Bullroarer Update 30.3 - Beta 4 - CLOSED

[AlagorianAndCo]

Hello there,

Had a lot of mentions in BR World chat that the conversion rate from old LIs to new LIs is not up to scale and I can confirm this myself. The amount of ancient scripts is not coherent with the amount of runes and shattered morgul traceries. With a first age weapon fully converted I was only able to build a new legendary item with NO power traceries or crafted traceries (5 traceries missing on class item/4 on weapon) indicating a missing 4500 ancient scripts.
There has also been some disappointment in the fact that only shattered traceries are given and not cracked traceries. With Gundabad being only 3 weeks from release once 30.3 comes out, (therefore rendering the morgul equipment moot) holding the players back from having the best 121+ traceries available seems rather... insulting to many.

Though changes have been bought about to certain classes, the overall class balance is still not where it should be at with the new LIs in place. In terms of damage output, agility classes (hunters, wardens and burglars) have all received a significant DPS increase, near doubling the damage on live. Champions and rune keepers (two other primary damage classes) have had their damage balanced without swapping but have received no boost, therefore rendering them nigh unusable as DPS.

For specific numbers, on a 3 minute test dummy session:
Hunters, wardens and burglars: 350-400k DPS average for experienced players
Champions: 200-220k DPS average for experienced players
Rune Keepers: 220-240k DPS average for experienced players

An argument that rune keepers would be shifting to a more healing based class could be made, however whilst minstrels and bears have seen an increase to their healing capabilities, the same cannot be said for Rune-Keepers, leaving them behind once again as an unfavorable class.

**The class balance in live is actually really quite nice and possibly the most balanced the game has seen in many years in terms of which classes can fit the tank/dps/heal roles. It would be a shame to see that balance tilted to the extreme point it is in beta.**
Possible solutions to this could be to reduce the base damage of agility classes or improve the base damage of might/will classes.


Lastly, as a primarily warden player: the Heal Bonus for Conviction tracery serves no purpose. The heal from conviction has been DRASTICALLY reduced in beta (healing around 10% of what it is on live). Currently the heal does (in a blue line, tank trait and build at level 130) 761 morale every 3 seconds for 18s... on a tank that has 1 million morale. Boosting this by 38% results in a tracery that will never be used as the base heal of Conviction is essentially non existent as warden self heals do not scale correctly when leveling. (They are very viable in earlier phases of the game, but useless past isengard/rohan ish levels). An easy solution to this would be to either tweak the scaling of heals for Conviction (and Restoration) OR change the tracery to affect Conviction's stat boosts (Tactical Mit, Crit Defence etc)

Would love to have a bit more communication on the class balance issue. I know that some information has been thrown around along the lines of 'we know champs need fixing, we're on it' has been thrown around but since certain skills were improved in terms of 1h/2h damage we havent heard anything about class balance since (and Im not even a champ player)

Thanking you muchly for your efforts and time taken to read this!

- The Doctor

[Goatimli]

I like the new room in the last homely hose.

I agree—it's a nice addition to an iconic place. One small point though: I hope the generic name of the Legendary Weapons / Items vendor will change to an Elven name for live. It definitely affects the immersion and seems out of place for a city like Rivendell.

[danquanngaytho]

Can SSG halt the LI revamp this time please? To be honest, I don't think the new system may function properly as the initial plan.

Instead of "completely" revamping LIs for 11 classes from level 50 and up, please converting the "planned" Brawler's traceries into current legacies. SSG has too much on their plates right now: the LI revamp, the Brawler, and the Gundabad expansion. By temporarily halting the LI revamp, SSG can have more time to polish Gundabad and Brawler. Then, when these contents are stable, the company can figure out the suitable solution for the LI revamp.

[LagunaD2]

Can SSG halt the LI revamp this time please?

No, they can't.

[OldManMagic]

Is there, or will there be, a process to convert Scrolls of Empowerment, Delving, etc, IXP Runes, and other LI Items that are unused in inventory? If so what's the Conversion Rate?

[Merlinous1]

so the completeness of the LI doesnt seem to matter when it comes to conversion for the new stuff. the difference in conversion for a non imbued LI compared to a fully maxed out item isnt all that much. a fully maxed out LI should be exchanged for items that can fully max the new one. it will only be BiS for a month....then we get to 140 so the grind can begin on improving. Why are they being so stingy?!

[Harvain]

Can SSG halt the LI revamp this time please? To be honest, I don't think the new system may function properly as the initial plan.

