Hey Frosty(or any dev that works on the UI) any word on new art assets????

[Duggan]

/signed

please release art assets for the community

[malthol]

Please keep the assets released to skin makers up to date. This is really important to many of us. Heck, I've noticed that I play my characters with a good UI skin much more than those with the default skin (for the record, my favorites are: LM's Durinsfolk, LM's Eorlingas, and Men of Gondor, oh and Delving Hills).

[Sapience]

While Frosty is still here at Turbine, he is no longer involved directly with the UI skinning system. However, i've pointed those who are actively involved with the system to this thread and impressed upon them how important this issue is to the community. No promises, but they did agree to look into a fully updated asset pack as soon as time permits.

[Fredelas]

No promises, but they did agree to look into a fully updated asset pack as soon as time permits.

What exactly does it mean to "look into a fully updated asset pack"?

Edit: (Because that sounded overly critical)

They don't need to make promises. Surely it's someone's job to take care of this, and we don't require them to promise to do their jobs. We just need need them to do it.

Rather than looking into a fully updated art asset pack, how about they commit to releasing a fully updated asset pack?

It seems that this elusive "time" figure has not permitted this at any point in the past 6 months. How about they get someone who is a manager involved, instead. Usually it's easier to get permission from a real person like a manager than it is from an ephemeral concept like time.

[Crell_1]

While Frosty is still here at Turbine, he is no longer involved directly with the UI skinning system. However, i've pointed those who are actively involved with the system to this thread and impressed upon them how important this issue is to the community. No promises, but they did agree to look into a fully updated asset pack as soon as time permits.

1. thanks for looking into it.
2. Can you share where +Frosty transfered to? We've appreciated the art contributions and support! I for one wish him well!

[Anorax6502]

/signed from me as well.

[slack_n_hash]

They don't need to make promises. Surely it's someone's job to take care of this, and we don't require them to promise to do their jobs. We just need need them to do it.

It is quite possible that it is NOT "someone's job to take care of this". Much like LUA, skinning seemed to be almost a developers after-hours side project rather than a fully resourced game feature.

At least Frosty is still around to answer any questions the current UI people have, so it should be a matter of when, rather than if, they can get this to us.

REQUEST to the Turbinite seeing this:

Please give priority to the skin definition file over the rest of the art assets, as we can work with that. IMHO, the character panel changes are the biggest problem affecting current skins, so giving us even just that part of the skin definition would help a lot. We need the rest too, but feel free to drip feed us whatever you can.

Thanks in advance!

[Sapience]

It is quite possible that it is NOT "someone's job to take care of this". Much like LUA, skinning seemed to be almost a developers after-hours side project rather than a fully resourced game feature.

That's fairly accurate. I'll pass the request for the skin definition file along.

[aleczander]

That's fairly accurate. I'll pass the request for the skin definition file along.

yay!
has sapience tried any skins? the enlargement of the dressing room window alone, in some ui skins, was enough to make me download them

[Sapience]

yay!
has sapience tried any skins? the enlargement of the dressing room window alone, in some ui skins, was enough to make me download them

Yep. I'm a minimalist though. I've used both ArenUI and Azure Glass.

[Intrinsity]

That's fairly accurate. I'll pass the request for the skin definition file along.

Thank you for replying and thanks for passing this request to whomever has decided to take it over. Once again, I would like to re-iterate how important skins are to some community members like me. They really are a huge part of the enjoyment of the game for me. I personally stick with the LM Eorlingas (go figure huh) and have for a long, long time. My enjoyment of the game would absolutely be diminished if LM Eorlingas (and all the other great skins) could not be updated in the future.

As was stated above, I think everyone involved would be happy to see a "trickle" release of updated material if that is required so that the hard-working "skinning" community can continue their great work.

Just a thought...Turbine should look into hiring a part-time employee to jointly work on LUA and on UI skinning. Even 10 hours a week on each (20 hours total per week) would make alot of community members happy and if skinning became officially supported...could be turned into a profit center for Turbine...

I'm just saying...

[frostytyger2]

/signed

i have been using daimonui for more than a year and a half, and honestly i dont know if i would keep playing (and paying) if i could no longer do so, it enhances the game so much

[Yula_the_Mighty]

you may be right, Yula....and if so thats pretty sad...

the last pak was released 6months ago yesterday....

