new Beor class excluded to the hobbit

[Mar-Evayave]

On the topic of racism... for what it's worth... which may be very little... but perhaps give some insight...

I am a HUMAN, not a WHALE. Does that make me "racist" or even "speciesist"? Does that make me anti-whales? No! That just means that I am physiologically NOT a WHALE, nor will I ever BE a whale. I will never weigh 180 tons (thank Eru...), I hope I never have a blowhole on the back of my head, and I'm not likely to start living in the ocean. Similarly, whales will never go to college, will never drive a car (talk about squeezing a marshmallow into a Hotwheels... O.O ), or any of the thousands of other activities that are unique to the Human species. Simple as that.

In the same light, Beorn was a MAN not a HOBBIT, and the same goes for his people. That doesn't make anyone racist against Hobbits.

I happen to love whales, btw. Beautiful creatures. I love Hobbits too, for that matter.

[rodin12]

and that may not be cpt, champion and lm that is not exclusive man merry and pippin are Knights of gondor

[Brya]

and that may not be cpt, champion and lm that is not exclusive man merry and pippin are Knights of gondor

Neither Pippin or Merry were "Knights", and a "Knight" is not a "Captain".

Pippin was a Guard of the Citadel, which is more of a Ceremonial bodyguard role than actual fighting soldier.

Merry was a Squire of Rohan.

[BangoTwinkletoes]

Neither Pippin or Merry were "Knights", and a "Knight" is not a "Captain".

Pippin was a Guard of the Citadel, which is more of a Ceremonial bodyguard role than actual fighting soldier.

Merry was a Squire of Rohan.

Merry & Pippin did a pretty good job of leading their fellows at the Battle of Bywater. Think you'll find their weapons & gear were more than just ceremonial.

Let's also not forget that it was indeed Merry who dealt the fatal wound to the Witchking; Eowyn just taking the last couple hundred of morale and nicking the kill!

edit - spelling.

[freedaemons]

They were the only knights of gondor, and you are neither merry nor pippin. Furthermore they already linked their roles to the guardian class. If you are trying to get the lore to work to make hobbits get more classes, think again, the lore indisputably supports all hobbits except those in the fellowship of the ring be stuck in the shire and eat pies.

[robbie1435]

and that may not be cpt, champion and lm that is not exclusive man merry and pippin are Knights of gondor

Captains aren't Knights... And since it is known that all other races are fading, and that men must lead the path, they are most appropriate for the captain class.

Champions are dual-wielding meat machines. They kill stuff with no mercy(In a good way!!!!). Merry and Pippin were not meat machines, they were defenders... In my honest, truthful, opinion, Merry and Pippin would be classified as a guard.

A hobbit lore-master is a little out of proportional as well. All hobbits did was eat, sleep, and eat more... And travel. They didn't have time for books and knowledge. They just wanted to have a good time!

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No, as for Beorn and the Beornings:

The Beornings were distinctly man, and only man. No other race inherited the genes the Beornings had that allowed them to... well... be Beornings. Just because the, arguably, most important character was a hobbit(It is my opinion that Aragorn was fairly important, as he has practically a separate book than Frodo, if you split the two stories), doesn't mean that a hobbit should be allowed to play every class. Turbine is right at keeping the Beorning race specific to Men, as no other race fits. Not every race is perfect for every class, and unfortunately, hobbits aren't the best pick for Beornings, as they don't make sense in the lore.

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That's just my two cents in the discussion!

[BangoTwinkletoes]

A hobbit lore-master is a little out of proportional as well. All hobbits did was eat, sleep, and eat more... And travel. They didn't have time for books and knowledge. They just wanted to have a good time!

Two words - Farmer Maggot. Even old Bombadil had wise words to say about him. Who's to say that Maggot was a one off? Especially given that Born the Old is going to have lots and lots and lots of direct descendants when this new class gets rolled out

[Harbut]

A hobbit lore-master is a little out of proportional as well. All hobbits did was eat, sleep, and eat more... And travel. They didn't have time for books and knowledge. They just wanted to have a good time!

Steady on! Hobbits just dont eat, drink, sleep! They also toil the good earth and are natural farmers....and thats no job for lazy folk. There are also the hobbits of Buckland who patrol the High Hay and guard against anything nasty coming in from the Old Forest, they are the more militia orientated of all the Hobbits, who will arm themselves and come running if the Horn of Buckland is sounded and let us not forget the battle of Greenfields and the mighty Bullroarer!
Hobbits are not all cute happy folk!. Many have the same qualitys as humans. Cowardice, greed, apathy etc etc...the Sackville Bagginses spring to mind...whoever thinks Lobelia is cute needs their head read!

