Trait points: how and when do you get them?

[Mennhabar]

I read the various user written guides to the class changes. (I have at least one alt for each class. Some are happy. Some are not)

I understand that you must spend trait points (1 in the selected "base" branch, 2 in the others) in order to unlock skills and buffs, ok.
And I also seem to understand that at level 85 you can expect to have about 55 of these points.
I remember vaguely of having read somewhere about obtaining one point every other level. Is it right?
So I think the other 12-13 points come from class quests and deeds. Correct?

How have class and legendary quests changed? Do they simply grant points or also "unlock" some skill in the trees that is otherways not buyable?
Are the completed deeds relative to skills that have been removed still worth something or not?

Any detailed info would be appreciated, thanks

[Brya]

1 point every two levels, starting from a relatively low level. I'm tempted to say starting at Lv7, but can't confirm that right now.

A certain number of points (can't confirm the exact number) from class deeds. These can be earned as early as the deeds are available to unlock.

At 85, 55 points is the absolute maximum you could have.

At 95, you can earn another 10. 5 from simply leveling up every other level, plus I believe there is an extra trait point that can be earned from each region in Helm's Deep. Hopefully someone else can confirm this or give more specifics as I haven't dabbled in the questing.Take this bit with a pinch of salt though until someone more knowledgable can confirm it.


As to your other questions:

Class deeds have changed, and these are now grouped into various meta deeds, awarding 1 point each. These award points, NOT skills. There is nothing in the trees gates behind requirements other than spending trait points lower down in the tree.*

*Free/Premium players who either need to buy, or have already bought some class/legendary trait slots on LIVE will not have access to the seven specialisation set bonuses unless they unlock these. While they are still very potent and definately worth unlocking, Free players will probably feel less gimped with these changes, since they will still have complete freedom in the trait trees themselves without unlocks.

Can't confirm or deny what's happended with the legendary trait deeds (Book page collection).

[bohbashum]

there are 65 points in total

45 from level up

• you get a point every odd level starting at 7.

8 from class deeds

• these are now meta deeds.
• each meta deed need 3 things completeled

3 book deeds

• like the legandary deeds, get all the pages

3 from moria

• class quest
• vol 2 book 6 deed
• guards max-rep book

1 from class quests

• when you do both level 45 class quests

5 from HD quest lines

• not exactly sure which ones but there earnt in deeds.

[Mennhabar]

there are 65 points in total
...

Thank you, this is very precise and informative (like your guides).

And what about the TPs gained from the class deeds?

Since many class deeds are disappearing, I guess it would be a good idea in these two weeks remaining to spend some time to "cash in" all those 5TPs for the class deeds not yet completed...
For some classes there are some branches that I overlooked completely, sigh.

[Gilean-EU]

Thank you, this is very precise and informative (like your guides).

And what about the TPs gained from the class deeds?

Since many class deeds are disappearing, I guess it would be a good idea in these two weeks remaining to spend some time to "cash in" all those 5TPs for the class deeds not yet completed...
For some classes there are some branches that I overlooked completely, sigh.

Not sure if it's going to live like it is now, but those metadeeds are new, and they give you Turbine Points as well. You will get "extra" points from these new metadeeds when you log in after HD goes live: if you have completed all your current class deeds previously, you will notice 8 new class metadeeds that you have also completed upon login (and get TP's from those).

Also it's worth noting that don't worry if you still have some "fellowship needed" class deeds uncompleted, like reviving skills for healers and fellowship maneuvre skills for burglars: those are replaced with new deeds where you don't need other players in order to advance that deed. For example you might see that instead of fellowship maneuvre deed, your burglar now has another deed where you need to burgle mobs

[catofnine]

Also it's worth noting that don't worry if you still have some "fellowship needed" class deeds uncompleted, like reviving skills for healers and fellowship maneuvre skills for burglars: those are replaced with new deeds where you don't need other players in order to advance that deed. For example you might see that instead of fellowship maneuvre deed, your burglar now has another deed where you need to burgle mobs

Wow, this is the only bright spot in regards to class changes for my lowbie burg. The thought of having to beg someone to group with me to get the fm deeds done or miss out on those skill points really annoyed me. This is welcome news. Thanks!

[Amberjack]

Has Turbine released any information yet on how much it will cost to add trait points/raise the trait points limit, or is that information still pending?

[catofnine]

3 from moria

• class quest
  

Ah, crud. Oh Dark Delvings it seems you and I are fated to meet once again. "L95 Guard LFM DD."

[Rufus_T_Fyrfly]

So I guess the days of TP farming are drawing to a close. Or will there still be virtues to grind?

