Negative rep a no no conversation?

[Sapience]

Seriously? The CMs have made it clear in the past that they look for people trying to game the system in that way, and will remove any rep they got through said gaming, so how is this possible?

I just don't see that happening, Greg.

We audit the rep system from time to time and when we find clear cut cases of rep farming or other abuses we correct the situation. In extreme cases this can me stripping all rep for an account.

[GregJL]

We audit the rep system from time to time and when we find clear cut cases of rep farming or other abuses we correct the situation. In extreme cases this can me stripping all rep for an account.

Oh, I'm not saying y'all aren't on your game, and I'm not even saying anyone is DELIBERATELY farming rep. I do think that like attracts like, though. I've not seen many cases of "+rep" for posts that the one giving that "+rep" disagreed with, no matter the "tone" of the post. I suspect that there is -rep given just because certain posters don't like other posters, and no matter WHAT is posted, the person will receive -rep from them.

[Digital_Utopia]

Oh, I'm not saying y'all aren't on your game, and I'm not even saying anyone is DELIBERATELY farming rep. I do think that like attracts like, though. I've not seen many cases of "+rep" for posts that the one giving that "+rep" disagreed with, no matter the "tone" of the post. I suspect that there is -rep given just because certain posters don't like other posters, and no matter WHAT is posted, the person will receive -rep from them.

It's a lot easier to +rep someone repeatedly than -rep them...even still, there is a limit of how often you can +rep a particular person. If you give +rep to a single person more than once or twice in a row, it will send you a message that you need to spread it around more.

In other words, it's designed so that it needs participation from many people to increase one person's rep. If the limitations are so severe for +rep, then I would imagine that it would be even more limiting for -rep.

[SaintBass]

Found that relevant.

[GregJL]

It's a lot easier to +rep someone repeatedly than -rep them...even still, there is a limit of how often you can +rep a particular person. If you give +rep to a single person more than once or twice in a row, it will send you a message that you need to spread it around more.

In other words, it's designed so that it needs participation from many people to increase one person's rep. If the limitations are so severe for +rep, then I would imagine that it would be even more limiting for -rep.

Dunno, it's not like I've got enough to neg rep anyone, and anyone who might post something that I would give -rep for is probably already on my ignore list

[caragurth]

We audit the rep system from time to time and when we find clear cut cases of rep farming or other abuses we correct the situation. In extreme cases this can me stripping all rep for an account.

Well at least there is a way to prevent people from farming rep. How is it even possible to farm reputation? It doesn't make sense to me.

[Ames]

We audit the rep system from time to time and when we find clear cut cases of rep farming or other abuses we correct the situation. In extreme cases this can me stripping all rep for an account.

So... can we do something similiar for those who farm rank in the moors?

[Menathradon]

We earn them the same way you do. If you look around you'll see we all have different levels.

And yes, once you can give neg rep, you can give it to anyone.

You mean.. we can give YOU GUYS negative rep?

THE DAY IS MINE!!!!!

[Aoeworth]

whoa whoa whoa, hold the phone.

Are you telling me there is board/forum rep? Not rep as in ally, kindred rep status in the game?

*boggles brain at why you would 'farm' forum rep* LOL, wow.

[Zarador]

Oh, I'm not saying y'all aren't on your game, and I'm not even saying anyone is DELIBERATELY farming rep. I do think that like attracts like, though. I've not seen many cases of "+rep" for posts that the one giving that "+rep" disagreed with, no matter the "tone" of the post. I suspect that there is -rep given just because certain posters don't like other posters, and no matter WHAT is posted, the person will receive -rep from them.

Well, for starters, I think in some ways anyone that is concerned about their reputation, farms it in a sense. I for one have edited or even deleted posts that said my opinion, but in a harsh and not mindful manner. It's not even the forum reputation that concerns me. It's the thought that coming off as a pompous idiot negates any point that I wished to express.

I have given +rep on many occasions where I disagree with the posters concept or opinion, but respected the manner that they used to project their point and keep their calm.

If you present what you perceive to be a fact in a civil manner even if it's based on erroneous information you have presented a valid argument. If you respond to that erroneous information with a snotty retort, even if your right, you have ruined a part of your reputation with the community. You don't sway opinions in an argument by putting the other person in defensive mode while backing them into a corner and making them look foolish. You give them a graceful exit and a chance to accept your presented argument and change their opinion if they agree that you are correct.

Praise in public, correct in private. Or as many say in the game, take it to tells.

[xx19kilosoldier]

The pettiness of this system is rearing its ugly head now that more people have farmed enough rep. The neg rep is getting handed out for anything and everything. Its a stupid system and was never needed. Just another bad choice by Turbine. This forum at one time had a civility to it, even though some disagreed, there was usually some form of rational discussion to be had.

If anyone really gives a **** about the community, head over to some of the sub forums, hand out some rep to the posters that actually contribute something besides caption this, pics of bacon, and the other "Witty" threads here on the general forum.

