Minas Morgul Pre-Sale has Begun! Discussion thread

[istvana]

I bought the ultimate edition again and do not regret it given all the time I spend on LOTRO.

I note that it does not include even a month of VIP time as Mordor did.

I note that the xp earing does *not* stack with the Mordor earing so it is totally useless until level 106 for anyone that bought the Mordor ultimate package.

I prefer emphasizing the positives but people deciding what to do should know these things.

[W_T_D]

No, I am talking about the "Expansion comes out at the end of the October but you can buy it via LOTRO Store in March" thing. I am asking about what will happen to the people who have saved and bought Lotro points beforehand or who are already life-timers and have tons of LPs to spend. This is literally a "buzz off!" to the people who have been paying and playing regularly.

Exactly, I started playing around 9 years ago when it became Free To Play, I enjoyed the game and saw a benefit in subscribing to get the perks of it, It was worth it to subscribe to unlock the extra bags, gold cap and areas I could not enter unless subscribed or payed outright for them. After several years of being a paying VIP I managed to buy all areas wit the accumulated TP/LP, At no time did WB/Turbine/SSG put out content that exceeded my yearly fees, so they all made money off my subscribing. In the earlier years I also payed cash for some of the expansions as I did not have enough TP to buy them with. In the first few years subscribing provided me with benefits, after that I still subbed to support the game and payed ahead for the future updates by saving the LP. I also added 2 additional VIP accounts in this time ( never enough storage space )

Then Mordor cam out, and wow were the prices high for no real benefits. So I decided on getting the lowest price base unit. But SSG did a major game changer by making it not available for LP unless you waited like 5 months, the first time in Lotro's FTP existence that such a thing has happened. As a yearly subscriber I felt snubbed, like my $100 a year meant nothing to them. So I waited in the penalty box for it to become available for LP. End result was I let all my VIP subs run out since SSG no longer valued their VIP subscribers. If I did not have enough LP in the store, I would have paid the $40 cash for the expansion.

I am sure I am not the only one who stopped subscribing over this, SSG lost a steady stream of income from me and others because they became greedy.

Now the next expansion is going to be the same way., I still have plenty of LP from several years of subscribing, so I will just wait once again in the penalty box to be able to buy for LP. I'm sure there will be a large base of ex VIP's in the same boat and we will all start the new area in March 2020.

Why not have the expansion available for pre-order for 4000LP and discounted in March 2020 for 2495LP? ( yea, I know, there are sales on LP and people used to buy during this time to save on future updates, but that all ended when SSG took over. )

Only SSG knows the true impact of this new model they instituted.

[Hallandil]

No, I am talking about the "Expansion comes out at the end of the October but you can buy it via LOTRO Store in March" thing. I am asking about what will happen to the people who have saved and bought Lotro points beforehand or who are already life-timers and have tons of LPs to spend. This is literally a "buzz off!" to the people who have been paying and playing regularly.

Lifers still had to purchase Mines of Moria and Siege of Mirkwood back when those titles were originally released (prior to Free-to-Play). Lifetime was "Lifetime Subscription" which does not include expansions, as per the original agreement of buying a lifetime account.

Mordor does not differ from this.

The game cannot survive on using hoarded LP as SSG does need to make money to operate (and when revenue can't come from expansion sales, they are then required to nickel and dime through other means). Not to mention the inflation of Store prices thanks to lifer hoards.

[peachykins]

Lifers still had to purchase Mines of Moria and Siege of Mirkwood back when those titles were originally released (prior to Free-to-Play). Lifetime was "Lifetime Subscription" which does not include expansions, as per the original agreement of buying a lifetime account.

Mordor does not differ from this.

The game cannot survive on using hoarded LP as SSG does need to make money to operate (and when revenue can't come from expansion sales, they are then required to nickel and dime through other means). Not to mention the inflation of Store prices thanks to lifer hoards.

How nice blaming lifetimers for SSG's problems. Many lifetimers buy points so dont even go there on blaming them.

