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  1. #1
    DrOctothorpe is offline The Lord of the Rings Online Team
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    The Ruined City - Feedback

    Hey all, the Ruined City instance went up with yesterday's update. We'd love to hear some feedback! Difficulty, experience, all the usual.

  2. #2
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    Ran this this evening - will add the feedback to this thread tomorrow. (Just to let you know that people are testing and that feedback is coming!)
    - Taravan, R12 Captain - Tirian, Tanking Guardian - Telperon, Completionist LM -
    - Afranius, R9 WL - Tolobain, R7 Weaver - Vargan, R6 Stalker -

    Ex-Leader of Lost Realm of Imladris - Evernight - Co-Founder of Beauty and the Beasts

  3. #3
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    I just completed it lvl 50 t2 with my lvl 100 guard solo, just to make a quick check.

    Dmg output of mob group is very high for lvl 50 tier 2. (And maybe lvl 100...)
    In comparison a Seat of the Great Goblin lvl 50 t2 Archer does half the damage compared to a normal ranged unit in The Ruined City. (~175 vs 350 on my guard)
    And the number of enemies per group is also higher in The Ruined City, ergo even more dmg per pull.

    Bugs:

    I saw a fell-spirit spawned in a stone shortly behind the first group after the first boss.

    The 2nd troll boss kicks orc on top of the siege towers wheels, where they exploit.

    There is also a spawnpoint near the siege tower where some orcs have pathfinding issues and are in exploit if you are not near them.

    The first boss drops yellow rdm loot and has no treasure chest. Not sure if that's wai.

    Troll boss chest had a lvl 50 armor with no stats and no slots. Only armorrating and setbonus.


    Suggestions:

    I'd like to see teleports placed after boss 1 and 2, so people don't have to run all the way to the end everytime something went wrong.
    This would improve the fluidity of gameplay. Nobody really like the waiting in such cases.

    Please reward only fused relics and not individual relics. They only clutter the inventory.

    I don't think rewarding lvl 50 clubs with tactical stats is a good idea instead of legendary items. But i'm not sure, maybe there is a reason for that. (Shadow of Angmar mode?)


    <3

    I like the overall pace of the space.
    There are no invisible barriers, and you can pull multiple groups if you are brave/foolish enough.
    Crowd control classes have something to do, if the group wants to utilise cc.
    The number of enemies during fights is higher compared to other 3 man instances. This can change how players use their class.

    Thats all for now. I hope I can test again on level with 2 more players.

  4. #4
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    Things I have noticed in T1, build 3 :

    - First boss is still not reseting correctly if you fail it. Well he his, but you have some more ads waiting for you that respawn every time you kill them in addition to those that are tied to the encounter.
    - First boss has no chest after being defeated
    - There are multiple places were ads (or even the troll) enter anti-exploit mode in the second encounter. Basically anywhere the ground looks like piles of trash (not sure how to say it) if a mob enter it, it gets stuck there.
    Gabrediel, Original Challenger of Sarouman | Gabramir, Original Challenger of Gothmog

    Unquale - Sirannon [FR]

  5. #5
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    I tried this instance in two different ways - firstly T2, and then T1. The group was made up of my guardian tanking, a LM dpsing, and a rk healing. I made some notes as I went along - some of them are rather self explanatory, but I'll give more detail for the bosses.

    Tier 2

    The trash pulls for this were relatively easy - there were no problems on the first pull, and while I nearly missed the second wave of adds on the second pull, we managed to get through that fine too. The third pull was fine too, although those bleeds were stacking up on our healer.

    Boss 1: Jukotor - we tried this many times, and failed each time. After some initial problems grabbing aggro (the mobs are very well spread out, and it's tricky to grab more than 3 at once with challenge, and so I needed to chase down a couple of the other ones), we managed to get the mobs under control, but each time we were destroyed by Jukotor's Fell Feint attack. This attack easily 1 shotted the RK (it did 23.6k common damage - RK's mits were 9k phys mit, and 8k tact mit), and the LM (21.2k, mits 12k PM, and 20k TM - plus 48.9% crit def).