Something funny, since a certain poster has gotten to his/her rep goal, havent seen any more "caption this threads" have we?

One good thing about canceling an account, your forum account goes with it.

Great work Turbine.

[Zarador]

The pettiness of this system is rearing its ugly head now that more people have farmed enough rep. The neg rep is getting handed out for anything and everything. Its a stupid system and was never needed. Just another bad choice by Turbine. This forum at one time had a civility to it, even though some disagreed, there was usually some form of rational discussion to be had.

If anyone really gives a **** about the community, head over to some of the sub forums, hand out some rep to the posters that actually contribute something besides caption this, pics of bacon, and the other "Witty" threads here on the general forum.

Something funny, since a certain poster has gotten to his/her rep goal, havent seen any more "caption this threads" have we?

One good thing about canceling an account, your forum account goes with it.

Great work Turbine.

So your fellow players disagree in the manner that someone presents them self in a thread, somehow Turbine should "fix" that? Just like I have no way of knowing what **** could possibly mean, far to clever for most to figure out.

There have been threads that were entirely on the other side of debate that got their point across and received positive reputation for doing so in an intelligent respectful manner.

How is it that so many very controversial posters managed to max out their reputation? Could it be that they know how to make a point without making a point a flame?

I do however agree with the part about canceling the account removes the forum account. I always abhorred the posts from people who left the game and still kept up the old tiring arguments explaining how two years later, they still don't care about the game. Let it go!

[Cromwall]

I don't mind the rep system as such. I can see that it would be useful for self moderating the forums to some degree. A passive form of control, a way to help stack the posts in favor of positive comments about the game.

I always find it amusing, however when some feel the need to tell the world that they have given out +rep. Maybe hoping that the person they gave it to will return the favor.

Either way.. have the forums and the pursuit of rep become more of a hobby than the game its supposed to be representing?

[xx19kilosoldier]

So your fellow players disagree in the manner that someone presents them self in a thread, somehow Turbine should "fix" that? Just like I have no way of knowing what **** could possibly mean, far to clever for most to figure out.

There have been threads that were entirely on the other side of debate that got their point across and received positive reputation for doing so in an intelligent respectful manner.

How is it that so many very controversial posters managed to max out their reputation? Could it be that they know how to make a point without making a point a flame?

I do however agree with the part about canceling the account removes the forum account. I always abhorred the posts from people who left the game and still kept up the old tiring arguments explaining how two years later, they still don't care about the game. Let it go!

Turbine created the mess. Tell me how the forums are some how better with this stupid system? Was there something wrong before? I think not. Im not trying to flame you, or the others who actually contribute with out the us vs them mentality that permeates around here lately. But there is no denying that there are a group of posters who have farmed their rep with an agenda to be had once they could neg rep posters. Personally if I where Turbine I would much rather have a place where some disgruntled players could come to vent and have a voice instead of just throwing up their hands and quitting and walking away because they get shouted down and neg rep by a very vocal minority that feel that its their "duty" to squash all dissent.

Again, if this doesnt pertain to those constructive posters, please forgive me, I do not mean to insult their contributions. I am a long time frustrated player who has been hoping maybe things will change in the game to bring back some of the enjoyment I felt is missing for me. I was lingering on the forums, not always as constructive as I would of liked but it was and had been the frustration I have been building for a bit now. There doenst feel like those of us in the community who push for change are not wanted, and thats fine for them, but I suspect that Turbine would have a different view on this.

[Khafar]

You're making a mountain out of a molehill. What percentage of the rep points handed out do you think are negative? 0.1%? 0.3%? A very small percentage of posters here can hand it out at all, and I suspect most of them don't give out nearly as much -rep as +rep. I certainly don't - to date, I've dinged one poster exactly once, total. Not only that, but -rep is by design only worth 1/2 as much as +rep. So if I can bump you by +24, I can only ding you by -12.

The entire system is slanted toward giving out +rep.

Khafar

[robnkarla]

One thing I would be curious to see would be what the titles are for negative rep. I don't think I've seen anything other Neutral, but would be interesting to see a list of the titles. (Imagine what kind of rep farming their might be if the title was "the Creep" )


Also, I'm really amazed at which posts seem to garner rep and which ones do not. Often the posts that I feel might actually have an impact and have seen positive reactions fall flat, but an odd comment here and there can be flagged a few times with +rep.

I've hidden my rep often as I would rather be viewed under the context of the current post than any added opinion (positive and/or negative) a reputation level might bring, but in the end I decided to show it. This was due more to the fact that I find it fascinating to see what people give rep for and when it is hidden it is not used as often.

