LM hell debuff

[Spilo]

While the heals are powerful for pvp you also have to remember it's not based on pvp, we can wish about changes that are needed but we can be real and understand not much will get done.

I also want a Ents pet

I'd still argue that heals are too strong. All Minis need in 99% of PvE healing scenarios is to spam Bolster Courage. At least make it harder.

[LEGENDofALL]

I'd still argue that heals are too strong. All Minis need in 99% of PvE healing scenarios is to spam Bolster Courage. At least make it harder.

Theyre strong no doubt about it but the healing isn't the issue in pve it's the content is easy.

[infinitewhimsy]

Every class has tons of useless skills/traits and lacks things they should have.
./shrug

I'm no where near a LM expert but what if we changed to heal debuff suggested here to a incoming healing buff. There are enough heal debuffs in the game. Thoughts?

I think they call that water-lore.

The inc healing bonus tied to BFPs was a terrible idea with an even worse implementation. It needs to be removed, or at the very least reduced to a 0-15% scale rather than 0-50%.

Creep heals would need to be scaled up then imo.

[Armdyl]

Creep heals would need to be scaled up then imo.

pretty sure they are very well scaled atm.

[Giliodor]

pretty sure they are very well scaled atm.

... That's the damn point. Creeps have high +inc heals from BFP. If that were removed, creep heals would need to be scaled up. Get it now?
I do think creep heals are fairly weak compared to freep heals, but there are so many creeps that I'd almost call that justified.

[spelunker]

Creep heals would need to be scaled up then imo.

No. In group encounters the Inc healing component of bfps is the single most important thing rank provides, and unlike the other elements of a bfp has no equivalent freepside. The massive range of values on these bfps also makes for extreme inconsistency between low and high ranking players. Freeps/creeps deserve rewards for their time investment into ranking, but nothing on the scale of 50%.

Freep heals need a major nerf, as they have at the very least since audacity was introduced. This convo is about a Inc healing debuff though.

[infinitewhimsy]

No. In group encounters the Inc healing component of bfps is the single most important thing rank provides, and unlike the other elements of a bfp has no equivalent freepside. The massive range of values on these bfps also makes for extreme inconsistency between low and high ranking players. Freeps/creeps deserve rewards for their time investment into ranking, but nothing on the scale of 50%.

Freep heals need a major nerf, as they have at the very least since audacity was introduced. This convo is about a Inc healing debuff though.

If you want to remove the incoming healing on BFP, which I'd agree with, then you either need to rescale Creep heals or Freep damage, since the latter is too high to deal with even with said incoming healing. So...

[spelunker]

If you want to remove the incoming healing on BFP, which I'd agree with, then you either need to rescale Creep heals or Freep damage, since the latter is too high to deal with even with said incoming healing. So...

The post where I go into more detail about this point.

Well, to give some perspective on my opinion of the direction things should take. I think heals need MASSIVE across the board nerfs on both sides (moreso freepside, but definitely both sides) and/or audacity's dmg reduction be removed and replaced with a roughly doubling of health pools. Simply reducing or eliminating the current inc healing bonuses available on either side wouldn't go far enough in reducing the effectiveness of healing, imo.

I want to see healing reduced to a slowing of the rate your group dies, not something with the easy potential to completely avoid deaths happening. I don't see this ever being in the moors paradigm, so I support literally every class getting some inc healing debuff functionality, with more targeted classes and skills adding the ability to stack -inc healing.

You're welcome to disagree with my opinion on how heals should function in the moors or w/e else. But within the context that the statement was made, there is nothing wrong with what I said. Of course if creep Inc healing bfps were removed and freep heals remained unchanged something would have to give, but that wasn't what the post was about, and really the post has little to do with the overall thread.

[JCAG]

If you guys really want to make some changes happen for the LM, then please participate here: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...nges-Requested

Won't take more than 2 min. to give your vote and perhaps make an actual difference in what happens to our LM's.

Cheers,

JCAG

[LEGENDofALL]

If you guys really want to make some changes happen for the LM, then please participate here: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...nges-Requested

Won't take more than 2 min. to give your vote and perhaps make an actual difference in what happens to our LM's.