Turbine has been hiring folks for pretty much everything since around may of last year...

I understand what you are writing. Sometimes I do not do a very good job of explaining how software development works. It seems very simple as an insider like me. I hard for people on the outside. Let me try again.

As a software designer - I am only going to talk about myself and own experiences and what I've seen. I have no doubts Turbine is not that much different in this area from my own experiences.

1) You have work you must do. It is assigned by your supervisor. This is what you get paid for. You have to do this stuff. In the worst case, you have more than 40 hours of this work to do each week.

You may or may not get paid for hours for extra hours beyond the 40 hours. I certainly do not get paid for the extra hours. All I get for my 50, 60, 70 or even 80 hours is to keep my job. I do not do it. They will find someone that will do it. If I am lucky see the benefit in a bonus, a pay raise, or my choice of next assignment.

2) There is a lot of things. They are not part of item 1. I do them --> I get - Are you done with your assignments? I do not do them - my supervisor could not care less. Often these are things like art asset packs.

3) You end up in the situation of - I am tired. I do not want to come in another Saturday. All to do something that makes the customers happy. My supervisor could not care less. My wife and kids are peeved. Makes my life miserable.

4) Typically your supervisor will notice you have spare capacity. You are doing stuff that not assigned to you. They will increase your work load notch by notch until you have no capacity to work on pet projects any more.

5) Sure the company will have additional staff. They go to other projects. They are not working on the same product as me. If they are assigned to the same group. They are given a ton of work to keep them busy.

Bottom Line - Things like art assets packs for Lotro are not something Turbine is paying anybody to make and deliver. Turbine has no intention of paying anyone to do it. This kind of content from Turbine is like a customer created fan site. Or the a skin itself. It only occurs as long as someone is willing to do it for free.

Hopefully with Sapience asking, someone will find time to do it as "submarine" work. In software development - "submarine" work is activities done with out approval by management.

[sirwillow]

/signed

i have been using daimonui for more than a year and a half, and honestly i dont know if i would keep playing (and paying) if i could no longer do so, it enhances the game so much

/signed I love using daimonui and other skins. it helps me to personalize from character to character and now with updates not releasing resources it breaks the skins. I don't understand why something that was given so much support early on has essentially been ignored over the last several months to a year.

C'mon guys, get those assets released so that the skinners and lua scripters can get busy and keep making improvements to the game that you aren't able to do. Otherwise you're just letting the game get more and more "broken"

[Duggan]

i know i find myself not playing as much.

i dont like how the skins i want to use are broken and i find the default just sooooo boring.

[Roberto_the_First]

Hopefully with Sapience asking, someone will find time to do it as "submarine" work. In software development - "submarine" work is activities done with out approval by management.

We call it 'ghosting' here.

put me in the /signed group for movement on this. I'm using Durin's Folk Black, and since the author doesn't play anymore, I'd like to modify it with updates

[Alias86]

No promises, but they did agree to look into a fully updated asset pack as soon as time permits.

Which will probably be about the same time that a fan site kit will be released. As in, never (and that one actually *was* promised).

So much effort has been spent on the Lua system, which while handy, is so functionally limited at the moment that it is obviously in the game purely as a marketing feature - "Yes, we have Lua just like WoW!". But for an existing, fairly comprehensive system like UI customisation, which would take comparitively little effort to maintain community support for, there is over 6 months with no updates. This might not be such a bad thing if the default UI wasn't such an eyesore, clearly developed by programmers rather than UI designers.

Yes, I am critical - that's one of the benefits of being a customer. All this talk about lack of resources, I couldn't care less about. There are obviously enough resources being dedicated to new revenue streams like Store cosmetics, horses, and items, along with ridiculous unnecessary redesigns of the Character panel. All the promises that the Store would enable Turbine to push out releases faster and more regularly have really just boiled down to a closed loop, where the only releases that have been made more timely are those that are sold explicitly through the Store itself.

There are hundreds of people here waiting to promote the game by providing new skins *for free*, and all it needs is one guy from Turbine to spend a couple of days getting out at least the skin definition file to make it all happen. Plus, the other important benefit is that I would complain less and you wouldn't have to hear it

[Schreik]

I think that there is also a certain element of Turbine wanting users to stop screwing with the UI and trying to remove the store buttons. Any time they release the new packs, someone figures out a way to remove the buttons, and they are probably tired of going back and changing the asset tags to make sure that you can't.

