Lifetime Account Members Thread

[Overtone]

how do you know that points carry over month to month... somehow i doubt it... where did you get that if i may ask?

Read the official FAQ and read the Answers sticky FAQ at the top of this forum.

[Ayrolen]

Why?

If we already paid $200 for an account then why do you care if we log in or not? This was the main reason I paid for a lifetime... so I would not "have" to log in if I do not want to!

Even though I do log in enough to pass your silly test... what this means is that now I "have" to log in. This sucks!

OMG it's 3 months! THREE. If you want the bonus 1500 points, you have to log on THREE times until this thing launches.

[carlosjuero]

Why?

If we already paid $200 for an account then why do you care if we log in or not? This was the main reason I paid for a lifetime... so I would not "have" to log in if I do not want to!

Even though I do log in enough to pass your silly test... what this means is that now I "have" to log in. This sucks!

.... That "requirement" is only for the bonus points; if you don't care about the bonus points then you don't have to log in once a month. After the game goes F2P in fall you will gain the 500 free turbine points/month for as long as you maintain a VIP account.

how do you know that points carry over month to month... somehow i doubt it... where did you get that if i may ask?

A) DDO Turbine Points roll over - silly to think they wouldn't here
B) They would be shooting themselves in the foot if they didn't allow points to roll over.

[Dumnbunny]

how do you know that points carry over month to month... somehow i doubt it... where did you get that if i may ask?

I found this answer linked to in this thread. In short, yes, the points carry over, they do not expire.

[AlatarielCarnesir]

how do you know that points carry over month to month... somehow i doubt it... where did you get that if i may ask?

Here's a link to Sapience's post on this question:
http://forums.lotro.com/showpost.php...91&postcount=4

[Cassea]

The change to LOTRO will be the community. Log into DDO as an experiment - it won't cost you a dime. It is a wonderful compilation of all the bad parts of MMO communities rolled up into one happy little rodeo. This makes me a sad, MMO shopping here I come.

DDO needed a new business model, LOTRO was working and now what wasn't broken is getting 'fixed'. I have been waiting for the other shoe to drop since the aquisition and here it is I guess.

However, I only have one question as a lifetime suscriber to a game I love(d). Will lifetime subscribers be given a one time chance before launch to waive any and all benefits under the new system and recieve a refund?

If turbine steps up and does this I will happily be on my way, and hey, I may even check in for free from time to time to see how middle earth is faring.

I left EQ2 and Sony forever because of micro-transactions. When Turbine asked me to take a survey about FTP and Micro Transactions I was honest and stated that I will not play ANY game that tries to double dip....

It's either free to play 100% and we pay for the game with these silly transactions or you charge a monthly fee and everyone plays on an even keel.... IE no way to buy your way to an advantage.

So Sony and Now Turbine are on my list. I don't care how good or bad or how minor this stupid store is... I'll not be a part of it.

I had thought Turbine was different... apparently I was wrong.

[Cassea]

I couldn't stop laughing after this so I stopped reading. Morally against MTs. Hooboy. Funniest thing I've read ALL DAY. Thank you.

Thanks for making fun of what I believe!

I don't care if a game is designed to use MT's from day one... I'll just elect not to play it. To change a game in this way after years is wrong!

Either the game is 100% free and supported by MT's or it's supported by subscriptions and no on ein game can have any advantage by means of real money.

I'm morally against a company doing this to an existing game and trying to have it both ways... MT's "and" a monthly fee.

Glad you find my opinion to be so funny.

[Brandon_Blackbird]

Where has it been said that free to play folks who elect to pay for points and use the store will have an advantage over VIPs (who, by the way, have access to that same store, and get free points to boot)?

[Ainaur]

how do you know that points carry over month to month... somehow i doubt it... where did you get that if i may ask?

They will carry over month to month. This is how Turbine do it in DDO.

*edit* ...and it took so long to post this that you'd already been answered! The forums are busy this evening.

[alkadar]

Not good at all. It will do two things mainly. First, it will attract immature kids who can play for free and ruin the game for the rest of us.

Secondly if people think that free to play is really free they are mistaken. In all these games that are suppositely free to play, you have to keep buying points in order to upgrade your toon, access newer zones etc..

Either that or be at disadvantage compared to players who can afford to pay for it.

This will effectively break the players into two groups. Those who just log in and play for free with inferior toons and those who can just throw money at the game and boost their toons.

[GalateaOrea]

Where has it been said that free to play folks who elect to pay for points and use the store will have an advantage over VIPs (who, by the way, have access to that same store, and get free points to boot)?

