New Legendary System Implementation/Rollout - Horrid

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

Three, in this system you basically reinvented the wheel and made it a square....instead of focusing on what was in place and working.

At bare minimum you owe your players some form of compensation for a horrid rollout that is resulting in high levels of frustration for many players. :mad::mad::mad:

I'm not impressed so far.

Not even a little bit and the world broadcast of: World broadcast: 'We are aware of an issue in which Tracery levels can exceed the level of the Legendary Item that they are in. This is not working as intended and we are currently working on a fix to address all affected items. We will have more information as it is available. In the meantime, please do not spend your Mithril Coins on levels past 449. Thank you for your patience.' suggests that an urgent rollback may be the smart move.

SSG you kind of dropped the ball on the implementation here. I was surprised that there is no prompt or explanation anywhere in game on how to use the new LI system. Chat is filled with people confused about how to even begin, where to go, why they can't deconstruct their old weapon, why they can't equip the new, how the heck to even open the LI panel...why was none of this explained anywhere in game? Some kind of tutorial, a mail message, an NPC somewhere, I don't know, something! You've got this brand spanking new system, but people need some guidance on how to use it!

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Originally Posted by CloudCastle

SSG you kind of dropped the ball on the implementation here. I was surprised that there is no prompt or explanation anywhere in game on how to use the new LI system. Chat is filled with people confused about how to even begin, where to go, why they can't deconstruct their old weapon, why they can't equip the new, how the heck to even open the LI panel...why was none of this explained anywhere in game? Some kind of tutorial, a mail message, an NPC somewhere, I don't know, something! You've got this brand spanking new system, but people need some guidance on how to use it!

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Agreed. The basics really - where to go, how to appraise, how to equip etc. Many venues to offer that explanation in-game because you shouldn't have to rely on BETA forums for such things. After update WC was a riot today.

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

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ABSOLUTELY agree. Nothing more to add, perfect. Specially second point. No guidance (in-game) at all is horrid.
The legendary items is a very important part in the game and most of us don't know what to do or where to start.

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Originally Posted by Edariel

ABSOLUTELY agree. Nothing more to add, perfect. Specially second point. No guidance (in-game) at all is horrid.
The legendary items is a very important part in the game and most of us don't know what to do or where to start.

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So go with plan A - convert nothing for my 110, 107, 104 and 102 until i hit level 121? By then i can save all the reworking and wait for it all to be fixed?

Maybe convert for the under 100's when they hit the next level tier as not think they will stay viable all through to 121.


At a glance looks that way.

Someone also confirmed its a gold sink and cost a lot in total to upgrade stuff. Any thoughts here?

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Originally Posted by CloudCastle

SSG you kind of dropped the ball on the implementation here. I was surprised that there is no prompt or explanation anywhere in game on how to use the new LI system. Chat is filled with people confused about how to even begin, where to go, why they can't deconstruct their old weapon, why they can't equip the new, how the heck to even open the LI panel...why was none of this explained anywhere in game? Some kind of tutorial, a mail message, an NPC somewhere, I don't know, something! You've got this brand spanking new system, but people need some guidance on how to use it!

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They sure did. I was expecting some popup about the LI but nothing. And the barter in Rivendell should have had some explanation on where to start and proceed. Just something there would have helped a lot and she was the first I clicked on because I had no idea how to get the currency from the old ILIs

A friend sent me this, which is a better explanation then what is on their site, but is still a ton to digest:

https://easilyamused.notion.site/New...82d75d39d40062

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

Three, in this system you basically reinvented the wheel and made it a square....instead of focusing on what was in place and working.

At bare minimum you owe your players some form of compensation for a horrid rollout that is resulting in high levels of frustration for many players. :mad::mad::mad:

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I agree whole heatedly. This game is becoming a major attempt at a cash grab. My wife and I have been VIP for 10 plus years and that means very little now. We don't participate in raids so getting high-end kit is a grind, we now have to pay for every upgrade and it looks like we now have to pay to have a decent weapon too. I'm nearly at the end of my charity to these new owners.

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

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I mentioned this at least 3 times on the BR forums. The UI has way too many BUY MC buttons. It's obnoxious but more importantly it takes up very important real estate in the already limited UI space we have.

Come on guys, you can do better than this.

In a different thread I argued that the patch notes didn't make the rollout seem like a disaster - they just made it seem incomplete and released far too early - so maybe the sky isn't falling.