[whheydt]

Ah, crud. Oh Dark Delvings it seems you and I are fated to meet once again. "L95 Guard LFM DD."

The level 58 class quest was changed some time ago. Doing the group instance is now optional. If you've done the parts before that, you'll have that point.

[Ecsmyth]

Has Turbine released any information yet on how much it will cost to add trait points/raise the trait points limit, or is that information still pending?

If you mean buying from the store trait points instead of doing the deeds, and buying more than the total 65 points ALL players can earn: no, they haven't released anything.

And I pray they don't. Ever. Being able to buy trait points from the LOTRO store would be (in my opinion) the worst thing to do.

If you mean something other than what I said, please disregard this comment and apply the following response: "I dunno"

[Amberjack]

If you mean buying from the store trait points instead of doing the deeds, and buying more than the total 65 points ALL players can earn: no, they haven't released anything.

And I pray they don't. Ever. Being able to buy trait points from the LOTRO store would be (in my opinion) the worst thing to do.

If you mean something other than what I said, please disregard this comment and apply the following response: "I dunno"

Um.

I'm sorry. I didn't realize that there was ever any doubt, on anyone's part, that the entire trait point system was put into place specifically to allow for further monetization.

[trancejeremy]

If you mean buying from the store trait points instead of doing the deeds, and buying more than the total 65 points ALL players can earn: no, they haven't released anything.

And I pray they don't. Ever. Being able to buy trait points from the LOTRO store would be (in my opinion) the worst thing to do.

If you mean something other than what I said, please disregard this comment and apply the following response: "I dunno"

I was hoping they would simply drop the class deeds. Some of them are virtually impossible to get. All the Moria stuff, for instance.

One of the big inherent problems in trait trees is that the further up a tree, the better the skills and thus the more powerful a character is. If a character has fewer points than another character of the same level, there is going to be a large power difference.

And yet, that's the whole point of levels, to describe roughly how powerful a character is.

I'm not saying they should sell them, but if they sell them up to the maximum possible, at least it would give people a way to actually get all the skill points. Otherwise they are just going to be out of luck.

[Darlgon]

Did they at least drop the number of kills, like was promised.. what.. TWO XPacs ago? Killing 350 giants or 400 Angarmin is beyond painful, even if you can one-shot them. You end up waiting for them to respawn instead of hunting for them because you wiped the area.

[furtim]

I was hoping they would simply drop the class deeds. Some of them are virtually impossible to get.

I believe most of the more obscure and difficult ones were changed (though you still get credit for completing the old versions), but I don't have a list in front of me or anything.

[bohbashum]

And what about the TPs gained from the class deeds?

Since many class deeds are disappearing, I guess it would be a good idea in these two weeks remaining to spend some time to "cash in" all those 5TPs for the class deeds not yet completed...
For some classes there are some branches that I overlooked completely, sigh.

pretty much all the old deeds are still around except a few that got converted to new skills.
- in the old system there were 22 class deeds but 24 traits as 2 were earnt from class quests, namely level 15 and 30 class quests.
- in the new system in the 8 meta deeds (8 trait points); 22 class deeds and 2 class quests (15 and 30) that need to be completed.

no TP at all should be lost or gained as no new deeds have been made and the meta deeds don't give TP.

just to note - I fudged up the little guide I put before, I said 15 class quest gave a point. I actually have no idea where this missing point is

Ah, crud. Oh Dark Delvings it seems you and I are fated to meet once again. "L95 Guard LFM DD."

as someone noted before the class quests have changed a long time ago and completely solo-able now. you have 3 solo quests you need to do for the class quest then an optional group quest that gives a funky item iinc.

[Gilean-EU]

pretty much all the old deeds are still around except a few that got converted to new skills.
- in the old system there were 22 class deeds but 24 traits as 2 were earnt from class quests, namely level 15 and 30 class quests.
- in the new system in the 8 meta deeds (8 trait points); 22 class deeds and 2 class quests (15 and 30) that need to be completed.

no TP at all should be lost or gained as no new deeds have been made and the meta deeds don't give TP.

Hmm. I transferred from live to Bullroarer two of my characters who still have some class deeds to complete. One of them was captain with deed to revive other players still in progress. on Bullroarer I had a deed to hit criticals with Valiant Strike or Inspire. And I already had some progress with that deed, altough I did not have that deed on live. I have a feeling that the game does record these kind of things and you get your old progress taken in account when HD goes live. Which is nice.

