Please tell me this isnt true :(

[Lothirieth]

My guardian mounted (heavy steed) has plenty aggro, fellowship benefits (+armour etc), and can take one hell of a beating toe to toe with groups of enemies, as can his mount. Not raid sized mobs with all the trimmings, but landscape mobs yes, bring 'em on.

This doesn't mesh with what a guard in my raid alliance told me, nor Lotro wiki's list of guardian mounted skills. I'm not seeing any skills to keep aggro. I'm seeing some force target to ride beside/in front of you, which is something my LM has too (though it is possible lotro wiki does not list them all.) And I am talking about harder mobs with all the trimmings, not your normal landscape mobs. And how exactly is your heavy horse going to be that much sturdier than anyone else's heavy horse? They're not *that* different.

A lot of what you are saying is a problem with how people have built their mounts, not how MC is designed. Most players I've seen are running around on light steeds with few/no points put into anything but damage skills and movement skills, the basic relics- all designed around damage- and complain about how they can't do x, y or z.

Well, I think that's because damage is about all any class can do well. That's certainly true of LM. I find very little difference between light and medium steed (medium is a bit more sturdy ofc, but I stick with light in order to have the chance to dismount mobs, very helpful when I have to "tank" Bugud. :P) but I've not gotten to try heavy steed due to Turbine forcing us to pay up if we want to try all three steeds.. I refuse. :P I've traited enough into the three lines though. I'll never get all the classes high enough to fully experience MC on them (let alone experience at all), but from all the talk, our classes seem quite similar on horseback. They've lost their individual feel and they're not that versatile.

If Turbine added in MC content that forced players to have tanks, cc, heals as well as damage, players would start to trait things other than light steed/red line and we might see more variety and class roles being used. The content right now doesn't require anything more than damage, damage and more damage.

See, I don't think they could offer any content different from damage, damage, damage with the way they have currently built our classes on mounts. I'm asserting that to give us content that required tanking, cc, heals, that that would be a mess as we don't have the proper skill sets for this.

I would also <snip> reduce the amount of damage ranged attacks do, for players and NPCs. Being able to damage something at a distance without much risk should not be significantly more effective than the melee attacks of classes forced to have to engage in melee (and consequently get hit much harder) to fight.

No kidding on reducing ranged damage from NPCs. Either that or significantly increase our mounts' morale. I also agree that it shouldn't be dangerous for melee classes to move in and do damage as well. Really, it's quite unfair that my LM can solo Bugud just because she can keep distance from everything and stance dance to regain health and power.

[Erlessa]

I personally hope it's true. I wouldn't want it anywhere else than in Rohan, perhaps other landscapes, OK, but no instances, skirms, no group content, NO DEV TIME.

[Damojo]

This doesn't mesh with what a guard in my raid alliance told me, nor Lotro wiki's list of guardian mounted skills. I'm not seeing any skills to keep aggro. I'm seeing some force target to ride beside/in front of you, which is something my LM has too (though it is possible lotro wiki does not list them all.) And I am talking about harder mobs with all the trimmings, not your normal landscape mobs. And how exactly is your heavy horse going to be that much sturdier than anyone else's heavy horse? They're not *that* different.

My level 50 light steed has 2100 endurance, 4900 power, 950 armour and 490 strength. My level 23 heavy steed has 2800 endurance, 2900 power, 1800 armour and 695 strength. At level 23 it's stats are significantly beyond the light steed, which has finished development, in every respect other than power. And that is without any bridle relics or other boosts, the light steed has bridle relics and a 2nd age bridle, and I have deliberately boosted its armour. If this trend continues for another 27 levels, it will be very much sturdier than the light steed. How can you say they are not that different?

My guard has two ride-beside skills, a 20% threat bonus from stances, and gives a 500 armour boost to himself and all fellowship members on demand. He is only level 79 so has more to come. Just like a tank should, the mechanics are different, but he can make enemies concentrate their attention on him, and use his armour to protect the fellowship, which is what a tank does, is it not? It's mounted read mobile combat, I didn't expect his mechanic to be to stand still on horseback, tap his shield and shout.

When there are anything but landscape mobs to fight against in mounted combat, we can swap experiences. At the moment that is all anyone has, warbands to me are just high morale landscape mobs, they don't really fight any differently.

[Punkinchunkin]

Is the store making profit? I have no idea, but I hope so. Is Turbine as a whole making money, again I don't know, and frankly it's none of my business, but again I hope so. Because I want to be logging into Gladden next year, and the year after. And if Turbine don't produce the numbers, I won't be. That means a lot more to me than whether I can display a few more stuffed bears in my home.

Turbine making money is ALL of our business. We supply the income. I pay and play for this game for my enjoyment and I EXPECT something back, not just cheezy store items. WB/Turbines current practices make me NOT want to spend money or invest in their product. If every move and idea is being floated at board meetings with the hook of "how much can we make?" Then Turbine has it all wrong.

Take care of your customers and they in turn will take care of your bottom line, screw your costumers and nobody will be left to pay your bills. The sooner Warner Bro$ figures that out the better.