I stand by my opinion of the patch notes. Playing the game, on the other hand, the system was implemented far more incompletely (to be polite) than I had expected and I kept looking nervously up to see if the sky was still there.

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

A friend sent me this, which is a better explanation then what is on their site, but is still a ton to digest:

https://easilyamused.notion.site/New...82d75d39d40062

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Thanks for the link


Great pity no one at SSG could give us the Conversion Rate table beforehand.
The 408 - 424 ILI level making the 8 or 9 Tracery Token returns mark means I haven't wasted the last few days of making a bunch of new ILIs where my levelling LIs used to be.
Getting them all up to 410+ range in the few minutes before the shutdown worked out better than the wait and see advocated by SSG.
Anyone Imbuing at the last minute and doing nothing lost a lot.

Remains to be seen if the huge amounts of resources it took may have had a better use sometime later...

P.S. can still use up Empowerments on ILIs but adding IXP on old ILIs does nothing to advance them into another category for conversion, just blowing your saved resources.

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

Three, in this system you basically reinvented the wheel and made it a square....instead of focusing on what was in place and working.

At bare minimum you owe your players some form of compensation for a horrid rollout that is resulting in high levels of frustration for many players. :mad::mad::mad:

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The more I see about this the less I like. We were promised the LI revamp for so many years, it's a very basic thing to expect that it would be fully free, and better than the old system. Right now I feel a strong urge to question both of those points. It feels like half the things I know about the expansion pack are that yes, while the LI revamp is free...it seems to be taking a ton of dev time away from the rest of the content, and in the end we have a complicated system that I don't know if it will improve or weaken my LI.


Haven't logged in or bought the expansion yet. All the merits are just text, a few tiny screenshots of pets and cosmetic. Where's the beef? I have maxed out LIs that have been in my slots for longer than many devs have been with game companies.

Where is the assurance that this is equal, or better, and not worse for my character?

And I still don't understand after reading the LI page multiple times: Did I ruin something by not converting to the new LIs already, or can my maxed out first agers still turn into maxed out....whatever the new ones are called?

The new LIs are more powerful, even if they are not maxed. The disaster is that there are no in game explanations how to even start to get the currencies from the existing LIs. As I mentioned before, they need a good in game explanation and that is missing. Once I figured everything out and made my new items, they are stronger. So the sky is not falling.

And what does it matter if it's maxed as before, with Gundabad new traceries will be avaiable and slotted, enhanced, maybe maxed. They will NOT grow forever but need to be replaced like the old Moria LIs needed to be replaced. Just this time we keep the weapon.

Drobo,

Thank you for your post and especially, thank you for:

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

A friend sent me this, which is a better explanation then what is on their site, but is still a ton to digest:

https://easilyamused.notion.site/New...82d75d39d40062

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SSG should be ashamed for not taking the time to do what 'easilyamused' did for us. Shows who has the greater interest in the players of the game.

Sigh.

When one considers what the posts in these forums used to focus on in the past, the fun factor, gameing advice, recommendations and the interaction and investment by Turbine who loved the game first, and money afterwards, to what it is now, genuinely concerned players who complain with good reason about the atrocious issues that SSG simply does not address, the petty 'lockdown' of things that make playing the game more fun and easier (not to be confused with the challenging content that the hardcore faction desire) and SSG being money centric rather than fun-factor and game centric, well, its just appalling. It really burns me up, specially as I have nothing to vent my frustrations on.

Thus, when many folks like you, Drobo, post such fine content in these forums, it is oh so appreciated. It really is!

Thank you!

Asterus.

One thing I don't understand (well one main thing I will bring up here).

I understand that they said we would not be able to reforge or apply scrolls of empowerment, star-lit crystals and even use heritage runes. But why also disable iXP gain from regular playing?
If you can only claim the conversion from an LI once, and can't advance them beyond what is already unlocked, what is the harm in allowing the LI to progress to that point (reaching the progression that was unlocked already)?
I can imagine the discontent of all the people who dumped crystals and scrolls into their LIs unaware that they will only receive compensation for those in the conversion if they had also filled those new tiers with iXP. Why not let them fill those unlocked tiers with iXP before they convert the LI, what is the issue with that?

Any classes negatively impacted by the change?