This is also evidenced by the fact that they brute force replace loading screens when you try to use other art now. The will not tolerate people not being slapped in the face with adds and BUY THIS NOW! buttons everywhere.

I know that F2P is a big money maker, but the more time I spend on the forums, in game, and looking at the community it's quite apparent the game has nearly lost it's soul. It doesn't feel the same at all any more. Sad really, but I also think that their slow release of anything, content included proves that the newest project at Turbine is taking lead, and as long as LOTRO is raking in cash in the store they could care less about the content, or making fans happy with customization.

[Silverangel]

This is also evidenced by the fact that they brute force replace loading screens when you try to use other art now. The will not tolerate people not being slapped in the face with adds and BUY THIS NOW! buttons everywhere...the game has nearly lost it's soul.

Nearly? I like coming back to these forums just to read necromantic niggles like this.

[therealraife]

I think that there is also a certain element of Turbine wanting users to stop screwing with the UI and trying to remove the store buttons. Any time they release the new packs, someone figures out a way to remove the buttons, and they are probably tired of going back and changing the asset tags to make sure that you can't.

This is also evidenced by the fact that they brute force replace loading screens when you try to use other art now. The will not tolerate people not being slapped in the face with adds and BUY THIS NOW! buttons everywhere.

I know that F2P is a big money maker, but the more time I spend on the forums, in game, and looking at the community it's quite apparent the game has nearly lost it's soul. It doesn't feel the same at all any more. Sad really, but I also think that their slow release of anything, content included proves that the newest project at Turbine is taking lead, and as long as LOTRO is raking in cash in the store they could care less about the content, or making fans happy with customization.

The only store button I personally care about getting rid of is the one on the mainbar. I don't personally feel there is a need for one on the screen at all times, especially when you are a vip, and there is a button conveniently placed in nearly all other ui windows. The ones in the windows aren't a nuisance to me.

And I don't really need the actual art assets, just a list of the asset id and xml changes would suffice.

I would like to give my /signature even if it doesn't do any good.

[Fredelas]

I'm not even interested in getting rid of any LOTRO Store buttons.

Since a purchasing opportunity is integrated into so many of the UI panels now, I can understand Turbine's desire to keep that a consistent experience for customers.

My interest in UI skinning is not to change anyone's purchasing experience. I just want to present an interface I feel organizes and displays information in the best possible way for users.

[bgbutler71]

I use Daimon UI and I love the ability and look it gives. Please turbine give them what they need to support this.

Creators of UIs
I love the work you all do, please keep it up. I can not fathom on how to do it, but love the final product. You have my support.

Zeff of Vilya

[Bry2007]

Any news about this Sapience?

[AccessDenied]

/signed

I am a relatively new member of the community both here and in LotRO in general. While I do not believe the Official UI is horrid and unusable, I do believe that it is getting dated and no longer completely fits the needs of the gaming community. So, as many of you did before me, I started looking to Skins, Plugins, Add-ons or 3rd party materials.

What I'm seeing is rather sad. At one point there were some wonderful looking UIs that added a new feel to the game. Various minor innovations by the gaming community enhanced data comprehension because someone thought of a better way to display a facet of the game. However, I've also noted that many of these UIs are quite old and no longer work across the entire interface. New elements, added or altered by Turbine, were implemented without supporting the modding portion of the gaming community with the information to embrace and make use of these new assets.

What I am seeing has me wondering quite seriously if LotRO is a failing community.

As mentioned in a previous post, the modding community has kept many games that are old and dated, alive. Constantly refreshed by an innovation to some aspect of the game; paring the UI down to nothing in a minimalist dream, embroidering all elements until lace - by comparison - is a ragged bit of cloth. Yet always simmering with a steady growth of ideas, implementations and enhancements from the brainstorming of creative individuals.

The fire of these creative individuals is fading, passing - there is nothing for them to do.

Except go elsewhere, to other gaming communities, where their efforts and endeavors will hopefully be embraced more enthusiastically.

[Silverangel]

What I am seeing has me wondering quite seriously if LotRO is a failing community.

They got a new community.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JztbiHaaMUY