Just to be clear and ensure I understand...

[Obviously]

Crafting is pretty much useless. While leveling up and at end game.

While leveling up, you can aquire everything you need via the game store with turbine points and/or through drops/quests/skirmishes with skirmish marks. You can only join 1 craft guild, so in essence you can only truly benefit from 1 craft making your other 2 crafts more so useless. So you can be a Tinker, but will only truly benefit from either jeweler or cook. This basically summarizes crafting.

My suggestions:

1a. Craft guild: Change guilds to match craft professions. i.e. a Historian guild, a Tinker guild, etc.

1b. Change professions: If only going to allow us to join 1 craft guild and aren't going to change the above, then allow us to customize which 3 skills in our chosen profession. i.e. we join the woodworkers guild, and choose woodworking, forestry and tailoring as our 3. or we join the scholars guild and choose scholar, cooking and farming.

2. Either bump the crafted items, or nerf the quest/skirmish/drop/store items. Right now there is no point in leveling any craft. quest/skirmish/drop/store items are far better and easier to acquire. food/pots are easy to acquire, much easier than scholar too.

3. Make crafting times shorter. Right now you need to set aside a good chunck of time to craft and yet to what end and what purpose or benefit? None. It's a waste of time. Shorten our waste of time.

People like to craft, it gives another dimension to a game. As it is now, it is useless. It needs an overhaul.

[Unique]

Well, that's you're opinion.

Let's just say that I don't agree that it's useless, sorry you feel it is.

[oldbustedjorn]

Well, that's you're opinion.

Let's just say that I don't agree that it's useless, sorry you feel it is.

Yea I'm gonna with this. While it certainly isn't all it could be, it still can be useful. Of course, I'm not equating usefulness with necessity either. Just because I CAN buy something in the Turbine store, doesn't mean I have to if I enjoy crafting.

But I do realize some folks find a good majority of their fun in playing the AH so I can imagine they don't like the current state.

In summary, if you like to craft for crafting sake, it can be fun and useful (especially while leveling up). If you only want to craft if it is equal with end-game raiding gear and profitable, then you will be disappointed. If they were made equal, be prepared to post in a thread about how there is no point to raiding because crafted gear is the same...

[Celebria]

Crafting needs help definitely. But I'm not sure I'd say it's completely useless. lol

My alts all wear and use crafted gear for everything as they level. It's hands-down the best stuff at each level in the game. Especially when it's critted. I never put loot gear on my low-levels.

Not having guild on all my crafts hasn't really stopped that profession's usefulness. The only time I really miss guild is when it comes to legendary items.

At end-game, crafting is not as lucrative as it used to be, but my main still makes boatloads of gold selling critted crafted items on the AH.

Finally, crafting in general is still fun for those players like me that enjoy collecting and processing resources (the skirmish bulk recipes are wonderful here) and I like leveling crafting along with my leveling alts. I enjoy seeing the progress bars go up.

Even if I didn't have a 65 main to make things easier, I'd still enjoy crafting, but that's just me. Crafting needs an overhaul but all is not lost yet. LOL

[Skigorn]

Not useless. I get tremendous benefit from all of my crafters. I can make full sets of armour every few levels. I can make regen food, battle scrolls, jewellery and crafting tools. Will some of these items be available in the Lotro store? Sure. Will I pay real cash for them? Definitely not. Why should I spend $5 on dyes when I can make them for free.

If you intend to spend your money on store items versus acquiring them through in-game means, then I thank you for supporting Lotro and keeping the cash flowing to Turbine.

[auximenes]

Crafting is pretty much useless.

Not in my opinion, especially after the crafting changes hit with the upcoming patch. It will make it easier to craft items that are better than most quest drops before you've out-leveled those items.

[Riamus]

Crafting is far from useless. Unless someone has a ton of money to spend on Turbine Points, you're not going to be buying everything from the Store. Even with the VIP's 500 points per month, you still can't get everything you would want/need without spending more real cash to do it. So for most people, crafting is just as important as before.

It wouldn't make sense to join a *crafting* guild for gatherer professions. So at most, you could only ever join 2 guilds. Also, the third profession is only useful if you are buying or trading mats with others or using the AH or an alt. Also, because not all vocations have more than 1 crafting profession, having more than 1 guild for some characters and not others wouldn't be a smart thing to do.