Also they post guides online on twitter and their forums, but I do wholly agree there should have been an in-game one for the older players who don't check social media often. Personally, the new system seems simpler, and all the conversion rates pre-lvl 100 seem good/enough. And its simple enough to understand, slot in x tracery to x slot and all, on the younger players ik who play this find this one to be better than the old one.

The monetization tho, I mean guys this ilhad existed for years now xD, it's not like anyone complained about it before, or rather, it was allowed to exist with ppl saying it "was a choice".

Any 130s able to comment on if converting max imbued LIs are good?

Guessing all the player ideas and feedback over the last bunch of years regarding legendary weapons weren't the way to go and this new awesome pile of poopoo got the tick.

I've poured a lot of money into this game in the last 10 years, it's been obvious to me for the last few that the overall intent is to find more ways to get me to spend more. This gets me real close to quitting.

So the overall system is just better. And it seems that whatever firebrands here are saying its bad or etc., either didn't read the guide, or are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

That said, ppl's issue with the monetization.

I mean guys this is kinda the community's fault in general. You can't be pissed for them monetizing LI upgrades when you've all clearly allowed it for every other character progression item in game whether that be the quest packs which is lvl content, the virtues which is important for char content, the riding skill which no one even charges for anymore, and pretty much everything else.

I would rate this LI revamp as a success (dps tho is another question but everyone on WC is saying its better). But SSG, pls include an in-game pop-up, it seems ppl didn't look on twitter so one that links them to it would be great. Also including that u can't stack tracery types, save the word of craft would be helpful.

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Originally Posted by wrath247

So the overall system is just better. And it seems that whatever firebrands here are saying its bad or etc., either didn't read the guide, or are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

That said, ppl's issue with the monetization.

I mean guys this is kinda the community's fault in general. You can't be pissed for them monetizing LI upgrades when you've all clearly allowed it for every other character progression item in game whether that be the quest packs which is lvl content, the virtues which is important for char content, the riding skill which no one even charges for anymore, and pretty much everything else.

I would rate this LI revamp as a success (dps tho is another question but everyone on WC is saying its better). But SSG, pls include an in-game pop-up, it seems ppl didn't look on twitter so one that links them to it would be great. Also including that u can't stack tracery types, save the word of craft would be helpful.

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Hu? Why do you want people to go on twitter?
All information for an ingame system must be ingame, that's all.
No need to see twitter or even forum to know it or understand it (even if it can be made clearer in other websites like dadi's, lotrowiki and all).

In my opinion (and from what I understand) it seems to be almost or the same as in BR last week (no real surprises here) and prove that BR players feedbacks are not taking in consideration. It was not ready saturday, it's not now and more weeks would have been better than releasing it halfway through.

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Originally Posted by Oldwiley

So go with plan A - convert nothing for my 110, 107, 104 and 102 until i hit level 121? By then i can save all the reworking and wait for it all to be fixed?

Maybe convert for the under 100's when they hit the next level tier as not think they will stay viable all through to 121.


At a glance looks that way.

Someone also confirmed its a gold sink and cost a lot in total to upgrade stuff. Any thoughts here?

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Yeah, that's what I intend to do.
Lower-levels, under 100 - won't lose anything from conversion. They can even go with low-resource yellow traceries as it matters not if I have 25% buff or 20% buff (or 400 tac mastery instead of 600), and the source of ancient scripts (except disenchanting one tracery that dropped from Stairs T1) is unknown. They cannot be all from instance drops... Can they?

Level 106 - I made sure she had a imbued LIs with significant boost (dps and critical legacies maxed) to get her to 121. Getting lower-level traceries and runes is a waste, I'll need those scripts at 121.

As for gold - at 130 reforge asked for 15 gold, that's all.

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Originally Posted by wrath247

So the overall system is just better. And it seems that whatever firebrands here are saying its bad or etc., either didn't read the guide, or are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

That said, ppl's issue with the monetization.

I mean guys this is kinda the community's fault in general. You can't be pissed for them monetizing LI upgrades when you've all clearly allowed it for every other character progression item in game whether that be the quest packs which is lvl content, the virtues which is important for char content, the riding skill which no one even charges for anymore, and pretty much everything else.

I would rate this LI revamp as a success (dps tho is another question but everyone on WC is saying its better). But SSG, pls include an in-game pop-up, it seems ppl didn't look on twitter so one that links them to it would be great. Also including that u can't stack tracery types, save the word of craft would be helpful.

