imbued legendary or not???

[yongi]

To a returning player, I am confused with this system despite reading up info on Web.

Should I imbued my level 100 li or not? My level 100 li still not fully max. Is there any reason to max it since if imbue all xp will be reset to zero.

Any longtime can help?

[burningflame]

To a returning player, I am confused with this system despite reading up info on Web.

Should I imbued my level 100 li or not? My level 100 li still not fully max. Is there any reason to max it since if imbue all xp will be reset to zero.

Any longtime can help?

My advice is to wait, research and learn till you are comfortable and ready to do so. You can always imbue later but you can't reverse it once you have imbued. The only option then is to drop it out of your bags to destroy it.

Claira

[NogodZ]

To a returning player, I am confused with this system despite reading up info on Web.

Should I imbued my level 100 li or not? My level 100 li still not fully max. Is there any reason to max it since if imbue all xp will be reset to zero.

Any longtime can help?

Wait and see is a good option, I think we are all still trying to figure out the best setup. Maxing your current item is the way to go, IF you are sure of your setup, since it is hard to change things after imbuing. If you decide you want another legacy, you can't just swap in a new legacy like in the past, you need a special imbued legacy replacement scroll, which is only available for TP, or spend MC I think.
All the exp you have into the item will not be lost, it just becomes the new baseline for the imbued item. You'll want to make sure you have at least a few million IXP runes saved up to re-level the weapon. Same for any star-lit crystals applied, remembrance, delving, etc. That are all factored into the new item, and it's much better to do those before imbuing. Although, it doesn't take much at all to get the weapon back to where it was - the rest just makes it grow more powerful (depending on your class and specific legacies). I would do some more research before committing to anything.

Legacy tiers don't seem to matter all that much when you apply them. If you are at t6 pre-imbue, you start at 31 post-imbue. If you were at t5, you'd start at 30. So it's either add one pre-imbue to get to t6 to get to 31, or add one after to go from 30 to 31. At least that is my experience so far.
This is a good write up:
http://rarebreed.guildlaunch.com//fo...33773#37639769
And check here for legacy changes:
https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...81#post7361581

S

[Spaz]

You'd better think twice if you have Bleed Pulses legacy on your LI.

Yet again Turbine gave us the ole two finger treatment.

If you Imbue your LI and it has the Bleed Pulse legacy, it will be stripped off and replaced with Bleed Critical Rating which is a HUGE NERF. (I would lose 5k dmg output!)

Basically, at this time, I absolutely refuse to imbue - and as I expected, the Imbuing has turned out to be another lie. Turbine knew very well what we would be forced to give up and that it's just not worth doing. So it has essentially become an empty promise from Turbine - at least for Captains. Apparently it's not bad enough that the Captain class is the lowest DPS class in the game. Nope, they gotta nerf us even more.

So you must decide for yourself if it is worth sacrificing 5k in damage?
If so, then I suggest replacing the Bleed Pulse Legacy PRIOR to imbuing with another legacy that might actually be useful when imbued.

Dadi from Rare Breed kinship put this amazing Imbuing Guide together and I highly recommend you look it over very carefully.
http://rarebreed.guildlaunch.com//forums/viewtopic.php?p=37639769&g id=233773#37639769

[Warmutkan]

Wait and see is a good option, I think we are all still trying to figure out the best setup. Maxing your current item is the way to go, IF you are sure of your setup, since it is hard to change things after imbuing. If you decide you want another legacy, you can't just swap in a new legacy like in the past, you need a special imbued legacy replacement scroll, which is only available for TP, or spend MC I think.
All the exp you have into the item will not be lost, it just becomes the new baseline for the imbued item. You'll want to make sure you have at least a few million IXP runes saved up to re-level the weapon. Same for any star-lit crystals applied, remembrance, delving, etc. That are all factored into the new item, and it's much better to do those before imbuing. Although, it doesn't take much at all to get the weapon back to where it was - the rest just makes it grow more powerful (depending on your class and specific legacies). I would do some more research before committing to anything.