Food drops are supposed to be much less with F2P, so you'll need the crafted food even more unless that's changed. Of course, I only rarely bother eating anything because the game is so easy. Crafted gear isn't bad as long as you stay "current" on your tiers. If your tier is low, then you won't get anything good from it. Also, crafting is more about critted gear. Critted gear at an on-level tier will often be better than normal quest rewards, though not always. Single use gear will also often be better.

Yes, you can farm skirmish marks for really good gear, but that requires a lot of time (more time than crafting) and not everyone likes skirmishes. If you prefer skirmishing, then you can use that for your gear. If someone else doesn't, then crafting is a good option. Just because you prefer one method doesn't mean that having more methods is bad.

Crafting takes time, but so does any other method besides the Store if you want decent gear. And the Store sacrifices your cash in order to save time.

[Linwe-Elfmaiden]

I disagree completely.

Crafting certainly can bear with some improvements for level capped crafters AND their potential customers, but it is HARLDY useless.

I have SM crafters (multiples no less-- serious craft-a-holic!) as well as one each kindred with each guild. I am very often crafting for the kin's lower level characters as well as my own. The critted crafted gear is superior to loot and quest rewards 99% of the time.

For those at level cap, I still craft Legendary items, food, scrolls, pots, and crafting tools, the occasional shield, cloak, jewelry item etc. My cook and scholar are the busiest.

Our current system for radiance and legendary items and tier 6 crafting itself is what needs an overhaul so that crafting can become more valuable for tier 6 and any future tiers.

[Obviously]

Thank you for the replies, but you haven't swayed me yet. Maybe I'm in the minority here then. Yes, I can see a benefit in crafting for alts, but is that the only benefit? Alts, lowbie kinfolk, etc? But as I am leveling up (returning after hiatus overseas), my levels aren't the same pace my crafted gear unless I want to slow down my leveling. Pots and food drop readily from mobs. As for skirmishes, I can easily keep enough marks doing just the dailies to keep my soldier updated and enough leftover to supplement quested gear holes in my outfit. As for the lotro store, no, I won't be buying anything except the perma stuff like storage and stats but those crafted items are there, so won't that have an impact on the crafted AH items? I mean really, if little johnny gets his soccer mom to put in the credit card number once, it's an endless bank for him to buy whatever, whenever. The lotro store isn't geared for mature adults who spend wisely, its for the little kids who don't pay the bills as I see it. As for crafting endgame, I dont expect or want raid items to be less than craft items, not what I meant, but with most consumables having good drop rates, why craft consumables. So for a first time leveler with no alts in mind, say even a F2P account with only 1 character slot, why craft? If food drops will be limited, then I can see Cook as a good craft since food is very beneficial for leveling. Yeoman or Tinker might be the best profession for me then. /shrug I will keep at it, just my impressions of crafting after playing and research I guess. Thank you all!

And as a side note, I totally expected trolls and flames. Very refreshing, thank you for that too.

[Linwe-Elfmaiden]

You CAN craft for yourself once F2P goes live. I did it in Beta. I rolled 8 baby toons, everyone crafted (two were strictly explorer-gatherers). Since you can crit once you open the second anvil on a tier (part of F2P crafting changes!) you actually CAN make yourself GOOD gear before you have out leveled it. All 8 of my baby toons in Beta wore critted everythings.

I don't think anyone is denying crafting needs some serious love, but what you ARE seeing is that there are many of us who would not call it useless.

[Riamus]

Yes, if you level yourself very quickly, keeping caught up on crafting tiers can take some work, but keep in mind that this game is all about the experience rather than leveling as quickly as possible. It's a very different goal of the game than you'll find in many other MMOs out there. You will find the most enjoyment from the game if you take your time leveling and don't skip tons of quests just because they aren't your level or higher. And reading the quests makes the game that much better because there are some great quests out there if you're willing to take time to read.

If you take time to finish lower level quests (light/dark blue, green, or even gray) rather than skipping them, it will slow your leveling down and you'll be able to keep crafting up without any kind of grinding. Or, if you don't want to go that route, consider working on your deeds. Working on completing your deeds will keep you in an area long enough to get crafting up to the next tier.