Instead of "completely" revamping LIs for 11 classes from level 50 and up, please converting the "planned" Brawler's traceries into current legacies. SSG has too much on their plates right now: the LI revamp, the Brawler, and the Gundabad expansion. By temporarily halting the LI revamp, SSG can have more time to polish Gundabad and Brawler. Then, when these contents are stable, the company can figure out the suitable solution for the LI revamp.

The table is set, it shall be shaken and the pieces replaced with time.

There can be small delays but this appointment shall go forward.

The new Era of LOTRO approaches.

[JERH]

Yea I don't mean because of the effort, I mean because of how distorted this whole system is. We are basically rewarding people for hoarding useless items right before a new release. This is not good game design at all.

I’ve watched prices over time for years. So, you mean like solvents, essence removal scrolls, accelerators (rep and exp), attack dmg scrolls, … all don’t drop as a release gets older and then balloon many times in price just before and right after a new release? They do.

This current LI behavior is reasonably harmless and only costs built up ixp. The SSG team knows convert numbers are out of wack and will try to balance things. Doing preemptive things based on BR previews may work or it may backfire to nothing. Caveat emptor.

[JERH]

so the completeness of the LI doesnt seem to matter when it comes to conversion for the new stuff. the difference in conversion for a non imbued LI compared to a fully maxed out item isnt all that much. a fully maxed out LI should be exchanged for items that can fully max the new one. it will only be BiS for a month....then we get to 140 so the grind can begin on improving. Why are they being so stingy?!

Yes, it does matter but not that much. An newly imbued FA brought up with ixp to max (tier 43 or so) with no starlits or SOE invested is about 2/3 of the convert return as a fully maxed FA. A level 60-70 non imbued FA returns about the same 2/3 as the newly imbued. All those starlits and SoEs invested are devalued by significant compression at the high end. The devs will have 2 weeks to attempt a balance.

[Harvain]

Get more information aboutthe Legendary Item update arriving with Update 30.3! Read more onLOTRO.com.

https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...tems-explained

[Laurelinarien]

Regarding the article about the new LIs

1. No mention of a non-Mithril method of tracery removal. Will our essence reclamation scrolls work?

2. Any idea what's gonna become of the Relic Removal Scrolls?

3. Really crossing my fingers on that UI overhaul.

[Craiden]

This is not really Brawler or LI-related and I tried to submit a bug, but not really sure if it worked, so I'll also put it out here if I may. I know the good people at SSG have other, more important things on their plates, but I still wanted to mention it, maybe it gets filed in a Jira ticket and will get fixed eventually when time allowes

So this is the issue:

With the addition of the Lightning Attenuation, there is large and pretty annoying shadow on an Elves' head when selecting hairdo #19.

See this screenshot:


Thanks for reading.

[W_T_D]

As others have already pointed out the maximum gain from conversion comes from a max out imbued 1st/2nd/3r age weapon: 82/5400/270/9 (rare runes/script/teal runes/traceries).

However, the most cost efficient way to get them is with a level 70 (that is with a delving scroll, no crystals on it) 1st/2nd (and perhaps 3rd age, haven't tested this yet) LOW LEVEL item.

So, if you have slots empty OR with imbued items WITHOUT crystals OR with normal weapons for swapping without delving scrolls, you better get low level weapons, buy some low level delving scrolls, level them up with ixp and you get 50/3600/150/5 (rare runes/script/teal runes/traceries).

If I have anything wrong please let me know and I will edit this post.

The question is: Will there be a dev diary and an email sent to EVERY player explaining all this or not? Because, frankly, I don't mind doing whatever the Devs decide is best, but please TELL US about it. You will get less frustrated players this way!

Would have loved to do some testing on this except:

All my characters LI weapons were gone in this beta.
If I knew ahead of time I would have had some 1st, 2nd, 3rd age, imbued and not to see what happens.
Since you cant reforge the old LI's I was unable to test anything. other then deconing a bridal and class item.

This currency cap is going to screw many people, many will just have 2 LI's, decon both and loose much to currency cap.

[Harvain]

Would have loved to do some testing on this except:

All my characters LI weapons were gone in this beta.
If I knew ahead of time I would have had some 1st, 2nd, 3rd age, imbued and not to see what happens.
Since you cant reforge the old LI's I was unable to test anything. other then deconing a bridal and class item.

This currency cap is going to screw many people, many will just have 2 LI's, decon both and loose much to currency cap.

Currency Cap can be exceeded as long as a Player is Converting/Appraisal & Distribute.

Then all the current limitations apply, if a Player receives Currency over the Cap in other ways, the Player won't receive such and can only get any other form of said Currency when below the Cap Limit and up to how much room a Player has (example: if you have 9,500/10,000 and receive 700 of Currency, you'll gain 500 but lose 200 forever).

