Petition to Turbine Exec Management - Protect our Leaderboards!

[Ellouhollia]

To all PvMP'rs - see the following post and if you, like me and many others think this is wrong, please make some noise here. If there is already a 'petition' thread on this topic, I apologize please redirect me...

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...61#post6759961


Good Hunting,

Ell

[catrean]

/signed

[Squelcher]

Why not ask the wonderful Player Council to lobby for this...?

Heh heh heh...

[Frankj45]

How am I suppose to track whose rank farming now.

[fulred]

How am I suppose to track whose rank farming now.

Get rid of leaderboards, cannot track those farmers...

Turbine: see we found and delivered a solution to those farming! If you can't see them, you won't complain!

or so goes the thought.

Well, I guess there are other reasons behind it, but is hard not jump to conclusions given what we see.

[Zoggo]

1 step forward 2 steps back.

Taking down leaderboards is a really really big mistake Turbine. GW2 just added pvp leaderboards and there is a reason for that, players like em. Most people like to know their own progress compared to others and take a certain pride as they rise through the ranks. Checking leaderboards and the excellent BlackAppendage site is part of thousands of players daily routine. Fightclubbers will become almost undetectable too.

This petition should be full by now. Can't believe the apathy of the pvp players. Maybe the years of indifference, inbalance and broken promises (new map) from Turbine finally broke the pvp communities spirit.

Why do the leaderboards have to be connected to the new forum? Surely it's possible to make a seperate website for leaderboards?

/signed

[Tirian-Hammerfist]

This post was cursed after someone put the word 'petition' in the title - Sapience once said that they just ignored these (I'd find the quote to link to you all, but just take my word for it).

That said, I fervently support this idea - the leaderboards really give a sense of achievement to pvmp, especially when you begin to get into the higher ranks and it becomes a bit of a grind - while I've nothing higher than r7, I know many of my kinnies fervently study these boards, through the blackappendage site (which I know isn't supported by Turbine), and this keeps them coming back to the Moors, and keeps them paying VIP. The leaderboards are an essential part of the Ettenmoors experience, and it would be a great shame to see them go.

[Ellouhollia]

This post was cursed after someone put the word 'petition' in the title - Sapience once said that they just ignored these (I'd find the quote to link to you all, but just take my word for it).

That said, I fervently support this idea - the leaderboards really give a sense of achievement to pvmp, especially when you begin to get into the higher ranks and it becomes a bit of a grind - while I've nothing higher than r7, I know many of my kinnies fervently study these boards, through the blackappendage site (which I know isn't supported by Turbine), and this keeps them coming back to the Moors, and keeps them paying VIP. The leaderboards are an essential part of the Ettenmoors experience, and it would be a great shame to see them go.

*** Original response removed due to the poor taste of my emotionally charged comments on this topic and those involved ***

[Zoggo]

This post was cursed after someone put the word 'petition' in the title - Sapience once said that they just ignored these (I'd find the quote to link to you all, but just take my word for it).

Why would a community manager ignore petitions? Surely a big petiton for/against something on the forums is positive feedback for Turbine.

[droppingfirewhereistep]

/signed

[BrittainTheCommie]

Yes - Sapience says no petitions....and Sapience say something like "I feel it's moving in the wrong direction". Sapience has a VERY bad case of hubris, is out of touch with the PvP community, and people above him need to start looking at how his feelings are going to have a direct and NEGATIVE impact on WB/Turbine Revenue. Management needs to step in and conduct a thoughtful analysis of this mans decisions.

Regards,

Ell

[Tirian-Hammerfist]

Indeed, it wasn't exactly phrase diplomatically Ellouhollia... To be honest, more than being a tactical misjudgement for this petition, its just plain rude, and as such, uncalled for.

[Seattle2k11]

I loved while ranking up looking at who was above me on the list an saying to myself this is how much I needed to pass them. Felt good when I passed a couple people on the list.


/signed

[Zanishi]

I don't think its as much the leaderboards as much as the other information gathered for sites like altfinder where you can track peoples alts renames and transfers that violate players privacy...

[Ravyrn]

I think a better choice by the OP would be to remove the word petition and place this in the suggestions or lottery, lorebook, and community site discussion. I would use the point that such leader boards help encourage competition, even between the same side. I myself just shared a push to r13 with another hunter on my server. Trying to beat him to r13 made me more competitive, and consequentially made me play more and have more fun. He beat me while I was sleeping by about 4 hours, but I feel the competitiveness bolstered by the leaderboards that let us both know how close we were made mine and his gameplay much more enjoyable.

Arguably, without the leader boards, a great amount of competition will be lost in the Ettenmoors and farmers who are more adept to not getting caught will go largely unnoticed. I think the forums issue most certainly needs to be addressed. The logouts while posting and the lag are intolerable. Yet I deem it unfair that the pvp community must make such a great sacrifice in the name of better community site performance. Once the revamp is done, the community site will only be a forums, I believe.