    In order to try and mitigate this big hit (which appears to be a random attack - I definitely had boss aggro when these hits were done, and he clearly runs away to do the attack), we tried using shield wall on the rk, but that took off approx. 3/4 of my health (couldn't find exact attack in combat log - but my stats are 60% Tact and Phys mit, and 66.7% crit def, with 29k morale), and was swiftly followed by the archers (who proved difficult to aggro, as they stayed at range), killing the rk after I briefly removed Shield Wall to heal up.

    The Shield Wall tactic was the most successful one that we tried, but each time Fell Feint managed to destroy us, either wiping out the RK or the LM (I think the boss only used the attack on me directly once). If there was a way to avoid this special attack (kiting with an eye for a certain duration? Although when we tried kiting, he kept going until he had landed the blow), then this boss would remain tricky (the adds hit quite hard, and the boss has an additional special attack with a 6k per 2 seconds bleed - although it might be greater on T2, as we only got that far on T1), but at the moment I can't really see a way past that big hit - unless it requires maxing out mits further, although I still think light classes would struggle.

    Tier 1

    After failing to get past Jukotor, we weren't ready to give up just yet, so we thought we'd give T1 a go, so we could understand the difference in difficulty between the two, and to get a grip of the mechanics.

    The trash mobs on T1 (without exception, throughout the instance) were all very easy, and as expected died very quickly.

    Boss 1: Jukotor - on our second attempt at this, I saw that the adds spawn at intervals (couldn't tell if it was morale based, or time based), which were tricky to grab hold of, but not impossible - but as they didn't do much damage, it wasn't too much of an issue.

    As for Jukotor himself, his morale was greatly reduced, and Fell Feint did far less damage (approximately 6k on the RK and LM), which is probably what I'd expect from T1, although it could be beefed up slightly without too much concern. We killed him pretty quickly and without too much worry - this first phase of the instance had good pacing, in my view, for a T1 instance.

    Boss 2: Thrug - this fight on T1 (we didn't get as far as T2, so I can't measure it up against that) was rather boring. It took an exceptionally long time to kill the boss (reminded me of Dargnakh T1...), although afterwards I realised that it probably would have made more sense to tank it in red spec, as the boss didn't do very much damage (and as such, the rk could also have dpsed, while the LM could have used Water lore to keep us alive). For a while, orc waves kept coming in, but these did no damage whatsoever, and the troll tended to deal with them before we needed to bother.

    Quite often, these orc adds would get stuck and would trigger anti-exploit mode, and while we could still kill the troll during these points, it meant that after the instance was completed we were stuck in combat and could not loot the chest. It also meant that, when the RK accidentally activated the final boss early, we found that when running back the troll had reset. Luckily we were able to get round this through the gaps in the side of the gates, pulling one or two orcs as we went past, but not triggering the boss.

    It felt on this boss that he had a large morale pool simply to make the fight more substantial - but to be honest, I think people are unlikely to run this instance on T1 with the frequency of something like Sambrog or School/Library when this fight takes so very long. If it was a fight of attrition, I could understand it, as we'd be desperately attempting to survive while the hits got bigger and bigger (perhaps the troll could get a rage effect?), but currently at T1, this fight isn't entertaining in the slightest.

    Also, a side issue, when the boss killed the orcs, it came up in the chat log as 'The Thrug defeated the...' rather than 'Thrug defeated the...'

    Boss 3: Limthuil - this boss was easy enough, though the fight was more interesting that the previous boss. The adds were easy enough to deal with (and their debuffs didn't seem to have much effect, though they disappeared too quickly for me to see what they were, but I assume this will have more of an effect on T2, and especially on HM when you can't kill the spirits).

    The only thing that was challenging about this boss was the attack 'Great Slash', which one shotted the LM, for 26k damage, although I think that this was due to me momentarily losing aggro (although I wasn't sure if it was a random attack or not, though it never happened again in the fight). I can see this fight being fun at T2, particularly on challenge mode with the need to manage the adds, although I can't speak to how difficult it was on T2 as we never got that far.

