retire in my forties I never was much good at groups. I do what I tell me and I always make the right decisions. I may have sometimes been incorrect but I was never wrong.

To me the problem is clear -- two very diverse aspects of our culture. Or more precisely trying to merge these two aspects. Literature and gaming. It's nice to be able to use the IP title to attract customers. That's what brought me here. I'm a big big Tolkien and Lord of the Rings fan having read the books so many times I can't recall. Having a poor memory helps with this. :|

As I started out playing LotRO like so many others I was blocked from doing the epic story. How many people were you with the last time you read a book? How many people does it take to watch a movie? I'm old with cynicism in full bloom what do I want with people in groups? I very nearly dropped the whole thing at that point. I persevered, tried to learn the game, 'finished' it as best I could. Solo. I'm sorry but the LotR IP is so so much bigger than LotRO and may even be bigger than MMOGs too. I wonder what the 'subscription' is for the books?

I've tried grouping including kinships. My observations? Grouping = Drama! Why not try adjusting your play style to the rest of the group rather than whining about how they're not playing their class properly? 'One for All' is part of the goal. Way too much 'All for One' here IMHO. But that's life. Not really a problem with all that but not what I came here for. I've got some radiance gear and am currently working through all that endgame business. Grudgingly. Especially now that Myst Online has come back yet one more time.

So, how did Tolkien get around the problem? Frodo added friends to his side. Has this method been discounted as a means of getting through the epic content? Frodo wasn't 'buffed' up, well not much, his fellows joined him. I appreciate we're well down the pipe now and Bravo!, Allan 'Orion' Maki. Just the same I wonder how it would have gone had Tolkien's method been used? Regardless I will play my missing epic content and be very very appreciative while I do. Thank you Turbine and Allan for attempting this monumental task! This _was_ the single significant down-side to RPGing for me.

P.S. A little side-note to all the MMORPG players: It's about subscriptions guys. End of story. If you want the servers full and cash-flow to ... um .... 'flow', all demographics have to be considered. It seems to me Turbine knows the numbers and solo players are a significant enough subscription component to re-invest in. As is raiders and player-versus-player although why you'd want to RPG an FPS is beyond me.

[gantoris]

It seems that most of the people that are angry at this are using the argument of either the buff being too much, or that it makes grouping not worth it.

1. If your at level 65 doing lvl 50 content.. guess what? your already OP for it!!! Try doing this content at the level called for then see if the buff is OP before speculation wins the day.

2. IF it scales to the group size, then it would be no benifit to grouping or soloing or duoing or .. or ... or. It would make it to where you can play it with what you have and or can get.

Myself, I love the idea. because even with a helpfull kin often i cannot get enough appropriately leveld mates to do this content. However i can usually get 3 or 4 to help, now we will actually be able to do it! Fantastic!

When I do this content I fully expect the buff to be way OP because i'm lvl 65, I can look past this because if i go in with a full group of lvl 65 toons .... then we are way OP.

As someone that has been playing the game since the beginning and has never completed the volume 1 epic on any character, THANK YOU TURBINE!

[Cleft_dad]

So here is my 2c on IG... we are not their target audience.
We: People who have been playing LOTRO for 1-1/2+ years, have several level capped and/or raiding toons, and are familiar with all aspects of the game.

Target audience: First time players.

Inspired Greatness wouldn't be necessary if there were people actively running Volume I epic quests, but the 'we' mentioned above did these quests long ago. Alts from this 'we' get the royal treatment in gear from higher players or kinmates, and runs are coordinated within a kinship that has likely existed since beta or soon thereafter.

I started in Aug. 2009 and joined one such kinship, thinking that the established players would give me a good base from which to acquire assistance when I needed it. I'd get to a fellowship quest, inside the epic story or out, and receive a response along the lines of "oh man, I remember that quest. It sucks. Glad I never have to do it again." My first character missed all group content below 50 because I either got the response above, or the equally frustrating to new players "you don't need to run that to level" comment. I go months in between my opportunities to do any of the epic questline I need to complete because I either find a group several chapters or even books behind me, and by the time I've finished helping catch them up to me the group dissolves, or I find no group whatsoever, give the quest a few futile solo chances then abandon it.