This has been said many times all over this forum by people who apparently are terrified of acronyms. I don't understand it myself. I don't know why a F2P person who doesn't pay for a sub but has paid for Turbine points to buy an expansion or the adventurers pack or access to the North Downs is some how a different player than someone who subscribes and gets 500 free points given to them every month to buy whatever they want. Apparently, if I understand all the posts correctly, allowing people who don't subscribe to play is like inviting in the barbarians who will trash everything, take everything, and leave hobbits crying helplessly in their holes. How a mature community that's been playing for three years is threatened by a an influx of new people, I dunno. I get the whole WoW reject thing (being a refugee from WoW myself), but an hour reading GLFF will convince anyone that there are plenty of people playing this game now who are neither very mature or not very pleasant.

[Degarmo]

You aren't going to gain any significant advantage, or any from what I read, by using the store, except perhaps at lower levels where they may offer starter packs. Essentially, this is a free-to-try deal where you're strictly limited unless you want to fork out the bucks.

Founders/lifers are making out like bandits as far as this new system goes. Turbine stands to make a lot more money - remember, the Founder/lifers were only giving them money for expansions, because after 20 months (assuming a rate of $10.00 bucks a month for paying all up front) it was paid for and each month after that the game was free.

There was no new money to get from the founder/lifers, but instead of screwing us all over they actually decided that they were going to give points out. They could have just said, "thanks for the long run, and we're changing our product as we said we would," and that would have been fine if they guaranteed that everyone that was in that particular category still got everything for free that they already get.

So, it looks like that it's going to be a great deal for some.

That was never the part that worried me, however. I'm on Landroval and have been since launch. We have a wonderful community there and I hope that it is not completely overrun. I'm used to jackasses in any game and they're not that difficult to deal with, until they become a very great number. Jackasses always find ways to screw things up, always, they're very good at it.

Also, down the road, money always, always, always talks much louder than anything else. To that end, there is always the possibility of things going to hell.

For now though, I'll just enjoy the perks and hope for the best, because really, that's all I can do

[morrowbreeze]

As a lifer, and after being in game most of the afternoon, I have to say I was shocked at first, then stunned, and as the day wore on just muted. I know that my kinnies have been very emotional about this. We will lose some for sure and that hurts.

I will stay on as long as the OOC and other "official" channels stay bearable. I dont so much care about points, stores, etc. I care about the quality of the incoming masses. Landroval is going to change from what it is now. I will not tolerate abusive foul talking chat. I can ignore and filter, but I shouldnt have to other than occasionally on my server. And I am not going to close down all my channels to an invading rush of foul speak. I hope that we on Landroval can keep a semblance of our community intact.

[AlatarielCarnesir]

Either the game is 100% free and supported by MT's or it's supported by subscriptions and no on ein game can have any advantage by means of real money.

There are actually four cases here: MT vs. subscription, no cash advantage vs. cash advantage.

A MT game with a cash advantage would be... Allods Online (stuff for sale reduces your downtime after death).
A MT game with no cash advantage would be... DDO (free players can accumulate points to buy stuff).
A sub game with a cash advantage would be... WoW (sparkle pony).
A sub game with no cash advantage would be... the typical case, the way things were, etc.

It all comes down to what exactly is for sale in the store, the cost in points and how fast a free player can get them.

[darshie76]

This morning i go to work, check FB and see the post....i said "wth, nice joke!" and start to read the posts of the other people....and realize that is not a joke.

As lifetime let me express my feelings; noticing that after 27 pages of this topic read one after another before posting, seems that are the same feelings of the majority of this forum.

- As lifetime subscriber, we didn't signed up for being special; it just meant that we would not pay money to play anymore, as token of support for a game.
Now the support is over; the lifetime paid in advance for an average of 2 years of gameplay (plus expansions); so all that we did was to pay upfront for 2 years, giving them money enough to continue to improve the game; and now we are at the point where we are done, our entrepreneur spirit paid off, giving us a great MMORPG, but sadly, like all the nice stories, it gets to the end.

The end means that now everyone can get in, we are not different, other than for the fact that we get content that we paid for already, so technically nothing changes for teh guy that log in and do quests; what changes is the spirit of the game; the disillusion that we lifetime subscriber were here since the closed beta, betting on a product that is much better than WOW, SWG, Aion and many others; and now the circle is closed....the devs covered the expenses to buy the license; the sharks that started the project (guess WB or whoever is behind turbine) now are ready to collect money, and don't give **** about feelings, because all that they did was to finance a project to make money, not because they care about LOTR or Tolkien.