    General comments

    Overall, I found it an enjoyable instance, if a bit long. For a 3 man, I felt the troll fight lasted far too long, and the distance to return to the final boss from the start is pretty substantial - additional doorways, ala Dargnakh's Rage, would be welcome here, as others have suggested. Without these things, this instance would become a bit of a slog, particularly compared to some other 3 mans which are effectively the 'quick fix' of grouping, although I wouldn't object to the length if there was some degree of challenge throughout. This is likely to be present on T2, but T1 is too easy to be so long.

    Regarding difficulty, I think that on T2 the mobs were hitting about the right damage, although I think I'd scale down the attack of the first boss a tad, or make it avoidable in some fashion (whether by kiting, potting, CCing, etc.), otherwise it made this fight undoable for my group. It might be the case that you'd need heavily armoured classes to do this (champ, cappy, guard setup), but I'm sure your aim is to make this fight possible with any classes that follow the tank-dps-heal formula, and therefore some concessions might need to be made for lighter classes.

    As for T1 damage, its rather negligible, especially if you bring a healer along, and I could happily see this increased a bit, although I'm aware that the intention of T1 is to be pretty easy, so I won't take issue with that too much.

    Regarding loot, it was pretty poor fare. On T1, the marks and meds rewards that we got for each boss were as follows:
    Jukotor - 44 marks, 7 meds
    Thrug - 73 marks, 11 meds
    Limthuil - 88 marks, 18 meds

    Compared to something like Sambrog, or even one side quest in the Big Battles 3 man, this is pretty poor fare. Glittering Caves, for instance, on the first side quest, gives 469 marks and 114 meds just for completing that first side quest, which can be done in 5 minutes. Getting approx. 200 marks and 36 meds for an instance which lasts half an hour in comparison to Glittering Caves, or even in comparison to Sambrog (not got the figures for those rewards at my fingertips) suggests that this instance isn't worth doing for the rewards.

    Additionally, when we reached the final boss, there was a purple necklace (standard poor fare, but then as its t1, I didn't expect anything great), but there's also one relic and bounty to share between the group. It should be 1 bounty and 1 relic EACH, and the relic should be a fused deep relic (at the very least) - with the arrival of imbuement, people aren't going to be stockpiling the low level relics that you'd usually get from these instances - instead, they might be after the higher tier ones (T7 at the lowest) to build up the perfect relics for their imbued LI. Providing 1 mediocre relic between 3 people isn't going to make this a rewarding instance to run.

    Essentially, while T1 should not provide any particularly sparkly items (blue or gold jewellery, star lit crystals, scrolls of empowerment etc.) it should provide enough marks and medallions and relics to make it feel worthwhile - there's nothing worse that getting to the end of a long instance (particularly after that troll fight), and realising how little you've actually gained from it. On T1, I'd suggest 200 marks, 40 meds per fight, to make this feel worthwhile.

    Overall, the instance was enjoyable, and I can see that T2 will definitely be good fun, and a challenge - but for the moment I couldn't see a way past the first boss. T1 is too easy and too long, although that's mainly due to the troll boss, and the rewards at the end don't really feel worthwhile - but I think the instance is certainly promising, and I liked the storyline within it too.
    - Taravan, R12 Captain - Tirian, Tanking Guardian - Telperon, Completionist LM -
    - Afranius, R9 WL - Tolobain, R7 Weaver - Vargan, R6 Stalker -

    Ex-Leader of Lost Realm of Imladris - Evernight - Co-Founder of Beauty and the Beasts

  6. #6
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    Some screenshots:

    dropped at lvl 50. Hope it's removed from the loottable lvl 51+. Edit: Oh, it is actually a sword. Well... why not?!


    This is where some incoming waves got stuck:


    Orc thrown on top of a wheel:
    Last edited by Schinderhannes; Apr 16 2015 at 03:24 PM.

