My thoughts on LOTRO's Player Council

[Graycient]

Hey Guys

Article Link: http://www.lotro.com/en/game/article...player-council


I'd like to say I'm rather happy Turbine has decided to do this. I, however, do think some things are a bit, well, strange... Let me explain to you what those things are and WHY I believe they should be given more thought, or certain changes.

The overall idea though, Good idea guys!

Question, if Sapience (or whoever would be so kind to answer). When you say "LOTRO Team", actual developers included? Or representatives? Game Masters?

Participate in a face to face meeting with the LOTRO Team and Turbine staff if asked. Location to be decided by Turbine. (Travel expenses to be provided by Turbine.)

I get why it looks like a good idea, but here's why I don't think this is: Turbine needs to be pouring their money into the actual materials. Use a webcam system. It's as close as you can get WHILE saving money. I don't see a reason to spend extra money. Especially when you say "The LOTRO Player Council will consist of not less than 30 and not more than 50 players at any point during the term." Holy cow... Maybe a little too big? Especially if you're paying travel fees.

Applicants may be from any geographic region officially supported by The Lord of the Rings Online.

If they're still able to play LOTRO, I don't see why. Unless of course considering the above quote.

Council members serve for the stated calendar year. The 2013 Player Council will serve for all of 2013, etc.

Let's say something happens to the player. Illness/Death. Is there some kind of replacement part that allows someone to join in for the part of the year to replace the person?

Members of the press or those acting in a journalistic/editorial capacity are not eligible to participate on the council.

Rather than just making them sign something saying they can't release certain information?





All in all, this sounds interesting.

Best of luck finding your council members

[IngeniousMrToad]

As I stated in another post, I believe the player council will be functionally cosmetic, regardless of the resources they say they may put into implementing it. I don't for one moment believe that they will listen to anything anyone says unless what they have to say is in alignment with whatever it is they intend to do anyway. It's kind of like going into a team meeting with an agenda where you're the ultimate decision maker. You listen to everyone just so you can say you listened to them. You stay very polite, smile a lot, watch the clock, and end up doing what you knew you were going to do before the meeting was even scheduled.

Even if I'm wrong, the whole thing is meaningless, to me anyway. It's my perspective that Turbine has corrupted this game to the core and that there is nothing they will do to make it even remotely like the game I used to love. I'm not blind to the fact that Turbine essentially ridicules players that share my sentiment; do you think they'd actually listen to someone like me on their council? I don't, and that's why I think the whole thing is a sham.

It's my opinion that the council will only serve to feed the collective egos of those who are driving the game in the direction it is already going. Those who voice opinions that don't align with that direction will be politely nodded to and smiled at, and then dismissed from further thought...(if you think like us, we'll love ya!) I have serious doubts they will listen to any honest criticism.

Before all the bashers unleash on me, please understand that I am not criticizing you for liking the game as it is. Simply put, I don't, you do, you obviously win. I know I'm free to leave the game at any time, and I have for the most part already. I do however, wish those who love the game for everything it is, and the impending debacle that it has yet to become, all the best with this council. (Although I honestly wouldn't trust the drivers of the bus to protect your best interests). Seriously, I hope it works for you guys so that you can avoid what it is players like myself (and my wife who I met in LOTRO) have had to stomach over the last couple of years -seeing something fun and worthwhile rot away right in front of you.

And no, I'm not quitting - so you can't have my stuff...

[Fredelas]

There's already an "official discussion" thread about the Player Council. Your feedback might be seen (and questions answered) by the right people there.

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...Player-Council!

[Graycient]

There's already an "official discussion" thread about the Player Council. Your feedback might be seen (and questions answered) by the right people there.

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...Player-Council!

Oh... Must've missed that. Thanks!

[Edrogar]

As I stated in another post, I believe the player council will be functionally cosmetic, regardless of the resources they say they may put into implementing it.

I agree, i've played a few games that have implemented a similar "council" and so far i've not found one that actually makes a single bit of difference, i was even in one of these programs myself.

In SWG i was a Senator for a while and it didn't matter what we said SOE always did the opposite, it got to the point that we knew this and used it to get our way.

In Eve they have the CSM, absolute waste of space, self motivated bunch of elitists much? Let's just say half the CSM are goons and we all know whats on the goon agenda.

I think it's a nice gesture and looks good on paper, but in reality all we will have is 30 to 50 players with a fancy title twiddling their thumbs and bickering on the forum.

[ifreborn1]

Maybe the council is a troll relocation program? Or a troll rehabilitation center?

[BangoTwinkletoes]

In Eve they have the CSM, absolute waste of space, self motivated bunch of elitists much? Let's just say half the CSM are goons and we all know whats on the goon agenda.

Lol yes indeed! The CSM is the exemplar of why a player council should be avoided. Nothing good will come of it. Rather I'd like Turbine to get off their backsides and publish their own roadmaps for the game.