[PerinStone]

My level 50 light steed has 2100 endurance, 4900 power, 950 armour and 490 strength. My level 23 heavy steed has 2800 endurance, 2900 power, 1800 armour and 695 strength.

Are you talking about your bridle levels? You have 1 horse to level. You can switch back and forth between light and medium, but the level will always be the same.

[MullaramSullaram]

I'm happy for there not to be any mounted combat instances.

I haven't really enjoyed it and i don't know many tanks who have. For one we don't have any way to keep aggro and it takes to long to kill even weaker mobs.

I have seen ranged DPS classes one shot mobs and thought how wonderful mounted combat must be for them.

[Rothan117]

I was singularly unimpressed with mounted combat while participating in the beta rounds. Since Rohan went live I have simply not been motivated to push leveling my warden or my alts, all due to mounted combat. Made all of one level on my warden just working on the Epic without even getting my steed and my hunter is 78 but still does not have a steed as I had not done Great River with him and made levels completing that zone.

I did the beta rounds on my warden and found that for a tank mounted combat was just boring and not the least bit fun for me. Others may find it fun on a warden but I did not and for me that is what counts. My main is my warden and as a result my time in game has declined by at least 80% since Rohan went live, mostly I play my minstrel who is leveling through Moria at the moment and does not have to deal with mounted combat.

[Rowan]

OP, it's not true.

What I said is that we have no immediate plans for a mounted combat instance. I don't like to make promises I can't keep, or raise false hopes. Mounted combat instances are something we have talked about a great deal (there are challenges building the content that we'll need to work through first).

We definitely have plans to develop mounted combat as a system. There are already changes in the works in regard to trait trees and smoothing some of the combat mechanics. The list of potential work is very long - the same lead designer has been on mounted combat since it kicked off in 2011, and he is fully dedicated to building on the foundation we have now.

[Vilda]

First of all, resolve these *bad* lags, sometimes it is almost unplayable...

[Rowan]

First of all, resolve these *bad* lags, sometimes it is almost unplayable...

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9, so hopefully you'll see improvement on Monday!

[Norwrei]

OP, it's not true.

What I said is that we have no immediate plans for a mounted combat instance. I don't like to make promises I can't keep, or raise false hopes. Mounted combat instances are something we have talked about a great deal (there are challenges building the content that we'll need to work through first).

We definitely have plans to develop mounted combat as a system. There are already changes in the works in regard to trait trees and smoothing some of the combat mechanics. The list of potential work is very long - the same lead designer has been on mounted combat since it kicked off in 2011, and he is fully dedicated to building on the foundation we have now.

Sounds great but PLEASE do not change the mechanics in a way where there are forced roles, such as a Minstrel who wants to dps only finds herself on the healing side of things. Thanks. :-)

[Thurinor_EU]

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9, so hopefully you'll see improvement on Monday!

Is that a release date?

[Thoroval]

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9, so hopefully you'll see improvement on Monday!

I certainly hope so. When I've experienced mounted combat as I believe Turbine intended, it was really quite compelling. However, the stop-start-stop-start/inability to steer/suddenly somewhere I wasn't just a second ago lag-fest that I often endure shoots that experience all to oblivion. Makes it to where I don't even want to look at my war-steed much less ride it.

Is that a release date?

I believe they must release U9 by Monday or else the Yule Festival will have to be delayed (or pulled and go with last year's festival, which wouldn't exactly upset me).

[Rawlor]

Is that a release date?

Apparently so

I guess we'll probably get an official update later today, or by mid tomorrow at the latest.

Makes sense to release on Monday rather than the week of Christmas

[Crell_1]

Is that a release date?

Yes.

Additionally, its the same date we could have worked out from Celestrata's comments yesterday about the number of dev diaries =)

[furtim]

OP, it's not true.

What I said is that we have no immediate plans for a mounted combat instance. I don't like to make promises I can't keep, or raise false hopes.

It's like a fundamental law of community relations. No statement is so well crafted that the forums can't find some way to extrapolate the worst possible scenario from it.

[Hudson7]

OP, it's not true.

What I said is that we have no immediate plans for a mounted combat instance. I don't like to make promises I can't keep, or raise false hopes. Mounted combat instances are something we have talked about a great deal (there are challenges building the content that we'll need to work through first).

We definitely have plans to develop mounted combat as a system. There are already changes in the works in regard to trait trees and smoothing some of the combat mechanics. The list of potential work is very long - the same lead designer has been on mounted combat since it kicked off in 2011, and he is fully dedicated to building on the foundation we have now.

I appreciate you clarifying your statement - although that really doesn't answer the question any further. You said during that interview that you have long term detailed plans, so are Mounted Combat Instances part of those plans? You said in the interview they are not, so which part of my post are you disagreeing with? And by my post, I mean my my post that started this whole discussion.

I'm more then happy to take this off-line, but I'm just trying to understand what you're saying and what you're disagreeing with.

Thanks!

[Hudson7]

It's like a fundamental law of community relations. No statement is so well crafted that the forums can't find some way to extrapolate the worst possible scenario from it.