- free to play means a lot of trash coming on the servers; much more gold sellers, and all the nasty things that you see in these free to play kinda games (imagine farmville, mafia wars and similar but in middle earth); the economy will fall, and who used to fight whole weekends (because this is when he/she can play....otherwise is in an office or on workplace the rest of the week, and in the evening takes care of his/her family and kids), to get gold, will realize that was all for nothing, because now you can buy shiny stuff just using your wallet; no more incentive to get that nice hat with eyepatch that you can get only at the spring race, because now you can buy it...and worst of all, people that has no idea of what it takes to do a chain quest that last 6 hours in fornost, can get their nice item just paying.....we were so disappointed at people that use services to level up, saying that it takes away the fun and don't teach you how to use a character; and look at what is coming now O_O

Now my ideas, that would somehow save the situation before that i will completely abandon this game and start to play full time with star trek online (awaiting the new star wars mmorpg); that is a ****** game compared to LOTRO, but at least i have no expectations nor attachment to it, other than being a lifetime subscriber there too;

- Lifetime subs gets servers where only lifetime plays.
- nothing changes for lifetimer, the extra turbine points can be accumulated or just left there to buy some weird item, but the other items, legendary items and so on will stay locked with quests, requiring quests to be acquired
-other players that are paid subscriber can play on the lifetime servers; new players can decide where to play (free player servers or VIP servers)
-automatic ban for any gold seller/buyer; no question asked (just in case that a smart guy plays on free servers grinding gold and selling it on the VIP servers, destroying the economy
-no money/items transferring between free and VIP servers; not even small, otherwise you just send 10 mail with small items instead of 1 with a lot of gold and the results are the same.

Looks like madness? Yes it is, because with these rules, the purpose of getting more customers will be nullified; but this would honor people that paid for a game that when started, was ****** and buggy, unbalanced and incredibly frustrating; we believed in it, we supported it with suggestions, filing bugs and paying for what would worth maybe the same price of guild wars; and now, that this game is a great game, and we lifetime should get the well deserved reward for being so loyal and attached to it, we just get a kick in the *** saying "sorry, now you are like the others, with some benefits for your gracious contribution 3 years ago".

I understand that in the past years the model of free to play, pay for the extra" is what sell the most; but there is a company that makes a certain game, called WOW, that didn't went down to compromises; neither offering a lifetime, neither giving a free2play (and will never do, i can bet on it); Turbine should probably revise the plans and follow them, since as now, you demonstrated how much you have to learn; not about graphic or gameplay, but about loyalty and respect for your supporters.

I said what i have to say; will fall on deaf ears i bet; but makes me feel better to express what i feel; and maybe, will give a thought or 2 to whoever has the patience to read another long post, in a bad english, on a 27 pages thread.

Darshie76 aka Loremaster Amiroth (Landroval)

[Ascus]

I am a lifetimer (x4 for family accounts), and have been on hiatus for a while. I think this is a good move The newbie areas will be filled with newbies, the will become alive again.

The deal they have for lifetimers, is more than generous. If anything it makes the lifetime sub even more of a deal. I would wager to guess that if you hold onto your points you will be able to get expansions for free.

I played DDO and at launch for a couple months, then after it went FTP, I enjoyed it more then, the newbie areas actually had new players in it, a constant flow of new players. Even today the starter areas are packed with players, finding groups is no problem at all.

Seeing how successful the ftp was, its not surprising the LOTRO is following the path. Turbine, is a business and should seek to maximize their income. The deal they have for lifetimer is great, even if you bought one yesterday, they likely many people that will regret not getting one.

The only question will be is will the players come? DDO name aligned well with pay by module, Lotro's open world does not work well with it. I still hope you can still go to the above ground areas like Rivendell and Northdowns, just not get quests there.

[Las_Cruces]

I'm another not taking this well. I started this game in February (4 months ago) and purchased a lifetime subscription. How on earth is it remotely fair to invalidate that now? It'll probably be another 2-3 months before this starts but I'd have needed 9-10 more months to break even versus having just paid the monthly subscription. Paying for a lifetime subscription was supposed to be a gamble of how long I'd play the game -- not whether Turbine/WB would continue the game or change the way they fund it.

I'm not sure what the economics are of the turbine points yet. I guess I'd have to see the store and the items/services available for purchase and if there are any mandatory purchases for simply playing the game. On the surface though, a so-called free to play system is generally more expensive for the average user than a fixed monthly cost. I jumped from Allods after seeing what they were going to do with their cash shop and now LOTRO is apparently getting one. Once a cash shop is put in, things can change drastically. They'll have to come up with the same or more cash from the shop than they were getting from subscriptions or it's not a valid business model.

[darshie76]

I left EQ2 and Sony forever because of micro-transactions. When Turbine asked me to take a survey about FTP and Micro Transactions I was honest and stated that I will not play ANY game that tries to double dip....

It's either free to play 100% and we pay for the game with these silly transactions or you charge a monthly fee and everyone plays on an even keel.... IE no way to buy your way to an advantage.

So Sony and Now Turbine are on my list. I don't care how good or bad or how minor this stupid store is... I'll not be a part of it.

I had thought Turbine was different... apparently I was wrong.

