Earning points through gameplay

[Gedachtnis]

Understanding that you don't want to put all the cards on the table yet, I'm wondering if we can get some guidance on the mechanics of earning points through gameplay? While I might wish it was different, I do understand the decision and logistical nightmare of not awarding retroactive points for gameplay already completed.

As a kinleader, I organize things like Deed earning events, Epic Quest nights, etc; for my members. I also want my members to have the best advantage when the the F2P model hits. Knowing that we won't get retroactive points yet having no idea what the gameplay point triggers are has left me in a bit of a lyrch.

Could we please get some idea about what the point triggers might involve? For example if points are earned mostly through non repeatable triggers (deeds, etc.) we can hold off on doing "fluff" runs of this type and focus on other content until launch.

Any help from the Powers that Be would be much appreciated!

[Kentelyoo]

This is THE most important question in the whole thing. I really hope for an answer, but I'm sure they are not ready to answer yet.

[carlosjuero]

Obviously I can't say how it will work in LotRO, but in DDO it works via the Reputation (Favor) system.

At X amount of favor (total) you get Y amount of TP as a reward; This is segregated into Once / Server rewards and Once / Character rewards.

I am thinking, though, that our Rep system is a bit too large and complex (in comparison) for this to work right. I think I remember Patience saying that it wouldn't be tied to deeds, so I am thinking (with no proof mind you) that it might be tied to certain quest line completions (like maybe certain checkpoints in the Epic Quest Line).

More clarification would be good, as would the question as to whether these points will be retroactively rewarded.

[Spydre]

In DDO as you complete quests you earn favor. After a set amount of favor you are mailed a letter saying you now have X DDO points. It's not a large amount and doesn't happen every hour (unless you play that hard) but it can be enough for a few extra items/perks over time.

They might have it staged like some of the deeds in zones. Complete 20 quests in Shire, earn 100 LotRO points.

[Patience]

Make sure you sign up for the beta! We don't want to go into too much detail yet because it may change during beta, at least as far as which systems award points, and the associated values. We know it's not a ton of info yet, but we encourage everyone to sign up for beta to help give feedback, and we'll release more details as they get firmed up.

[Gedachtnis]

More clarification would be good, as would the question as to whether these points will be retroactively rewarded.

Points will not be retroactivelly rewarded, per a Dev post. Though they didn't specify if they could be earned via a mechanic like the Refecting Pools.

[carlosjuero]

Points will not be retroactivelly rewarded, per a Dev post. Though they didn't specify if they could be earned via a mechanic like the Refecting Pools.

Ah, do you have a link? I must have missed that amidst all of the furor.

[Gedachtnis]

Make sure you sign up for the beta! We don't want to go into too much detail yet because it may change during beta, at least as far as which systems award points, and the associated values. We know it's not a ton of info yet, but we encourage everyone to sign up for beta to help give feedback, and we'll release more details as they get firmed up.

I did sign up Patience, though haven't been accepted yet, if you'd like to remedy that situation for me....

[carlosjuero]

I did sign up Patience, though haven't been accepted yet, if you'd like to remedy that situation for me....

Hehe - Me too [P.S. Turbine forgot my birthday last month... I think y'all owe me one :-p]

[Gedachtnis]

Here ya go, carlosjuero

[carlosjuero]

Here ya go, carlosjuero

Thanks much for that

[Sapience]

I did sign up Patience, though haven't been accepted yet, if you'd like to remedy that situation for me....

Hehe - Me too [P.S. Turbine forgot my birthday last month... I think y'all owe me one :-p]

Invites haven't gone out yet. But they will..... Moresoonerish! Perhaps even Incredisoon!

[ashkelleran]

Invites haven't gone out yet. But they will..... Moresoonerish! Perhaps even Incredisoon!

I didn't see those in the History of Time. Must have been my oversight, as those are *clearly* technical terms

EDIT: Reads again. Yep, there they are! I am now more educated.

[carlosjuero]

Invites haven't gone out yet. But they will..... Moresoonerish! Perhaps even Incredisoon!

Dangit! My dictionary is out of date again!! By the way.. did y'all patent Incredisoon? 'cause if you didn't.... ;-)

[jerb78]

so if points are not retroactive, what's the point of play between now and fall 2010?

i should also point out i'm not a hater of the f2p, but it seems silly to play at all if i'm going to miss out on TP's.

[carlosjuero]

so if points are not retroactive, what's the point of play between now and fall 2010?

i should also point out i'm not a hater of the f2p, but it seems silly to play at all if i'm going to miss out on TP's.

Because you will gain 500 bonus points/month of play between now and then?

[Gedachtnis]

Well, you get the bonus points if you just log in once a month between now and launch. No need to do anything.

That's kind of the point, what to do between now and launch. I don't want to take my kin on several play sessions between now and then just to find out we burned up alot of points triggers that we can't redo for the points.

[AdarinOuest]

If points "cannot be applied retroactively" as the dev post suggests then they are not tied to completion of quests, quest chains, or anything else of the like. If they were then it would be easy to assign the points... "Did Thradin complete Vol. 1, Book 1? Yes. 100 points awarded retroactively"

I mean look at rep awards when the rep awards were added for the various starter zone quests. Those all just checked to see if you completed and awarded themselves automatically.

No. The logical conclusion is that this is going to be a new system not tied to anything currently in place in the game. If not then despite being one of the biggest Turbine supporters out there, I will be the first in line handing out pitchforks and marching up to Massachusetts.

