Creeps just too op

[anderlecht]

How it's possible to kill to kill a reaver if your are not a champ ? Too many heals... And same for th rest, creeps are too op, creeps are too many ... Need just a balance.

It's no match actually. And you kill the pvmp...

[Daec]

Hard to tell if this is trolling or not

[Canarne]

Lets vote to remove all self heals from the mpvp!
Not joke.

[Sizz_the_sock]

How it's possible to kill to kill a reaver if your are not a champ ? Too many heals... And same for th rest, creeps are too op, creeps are too many ... Need just a balance.

It's no match actually. And you kill the pvmp...

Don't be ridiculous, if there are too many creeps either pug a group or join a kin that mainly does pvp.

Lets vote to remove all self heals from the mpvp!
Not joke.

Troll detected.

[Nenortiz]

Just started playing pvmp again recently and as a fully equipped T4 gear LM rank 8 i cant even think about winning a 1v1 against anything higher than rank 5. Water lore does absolute nothing these days. And the most damaging skill a LM has called "natures fury" doesnt even work in pvmp. On the opposite side i easy win (except some high rank champs) most my 1v1s with my r10 weaver where audacity is only at rank 23.
And creeps still want more buffs? Is it only because of Champs?

And lets not forget about Defiler heal lol

[subadar]

dont forget the current FoTM burgs

[Kate00]

Just started playing pvmp again recently and as a fully equipped T4 gear LM rank 8 i cant even think about winning a 1v1 against anything higher than rank 5. Water lore does absolute nothing these days. And the most damaging skill a LM has called "natures fury" doesnt even work in pvmp. On the opposite side i easy win (except some high rank champs) most my 1v1s with my r10 weaver where audacity is only at rank 23.
And creeps still want more buffs? Is it only because of Champs?

And lets not forget about Defiler heal lol

Defilers are a healing class and shouldnt be killed 1v1.

[Nenortiz]

Defilers are a healing class and shouldnt be killed 1v1.

Not even 3 freeps can kill a good defiler. Doesnt help that his 3 million crit heal is on a short induction.
Skill doesnt even matter here. There is no counterplay
Can freep healer easily outheal that many creeps? With all that incoming healing reduction? With reaver critting impale for 400k+?

[Kate00]

Not even 3 freeps can kill a good defiler. Doesnt help that his 3 million crit heal is on a short induction.
Skill doesnt even matter here. There is no counterplay
Can freep healer easily outheal that many creeps? With all that incoming healing reduction? With reaver critting impale for 400k+?

yes freep healers can outheal 3 creeps.

freeps have interrupts, fears, etc. to combat defiler healing. It’s annoying to have all your heals interrupted. Usually means death.

[Nenortiz]

yes freep healers can outheal 3 creeps.

freeps have interrupts, fears, etc. to combat defiler healing. It’s annoying to have all your heals interrupted. Usually means death.

Everyone is complaining about defiler heal except defiler players ofc.
The fact is here on my server it is GV camp like 90% of the time and freeps are quitting.
And defilers are in every corner of the map because easy to play and efficient.

Or am i just unlucky that i play a LM and ssg balances creeps around champs.
Until things get better for classes that are not burg or champ i quit too, thanks

[Strider5548]

"Every class that isn't mine is OP FOTM trash and needs to be nerfed"

-LOTRO PvMP Community

[Daec]

Everyone is complaining about defiler heal except defiler players ofc.
The fact is here on my server it is GV camp like 90% of the time and freeps are quitting.
And defilers are in every corner of the map because easy to play and efficient.

Or am i just unlucky that i play a LM and ssg balances creeps around champs.
Until things get better for classes that are not burg or champ i quit too, thanks

Pretty much all the freep tactical classes have been left behind when compares to physical classes. Blue RKs only saving grace is its cooldowns, the actual heals are garbage. once those CDs are burnt good luck keeping anyone alive.

you are correct that defilers are simple, yet extremely effective at what they do. Most creep classes are relative simple in terms of rotation (i'm not trying to put a negative connotation on this) its just how they were designed. In the grand scheme i think defilers are fine, its just there are a lot of them, you stack any 6 healers on a target and its gonna be hard to bring down no matter the class.

[Kate00]

Everyone is complaining about defiler heal except defiler players ofc.
The fact is here on my server it is GV camp like 90% of the time and freeps are quitting.
And defilers are in every corner of the map because easy to play and efficient.

Or am i just unlucky that i play a LM and ssg balances creeps around champs.
Until things get better for classes that are not burg or champ i quit too, thanks

what server do you play on? On ark right now creeps have the ON buff and its NOT a gv camp.

[Elmagor]

One topic: Creeps too OP. Another topic: Creeps too weak. Where truth? How devs can understand such feedback?

[UsaByz]

Individually creeps are fairly tough and are less reliant to function in a group than freeps nowadays.

Massed defilers are strong, and massed creeps in general are also strong. As they should be.
On ark, a lot of the time when creeps start getting farmed they group up and fight back.
Freeps do the same but to less effect due to lack of class variety.


Issues with maps and march aside, to win and overcome people have to group up, start mixing in support classes and try to do more than complain about not being able to penetrate 5 rows of defilers hots.
In the case of freeps you can have 3 classes that when combined completely paralyze most inc heals on any target with some debuff combinations

Creeps have the same tools with blight warg puddles flayer and spammable tangle shot and DS,

are there issues with fotm classes right now? sure. are burgs op af ? yes. are defilers strong when you dont have the tools on hand to deal with it? of course.

in the end it just comes down to whether or not you want to complain, or group up and make points.