I want to see innovative ideas for the future of lotro, not some means of delegating thought leadership to a bunch of self-centered egotists which i guarantee will degenerate into raiders vs solo'ers.

No thanks.

Edit - and before anyone mentions that it was the CSM that stopped CCP from going any further with the Incarna release and 'walking in stations' content or pay-to-win micro transactions, it wasn't. It was the huge number of players unsubbing that turned CCP back from the brink and instead focusing on the PVP aspects. Money talks in LOTRO even more than with EVE and in Turbine's view what's good for the Store is good for the game. Perhaps the role of the player council will be to review and agree on the week's sale offers for the store. Would not surprise me.

[maxjenius]

Lol yes indeed! The CSM is the exemplar of why a player council should be avoided. Nothing good will come of it.

It's just a silly marketing ploy. Turbine will ignore anything coming from it which does not mesh with company goals.

And those who most desire to be part of it are by definition least suited to be part of it.

[Edrogar]

Edit - and before anyone mentions that it was the CSM that stopped CCP from going any further with the Incarna release and 'walking in stations' content or pay-to-win micro transactions, it wasn't. It was the huge number of players unsubbing that turned CCP back from the brink and instead focusing on the PVP aspects. Money talks in LOTRO even more than with EVE and in Turbine's view what's good for the Store is good for the game. Perhaps the role of the player council will be to review and agree on the week's sale offers for the store. Would not surprise me.

Spot on. It wasn't the CSM that changed their minds, it was the prospect of losing a lot of money that caused CCP to back down, TheMitani "Goon Emperor" Mittens used the fact that at same time as they backed down he had visited them in Iceland to try to claim the kudos for getting them to back down.

A player coundcil is nothing but politics, money talks is the old saying, and it's the only thing that will make Turbine take notice, the only problem is getting the balance between withholding enough of our money long enough for change and withholding too much of our money too long and forcing the game to shut down.

[Damojo]

It's just a silly marketing ploy. Turbine will ignore anything coming from it which does not mesh with company goals.

And those who most desire to be part of it are by definition least suited to be part of it.

I agree, sort of. I wouldn't see its role as being open or free-rein. Rather than "What do the council think of changing Legendaries" I would imagine the question would be "We're changing Legendaries, method (a) or (b)?". Which of course can still give it a meaningful role, but not maybe as far-reaching as some envisage. In short, I don't envisage a design by committee, more of a sounding board. But of course that's speculation on my part.

As to being "suited" I'm glad there's an activity gate, and an infraction one. Someone who has left, walked away, given up, or otherwise doesn't play can't really contribute much beyond "I don't play because... " and they're done. And anyone who can't even take part in an open forum without being heavily infracted or banned is just going to be a liability when it comes to discussing issues which I imagine will often be polarising.

[maxjenius]

I agree, sort of. I wouldn't see its role as being open or free-rein. Rather than "What do the council think of changing Legendaries" I would imagine the question would be "We're changing Legendaries, method (a) or (b)?". Which of course can still give it a meaningful role, but not maybe as far-reaching as some envisage. In short, I don't envisage a design by committee, more of a sounding board. But of course that's speculation on my part.

If it's "Do you like A or B?" they could simply post a poll on the forums. Unless they want to lock down the info via an NDA.

As to being "suited" I'm glad there's an activity gate, and an infraction one. Someone who has left, walked away, given up, or otherwise doesn't play can't really contribute much beyond "I don't play because... " and they're done. And anyone who can't even take part in an open forum without being heavily infracted or banned is just going to be a liability when it comes to discussing issues which I imagine will often be polarising.

It's still the case that those who want to be part of it are least suited to be part of it. I wouldn't be on it unless they paid me (for the same reason I don't beta test: if I'm providing a service, I expect to be paid). Those who are slobbering all over themselves to be on it are going to be yes-men, name-droppers, egomaniacs, wannabe saboteurs, none of which are going to be of any use whatsoever.

[Damojo]

For the NDA, I think exactly that, especially as they have indicated signing one is mandatory.
And yes, I agree, there will be folk who genuinely want to do the best job they can, however others won't be ideal, and for some of the reasons you list. It will be up to Turbine to shuffle seats in that case, so that they are getting the input they want.

[maxjenius]

And yes, I agree, there will be folk who genuinely want to do the best job they can, however others won't be ideal, and for some of the reasons you list. It will be up to Turbine to shuffle seats in that case, so that they are getting the input they want.

I am way too cynical to think it will be of any value whatsoever.

[Damojo]

I'll keep an open mind for now. Any negatives from the process will probably become evident fairly quickly; positives will take longer to filter through.

[Sapience]

As noted in the article you linked to, there is an official discussion thread for this topic. Please use it. http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...Player-Council!