[sapienze]

It is good to see the word "Official" was removed from this thread's title. The person who made this thread does not work for SSG and in no way can claim anything they say is Official.

I was about to contact the CM about this and saw the word "Official" was removed. To who ever pointed this out to SSG, you have my thanks.

[Cordovan]

It is good to see the word "Official" was removed from this thread's title. The person who made this thread does not work for SSG and in no way can claim anything they say is Official.

I was about to contact the CM about this and saw the word "Official" was removed. To who ever pointed this out to SSG, you have my thanks.

I only really care if it matters, but it seemed to matter in this case due to the interest in a thread to discuss the expansion in general.

[Narthalion]

It is good to see the word "Official" was removed from this thread's title. The person who made this thread does not work for SSG and in no way can claim anything they say is Official.

I was about to contact the CM about this and saw the word "Official" was removed.

Really?

All a person has to do is read the OPs first comments and realize it wasn't coming from any "official" bluename. It seems the only thing the OP was guilty of was a little hyperbole in order to get some attention.

But, on behalf of an eternally grateful LOTRO playerbase, thank YOU, for being willing to save us from this great source of evil.

[Ltngstrike]

For the first time in our 12 year history with Lotro my wife and I will not be buying the pre-order expansion, maybe not even the expansion at all. Neither of us raid or do group instances so if game play beyond Erebor is any example of the new expansion then it has nothing to offer us. They have trashed crafting and made outfitting a character so confusing and daunting that we both have numerous lvl 120 characters parked unplayed. Most of our game play is devoted to leveling alts now.

We will be voting with our wallets on this one.

[Raymore]

Mordor Ultimate had a Month of VIP as well.

[Moondog548]

How nice blaming lifetimers for SSG's problems. Many lifetimers buy points so dont even go there on blaming them.

Blame's got nothing to do with it. It is what it is.

[Laurelinarien]

For the first time in our 12 year history with Lotro my wife and I will not be buying the pre-order expansion, maybe not even the expansion at all. Neither of us raid or do group instances so if game play beyond Erebor is any example, the new expansion then it has nothing to offer us. They have trashed crafting and made outfitting a character so confusing and daunting that we both have numerous lvl 120 characters parked unplayed. Most of our game play is devoted to leveling alts now.

This, coupled with a server like Gladden, drove my bf & me away from group content and into the "Legendary Servers". Another reason not to fret about this expansion: we group and level up there, only coming back to Gladden to quest and explore new landscape.

[Starliteyes]

Blame's got nothing to do with it. It is what it is.

Except when it's not. I know plenty of lifetimers who spend real cash, myself included. Just sounds like sour grapes to me.

I'd be more likely to blame the folks who say "I'm not spending another dime on this game until they give me X! That'll show 'em!" but still keep playing the game. Well, to be honest, if they gave everyone their "X", what kind of a hot mess would that be?

[Starliteyes]

This, coupled with a server like Gladden, drove my bf & me away from group content and into the "Legendary Servers". Another reason not to fret about this expansion: we group and level up there, only coming back to Gladden to quest and explore new landscape.

I agree! Since I gave up raiding/min-max/the grind, and just focus on quests and stuff I find fun, it's been a refreshingly fun time! Looking forward to the new areas, but I'll be taking my time and enjoying the fun bits.

[Gwinthilnel]

I was going to buy the Ultimate Edition until you guys knocked some sense into me. We haven't even seen the expansion on beta yet! Also I reevaluated what you get in the Ultimate and realized that it's absolutely not worth the $$. I'll likely be getting the standard version, but I'd much rather spend LPs on it. It's quite disappointing that it won't be avaliable for LPs until March; I mean at least make it like December or even January. By the time March comes around people will have already done all the content potentially.

I hope they take a look at this thread and make some changes, but I doubt it.

[Emaldiom]

It is good to see the word "Official" was removed from this thread's title. The person who made this thread does not work for SSG and in no way can claim anything they say is Official.