For the record, I'd much prefer to do the epic quests as a fellowship. I enjoy the synergy multiple classes/roles bring to a fight, and the conjunction element to LotRO is a great mechanic that I rarely get to see in action. But I don't know enough players outside of the 'we' to allow me this option, and so I'll take reluctantly the gift of Inspired Greatness and finish the content that drew me to the game in the first place since without the epic storyline, this is really an uninspired cookie-cutter MMO with mechanics, quests, and gaming archetypes that I could find in a much more popular MMO.

[sirwillow]

I started in Aug. 2009 and joined one such kinship, thinking that the established players would give me a good base from which to acquire assistance when I needed it. I'd get to a fellowship quest, inside the epic story or out, and receive a response along the lines of "oh man, I remember that quest. It sucks. Glad I never have to do it again." My first character missed all group content below 50 because I either got the response above, or the equally frustrating to new players "you don't need to run that to level" comment.

While I normally abhor it when people make this type of comment, I'm going to make it here. You've either got a lousy kinship, or are just running into the lousy people in it. Shame on them for doing that to you. Honestly, that is not how most kinships are- even the small ones. While, again, I normally hate when people do this, I would actually go over to your server's forums, and their kinship ones, and post on there your experiences and ask what the other kins do and who helps. Then go to a kin with the people who are willing, able, and wanting to play the way YOU want to make, and not leave you out in the valley if you're doing things they don't want to. That's just sad.

All that aside, I'm still very excited about volume 1 being made solo.

[Orion]

I am wondering about pets though. I have captains and loremasters, and have read that the pets do not get any buffs, so die very fast in the going solo versions. Is this going to be corrected?

For landscape areas, yes. The tech is just not there to transfer the ability to them as well...not yet.

[Orion]

Great stuff. I can't wait to run all my alts through the stories they've missed so far.

One question. You say at the end that rewards have not yet been adjusted. Why do they have to be? These are quests from level 15-50. The rewards are thus statted. Do you really need to nerf the rewards for solo versions when they'll be outleveled in 5 levels anyway? It's not like people are going to be zerging through instance clusters racking up medallions or level-cap rewards, so what does it hurt?

Well, there is certainly more than one question here, so let me try to answer each.

The rewards don't necessarily need adjustment, but some of the quests were adjusted significantly as levels were brought up or down to meet the overall goal of streamlining the experience.

No one said anything about nerfing. No reason to immediately think that this was something negative. It was not meant as a warning, rather as an apology.

Interesting posit there on the last bit.

[Orion]

I'm assuming you meant Volume 1... According to the developer diary, it would appear that the Inspired Greatness option will be available for every fellowship quest in every epic book (all 15 of them) in Volume 1. Can a dev confirm this?

All Volume 1 Books have been adjusted that is Books 1 - 15 of the first volume or, all Books released previously to or in conjunction with but not requiring Mines of Moria, have been adjusted to allow players to attempt them solo. Results may vary.

[Orion]

It was stated that a problem with the original IG buff was that you could not repeat the fellowship quest at a reflecting pool if you had already completed the solo version and vice versa, but the article never stated if this has been fixed. Has it?

No. This has not yet been fixed. There are still some significant technical hurdles that need to be addressed before we can complete that transition. If we could have done it in this time frame, we would have.

[Orion]

"The interaction at these locations will check your current fellowship status (are you in a fellowship?) and the number of fellows currently at the location and adjust the buff accordingly."

Does this mean it won't be solo or 6 players ? We'll be able to complete the quests as a duo or a trio ?

Yes. You can go solo, duo, trio, quad or with 5 or 6. Buffs will diminish with each new member of your fellowship.

[Serin36]

I really really appreciate the Volume 1 revamp! My question is simple:

When will we see a North Downs revamp?

[seabass2003]

Yes. You can go solo, duo, trio, quad or with 5 or 6. Buffs will diminish with each new member of your fellowship.

This right here is really awesome. Great work Orion and team!