Another character was burglar. He is my least played character (lvl 85 anyway) and has 5 deeds in-progress on live. Mostly fellowship maneuvre -deeds (2 of them) and some michief-stance deeds too. On Bullroarer I got totally different deeds (only one of the five was still the same, that was "resisting riddle"-deed). One of them was burgle, also with some process already done with that deed. And the process was not the same as I had with "old" incomplete deeds.

About that TP. I am not sure what gave my each character over 100TP's when I logged in to Bullroarer for the very first time with my copied characters, I did assume it was these new class metadeeds.

[Lohi]

The level 58 class quest was changed some time ago. Doing the group instance is now optional. If you've done the parts before that, you'll have that point.

They'll probably still need to pick up that one solo quest and do it though. But ask around, there are people who are doing moria instances still.

There is a bit of disconnect though in some ways. Gain two levels and get 1 point. Defeat a nameless monster in the Dark Delvings and you get 1 point. Collect a large assortment of odd items and venture into Carn Dum and Urugarth with an expeditionary force and get 1 point.

Granted you can do those last solo, but the effort to reward seems highly unbalanced in some cases. It used to be that the reward for doing the harder stuff was to get a very good legendary skill, as opposed to many class traits which almost complete themselves automatically over time.

[Brya]

Has Turbine released any information yet on how much it will cost to add trait points/raise the trait points limit, or is that information still pending?

Buying Trait points is not possible. You have to earn them via the methods outlined earlier in this post.

So I guess the days of TP farming are drawing to a close. Or will there still be virtues to grind?

Theres nothing here to remove the need for TP farming if if need to farm TP for anything in game.

If you are refering to the need on live to currently unlock class (x5) or Legendary (x2) trait slots, while these will no longer exist, you will need to instead unlock the specialisation set bonuses (x7). Any previous purchases will carry over, 1 for 1.

As for Virtues and racials, yes - you still need to complete relevant deeds to advance those. The virtue cap is being raised by 2 to 18.

[Raven-EU]

44 from level up

• you get a point every odd level starting at 7.

You get 45 points from levels. The first point is granted at level 7 and the second one at level 9 etc. This means that the number of points you get from your current level is: (level - 5) / 2 rounded down.

Level 95 will give you 45 points.

[bohbashum]

You get 45 points from levels. The first point is granted at level 7 and the second one at level 9 etc. This means that the number of points you get from your current level is: (level - 5) / 2 rounded down.

Level 95 will give you 45 points.

I'm going to be really bad and say I didn't work that out with maths (yes, I did A level maths as well... shame on me)

this is what my sticky note for working it out looks like.

7,9 = 2
11 to 91 = 40
93,95 = 2

44

ofc now I look back do you see my huge flaw?

so the missing point was there all along!

[Rufus_T_Fyrfly]

Theres nothing here to remove the need for TP farming if if need to farm TP for anything in game.

If you are refering to the need on live to currently unlock class (x5) or Legendary (x2) trait slots, while these will no longer exist, you will need to instead unlock the specialisation set bonuses (x7). Any previous purchases will carry over, 1 for 1.

As for Virtues and racials, yes - you still need to complete relevant deeds to advance those. The virtue cap is being raised by 2 to 18.

Ah I see. Thank you for clarifying.

[Amberjack]

Buying Trait points is not possible. You have to earn them via the methods outlined earlier in this post.

So in other words, Turbine is keeping mum about whatever purchaseable trait point system they're intending to implement. I guess that's not surprising, considering the reaction it'll probably produce. Still, knowing at the time of HD launch what the eventual price point is going to be in order to spec my character the way I'd like would be a large factor, one way or another, in my decision to keep playing.

[bohbashum]

So in other words, Turbine is keeping mum about whatever purchaseable trait point system they're intending to implement. I guess that's not surprising, considering the reaction it'll probably produce. Still, knowing at the time of HD launch what the eventual price point is going to be in order to spec my character the way I'd like would be a large factor, one way or another, in my decision to keep playing.

not sure where you got that idea from.

we've got a very clear understanding of the tree system and the system they will impliment.

[Thorwyn99]

So in other words, Turbine is keeping mum about whatever purchaseable trait point system they're intending to implement. I guess that's not surprising, considering the reaction it'll probably produce. Still, knowing at the time of HD launch what the eventual price point is going to be in order to spec my character the way I'd like would be a large factor, one way or another, in my decision to keep playing.

If you so will the 5 points from HD Quests are bought since you can only get them if you bought HD.
Assuming they will offer trait points in the store some time after HD is, well, an assumption. The hindrance to non VIPs is the missing specc bonuses, similar to live.