[CaerArianrhod]

What specific UI issue did you encounter that made you unable to use the new Legendary Item system?

This one, for example. Could you choose the right list?





Do you think this UI is really usable on a regular basis?





Is here enough space on everyone's screen for this?
Even on a big screen like my, if we got one or tow more slots with Gundabad?





Would you call something like this as usable?

[LagunaD2]

Do you think this UI is really usable on a regular basis?

The 13 buttons (in just the visible part of a single panel) prompting you to spend, or buy, Mithril Coins are very convenient!

/sarc

[cbfan14]

I noticed that the essences seem to have their item lvls present while slotted in gear. Is this implying that we'll also be able to upgrade essences in the future? Or this is something that's unintentional?

[Cordovan]

This one, for example. Could you choose the right list?





Do you think this UI is really usable on a regular basis?





Is here enough space on everyone's screen for this?
Even on a big screen like my, if we got one or tow more slots with Gundabad?





Would you call something like this as usable?

Thanks for the information. If you have not yet submitted a bug report on it, please consider it. It looks like the drop-down menu issue is related to the German translation making the string too long. We are still doing work on the other UI elements, which is why we have been making sure people understand that the UI seen on Bullroarer so far is still a work in progress. It probably will remain true that if you have a lot of things slotted and upgraded it will take up quite a bit of screen UI space, but we'll work to make it as readable as we can.

[CaerArianrhod]

Thanks for the information. If you have not yet submitted a bug report on it, please consider it.

I sent a bug report.

It looks like the drop-down menu issue is related to the German translation making the string too long. We are still doing work on the other UI elements, which is why we have been making sure people understand that the UI seen on Bullroarer so far is still a work in progress. It probably will remain true that if you have a lot of things slotted and upgraded it will take up quite a bit of screen UI space, but we'll work to make it as readable as we can.

And all that is the reason, why I don't understand, why there is no place and time for tests for a/the new (?) UI. It is simple a fun-killer if you log in after an update and the UI you are seeing every day is broken.

[auximenes]

Thanks for the information. If you have not yet submitted a bug report on it, please consider it. It looks like the drop-down menu issue is related to the German translation making the string too long. We are still doing work on the other UI elements, which is why we have been making sure people understand that the UI seen on Bullroarer so far is still a work in progress. It probably will remain true that if you have a lot of things slotted and upgraded it will take up quite a bit of screen UI space, but we'll work to make it as readable as we can.

FWIW, this problem has been around a long time, at least as far back as Rohan. There are many Legendary Bridle Legacy names which are too long and get cut off.

[Vilda]

....

Do you think this UI is really usable on a regular basis?

....

This is terrible

[Arnenna]

Thanks for the information. If you have not yet submitted a bug report on it, please consider it. It looks like the drop-down menu issue is related to the German translation making the string too long. We are still doing work on the other UI elements, which is why we have been making sure people understand that the UI seen on Bullroarer so far is still a work in progress. It probably will remain true that if you have a lot of things slotted and upgraded it will take up quite a bit of screen UI space, but we'll work to make it as readable as we can.

The general layout means that for many players, the LI goes off screen either top or bottom. It's not a good design as it doesn't scale, and even if it did, the text would be so tiny it would cause all sorts of accessibility issues.

There was a thread on the forums (can't remember whether it was BR or general forum) with a great suggestion, as well as screenshots of a mock up, to put the different traceries into tabs on the LI interface. It looked really good.

Edit: Found it.

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...-new-LI-system

[Gunhard]

the overall class balance is still not where it should be at with the new LIs in place.

What ive noticed with Morgul xpack is devs can balance dps properly, at least for major dps classes. So i keep my hopes high for new xpack. Rk being semihealing class is not the case. Pretty sure it will be balanced to be on par with other dps classes.

[Paladin_Ovron]

When reforging my main hand on my hunter, looks like a big when I try to reforge the main hand weapon, it won’t reforge. Somehow the button on the window is disabled. It worked on my bow.

[Nubja]

Thanks for the information. If you have not yet submitted a bug report on it, please consider it. It looks like the drop-down menu issue is related to the German translation making the string too long. We are still doing work on the other UI elements, which is why we have been making sure people understand that the UI seen on Bullroarer so far is still a work in progress. It probably will remain true that if you have a lot of things slotted and upgraded it will take up quite a bit of screen UI space, but we'll work to make it as readable as we can.

Work in progress with a real release date in a week and half, AND there's the thousands of issues this forum has raised still to address.

Do you understand why there is so little faith in this update?