Cheers,

JCAG

This thread was all about a dream and to be honest I for one see tools for LM through PVP eyes and not PVE eyes and to me it'd a different ball game.

That being said that's not a bad thread for most it's just not for me.

[Elgrind]

I dont want heal. debuff as a skill, but still we can resolve it with moors set.
I think Tradition set is best for that heal. debuff bonus.(4pieces ofc.)
So use one from those skills like Frost Lore,WindLore or Ancient Craft,... for that armour bonus.

[Assasiny]

Since everyone wants, wants , wants I'd like to see a class that's suppose to be a cc class get a heal debuff, now I'm not saying this should come in any tree line but should be in the yellow line and give it some real use for a half useless tree line.


I'm sure there's going to be a lot of no, no , no's but I'd like to hear why.

Thanks god there is someone with who I agree about the lm lol
2 and now 3 classes are supposed to be CC / debuff / supprt class : everyone has incoming heal debuff execpt lms

[Armdyl]

I dont want heal. debuff as a skill, but still we can resolve it with moors set.
I think Tradition set is best for that heal. debuff bonus.(4pieces ofc.)
So use one from those skills like Frost Lore,WindLore or Ancient Craft,... for that armour bonus.

if you're talking about the 5% armor bonus from the trait..have you actually looked at how much it effects your armor and mits? you need a magnifying glass to see it.

[LEGENDofALL]

if you're talking about the 5% armor bonus from the trait..have you actually looked at how much it effects your armor and mits? you need a magnifying glass to see it.

I personally think all the sets are blah at best, I'd like to see one tied to incoming healing debuff,one for a pet flank no inductions and I'm not sure about the third though im sure I could tie something to damage if I thought about it long enough

[Elgrind]

if you're talking about the 5% armor bonus from the trait..have you actually looked at how much it effects your armor and mits? you need a magnifying glass to see it.

In what part of my post you dont understand?
Simply:
For me:
Incoming heal.debuff bonus like skill ( new skill or adding it in some old skill ) = NO for me.
Incoming heal.debuff bonus in Moors armour set = YES for me. (from 25-35percent like cappy or beorn set are fine)

devs can use moors Tradition armour set for incoming heal. debuff. Bc now this set is tottaly useless.
"So use one from those skills like Frost Lore,WindLore or Ancient Craft,... for that armour bonus." = I just give a example which skills Devs can/should/would/... be tied with that armour bonus.

Edit: A skill tied with Armour set bonus for incoming healing debuff, could be skill with longer cooldown(40second) = so they cant be spamable.

[Vulcwen]

In what part of my post you dont understand?
Simply:
For me:
Incoming heal.debuff bonus like skill ( new skill or adding it in some old skill ) = NO for me.
Incoming heal.debuff bonus in Moors armour set = YES for me. (from 25-35percent like cappy or beorn set are fine)

devs can use moors Tradition armour set for incoming heal. debuff. Bc now this set is tottaly useless.
"So use one from those skills like Frost Lore,WindLore or Ancient Craft,... for that armour bonus." = I just give a example which skills Devs can/should/would/... be tied with that armour bonus.

Edit: A skill tied with Armour set bonus for incoming healing debuff, could be skill with longer cooldown(40second) = so they cant be spamable.

As suggested before, tying it to See All Ends would make it reasonably balanced, considering it's 1m cooldown, and it being single target.

[LEGENDofALL]

In what part of my post you dont understand?
Simply:
For me:
Incoming heal.debuff bonus like skill ( new skill or adding it in some old skill ) = NO for me.
Incoming heal.debuff bonus in Moors armour set = YES for me. (from 25-35percent like cappy or beorn set are fine)

devs can use moors Tradition armour set for incoming heal. debuff. Bc now this set is tottaly useless.
"So use one from those skills like Frost Lore,WindLore or Ancient Craft,... for that armour bonus." = I just give a example which skills Devs can/should/would/... be tied with that armour bonus.

Edit: A skill tied with Armour set bonus for incoming healing debuff, could be skill with longer cooldown(40second) = so they cant be spamable.

Id be fine if it was tied to armour but id be fine if it was a skill too.