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The fact that people have to look on forums/twitter etc to use this system just proves how much of a failure this new system is. Instead of the convenient old LI panel where we had everything in 1 place.. We have to go through pages of traceries, run to different bookshelves, navigate through the most horrible UI ever implemented etc.. You cannot even inspect players and see their complete LI build, if you inspect a player it only shows 3 slots. If you use a small monitor the tooltip doesn't even fit on the screen lol.. You need like 1000 runes to max out the traceries, and you get like 1 per chest doing instances. You cannot even refund the tracery if you trade the wrong one by mistake. YIKES, this system is horrible.

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Originally Posted by wrath247

So the overall system is just better. And it seems that whatever firebrands here are saying its bad or etc., either didn't read the guide, or are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

That said, ppl's issue with the monetization.

I mean guys this is kinda the community's fault in general. You can't be pissed for them monetizing LI upgrades when you've all clearly allowed it for every other character progression item in game whether that be the quest packs which is lvl content, the virtues which is important for char content, the riding skill which no one even charges for anymore, and pretty much everything else.

I would rate this LI revamp as a success (dps tho is another question but everyone on WC is saying its better). But SSG, pls include an in-game pop-up, it seems ppl didn't look on twitter so one that links them to it would be great. Also including that u can't stack tracery types, save the word of craft would be helpful.

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Why is it better?
You're missing an argument there.


What "guide" are you referring to?
The SSG one which is just a PR-piece and doesn't even e.g. mention that you have to reforge your newly purchased LI?


Why would an end-user be forced to use out-game resources to understand a newly and touted "improved" LI system?

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Originally Posted by bjute

The fact that people have to look on forums/twitter etc to use this system just proves how much of a failure this new system is. Instead of the convenient old LI panel where we had everything in 1 place.. We have to go through pages of traceries, run to different bookshelves, navigate through the most horrible UI ever implemented etc.. You cannot even inspect players and see their complete LI build, if you inspect a player it only shows 3 slots. If you use a small monitor the tooltip doesn't even fit on the screen lol.. You need like 1000 runes to max out the traceries, and you get like 1 per chest doing instances. You cannot even refund the tracery if you trade the wrong one by mistake. YIKES, this system is horrible.

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If you use the current "quality" of 30.3 as a base then working at SSG has to be like a dream come true: it doesn't matter how horrible your work is because everything will get a pass.

So true though. It's so difficult to figure out how to click a button to convert; head to rivendell, trade in for a new LI, get new traceries, plug and pick, then upgrade with enhancement runes.

Like, omfg, this was so so so so difficult. Like, omg! SO difficult to figure out in like a few seconds of reading their post on twitter or on their website. It's so so so so so difficult.

It's like they didn't post this link on twitter and their website: https://t.co/ni6vPN5vfj?amp=1 or https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...tems-explained

Yeah they could have an in-game pop up or smth, but sweet jesus ppl chill tf down. I would have thought ppl actually knew how to read more when they got older.

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Originally Posted by wrath247

It's like they didn't post this link on twitter and their website: https://t.co/ni6vPN5vfj?amp=1 or https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...tems-explained

Yeah they could have an in-game pop up or smth, but sweet jesus ppl chill tf down. I would have thought ppl actually knew how to read more when they got older.

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Seriously...
It's not they could have, it's more like they must have...
People going on twitter (not me), forum or website are very few in proportion on all games, you just can't use it as an unique vector of communication for a change so important.
It must be made ingame (a quest or/and a mail for example).

You, you know of it because you are in the forum, perhaps even in BR or that imaginery thing of Palantir, but the vast majority are not. And that's this majority who must taken in consideration for this, not us.

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Originally Posted by Nehniriel

Seriously...
It's not they could have, it's more like they must have...
People going on twitter (not me), forum or website are very few in proportion on all games, you just can't use it as an unique vector of communication for a change so important.
It must be made ingame (a quest or/and a mail for example).

You, you know of it because you are in the forum, perhaps even in BR or that imaginery thing of Palantir, but the vast majority are not. And that's this majority who must taken in consideration for this, not us.

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Yeah, that's the thing. Many players just play the game and don't use, may not even be aware of, the forums, FB, Twitter. It really would not have been that much work to create a link to the information on the launcher or something, if not a full blown in game tutorial. After all, the company is forcing this change on players. If the intention was really to address player concerns, they could simply have massively cranked up the availability of empowerment scrolls and left the imbued system in place.