If it IS a new system, it is not a big problem BECAUSE they are giving us 500 points a month so we can start getting points now doing what we are doing when many of us would otherwise be grinding out points while the server loads were manageable.

[Gedachtnis]

If points "cannot be applied retroactively" as the dev post suggests then they are not tied to completion of quests, quest chains, or anything else of the like. If they were then it would be easy to assign the points... "Did Thradin complete Vol. 1, Book 1? Yes. 100 points awarded retroactively"

I mean look at rep awards when the rep awards were added for the various starter zone quests. Those all just checked to see if you completed and awarded themselves automatically.

No. The logical conclusion is that this is going to be a new system not tied to anything currently in place in the game. If not then despite being one of the biggest Turbine supporters out there, I will be the first in line handing out pitchforks and marching up to Massachusetts.

If it IS a new system, it is not a big problem BECAUSE they are giving us 500 points a month so we can start getting points now doing what we are doing when many of us would otherwise be grinding out points while the server loads were manageable.

Actually it doesn't suggest that the points "can't" be retroactively added, but rather that a retro add is not "feasible"

It isn't feasible for us to retroactively grant points, unfortunately, though it was definitely considered.

There are several reasons it wouldn't be feasible.

1) Points are tied to the Account not the character. (unlike Rep). EDIT: I just wanted to add that it's likely you will only get the points the first time you complete a trigger event. The computing to sort through every account and every character on that account on launch day would seem to beg for massive crashes/lag and errors with multiple identical triggers being paid by mistake.

2) The number of points that have been potentially earned by Accounts with several capped charaters.

3) The disparity of points from the start that would result between those that play to end game and those that are more leisurely. By offering the bonus point system pre launch, current players will be pretty close in points at launch with minimum effort required.

My GUESS is that they will be rewarded much like DP's as one mechanic amongst others.

[robnkarla]

The hard part might be that it's not feasible because of the sheer number of Points that would be handed out. I'm sure there are many completionists with alts that would get thousands (if not tens of thousands) of Turbine Points for all activity since Beta. The act of granting all of them retro-actively could in effect break the system on day one.

This might be a driving force behind the annual loyalty bonus. This way they can hand out points that have a limit.

I'd also guess, this would be a point of interest to everyone connected to Beta. **Fingers starting to hurt from being crossed so long**

[AdarinOuest]

I read "feasible" as a mechanics issue. I do understand what you are saying though. I mean in the end this is a capitalist society and so if I have three 65's that have completed basically everything and each toon that completes everything through 65 winds up getting 10,000 turbine points through all the deeds, quests, levels, etc. completed it would decimate any chance they have of getting a single penny out of the guy that logs in his toons and winds up with 30k TP on top of the 5k he gets for being a lifer-founder-subscriber on day 1 of F2P.

[Lekkric]

so if points are not retroactive, what's the point of play between now and fall 2010?

i should also point out i'm not a hater of the f2p, but it seems silly to play at all if i'm going to miss out on TP's.

What's wrong with playing because you like to play the game? Isn't that why you've been playing all this time? It should be, because there was no way to turn time in-game into credit for future expansions before, right?

Until this F2P fiasco hits, this is just the same game you've always been playing. Personally I see no problem with the mechanics of the new system, I'll continue to pay my fee and be a VIP member. The only problem I see is if the hordes of new players are WOWfugees and make the game unfun. Note I didn't say LESS fun, because as long as I have fun playing this game I will continue to play it, regardless of the pay structure.

That said, if I DO stop having fun in this game, there are lots of alternatives out there and I'll just have to get my LOTR fix from the books and movies.

[robnkarla]

so if points are not retroactive, what's the point of play between now and fall 2010?

i should also point out i'm not a hater of the f2p, but it seems silly to play at all if i'm going to miss out on TP's.

I had the same initial reaction, but then shrugged it off. I'm sure there will be plenty of content that will garner TPs that I haven't don't yet on my characters. Will I probably do some of the content? Yeah, but I enjoy playing the game and will try not to allow this to impact my playing.

Also, I hope to be able to spend some of that time in Beta, but we'll see.

[Solaniel]

About getting points retroactively: comparing with DDO, you get TP awards only ONCE for achieving a certain level of rep (which works differently than in LOTRO). That being said, i really wonder why there's no talk about having retroactive points tied to completing the epic books THE FIRST TIME PER ACCOUNT. Wouldn't that take out the altaholic bias? I think it would, and we'd be somewhat happy that we'd be getting something for what is already done. Most of the current playerbase would get something, but somewaht with 9 characters wouldn't get more points than one with only one toon. I think, IMHO, that's a fair tradeoff.

Now concerning the change in community, i'm very sad to say that i might have to close some chat channels. ME is a very specific environment that always was a filter in itself. Furthermore, the traditional monthly subscription models kept the modestly interested people at bay. We'll have to wait and see what happens to LOTRO's trademark maturity level when F2P hits.

Now, will i continue to play? As long as there isn't a change in THE GAME ITSELF, which i love as it is now with its strong points AND flaws, i most definitely will. Some adjustments will be required. Remember people, the only constance in life is change.

[jerb78]

Because you will gain 500 bonus points/month of play between now and then?

i guess i missed that somewhere in the volumes of forum posts that i've been reading! thanks for the info.

i was planning on paying and playing for a long time before this announcement was made and i still plan to. i don't think the f2b is a bad idea and i'm glad that there will hopefully be a population increase because of it, even if they are ****** WoW babies.