  7. #7
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    The only thing that was challenging about this boss was the attack 'Great Slash', which one shotted the LM, for 26k damage

    If this is true and you didn't lose aggro, this has to change. Big one shot attack are boring. Find something else to make the instance harder please

  8. #8
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    If the toll remains beefy and keeps his high morale at t2, I think giving a few more (dangerous) moves could make him a bit more interesting during the long fight.
    Something like this:


    Tanks love to outmaneuver trolls.
    Would be cool if slow attacks like these would add ground indicator effects so players know what to do without some trial and error.
    Last edited by Schinderhannes; Apr 16 2015 at 11:59 AM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gardhik View Post
    The only thing that was challenging about this boss was the attack 'Great Slash', which one shotted the LM, for 26k damage

    If this is true and you didn't lose aggro, this has to change. Big one shot attack are boring. Find something else to make the instance harder please
    Well, in build 1, he hit me for 8k generally, 12k occasionally.. it was random aggro.
    This 8k is 40% mits, -40% melee damage debuff from fire-lore, 56% crit defence.. 12k is a devastate, or when I was debuffed for +50% incoming damage.

    Based on that, the base damage of the skill is about 22k (13k-ish on 40% mits).
    If you get debuffed, and it crits on low crit defence, you could easily get hit for 26k in that case.

    But yeh, that's quite a bit for t1, and considering t2 is about trice this (standard multiplier), that means up to 70k random aggro hits.

    So.. either make it unable to crit/devastate, or nerf the damage like what's been done with Fell Feint (which does only 22k damage instead of almost 40k now on t2).. without a nerf it'd still be 30k-ish on t2 though..
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
    Freeps: Vulcwen (R8 LM), Vulciel (lvl 100 RK), and some lower level alts.. Creep: Shadowweb (R6 spider)
    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schinderhannes View Post
    dropped at lvl 50. Hope it's removed from the loottable lvl 51+.
    So is it a club or a sword? I can't /bug it unless I know what it's intended to be. The parry bonus suggests it's meant as a sword?

    My suggestion is to keep it in. Don't remove it from the loot, but make it a sword and scale it to level of instance. Make both tactical and might-based varieties of it. This will give something more for LMs and heavy classes looking for (non-legendary) offhand weapons. A sword will be of more universal use than a club/dagger/mace.

    *Edit: is this item supposed to look like a club, but equip as a sword? (following the theme of trolls and clubs)? If so, that makes it unique and interesting option worth keeping for sure! - And if this was not intended, that still makes it a unique and interesting option to consider in future. Almost like cosmetic weaponry, but real stats and combat-ready items: even better. It could give the LM a chance to wield a club in addition to staff, bypassing the sword-only restriction. Or an option for human champions to use a club while still getting the 5% sword damage race bonus. Just citing examples, but great potential here.
    Last edited by Herwegur; Apr 16 2015 at 02:19 PM.
    Éalá Éarendel engla beorhtast,
    ofer middangeard monnum sended,
    ond sóð
    fæsta sunnan léoma,
    torht ofer tung
    las, þú tída gehwane,
    of sylfum þé symle inlíhtes!

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    "Leaving the game plan is a sign of panic, and panic is not in our game plan." - Chuck Noll

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herwegur View Post
    So is it a club or a sword? I can't /bug it unless I know what it's intended to be. The parry bonus suggests it's meant as a sword?

    My suggestion is to keep it in. Don't remove it from the loot, but make it a sword and scale it to level of instance. Make both tactical and might-based varieties of it. This will give something more for LMs and heavy classes looking for (non-legendary) offhand weapons. A sword will be of more universal use than a club/dagger/mace.
    Isn't it obvious? That half-troll picked up a sword, and used it to bake bread above a campfire. Unfortunately, it got burned, so it's no longer edible, so instead he just uses it as a club (he's too lazy to clean it).
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
    Freeps: Vulcwen (R8 LM), Vulciel (lvl 100 RK), and some lower level alts.. Creep: Shadowweb (R6 spider)
    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

  12. #12
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    The cosmetic appearance was a club. But I like the fact that loremasters can use it, because it is technically a sword.