Legacy tiers don't seem to matter all that much when you apply them. If you are at t6 pre-imbue, you start at 31 post-imbue. If you were at t5, you'd start at 30. So it's either add one pre-imbue to get to t6 to get to 31, or add one after to go from 30 to 31. At least that is my experience so far.
This is a good write up:
http://rarebreed.guildlaunch.com//fo...33773#37639769
And check here for legacy changes:
https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...81#post7361581

S

The quest line in East Gondor awards 3 Imbued Legacy Replacement Scrolls. These scrolls will let you choose which legacy to replace, and what legacy will replace it. I have tested this with a T6/10 legacy, and the replacement legacy was also at 6/10. In effect, if you mess up or change your mind down the road, you do have 3 freebies per character before you have to start spending TP/MC.

You're correct that it does not matter whether you apply scrolls of empowerment before or after imbuement: a tier raised now is the same as a tier raised later.

Captains should apply 3 star lit crystals to their emblems before imbuing them, as emblem main stats (tactical healing) don't seem to upgrade as high if you wait to use these crystals post-imbuement. The same is not the case for your weapon (and any DPS LI) - you can imbue this with 0-3 crystals. For both LIs it takes 6 crystals to max.


As others have said, read up until you are comfortable and have the legacies that you want on your LIs. A fully imbued LI is more powerful than a U15 FA, but if you change your mind a lot post-imbuement you will have to pay more marks in the long run.

[SapienChavez]

You'd better think twice if you have Bleed Pulses legacy on your LI.

Yet again Turbine gave us the ole two finger treatment.

If you Imbue your LI and it has the Bleed Pulse legacy, it will be stripped off and replaced with Bleed Critical Rating which is a HUGE NERF. (I would lose 5k dmg output!)

Basically, at this time, I absolutely refuse to imbue - and as I expected, the Imbuing has turned out to be another lie. Turbine knew very well what we would be forced to give up and that it's just not worth doing. So it has essentially become an empty promise from Turbine - at least for Captains. Apparently it's not bad enough that the Captain class is the lowest DPS class in the game. Nope, they gotta nerf us even more.

So you must decide for yourself if it is worth sacrificing 5k in damage?
If so, then I suggest replacing the Bleed Pulse Legacy PRIOR to imbuing with another legacy that might actually be useful when imbued.

Dadi from Rare Breed kinship put this amazing Imbuing Guide together and I highly recommend you look it over very carefully.
http://rarebreed.guildlaunch.com//forums/viewtopic.php?p=37639769&g id=233773#37639769

im not really following... you mean 5,000 morale, period? not 5k DPS (which would be nuts)

seems this would INCREASE your DPS, even if ti cuts your total dmg output.


i assume youre talking PvMP here. cant think of a scenario, save a few boss fights, where this would be a nerf (needing to use a skill more often) and not a boon (increased DPS, assuming it can apply a crit per-tick). even in those boss fights, it should increase our DPS

help me understand what you mean.

[0987654321]

im not really following... you mean 5,000 morale, period? not 5k DPS (which would be nuts)

seems this would INCREASE your DPS, even if ti cuts your total dmg output.


i assume youre talking PvMP here. cant think of a scenario, save a few boss fights, where this would be a nerf (needing to use a skill more often) and not a boon (increased DPS, assuming it can apply a crit per-tick). even in those boss fights, it should increase our DPS

help me understand what you mean.

i havent done any real math on it, so i cant be sure. but being able to stack 3 GW, is huge for captain dps. with the legacy gone you would be able to stack 2 at the very most. this being said, you can always keep bleed pulses on a swap emblem that isnt imbued, and have the new bleed legacy for CA (which doesnt benefit from extra bleed pulses as it does not stack with itself) and still get the pulses you want with GW.

again, i havent done any math or tested any of this yet, so this is really all just a gut feeling. however losing the extra GW, especially in longer fights, i cant see being good for dps

[Spaz]

ok.. lemme make it simple for you.

Cutting Attack & Grave Wound both come with bleed pulses.

Base pulse is 10 ticks and if you add the pulse legacy to your Emblem, you can add another 9 ticks (nearly doubling the bleed)

Now, if you cross trait like me, I pick up both the +20% bleed dmg in the Red Line and the +10% bleed in the yellow line = total additional bleed damage of +30% bleed dmg
AND if you add the +bleed dmg legacy to your LI and max it at +40%, the combined total increased bleed damages is now +70%

So, here we are with +70% increased bleed damage as well as 19 bleed ticks.