I was about to contact the CM about this and saw the word "Official" was removed. To who ever pointed this out to SSG, you have my thanks.

Said person do believe in his is own twisted eyes to be the official voice of the player base..
Golod to see it removed

I have high hopes for this update.. keep going ssg!

[Lord.Funk]

For the first time in our 12 year history with Lotro my wife and I will not be buying the pre-order expansion, maybe not even the expansion at all. Neither of us raid or do group instances so if game play beyond Erebor is any example of the new expansion then it has nothing to offer us. They have trashed crafting and made outfitting a character so confusing and daunting that we both have numerous lvl 120 characters parked unplayed. Most of our game play is devoted to leveling alts now.

We will be voting with our wallets on this one.

I agree! Since I gave up raiding/min-max/the grind, and just focus on quests and stuff I find fun, it's been a refreshingly fun time! Looking forward to the new areas, but I'll be taking my time and enjoying the fun bits.

Yeah, I still havent even decided yet. That is not usual for me. Money itsef is not the issue when I like something and find it worth it.

It's still that no matter if I have the money I want to pay for something I like.

1. I didn't want a cap raise already.
   
   
2. I do play instances and even sometimes raid, but this was way too quickly and I'm not even done and fully geared with Anvil T2 gear yet or T5 gold stuff. I have a few pieces but not all. Same for many of my friends.
   
   
3. I can't keep up with this rat-race anymore as I refuse to buy lootbox keys. I do have a life outside this game. It's how I can afford to pay and play, but still won't buy and support lootboxes to gear up. I'll gladly pay for expansions and sub on multiple accounts when I'm enjoying what I do with my son and friends.
   
   
4. Friends are talking about leaving on various discord channels as they are finally fed up with this rat race of chasing gear in instances and raids, universal solvents and essences and it all. Which too soon after are all outdated again anyway, if they even get as far as get fully equipped. Many don't but just a few pieces before LvL cap raised again. It's just too much. Already lost many friends with Mordor and now it seems more I know will leave. Most that stayed through Mordor and just suffered trough it, then did acctually like Iron Hills, Ered Mithrin and Vales. Now they simply can not stand another year (or more) of Mordor style content all over again.
   
   
5. Don't want to go back to Mordor if it involves LoE/Radiance 2.0 again (not sure yet if it does, but seems likely).
   
   
6. Do not like the included cosmetics. Compared to RoI, RoR and HD big packs cosmetics they are hideous in my taste. Can't even turn off the screamingly flashy glow on the outfit and steed. Looks like some anime masquerade/cosplay more or less. I play LoTRO as I tried GW2 an other MMO RPG's and can't stand that look. Yes I know that is just my taste. Son and friends agree though.
   
   
7. See no point with the stout-axes as no new class, not even warden playable.
   
   
8. No point with the 120 valar unless it can be used on a 120 character for the other bonuses, as I'm not making a new charactrer due to no new classes.
   
   
9. 20 Empowerement Scrolls is like doing the MT dailes on 2 alts once, so that's not going to change my mind.

If at least the cosmetics were anything like RoI, RoR and HD it would at least be something, but they're not. Neither was Mordor cosmetics. That was something LoTRO used to do well up until Gondor. I'm at a loss and not sure what to do at all yet.

I would even rather pay this price for the biggest packs of RoR and HD again with those cosmetics included for more alt accounts than to buy this expansion.

It's just how i feel atm. It might change. Don't know. Just seeing and reading friends reactions on discord last night got me down. How I felt at start of Mordor did not change and I did not start to feel good about the game again until we were out of it and finally in Iron Hills. Me and my friends have been enjoying Iron Hills, Ered Mithrin and Vales alot. Mordor none of us liked but suffered through. The rest left.

[Hephburz-2]

For me, my BIGGEST issue with every lotro expansion/update since 105 has been.

Level increase.