I guess is not Turbine; they don't make the business choices, but who is behind them...the sharks that gets the breaking news of a hearquake that kills hundreds and shoot it at 8PM when everyone is watching tv to make more money....and at the same time sell commercial ads time in between the breaks to make even more money.

Working in a sw company that makes decisions to make money, i could understand how Turbine programmers could feel; but this doesn't mean that i approve it

[Ayrolen]

- Lifetime subs gets servers where only lifetime plays.

Not going to happen.

- nothing changes for lifetimer, the extra turbine points can be accumulated or just left there to buy some weird item, but the other items, legendary items and so on will stay locked with quests, requiring quests to be acquired

That is the way it is going to work, yes. Already confirmed.

-other players that are paid subscriber can play on the lifetime servers; new players can decide where to play (free player servers or VIP servers)

Again, this segregation that so many of you elitists are asking for isn't going to happen. New F2Pers will be able to play anywhere they want to and this Founder/Lifer is perfectly fine with that.

-automatic ban for any gold seller/buyer; no question asked (just in case that a smart guy plays on free servers grinding gold and selling it on the VIP servers, destroying the economy

How the hell is that any different than it is now? When was the last time you saw a gold spammer?

but this would honor people that paid for a game that when started, was ****** and buggy, unbalanced and incredibly frustrating; we believed in it, we supported it with suggestions, filing bugs and paying for what would worth maybe the same price of guild wars; and now, that this game is a great game, and we lifetime should get the well deserved reward for being so loyal and attached to it, we just get a kick in the *** saying "sorry, now you are like the others, with some benefits for your gracious contribution 3 years ago".

4500 FREE points to spend in the store and 500 points per month after that is a kick in the ***? What kind of ungrateful world are you living in? As a Lifer, Turbine is now paying ME to play their game b/c they are GIVING me money to spend and I never have to spend a dime of my own money in that store, if I don't want to.

[Krintar]

deleted.........
apologies, was listening to a kinnie when i typed that. researched and understood. this whole business is irritating ingame as people are too lazy to fully read and then ask questions. my bad

[alkadar]

4500 FREE points to spend in the store and 500 points per month after that is a kick in the ***? What kind of ungrateful world are you living in? As a Lifer, Turbine is now paying ME to play their game b/c they are GIVING me money to spend and I never have to spend a dime of my own money in that store, if I don't want to.

It all depends what those points will buy you. You may discover that 500 pts per month is nowhere near enough to buy access to new zones or the like. That is the case in DDO where you can only unlock some parts of the game by paying for it.

[Degarmo]

Character Slots*/** 5/server
(can purchase more)

so the fact that i PAID for an adventurers pack means nothing? that in itself is stealing. I PAID to have 9 character slots and as a LIFER i expect to have the 9 slots i PAID for. if that is the way Turbine now does business............well blunty put KMMFA

You're still getting your 9 slots. It's in the * and ** print at the bottom.

EDIT: Here's the print I was talking about.

* Purchasers of the Mines of Moria™ expansion get access to the Mines of Moria region and content, premium classes (Rune-Keeper and Warden), legendary items feature, Tier 6 crafting feature, 2 extra character slots and a level cap of 60. Purchasers of the Siege of Mirkwood™ expansion get access to the Siege of Mirkwood region and content, a level cap of 65 and the Siege of Mirkwood skirmishes.

** Purchasers of the LOTRO Adventurer's Pack get 2 extra character slots and 20 slots of shared bank storage across all characters on the same servers.

[Brandon_Blackbird]

Character Slots*/** 5/server
(can purchase more)

so the fact that i PAID for an adventurers pack means nothing? that in itself is stealing. I PAID to have 9 character slots and as a LIFER i expect to have the 9 slots i PAID for. if that is the way Turbine now does business............well blunty put KMMFA

I'm so tired of people who don't read the FAQs before posting some ridiculous rage post.

YOU WILL NOT LOSE ANYTHING AS A LIFER. YOU WILL NOT LOSE ANYTHING AS A SUBSCRIBER.

Read the fine print, please.

[Patience]

Character Slots*/** 5/server
(can purchase more)

so the fact that i PAID for an adventurers pack means nothing? that in itself is stealing. I PAID to have 9 character slots and as a LIFER i expect to have the 9 slots i PAID for. if that is the way Turbine now does business............well blunty put KMMFA

Please read the FAQ and dev tracker, as this has been addressed repeatedly.

[Ayrolen]

It all depends what those points will buy you. You may discover that 500 pts per month is nowhere near enough to buy access to new zones or the like. That is the case in DDO where you can only unlock some parts of the game by paying for it.

And how is that ANY different than how we unlock new zones now? My Lifetime sub covers just that, my sub. It doesn't cover the purchase of new xpacs. If it's confirmed that we can save up points to pay for xpacs and I have enough to do that, gravy. If not, I'll buy it with real money just like I did MoM and SoM.