At this moment, I'm traited yellow line, and I have an FA weapon as well as an FA Emblem. Emblem is nearly finished, just needs a few more crystals. Weapon is a work in progress.
(and yes I know i'm not optimized.. yet)

Currently,
Cutting Attack:
1488-2449 (main-hand dmg) w/ 583 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [583 + (583*10)] = 6,413 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [583 + (583*19)] = 11,660 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -5,247

Grave Wound:
1347-2192 (main-hand dmg) w/ 535 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [535 + (535*10)] = 5,885 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [535 + (535*19)] = 10,700 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -4,815

Combined total damage output LOSS = -10,062
(NOTE: this doesn't take into consideration the impact of Telling Mark's +10% modifier which would make this an even greater loss)

Any questions????

[0987654321]

you do realise that bleed pulses has absolutely 0 effect on CA, because it doesn't stack with itself. and with the limited amount of actual dps skills a cappy has, its really not difficult to reapply it every 20 seconds. (and is an absolute must in the moors).

[NogodZ]

Losing 5k damage (and this is potential damage, not actual damage) over what, 30s? That's <200 DPS. If the target dies, the pulses are wasted. Your scenario is only really relevant for high morale targets that are going to be around for more than a few seconds. If your DPS is 5000, that is a 4% loss (in theory).
You're going to gain a LOT more than 200 DPS by imbuing, even after losing that one legacy - the skills are much better.
When maxed, base damage is higher, Cutting attack damage will be 21%, Grave wound 21%, Melee skills critical 21%, BoE 35%, etc. I think you are far to focused on one part of one skill, and not seeing the big picture.
If it's DPS you are concerned about, do what you will, but realize that your DPS will be lower, all else being equal, to someone who has an imbued weapon - even one that has not been maxed.

[tarpelion]

ok.. lemme make it simple for you.

Cutting Attack & Grave Wound both come with bleed pulses.

Base pulse is 10 ticks and if you add the pulse legacy to your Emblem, you can add another 9 ticks (nearly doubling the bleed)

Now, if you cross trait like me, I pick up both the +20% bleed dmg in the Red Line and the +10% bleed in the yellow line = total additional bleed damage of +30% bleed dmg
AND if you add the +bleed dmg legacy to your LI and max it at +40%, the combined total increased bleed damages is now +70%

So, here we are with +70% increased bleed damage as well as 19 bleed ticks.

At this moment, I'm traited yellow line, and I have an FA weapon as well as an FA Emblem. Emblem is nearly finished, just needs a few more crystals. Weapon is a work in progress.
(and yes I know i'm not optimized.. yet)

Currently,
Cutting Attack:
1488-2449 (main-hand dmg) w/ 583 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [583 + (583*10)] = 6,413 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [583 + (583*19)] = 11,660 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -5,247

Grave Wound:
1347-2192 (main-hand dmg) w/ 535 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [535 + (535*10)] = 5,885 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [535 + (535*19)] = 10,700 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -4,815

Combined total damage output LOSS = -10,062
(NOTE: this doesn't take into consideration the impact of Telling Mark's +10% modifier which would make this an even greater loss)

Any questions????

Use an imbued li with the bleed damage leg for cutting attack

swap to a non imbued li when you use grave wound

= more dps

[PaulandSilas]

ok.. lemme make it simple for you.

Cutting Attack & Grave Wound both come with bleed pulses.

Base pulse is 10 ticks and if you add the pulse legacy to your Emblem, you can add another 9 ticks (nearly doubling the bleed)

Now, if you cross trait like me, I pick up both the +20% bleed dmg in the Red Line and the +10% bleed in the yellow line = total additional bleed damage of +30% bleed dmg
AND if you add the +bleed dmg legacy to your LI and max it at +40%, the combined total increased bleed damages is now +70%

So, here we are with +70% increased bleed damage as well as 19 bleed ticks.