Pure and simple. SSG doesn't bring to us enough end-game content at each level cap to keep the player base active and enticed. With each level cap they leave in its wake a host of dead instances and dead content that will never be done again. I really FAIL to see the thought process here, I really do. It wouldn't matter if all instances and raids were scaled appropriately and dropped appropriate level gear, but they do not.

My ideal option going forward would be to axe the level cap increase and require us to use Light of Earendil again, considering we're going back to Mordor anyway - thus requiring people to farm a whole new set of gear anyway, BUT at the same time, NOT creating dead content.

[Oelle]

So... Minas Morgul out in March, huh?

Seems like it will be the same lame way like for Mordor:
buy for money and exploit or come later and be annoyed by no loot anywhere
at least, some bugs will be fixed within that half year... its just a bit sad, that most of my toons will likely be near levelcap or at levelcap when entering the new zones, which will give me a 'wrong' feeling about the intended challenge those quests are supposed to have. I'd have preferred entering Minas Morgul with a lvl120 toon, but with half a year time passing, I doubt many of my toons will stay there.

[sapienze]

I see no mention of Deeds in any promotion for the expansion.

There are no Deeds?

There was an oversight making the expansion promotion?

[zeroxes]

My wife and I are VIPs, and we pay annually for the game, but that may be coming to an end soon.

I just don't understand the value of the Ultimate Tier at all. I remember back in the day you could spend $70 for a "Collector's Edition" and receive an Art Book, a Soundtrack, a well-printed box set, and other digital perks for other games. Today, it's all digital. There's no physical anything. There's no insight into the artwork, no soundtracks, nothing to put on the "collector's" shelf. I understand optical media is a thing of the past, but if you're going to sell a digital package, at least throw your subscribers a bone, and use the value to build in new subscribers to extend the life of the game.

How is there no VIP incentive built in to any of this? There's no hook here to come in as a subscriber. There's no LOTRO points. The best value of all the tiers is the basic one. You at least get the expansion content, an extra character slot, and the stout-axe dwarf race. The other two are simply lacking in any value to match the dollars asked for. I had been waiting anxiously for the Minas Morgul announcement, and I have to say, I'm completely underwhelmed. The 0:45 trailer on YouTube did not get me excited for the content, and I'm disappointed that as a longtime player, supporter and subscriber, I must wait until March of next year (4 months after release) to play the new content, unless I want to shell out more money than I already do. After spending hundreds of dollars over the last 8 years and having an active VIP subscription, I'm locked out of any new content unless I'm willing to squeeze out more cash until next year. It's preposterous.

I love Tolkien. I have loved LOTRO. I've been faithful, but I'm losing interest guys. I turned off auto-renewal for my VIP subscription. You need to do a better job of keeping your subscribers happy and eager to come back. I'm not saying that $130 is too much to ask; I'm saying what you're asking from subscribers to pay for new content who already pay you every single month is outrageous and unrealistic. Please rethink your future strategies and perhaps I'll come take another look later on.

I'm 120 and finished with Vales of Anduin. I don't raid. I was only logging in while waiting for Minas Morgul landscape, but this announcement fell completely flat for me.

[Itachi1337]

Yeah, I still havent even decided yet. That is not usual for me. Money itsef is not the issue when I like something and find it worth it.

It's still that no matter if I have the money I want to pay for something I like.

1. I didn't want a cap raise already.
   
   
2. I do play instances and even sometimes raid, but this was way too quickly and I'm not even done and fully geared with Anvil T2 gear yet or T5 gold stuff. I have a few pieces but not all. Same for many of my friends.
   
   
3. I can't keep up with this rat-race anymore as I refuse to buy lootbox keys. I do have a life outside this game. It's how I can afford to pay and play, but still won't buy and support lootboxes to gear up. I'll gladly pay for expansions and sub on multiple accounts when I'm enjoying what I do with my son and friends.
   