[Zarador]

Turbine created the mess. Tell me how the forums are some how better with this stupid system? Was there something wrong before? I think not. I'm not trying to flame you, or the others who actually contribute with out the us vs them mentality that permeates around here lately. But there is no denying that there are a group of posters who have farmed their rep with an agenda to be had once they could neg rep posters. Personally if I where Turbine I would much rather have a place where some disgruntled players could come to vent and have a voice instead of just throwing up their hands and quitting and walking away because they get shouted down and neg rep by a very vocal minority that feel that its their "duty" to squash all dissent.

Again, if this doesn't pertain to those constructive posters, please forgive me, I do not mean to insult their contributions. I am a long time frustrated player who has been hoping maybe things will change in the game to bring back some of the enjoyment I fell is missing for me. I was lingering on the forums, not always as constructive as I would of liked but it was and had been the frustration I have been building for a bit now. There doesn't feel like those of us in the community who push for change are not wanted, and that's fine for them, but I suspect that Turbine would have a different view on this.

First off, I respect your point of view on the subject. I rather like the system because I feel in some ways it promotes some degree of self restraint that was lacking in other game forums. Some posters would deliberately act in any manner they felt knowing at worse they risked a slap on the wrist and a few days in the corner. You could have a great thread going and someone would totally derail it with an insulting argument just to troll and aggravate their fellow community members.

In the current system, your community members and your moderators can rate you by your behavior. I'm sure there are abuses, every system out there is subject to misuse and abuse.

There are proper and improper ways to vent frustration and get an argument across. I have given +rep to those I strongly disagree with simply because they conveyed a point that was valid to them in respectful informative manner. I'm also sure that some players farm reputation purely to "hold the power" (in their own minds) to discriminate against opinions they don't care for or just to make people miserable.

[Sapience]

One thing I would be curious to see would be what the titles are for negative rep. I don't think I've seen anything other Neutral, but would be interesting to see a list of the titles. (Imagine what kind of rep farming their might be if the title was "the Creep" )

There is only one title for negative rep, "Neutral".

[xx19kilosoldier]

You're making a mountain out of a molehill. What percentage of the rep points handed out do you think are negative? 0.1%? 0.3%? A very small percentage of posters here can hand it out at all, and I suspect most of them don't give out nearly as much -rep as +rep. I certainly don't - to date, I've dinged one poster exactly once, total. Not only that, but -rep is by design only worth 1/2 as much as +rep. So if I can bump you by +24, I can only ding you by -12.

The entire system is slanted toward giving out +rep.

Khafar

Khafar

Its not the neg rep in and of itself, its the atmosphere that it has created around here. You have always been pretty rational and I hope you can see where I am coming from on that.

[robnkarla]

There is only one title for negative rep, "Neutral".

Thank you for answering. How many red boxes can one have? I thought at first it might only be one, but I thought I saw a person with two.

[Sapience]

Thank you for answering. How many red boxes can one have? I thought at first it might only be one, but I thought I saw a person with two.

In theory, 11.

[finafarn]

Negative Rep is like Nuclear power it can be used for good or evil but you don't want to get any on you.

[Grodo]

In the current system, your community members and your moderators can rate you by your behavior. I'm sure there are abuses, every system out there is subject to misuse and abuse.

The system is too subjective and lately, the posts aren't rated by behavior, but by the subject. Threads that poke fun, criticize, or question Turbine's behavoir are guaranteed a negative rep.

Disagreeing with a subject should not prompt anyone to give negative rep. I think most understand this, unfortunately as Zarador says, there may be a few who misuse, abuse, or just don't understand the system.

"With great power comes great responsiblity"

Please don't use this system to bury or conceal topics you don't agree with. In the long run it does more harm than good.

[revoked]

I agree that negative rep should not be used just because someone posts something you disagree with. Iirc, when you give rep (and I can't give negative rep myself), it indicates you think the post is informative/help vs. inflammatory, trolling etc. A well thought out, and reasonably expressed post is a useful one whether you agree with the author or not. An inflammatory post that makes broad (and inaccurate) blanket statements or attacks others, undermines the forum even if you agree with the conclusions drawn by the poster.

That said though, I wonder on what basis you can say negative rep is given just because of the subject of the post as opposed to how the content was expressed. Threads or posts don't receive negative rep individually and only the total rep of any given poster is shown. As far as I know, the only way to know negative rep was given is if it was given to you, because only you can see which of your posts garnered the negative rep. Even if you have received some negative rep for a post and you feel your opinion was expressed respectfully and thoughtfully, and really it seems it was just because someone who could give negative rep didn't like your opinion, that doesn't mean that is the case overall.

[Khafar]

Disagreeing with a subject should not prompt anyone to give negative rep.

That certainly won't ever get negative rep from me. In fact, if they make a good case for their position in a civil manner, I sometimes give +rep whether I agree with them or not.

The single time I've given -rep to date, it was for a guy being abusive toward other posters. I /report those too, and have for the past 3 years. I'm perfectly happy to see those people get "shut down" over time, because there are plenty of people around who are capable of expressing their opinions of the game, the forums, etc without being complete jerks about it.

Khafar