As I understand it, we will lose the functionality of almost the entire community site save the forums and the lottery. The lorebook will be axed, fortunately, that's not a great loss as we will always have the lotro wiki. Furthermore, we are losing player blogs, but again, there are other avenues for players to blog about lotro other than from this website. We are also losing the abililty to see which characters belong to which account, and what equipment they possess... however I think good riddance to that. Lotroaltfinder robbed players of their right to privacy, and honestly the stat/equipment portion of the site have been broken for many months now. So no real loss there.

However, without the leader boards, the pvp community is losing one of its greatest assets, the daily leader board data provided by the player run leader board sites. Turbine should consider, at the very least, continuing to deliver the daily data to the player-run websites that have spent a lot of money and effort to maintain these sites with great dedication and enthusiasm (in some cases, even despite the fact the player no longer plays the game), all the while receiving no reward other than the community's gratitude. I believe forcing us to take such a great sacrifice despite across the board opposition from our portion of the community is both disrespectful to our community and distasteful. I think at the very least, an avenue should be left open for the consideration of re-implementing some portion of the leaderboards at a later date. I understand the need for sacrifices for the greater good (in this case, lotro.com not being laggyoopsyougotloggedout.com), but this sacrifice seems to great of one for the pvp community. The leaderboard websites have been an integral part of my gameplay in pvp since the sites first came up, and I continually reference the site each day to see where my server stands in the great scheme of things, and just to see who did good each day on my server in terms of renown/infamy gain. If we have to give it up for a little while, I suppose that is acceptable. But to take the leaderboards off the plate without any intention of re-implementing it I deem a very poor decision and one that is made without consideration to our pvp community.

[Lendas]

Turbine is essentially and example of what a gaming company should not do.

they make it up by marketing savvy etc etc.... but that only lasts so long.


eventually player frustration will win over marketing fluff.

[Thorwyn99]

Let's be fair here. Sapience said it would be either new forums or the data page.
It seems most people voted for the new forums.
Sucks to be in the minority but the conspiracy theories are a bit far fetched.

[Ellouhollia]

Yes I can admit my mistake. I do apologize for the tone of my comments regarding Sapience. In reality I have no idea what weights he is balancing. Please accept my apology to the community for the negative influence and to Sapience for speaking out of line.

Sincerely,

Ell

[aklouie]

Let's be fair here. Sapience said it would be either new forums or the data page.
It seems most people voted for the new forums.
Sucks to be in the minority but the conspiracy theories are a bit far fetched.

Ah, I do have to ask... when was the vote and who voted? From reading the initial announcement thread, there was a ton of shock that multiple systems are going down (blogs, lorebook, leaderboards, data.lotro.com). This seems to have been quite a surprise to a lot of people.

[Zanishi]

I am wondering if there cant be some kind of work around with the makers of pvmp+

like maybe exporting the stats recorded by it to a database?

just an idea...

[Squelcher]

I may just be guessing wildly, but the closing of these services stinks, to me, of cutbacks in their budget and lay-offs at Turbine. The closing of various lower-priority services is a pretty obvious way to cut costs.

Again, might just be a conspiracy theory, but I think Turbine might be in a bit of financial trouble right now.

[Mournsigh]

/signed

There is very little LOTRO PvmP'ers can turn to that relates to their (often daily for many) interest, other than discussion threads they create themselves or actual gameplay itself.

Leaderboards are a nice touch and in my own experience are considered to be pretty standard requisites in the industry. Yes the way they were presented within these forums was outdated and clunky and often victim to the odd log outs and unrequested page refreshes these forums autonomously perform on you, but the availability of the core data allowed others willing to make something out of it to allow the checking of stats far easier - at the same time putting less pressure on Turbine to make their own mylotro tools work properly....

I don't understand - or, I should say, haven't been told - a) why Turbine wouldn't want to include that core data in the revamped forum or b) why it would take a further step and disallow others to make something useful out of it.

Very depressing when seen as part of the whole gradual investment-pull-away by Turbine re PvMP, especially at a time it is advertising for new Creep Players on the login splash screens..."Fight for Sauron!!!". I'll add the missing legal disclaimer: "You will be buying many currently redundant skills! No PvP zone upgrade on the horizon! Challenge yourself hypothetically as there is no way of knowing how you fair against your friends or foes! Go up against bots, multiboxing and rank farming to test your mettle! Be shirked and shunned by developers putting your enemies first, and second, and third- can you withstand it?!" and so on....^^

[Jeffor]

/signed

Save our leaderboards!

[Exion_Blade]

Ok I'll do it. I'll poke the white elephant in the room (one of them anyways) and ask.

So why is it the leader-boards have to be taken down?

[Wartober]

The interoperability between the forums and the game is the main reason the forums performance sucks so much. To fix it, you have to break the connection. RIP leaderboards, but good riddance to these forums.