   
4. Friends are talking about leaving on various discord channels as they are finally fed up with this rat race of chasing gear in instances and raids, universal solvents and essences and it all. Which too soon after are all outdated again anyway, if they even get as far as get fully equipped. Many don't but just a few pieces before LvL cap raised again. It's just too much. Already lost many friends with Mordor and now it seems more I know will leave. Most that stayed through Mordor and just suffered trough it, then did acctually like Iron Hills, Ered Mithrin and Vales. Now they simply can not stand another year (or more) of Mordor style content all over again.
   
   
5. Don't want to go back to Mordor if it involves LoE/Radiance 2.0 again (not sure yet if it does, but seems likely).
   
   
6. Do not like the included cosmetics. Compared to RoI, RoR and HD big packs cosmetics they are hideous in my taste. Can't even turn off the screamingly flashy glow on the outfit and steed. Looks like some anime masquerade/cosplay more or less. I play LoTRO as I tried GW2 an other MMO RPG's and can't stand that look. Yes I know that is just my taste. Son and friends agree though.
   
   
7. See no point with the stout-axes as no new class, not even warden playable.
   
   
8. No point with the 120 valar unless it can be used on a 120 character for the other bonuses, as I'm not making a new charactrer due to no new classes.
   
   
9. 20 Empowerement Scrolls is like doing the MT dailes on 2 alts once, so that's not going to change my mind.

If at least the cosmetics were anything like RoI, RoR and HD it would at least be something, but they're not. Neither was Mordor cosmetics. That was something LoTRO used to do well up until Gondor. I'm at a loss and not sure what to do at all yet.

I would even rather pay this price for the biggest packs of RoR and HD again with those cosmetics included for more alt accounts than to buy this expansion.

It's just how i feel atm. It might change. Don't know. Just seeing and reading friends reactions on discord last night got me down. How I felt at start of Mordor did not change and I did not start to feel good about the game again until we were out of it and finally in Iron Hills. Me and my friends have been enjoying Iron Hills, Ered Mithrin and Vales alot. Mordor none of us liked but suffered through. The rest left.

Tell me just few things.. You sad it's still too early? Early for what m8? Raid is out for like one year? 8 months? And u saying you dont have gear? It's not our problem.. What? You need like 4 years old raid to have all gear? Comeone.. stop complaining... Throne of Dread Terror is out for like 2-3 years and people still dont know how to play? What shoudl WoW player say? They getting new raid every few months..

Conclusion: If you are not hard core player its ok to not get all best gears.. but tbh I am playing for like 2-3h 4 days in week and I got full geared my toon (all raid gear, all essences, all golden items)..

[Lord.Funk]

...It's not our problem.. What? ...

I never said it was Your problem. Did I say that ??? I acctually said the opposite that it is a problem for me (as well as friends and other people I have read both here as well as in various discord channels). That is why I am not decided if I even want to buy this pack or play the new area. Definetly not Your problem. Never ever suggested it was. In the long run it can be SSG's problem if many feel like me and stop buying or playing. I know I'm not the only one who feels like this. Only time will tell.

I even know people who do play instances all the time and like to raid often that are geared and still think this has become too much. In fact people like that who went "Oh noo, not a cap raise again and the whole gear grind all over" when they read the news yesterday and even expressed that they might leave. People who's goal it is to gear up and do end-game stuff.

Besides that was only some of the issues as to why I'm not decided, I'm sorry if I stepped on Your toes by having that opinion. There are other reasons to that I mentioned.

[Hallandil]

How nice blaming lifetimers for SSG's problems. Many lifetimers buy points so dont even go there on blaming them.

That's a whataboutism. If you're buying points, then why not buy the expansion?

Not everything is some salty attack on lifers. I'm fully aware that many of LOTRO's problems stem from SSG and actions by past management.

That doesn't change the fact that there is a large pool of accounts sitting in storage that still gain premium currency. Many being traded/sold by hackers and 3rd party websites.

[Arnenna]

I only really care if it matters, but it seemed to matter in this case due to the interest in a thread to discuss the expansion in general.

It mattered. it did to me anyway. Glad it got noticed.

[Ariwen55]

Thank you Standing Stone for taking care of my problem!
Truly appreciated!