Stereotyping is a very very bad thing

[Mar-Evayave]

A hobbit lore-master is a little out of proportional as well. All hobbits did was eat, sleep, and eat more... And travel. They didn't have time for books and knowledge. They just wanted to have a good time!

And garden, but I did want to point out something. While Hobbits were not into anything magical (Minstrels stretch this part a bit)...

But Hobbits have never, in fact,studied magic of any kind, and their elusiveness is due solely to a professional skill that heredity and practice, and a close friendship with the earth, have rendered inimitable by bigger and clumsier races.
-The Lord of the Rings, Prologue: Concerning Hobbits

... some definitely had a love for lore and learning. Why else would Bilbo set down and write his book, or Frodo his? The last few pages of the Red Book were saved for Sam, so apparently he, too, would write down the events as he saw them.

A love of learning (other than genealogical lore) was far from general among them, but there remained still a few in the older families who studied their own books, and even gathered reports of old times and distant lands from Elves, Dwarves, and Men.
- ibid

They may not all have been scholars, but that doesn't mean they didn't have time for it. They had LOADS of time; most simply chose to do other things, namely farming.

Aww. Here in the UK most of us are well aware that it is possible to get Two Whales in a Mini......

Okay, now I'm curious: Explain this concept to me. ^_^

[c_the_awesome]

Okay, now I'm curious: Explain this concept to me. ^_^

Its bigger on the inside...

[cdq1958]

And garden, but I did want to point out something. While Hobbits were not into anything magical (Minstrels stretch this part a bit)...



... some definitely had a love for lore and learning. Why else would Bilbo set down and write his book, or Frodo his? The last few pages of the Red Book were saved for Sam, so apparently he, too, would write down the events as he saw them.



They may not all have been scholars, but that doesn't mean they didn't have time for it. They had LOADS of time; most simply chose to do other things, namely farming.



Okay, now I'm curious: Explain this concept to me. ^_^

Hmm, reminds me of the days of stuffing 20 college students into 60s VW Beetles :P.

[Iolanthea]

Okay, now I'm curious: Explain this concept to me. ^_^

It only really works if you say it out loud

British fellow: I say I say I say, how do you get two whales* in a Mini?
British lady: Easy - just head down the M4 motorway


*to Wales, geddit? And a Mini is a well-known brand of car here in the UK......oh I guess some jokes might only work if you are a Brit hehe

[Rowellan]

Hmm, reminds me of the days of stuffing 20 college students into 60s VW Beetles :P.

Should be easy. I had six passengers once in mine and we were limited cause as the driver I couldn't have people sitting on me on the driver's seat

curse you! I must have spent a good ten minutes just staring at this!

You're not the only one... gee, that's hypnotic in a bad way...

[Brandon_Blackbird]

It only really works if you say it out loud

British fellow: I say I say I say, how do you get two whales* in a Mini?
British lady: Easy - just head down the M4 motorway


*to Wales, geddit? And a Mini is a well-known brand of car here in the UK......oh I guess some jokes might only work if you are a Brit hehe

*GROAN*

Okay, good one :P

[Mar-Evayave]

It only really works if you say it out loud

British fellow: I say I say I say, how do you get two whales* in a Mini?
British lady: Easy - just head down the M4 motorway


*to Wales, geddit? And a Mini is a well-known brand of car here in the UK......oh I guess some jokes might only work if you are a Brit hehe

@c_the_awesome as well...

*amused groan* That's one of those "it's so lame it's funny" things, I guess. xD I've heard of the Mini Cooper Classic (or whatever?) and of course Wales... but still... lol

[Kehleyr]

*to Wales, geddit? And a Mini is a well-known brand of car here in the UK......oh I guess some jokes might only work if you are a Brit hehe

Quite well known across the pond as well. I've been driving one myself for over 10 years.

[Mar-Evayave]

Quite well known across the pond as well. I've been driving one myself for over 10 years.

lol Can't say I'd want to drive one (don't much care for its looks), but the first time I heard of one was in the old Midtown Madness video games. xD

[Iolanthea]

Similarly, whales will never go to college, will never drive a car (talk about squeezing a marshmallow into a Hotwheels... O.O )

Aww. Here in the UK most of us are well aware that it is possible to get Two Whales in a Mini......