At this moment, I'm traited yellow line, and I have an FA weapon as well as an FA Emblem. Emblem is nearly finished, just needs a few more crystals. Weapon is a work in progress.
(and yes I know i'm not optimized.. yet)

Currently,
Cutting Attack:
1488-2449 (main-hand dmg) w/ 583 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [583 + (583*10)] = 6,413 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [583 + (583*19)] = 11,660 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -5,247

Grave Wound:
1347-2192 (main-hand dmg) w/ 535 dmg initially, and 583 dmg every 2 secs for
20 secs (10 ticks) = [535 + (535*10)] = 5,885 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what it becomes if we lose the Bleed Pulse legacy upon imbuing)
38 secs (19 ticks) = [535 + (535*19)] = 10,700 outgoing dmg per use/ target (what we currently have, but gets replaced with a crit rating upon imbuing)
Difference = reduction in damage of -4,815

Combined total damage output LOSS = -10,062
(NOTE: this doesn't take into consideration the impact of Telling Mark's +10% modifier which would make this an even greater loss)

Any questions????

Spaz - thanks for breaking that down. Do you run combat analysis? If you haven't imbued yet, can you post a screen shot of your dps please?

[Spaz]

I pulled the numbers from the description. Actual damage will vary from one Cappy to another obviously.
I uninstalled Combat Analysis b/c I was experiencing problems with it.

The argument that an imbued weapon is going to be stronger so that alone makes it worth it ... is total garbage.
It's just wrong that we should have to sacrifice ANY of our damage output in order to imbue.

We are already the single most nerfed class in the game. (tho I suspect burglars would be a strong contender)
We already do the least amount of dps in the game.

They forced heralds on us.. just.. WRONG IN EVERY WAY! I hate using a herald while raiding. Yes pathing was improved but is still far from perfect.
Banners have been rendered nearly useless because mobs run out of the banner box and we cannot move the banner.
Oathbreakers almost always trigger AOE stuns in boss fights which severely nerf the benefit.

Before we know it, turbine will replace our weapons slot with a Wiffle bat.

[NogodZ]

Like I said, suit yourself. While I can sort of see your point that losing any damage is bad, think of it as an investment. The cost is losing some pulses from ONE skill. The return is significantly more damage from many other skills. It's not "garbage". It's real increased DPS. If you want to ignore that to keep a few extra pulses from one skill that may or may not even get a chance to proc., go for it.
Things are always changing in the game as new things are added, and new balances must me achieved. You can either cling to the past and focus on minor details, or look at the big picture and make the best of it.

I'm parsing at least 800 more sustained DPS from an imbued emblem. It was maxed pre-imbue, but all I put into it is IXP so far. I compared without Grave wound in the rotation in both cases, to keep it directly comparable due to the pulses issue. I also didn't use any burst DPS skills. I did have the herald out in both cases, but only for the extra melee skill to keep the rotation moving along.

As for banners, I never add max points to make it ground targeted, so that way it stays on the target.

G

[OverlordGate]

I do agree that the removal of the pulse legacy was a big nerf!

In the current state Grave Wound hits every two seconds for 20 seconds. You could double this bleed for 5 seconds on a single target (because of the 15 seconds cooldown of GW) which wouldn´t make sense if you fight multiple targets, because you would loose the opportunity to spread the bleed with Cutting Attack. However with the pre u16 state you had the opportunity to permanently have the GW bleed twice (!) on one or multiple targets at once. You loose a whole bleed ticking for a minnimum of 900 (tooltip) and a lot more on critical hits every two seconds! The whole time you fight! In a fight of 1 minute you loose 2 GW bleeds, thats a minnimum (!) of 300 dps (if no single GW bleed crits in 40 seconds). You can guess what dps this is in a real fight with nearly 30% crit chance and the good old GW bleed critical multiplier trait. And if you now imagine more than one enemy... lets say in the new Rook fight (Dome of Stars Bonus Boss)... you won´t compensate this dps loss with an average of 6% more base damage of all the other damage skills.

Instead of giving us Battle Shout damage they should have leave the pulse legacy and add the critical damage for bleeds in addition. There was no need of removing the pulses legacy and everyone who claims this does not nerf our dps should take a look in the combat analyser once more...