  13. #13
    DrOctothorpe is offline The Lord of the Rings Online Team
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schinderhannes View Post
    This diagram is so adorable, we've added an attack pattern inspired by it to Thrug's roster. He's also now starting out at half health, which should help with the length of the fight rather a bit.

    Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Plenty more changes to be found in tomorrow's release notes!

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schinderhannes View Post
    The cosmetic appearance was a club. But I like the fact that loremasters can use it, because it is technically a sword.
    If they could adjust the model so it looks like a sword that was beaten into a rock, and put quotes around the "Club" part of the title, it would complete the joke =)

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    Tried to run it on t2 with beoring + LM (me) + guard.
    Didn't manage to get past the first boss because of the bleed killing the beorning, and putting me in trouble (he was yellow traited, but not performing amazing I must say.. lots of wasted heals, lots of unnecesary wrath spending), that said, we got the boss down to ~10%. We could deal with Fell Feint quite easily because of fire-lore (it hit for 11k).
    I died twice (got rezzed the first time), the beorning 5+ times.
    After that, we had trouble because the adds didn't reset.. so we had to deal with ~20 adds. After the first attempt and failing to clear the adds, the guard had to go.

    I then ran it on T1 with the beorning:
    First boss, fine.. damage from adds is still quite significant.. similar to landscape mobs (= sweet spot for T1 imo, most other T1 instances are far below this). It seems Fell Feint does the same damage on T1 and T2 though now, it also was 11k with fire-lore.

    Second boss (troll), takes a LONG time to take down (9m27s to be exact).. he has a lot of morale, high mits (even on T1) and that 1.1k HPS regen makes it harder to dps through (orcs only seem to occasionally target the troll as heal threat and AoE draws the orcs off.. that's a LM dps issue.. can't ST well without aoe XD). The punts and him running off also makes it hard to keep him in sticky gourd for max DPS. The adds/boss respawn if you leave the area though, and after the boss dies we got stuck in combat without adds around.

    The third boss.. he indeed has that random aggro spike attack.. wiped on that boss because I let fire-lore wear off, right when the boss switched to me (actual aggro.. the beorning was spamming force taunts in heal line (idk why), but I was generating more threat), and he killed me in 2s.
    The Lúmithil scored a critical hit with Great Slash on Vulcwen for 20,491 Common damage to Morale.
    And a few 4k hits I think.

    After that the beorning had to go, and I soloed it in blue line (which basically made it easy.. highest hit was 8k with great slash with fire-lore and +50% inc damage on me). It might be that this skill hits the same on T1 and T2 like Fell Feint does, idk.

    EDIT forgot this part:
    Overall:
    - Nice to see the invisiwalls bug fixed and barricades placed.
    - Stuck in combat after the 2nd boss as well as respawns is a problem (you need to re-enter and walk all the way back to loot the chest)
    - Maybe some quick travel options to each boss after you clear the area before it would be nice (not needed for the first one), so it's faster to get back.
    - If Fell Feint and Great Cleave do the same damage on T1 and T2 it could be fine.. if they do 3x damage on T2 it'd basically require a tank + healer + support which makes it take ages to complete.


    Quote Originally Posted by DrOctothorpe View Post
    This diagram is so adorable, we've added an attack pattern inspired by it to Thrug's roster. He's also now starting out at half health, which should help with the length of the fight rather a bit.

    Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Plenty more changes to be found in tomorrow's release notes!
    Lemme guess:
    Thrug scored a critical hit with Smush Them All Attack on <name> for 13373 Common Damage to Morale.

    EDIT2:
    I just forgot to mention this: The last boss is NOT immune to CC, so this would be a way to dodge his random attack.. If it stays like insane damage, but it's avoidable by CC, that would be a nice difference from most bosses.
    Last edited by Vulcwen; Apr 17 2015 at 12:59 PM.
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
    Freeps: Vulcwen (R8 LM), Vulciel (lvl 100 RK), and some lower level alts.. Creep: Shadowweb (R6 spider)
    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrOctothorpe View Post
    This diagram is so adorable, we've added an attack pattern inspired by it to Thrug's roster. He's also now starting out at half health, which should help with the length of the fight rather a bit.

    Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Plenty more changes to be found in tomorrow's release notes!
    Excellent to hear that this fight is being improved It'd also be good to see some changes to Fell Feint, so groups without LMs could manage it (fire lore I can imagine being very potent in this situation), but you might have already taken this into account
    - Taravan, R12 Captain - Tirian, Tanking Guardian - Telperon, Completionist LM -
    - Afranius, R9 WL - Tolobain, R7 Weaver - Vargan, R6 Stalker -

    Ex-Leader of Lost Realm of Imladris - Evernight - Co-Founder of Beauty and the Beasts

  17. #17
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    The only thing that annoys me greatly, is spirits spawning outside the palace. Killing them fails the CM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tirian-Hammerfist View Post
    Excellent to hear that this fight is being improved It'd also be good to see some changes to Fell Feint, so groups without LMs could manage it (fire lore I can imagine being very potent in this situation), but you might have already taken this into account
    I don't think you should be complaining about Fell Feint. You said the RK had 9k mits. That is way undercapped, even on common mits. The problem here is definitely not the instance itself.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giliodor View Post
    The only thing that annoys me greatly, is spirits spawning outside the palace. Killing them fails the CM.



    I don't think you should be complaining about Fell Feint. You said the RK had 9k mits. That is way undercapped, even on common mits. The problem here is definitely not the instance itself.
    I wasn't sure how much 9k was, as I only play heavies and am more used to understanding the percentages, not the flat figures, and as such I agree that the RK and LM should have both been closer to the cap - but as there were very few volunteers for the instance on Bullroarer, I had to test with what I got, and thus my recommendations were based on the group I had. That aside, I hardly think that random attacks are the most engaging of boss skills, as there's nothing you can do to stop them - essentially surviving that attack is more about pre-raid prep than anything done inside the instance, and I'd prefer a special ability that could actually be negated by the player in some way.
    - Taravan, R12 Captain - Tirian, Tanking Guardian - Telperon, Completionist LM -
    - Afranius, R9 WL - Tolobain, R7 Weaver - Vargan, R6 Stalker -

    Ex-Leader of Lost Realm of Imladris - Evernight - Co-Founder of Beauty and the Beasts

  19. #19
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    Edit:
    Tested it again on lvl 100 t1 and t2. (Beta 4)

    T1 difficulty is ok, although the endboss could be a bit harder compared to the previous 2 bosses. The movements of the troll boss are a bit hard to read while tanking, his animations overlap a lot or are interrupted, but it seems he is still learning some moves from miyagi.


    T2 difficulty is hard, and that's ok, but it varies a lot between mob groups, some are surprisingly big and hard hitting for a 3 man instance and no idea how to beat the endboss atm...
    The hardmode was confusing and frustrating in my first t2 run. Quest says: "don't kill fell spirits in the palace", but they also spawn outdoors and half of them can't be avoided as it seems. If you kill one of them, HM fails.
    There is also still one fell spirit spawned inside a stone pile before you enter the area of the troll boss. ([04/18 00:44:38 AM] Here are the coords: r3 lx1356 ly1855 i6 ox90.25 oy144.31 oz165.85 h212.3)
    Boss 1of3 doesn't have a chest. (T1 and T2)
    Enemies have yellow trash loot.
    Relic-loot is underwhelming. T5 relics and non fused/individual relics are not good imo.
    Why is the loot shared instead of awarding some things for everyone? (vs epic battles and in their absence cluster)
    Troll boss was already dead/gone when we entered the area. We killed the mobs and then the arriving adds. After that, we could loot the chest.