If you want to level very quickly, then you have the option of skipping crafting until you're level 65. You will then be making plenty of money and can easily level up your crafting by buying everything from the AH. You won't benefit from it while leveling, but you'll gain the benefits of it at max level (including some BoA items from the crafting guilds that you really need at max level). You can also easily make back any money you spend by selling critted items in the AH. They sell well and for a lot of money compared to most other things.

You don't need to craft if you absolutely don't like it, but it's far from useless for those willing to put in some effort.

[Unique]

Since you can crit once you open the second anvil on a tier (part of F2P crafting changes!) you actually CAN make yourself GOOD gear before you have out leveled it.

Yes, this small change makes a HUGE difference in the usefulness of crafting for yourself as you level. In beta I easily made my own critted armour as I leveled.

[Riamus]

Yes, this small change makes a HUGE difference in the usefulness of crafting for yourself as you level. In beta I easily made my own critted armour as I leveled.

Just curious on that. I've read that and I definitely like that. My question is... if you don't complete gold on one tier, you still won't be able to crit any of the next tiers right? So it's useful for getting more critted gear, but you still have to do just as much crafting to get to the next tier. It just means you can get critted gear sooner on each tier. Basically, you have to spend just as much time in Tier 1 before you have any access to crits on Tier 2. You just can start Tier 2 crits earlier. Then you have to spend just as much time in Tier 2 before you have access to crits on Tier 3. Am I understanding that correctly?

[Unique]

Just curious on that. I've read that and I definitely like that. My question is... if you don't complete gold on one tier, you still won't be able to crit any of the next tiers right? So it's useful for getting more critted gear, but you still have to do just as much crafting to get to the next tier. It just means you can get critted gear sooner on each tier. Basically, you have to spend just as much time in Tier 1 before you have any access to crits on Tier 2. You just can start Tier 2 crits earlier. Then you have to spend just as much time in Tier 2 before you have access to crits on Tier 3. Am I understanding that correctly?

That's the way I understand it too. But getting those crits earlier before you out-level them does make a difference.

[auximenes]

Yes, I can see a benefit in crafting for alts, but is that the only benefit? Alts, lowbie kinfolk, etc?

Making money on the AH or trade channel.

But as I am leveling up (returning after hiatus overseas), my levels aren't the same pace my crafted gear unless I want to slow down my leveling.

Crafting level-appropriate gear for yourself is much easier with the upcoming changes.

Pots and food drop readily from mobs.

Traditional morale and power potions have been removed/limited in the next patch, in order to increase the demand for Scholars to produce them. Those potions have also been buffed to restore more points per potion.

[Roghgar84]

I'd have to disagree with the OP as well. Could some changes be made? Sure, but they are improving the system, being able to make critted stuff sooner will help with keeping your crafting viable with you while you level.

Honestly even at end game I still use all my crafters, from scrolls, food, hope tokens, jewelry to making the lothlorien and mirkwood armor for myself since I have little to no time to raid to get gear since I have a busy RL.

[tdillman]

Just curious on that. I've read that and I definitely like that. My question is... if you don't complete gold on one tier, you still won't be able to crit any of the next tiers right? So it's useful for getting more critted gear, but you still have to do just as much crafting to get to the next tier. It just means you can get critted gear sooner on each tier. Basically, you have to spend just as much time in Tier 1 before you have any access to crits on Tier 2. You just can start Tier 2 crits earlier. Then you have to spend just as much time in Tier 2 before you have access to crits on Tier 3. Am I understanding that correctly?

Just as much time total. Yes. But it's not about saving time on the complete journey. It's about getting the good gear sooner and in time to use it.

[bigsix66]

There are areas of crafting that can certainly stand some improvement, particularly at the Tier 6 level. I think weaponsmiths and woodworkers should be able to craft offhand L65 weapons that are in the same ballpark as those that drop in SH.

The same is true of L65 crafted armour. I'm not asking that crafters be allowed to make radiant armour. Since radiance will be removed from the game, that will eventually become a moot point anyway. However, it would be nice if the best crafted armour at level cap was slightly inferior to the armour awarded in raids (not counting the raid set bonuses, which would make the raid gear that much more superior), as was the case back in the SoA days.

Crafting was extremely relevant in SoA. I hope it can return to its former glory.