Sadly it was a simple question that he's now muddied the water with. The question that started my post was "will there be mounted combat instances?" Rowan said there are no plans at this time. He also states in that same interview that they have long term detailed plans for the game. Yes I'll admit I'm taking a potentially pessimistic view of things, but the foundation of those statements are straight from the mouth of Turbine.

[john_anthony]

Sounds great but PLEASE do not change the mechanics in a way where there are forced roles, such as a Minstrel who wants to dps only finds herself on the healing side of things. Thanks. :-)

this is precisely why mounted combat is unsuited for -- and will NEVER be suited for -- group instance content. the people who like mounted combat like it because every class is a DPS class. but you cannot design interesting, challenging, or enjoyable group content around every class being a DPS class.

these are mutually exclusive things. you CANNOT build mounted combat into group instance combat without fundamentally reworking mounted combat such that the people who enjoy it (like the person above) will no longer enjoy it, by creating a necessity for people actually playing different class roles rather than everyone being a DPSer. meanwhile, adding a marginal amount of additional group utility to mounted combat will still not change the minds of those who currently find it a tedious, pew-pew-in-a-circle activity. so it's the worst of all worlds -- former mounted combat fans would get turned off by the changes and former mounted combat opponents would remain opposed.

this is why it makes far more sense for mounted combat to remain as a landscape-only feature, rather than crowding out the already sparse realm of group content. the most i can reasonably see in terms of group mounted combat is a single skirmish down the line. otherwise, it is fundamentally unsuited for group content.

so long as class roles are irrelevant and DPS is all that matters (which is what mounted combat's biggest fans see as the biggest plus of the system, while players interested in group content consider it the biggest negative), mounted combat cannot translate to group content. full stop. so, just let it remain a mini-game rather than ruining it for all players by trying to turn it into a weird hybrid it was never designed for and which would lack appeal to all different playstyles.

[cshamblin]

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9, so hopefully you'll see improvement on Monday!

I like the sound of Monday.

[Frisco]

I appreciate you clarifying your statement - although that really doesn't answer the question any further. You said during that interview that you have long term detailed plans, so are Mounted Combat Instances part of those plans? You said in the interview they are not, so which part of my post are you disagreeing with? And by my post, I mean my my post that started this whole discussion.

I'm more then happy to take this off-line, but I'm just trying to understand what you're saying and what you're disagreeing with.

Thanks!

It does answer the question. Very thoroughly. The OP wanted to know whether it was true that there was zero plan to evolve mounted combat any further, and he answered. Just because the OP based his assumption off of your blog doesn't mean you automatically get to dictate the thread.

If you're expecting a clear answer to "Will there be mounted combat instances?" prepare to hold your breath for a long time. Even if they were planning them down the line, it will take huge changes to the mechanic, and they may ultimately find out that it's not worth it if they have to make MC un-fun in order to make the instances work.

Rowan's post was very clear to me. They are working out kinks in MC currently, polishing it up. Maybe working on some balancing, new skills, etc. MC instances are an idea they're almost certainly considering, but since there is no current plan to develop them (plenty of other MC issues keeping them busy), he's not going to say "Yes, there will be MC instances in the future."

[Laire]

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9, so hopefully you'll see improvement on Monday!

Woot! Monday! I was right Monday cannot come quick enough.

[Bhoris_they_spider]

We resolved a couple fairly serious server bugs with Update 9

I wonder how many more will get introduced though?......

[Hudson7]

It does answer the question. Very thoroughly. The OP wanted to know whether it was true that there was zero plan to evolve mounted combat any further, and he answered. Just because the OP based his assumption off of your blog doesn't mean you automatically get to dictate the thread.

If you're expecting a clear answer to "Will there be mounted combat instances?" prepare to hold your breath for a long time. Even if they were planning them down the line, it will take huge changes to the mechanic, and they may ultimately find out that it's not worth it if they have to make MC un-fun in order to make the instances work.

Rowan's post was very clear to me. They are working out kinks in MC currently, polishing it up. Maybe working on some balancing, new skills, etc. MC instances are an idea they're almost certainly considering, but since there is no current plan to develop them (plenty of other MC issues keeping them busy), so he's not going to say "Yes, there will be MC instances in the future."

We can agree to disagree on the concept of thorough, it at least was a response to the OP, I agree. I saw some PR speak on the issue, and all the threads on the forums on this same line have been un-answered. Hopefully Update 9 which we'll see on Monday will be the first step.

[furtim]

It does answer the question. Very thoroughly. The OP wanted to know whether it was true that there was zero plan to evolve mounted combat any further, and he answered. Just because the OP based his assumption off of your blog doesn't mean you automatically get to dictate the thread.

Folks like Hudson are exactly the kind of person I was referring to. Developers almost never talk about what they're doing more than one big patch in advance, and Turbine especially has always held to this rule. Even with the second half of the Moria revamp, which we knew they were actively working on since they announced the first half, they didn't announce any specifics -- not even timing -- until it went on Bullroarer.

As frustrating as it is for us players when the devs refuse to make promises, it's even more frustrating when they make promises that they end up not keeping, so honestly I don't mind the relative silence. And if you really think this is worse, ask the PvMP folks who are still waiting for the new map that was hinted at a billion years ago what they think about that.