[Beorthnoth]

Aww. Here in the UK most of us are well aware that it is possible to get Two Whales in a Mini......

Nah, that was elephants, not whales

[Wiedman]

Please, for the love of God, can we all just agree that hobbit captains are not lore breaking? Tolkien himself called Merry, Pippen, and even Frodo captains. If that's not canon, I honestly don't know what is.

Seriously, I am so sick and tired of people pretending that hobbit captains are lore breaking. It's really starting to irritate me.

Turbine has its own reasons for restricting the Captain class to RoM, and that's their business. But those reasons are not based on anything Tolkien wrote.

[Cartman76]

Please, for the love of God, can we all just agree that hobbit captains are not lore breaking? Tolkien himself called Merry, Pippen, and even Frodo captains. If that's not canon, I honestly don't know what is.

Seriously, I am so sick and tired of people pretending that hobbit captains are lore breaking. It's really starting to irritate me.

Turbine has its own reasons for restricting the Captain class to RoM, and that's their business. But those reasons are not based on anything Tolkien wrote.

I'll go as far as saying any class that can't be a hobbit is lore-breaking since we all know hobbits are awesome!!!
Thin ice I know but it's a game and they are awesome

[Radhruin_EU]

Please, for the love of God, can we all just agree that hobbit captains are not lore breaking? Tolkien himself called Merry, Pippen, and even Frodo captains. If that's not canon, I honestly don't know what is.

Seriously, I am so sick and tired of people pretending that hobbit captains are lore breaking. It's really starting to irritate me.

Turbine has its own reasons for restricting the Captain class to RoM, and that's their business. But those reasons are not based on anything Tolkien wrote.

Be irritated, then. Even Merry and Pippin (who'd drunk Ent-draughts and grown to unprecedented size for hobbits) only got to lead other hobbits. They're a special case, one that doesn't lend itself to being generalised for player-characters, Captains are Men because of it being the time for Men to lead, with the Elves taking a back seat, the Dwarves being outsiders as they'd always been, and hobbits having never led anyone other than themselves and that very rarely. Like it ot not, it does reflect something from the books.

Holding up Merry and Pippin as examples is also feeble justification because as far as the plot of the game goes, they haven't even got to 'captain' anyone themselves yet. That was in the Scouring of the Shire, remember?

[Wiedman]

Holding up Merry and Pippin as examples is also feeble justification because as far as the plot of the game goes, they haven't even got to 'captain' anyone themselves yet. That was in the Scouring of the Shire, remember?

Right, and Scouring of the Shire was in Lord of the Rings, and the game is called Lord of the Rings Online. If it's in the book, it's lore appropriate. Otherwise lore appropriate has no meaning.

Furthermore Frodo is called a Captain while the hobbits are partying in Crickhollow. Are you going to pretend like that didn't happen, or that it hasn't happened yet?

[Radhruin_EU]

Right, and Scouring of the Shire was in Lord of the Rings, and the game is called Lord of the Rings Online. If it's in the book, it's lore appropriate. Otherwise lore appropriate has no meaning.

Oh hell no. Not when it hasn't even happened to them yet, and when Merry and Pippin were exceptional in a way player-character hobbits don't even get to be. And not when there's never an occasion when other people recognise hobbits as 'captains'.

Furthermore Frodo is called a Captain while the hobbits are partying in Crickhollow. Are you going to pretend like that didn't happen, or that it hasn't happened yet?

And you expect me to take that seriously? It's said in a casual, joking sense:

‘Good! That’s settled. Three cheers for Captain Frodo and company!’ they shouted; and they danced round him. Merry and Pippin began a song, which they had apparently got ready for the occasion.

- FOTR, 'A Conspiracy Unmasked'

Don't try to latch onto the least mention of the word like it means anything; Pippin called Frodo 'Lord of the Ring' later on as well, and needless to say he wasn't that either.

[guguzza71]

Right, and Scouring of the Shire was in Lord of the Rings, and the game is called Lord of the Rings Online. If it's in the book, it's lore appropriate. Otherwise lore appropriate has no meaning.

Furthermore Frodo is called a Captain while the hobbits are partying in Crickhollow. Are you going to pretend like that didn't happen, or that it hasn't happened yet?

There was that boy king who supported Halfling Captains not too long ago. The others weren't amused. I think he was poisoned at his wedding.