    I checked the incoming attacks after running in tier 1 and saw that minor melee attacks are a bit higher (Ø711dmg) than moderate (Ø631dmg) melee attacks. Is this intended?
    My guard received aprox. the same amount of both attacks in one fast run without losses. (minor and moderate: x 238hits, 569 minor melee hits @ Ø446dmg, 45 x mighty melee attacks @ Ø1241dmg) Numbers are not very accurate because of debuffs and group buffs. (guard, burglar and mini)

    Does anyone have a tactic for the last boss?
    It looks like he attacks the 3rd one on his aggro list at one point. No idea how all the debuffs work, not to mention how to handle them.
    Last edited by Schinderhannes; Apr 17 2015 at 09:19 PM.

  20. #20
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    Tried T2 today. Trash seems ok, but there were a few bugs.
    As said first boss has no chest.
    Also the ghosts spawn outside the palace and there is no way to go around them (even with song of distraction). I assume that it is a bug that they spawn outside but if it is not the challenge text has to be adjusted (otherwise people will think that it only counts for the last boss), or the aggro range has to be reduced.
    Also we had a bug were the second boss (troll) was dead as soon as we pulled the lever...
    So I can't say anything to him. We also need a short cut to the third boss in case of a wipe.
    He seems pretty hard but maybe with time and better gear it is possible. The bleed is brutal, even more than at the first boss. I (mini) got stunned while the tank had the bleed.
    Right now I don't see a warden tanking this, but I might be wrong.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schinderhannes View Post
    T1 difficulty is ok, although the endboss could be a bit harder compared to the previous 2 bosses.
    Not OK at all on T1 => with my Guardian in Blue, I pull all the mobs and I kill them AFK, with Auto-Attack On (same gear as on live, unbuffed with 40K+ morale => HPS > received DPS => unkillable)

    And there is a BIG MEMORY LEAK : on 32-bits (Windows 7 SP1), the VM used by lotroclient.exe is at 800-900K before entering instance,
    then increases to >= 1.6Go asa I enter the instance => it crashes sometimes in a few seconds (with all settings = low or disabled & 4gb RAM, which works perfectly for all other classic instances)
    Last edited by Castorix; Apr 19 2015 at 04:05 AM.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,631
    I soloed it at T1 today, regular mob damage seems fine.. equal to landscape. Trash could still use some more special skills, like a stun/disarm, as their landscape variants do.

    Boss damage (the total damage during a boss fight, to be more specific.. this includes all the adds) is quite a lot, I think some of the bosses are as hard as some T2 3man bosses (not that it's a bad thing.. some bosses are still easy even on T2).. I need to kite a bit to beat them.. for the last boss the spirits getting a +100% damage buff seem to be a quite significant buff to incoming damage, so I even need to kite that one, while traiting blue. I do like that the last boss isn't CC immune like most bosses, it allows for more varied tactics.

    That "smush" attack (I believe it's that one cause he doesn't really have an animation that shows he does that front-side-side combo, but it's waiting a few seconds before he smashes) did 16k damage to me cause my gear broke mid-combat and I let fire-lore wear off (wind-lore resisted .. ). The 2nd boss also was a pain to take down alone, as he has insanely high mits, meaning his 1.1k HPS heal took some effort to out-dps.

    @Castorix, passive heals like Bolstering Blocks need to be changed to an active/unsustainable variant (like a toggle skill that costs quite some power/second), it's just too OP when combined with high mits and avoidances. For wardens, I think the heal-on-dodge should be a 30s duration buff on Dance of War (or another buff gambit).
    Last edited by Vulcwen; Apr 18 2015 at 05:07 PM.
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
    Freeps: Vulcwen (R8 LM), Vulciel (lvl 100 RK), and some lower level alts.. Creep: Shadowweb (R6 spider)
    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    63
    Tank class = OP for t1

    I don't think the instance is easy, tank class is OP. It's no about the mobs damage its about your class. So many self heals, i don't know why tanks have a lot of self heals, tank should survive better than any other class but not without someone to heal him.
    Some classes can solo t1, some can't so its not about mob damage.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    3,298
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark-Rebel View Post
    Some classes can solo t1, some can't so its not about mob damage.
    It is also about mob damage : in T2, trash mobs damage is largely > and I cannot go AFK...
    All classes can solo T1 instances on live since U12 (I tested with my Hunter, a weak class, not top geared (even some 12-man content is soloable in T1 (some skraids) in Yellow).