[Daec]

One topic: Creeps too OP. Another topic: Creeps too weak. Where truth? How devs can understand such feedback?

Context means a lot, if you look at it from "i solo on an LM and i get trashed in every fight" you'll probably develop the point of view that creeps need a nerf when in reality LM has just fallen far behind other freeps, and creeps as well. If you nerf creeps so LM can compete creeps will get dumpstered by every other freep easily. Its much easier to give LM some tools and updates Same can be said if you're fighting a champ on creep, its not necessarily required that creeps get huge buffs to compete with champs its probably better to change champs (which some of this has happened) otherwise you'll end up with creeps running over every other class.

Creeps overall seem sit in an okayish spot, there is definitely some improvements to be made overall, and on individual classes. BA is starting to really stick out as needing a bit of work since other classes got some decent updates and BA was mostly left alone aside from some minor changes.

[Elmagor]

Context means a lot, if you look at it from "i solo on an LM and i get trashed in every fight" you'll probably develop the point of view that creeps need a nerf when in reality LM has just fallen far behind other freeps, and creeps as well. If you nerf creeps so LM can compete creeps will get dumpstered by every other freep easily. Its much easier to give LM some tools and updates Same can be said if you're fighting a champ on creep, its not necessarily required that creeps get huge buffs to compete with champs its probably better to change champs (which some of this has happened) otherwise you'll end up with creeps running over every other class.

Creeps overall seem sit in an okayish spot, there is definitely some improvements to be made overall, and on individual classes. BA is starting to really stick out as needing a bit of work since other classes got some decent updates and BA was mostly left alone aside from some minor changes.

Orion say in one of streams when they create creeps, they consider balance as "6 creeps can kill one freep"

[Daec]

Orion say in one of streams when they create creeps, they consider balance as "6 creeps can kill one freep"

Again, context means a lot. They considered that 15 years ago, today that is no longer the philosophy.

[Elmagor]

Again, context means a lot. They considered that 15 years ago, today that is no longer the philosophy.

I still don't see how they can turn 6 vs 1 fair fight into 1 vs 1 fair fight

[Dranak123]

Context means a lot, if you look at it from "i solo on an LM and i get trashed in every fight" you'll probably develop the point of view that creeps need a nerf when in reality LM has just fallen far behind other freeps, and creeps as well. If you nerf creeps so LM can compete creeps will get dumpstered by every other freep easily. Its much easier to give LM some tools and updates Same can be said if you're fighting a champ on creep, its not necessarily required that creeps get huge buffs to compete with champs its probably better to change champs (which some of this has happened) otherwise you'll end up with creeps running over every other class.

Creeps overall seem sit in an okayish spot, there is definitely some improvements to be made overall, and on individual classes. BA is starting to really stick out as needing a bit of work since other classes got some decent updates and BA was mostly left alone aside from some minor changes.

hello. Yes its interesting how you could balance classes in pvmp without messing up everything else. If you were to take your example of the LM I would suggest one or both or all of three things. This could be a template for use across those classes in need , not all of course...thats the point , and with a lvl 140 cap usage obviously so that you reset the board with a level update...goes without saying.
1. class essence of war...pvp only. in this case i would suggest induction reduction of 30/40/50 % to speed up LM and naturally boost dps to boot.
2. class specific kit or armour type at a push. in this case a sword with for instance a stupid ton of crit rating and crit defence. as well as the usual level of other stats.
3. similar to above , class slot items with crazy bonuses on that just would not wash in PVE.
as a side note...Guardian could benefit here too....
as a p.p.s. side note it would be interesting to note also that creeps generally have a basic level of all stats whereas freeps often have none whatsoever in some.....for example an LM has no block at all and so little parry evade its quite funny, and no crit defence ( 0% )
as a p.p.p.s. side note it would be worth pointing out also that silence affects 'light' classes more than others , and so the chain of silence/disarm/knockdown is a particular weakness and maybe worthy of assesment by SSG to reduce from 'I believe' 10s down to 5s , so that you can win or lose by actually having a chance to fight, which is the aim of the GAME anyway ?

[Sciguy]

Frankly, freeps can solo 2-3 creeps with ease. If you are unable to its probably due to lack of skill understanding. Hate to be harsh, but the fact is I can be buffed out 10+ ranked with full audacity and barely survive one burg. Even the squishier classes are not easy.

My suggestions:

1. Bring back the maps! An hour cd is useless to use them at all. March! does not replace the maps. If we must compromise, then give us back good maps with a reduced cd and poor/crude as 60 min. All there is left is a shuffle between rez circles and GV/Grams.
2. Give defilers some in combat rez ability. Four freep classes can do this, one creep class can?? Defilers could trade off dps for this.
3. Nerf burgs. Seriously, way too much
4. Give sprints to creeps. Champs and guards literally run away because their spints have almost no cd. Wargs and revers can run, but spiders should be able to sprint as well
5. Allow defilers to bubble targets like any freep healing class can

Not expecting this, but would be cool if:
1. Spiders could crawl walls/trees
2. spiders could summon pets in combat and have multiple at a time


Agree with LM needing a much better look, just ineffective overall. I understand my above points heavily influence creeps, but there is real frustration on creepside with the bag of tricks freeps have. It exploits the weaknesses creeps have. Many of which are not 140 freeps. There has to be balance and some small group solo ability.