    In Red, with ~35.5K Morale, Mitigations = 60% & 58%, Crit. Def. = 61.6%, most of received hits are around -500/600 (many weak, minor or moderate hits), it is a lot too low. No danger and no need of a Healer =>

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially blocked hit with a minor melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially parried hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 390 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 819 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 592 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a minor ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially evaded hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a moderate ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
    The Half-troll Executioner scored a hit with a melee double attack on Christianx for 585 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
    The Half-troll Executioner scored a partially evaded hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 498 Common damage to Morale.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Last edited by Castorix; Apr 19 2015 at 08:07 AM.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,631
    Quote Originally Posted by Castorix View Post
    It is also about mob damage : in T2, trash mobs damage is largely > and I cannot go AFK...
    All classes can solo T1 instances on live since U12 (I tested with my Hunter, a weak class, not top geared (even some 12-man content is soloable in T1 (some skraids) in Yellow).

    In Red, with ~35.5K Morale, Mitigations = 60% & 58%, Crit. Def. = 61.6%, most of received hits are around -500/600 (many weak, minor or moderate hits), it is a lot too low. No danger and no need of a Healer =>

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially blocked hit with a minor melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially parried hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 390 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 819 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 592 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a minor ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a partially evaded hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 503 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a hit with a moderate ranged attack on Christianx for 590 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a moderate melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
    The Half-troll Executioner scored a hit with a melee double attack on Christianx for 585 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Archer scored a critical hit with a weak ranged attack on Christianx for 472 Common damage to Morale.
    The Haradrim Devoted scored a devastating hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 655 Common damage to Morale.
    The Half-troll Executioner scored a partially evaded hit with a weak melee attack on Christianx for 498 Common damage to Morale.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    You need to consider that this is T1.. and not everyone has 35k morale and is a guardian.. What about the 14k morale minis/RKs that want to heal a 3man for once.. They will get aggro at times, and could have their hands full at healing very nasty bleeds (6k ticks after mits.. that's 40% of their morale every 2s) on the first boss.. just a few archers (identical to the trash) dealing 1k hits on average is gonna kill them.. For these players, just healing this instance would be harder than soloing T2 6mans is for you. Buffing the damage is gonna make things impossible for these players unless they get carried through.

    I'm not saying it's set too hard now.. but buffing it more will do away with the accessibility, which is a point of T1, the difference between T1 and T2 takes care of the difference in gear (which is pretty significant now.. quest gear puts you at ~11k morale when you hit lvl 100, and with full essence gear you can have 3 times as much.. which is basically the T2 modifier).
    T1, in the current state, is gonna be a challenge for new players and more casual groups, which is fine.
    As I said before, the trash could get some more special skills to make it more interesting (stuns/disarms, executioners should have some AoEs), but damage-wise it's fine.

    Further, there isn't a real problem with easy trash in some instances, a good instance has some fluctuation in difficulty. Start out easy, slowly increase the difficulty, put you against something hard (first boss), then back to easy, and slowly increase it again until the next boss. This makes boss fights special, which is the strength of this instance.
    SL on the other hand focuses challenge on the trash (and punishes melee DPS.. unless they changed that this beta.. didn't check yet), meaning it needs a different difficulty curve to not make the bosses anti-climatic, which I think they pulled off quite decently (on T2 the difficulty peaks are at the 2 defiler+troll pulls, the first boss, and then the last boss, on T1 the archers are more dangerous than the defilers, so that moves it around a little).
    Last edited by Vulcwen; Apr 19 2015 at 04:22 PM. Reason: ofc.. the boss no longer randomly Fell Feints..
    ~Dwarrowdelf (Bomb Squad)~
    Freeps: Vulcwen (R8 LM), Vulciel (lvl 100 RK), and some lower level alts.. Creep: Shadowweb (R6 spider)
    My ideas on how LM should be: [url=https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?543323-LM-revamp-reconsidered]LM Revamp reconsidered[/url]

 

 
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