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Originally Posted by DKenny

If the intention was really to address player concerns, they could simply have massively cranked up the availability of empowerment scrolls and left the imbued system in place.

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They didn't even have to "massively crank up the availability of emp scrolls", they could have just unlocked the legacies to level with you, removing the scroll/crystal requirement until you hit character level cap. And make the imbument start at 50. This would have made most sense.. It would also be future proof, once a new cap is released, unlock the legacies to level with you and make scrolls/crystals a requirement for endgame only.

Instead we got this abomination.

Pure disappointment. I thought this new LI system was suppose to encounter heavy grind that the old one required.Frankly, seems like the grind will be even worse. I logged in last night and I was clueless like my grandma trying to figure out PC, I had to ask around why I cant slot my new LI or how can I upgrade traceries etc. Honestly I don't see any change other than the words. Same legacies with additional stats and some extra slots for more mastery and what not but still they will require alot of enchantments for upgrade so my question is how the grind is improved for better? Crystals and scrolls are gone and now we have enchantments and other currencies. Same... different colour. Kind of killed my enthusiasm pre Fate of Gundabad. I have all classes on cap level with capped LIs. From what I've seen if I want to play further with the limited time I have I have to continue with 1 character and retire rest. Highly possible this update is the last stop for me. Retirement is near.

I am grateful that this underfunded treasure of a game didn't spend unnecessary dev time/money to a one-time event that you will never repeat. I'm grateful that they've done such a good job with the new LIs and that people in-game are so pleased with the results, even if the process is laborious.

Leave it to the forums to complain about a job well done, all things considered.

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Originally Posted by wrath247

So true though. It's so difficult to figure out how to click a button to convert; head to rivendell, trade in for a new LI, get new traceries, plug and pick, then upgrade with enhancement runes.

Like, omfg, this was so so so so difficult. Like, omg! SO difficult to figure out in like a few seconds of reading their post on twitter or on their website. It's so so so so so difficult.

It's like they didn't post this link on twitter and their website: https://t.co/ni6vPN5vfj?amp=1 or https://www.lotro.com/en/game/articl...tems-explained

Yeah they could have an in-game pop up or smth, but sweet jesus ppl chill tf down. I would have thought ppl actually knew how to read more when they got older.

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I asked you to provide an argument for your empty claim of "the overall system is better", but I guess it's "too difficult to figure out how to formulate an argument", right?

And stop it with your narrative that "the user is too dumb to figure it out": said article doesn't even mention that you need to reforge for the LI to catch up to your character level.

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Originally Posted by bjute

They didn't even have to "massively crank up the availability of emp scrolls", they could have just unlocked the legacies to level with you, removing the scroll/crystal requirement until you hit character level cap. And make the imbument start at 50. This would have made most sense.. It would also be future proof, once a new cap is released, unlock the legacies to level with you and make scrolls/crystals a requirement for endgame only.

Instead we got this abomination.

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I agree. And to be fair, some tiers would be unlocked for "free" when an LI was imbued, depending on the LI imbued, and when they increased the max legacy tier level, some of the additional tiers were also unlocked for free. But I agree, the system would have been better, and better lived up to the original billing of "growing with us" if the link had simply been between character level and tier level, rather than depending on mountains of empowerment scrolls and to a lesser extent crystals and not on character level at all.

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Originally Posted by DKenny

I agree. And to be fair, some tiers would be unlocked for "free" when an LI was imbued, depending on the LI imbued, and when they increased the max legacy tier level, some of the additional tiers were also unlocked for free. But I agree, the system would have been better, and better lived up to the original billing of "growing with us" if the link had simply been between character level and tier level, rather than depending on mountains of empowerment scrolls and to a lesser extent crystals and not on character level at all.

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This was something mentioned several times over the years. But as Raninia mentioned one time, if you want the best you should invest in it.

With the right tutorial this conversion would have been a better experience. I went to Rivendell, found the barter/reforger in the room and clicked on her. First there should have been a pop up to guide to Rivendell, second either in this quest or at the barter should have been step to step directions.
Other then that imo this system is easier to understand for newcomers, you deal with less steps and parts, can choose right away what traceries you need/want, don't have to worry about dps, exchanging traceries, deconstruction, finding relics, scrolls of Delving, crystals of remembrance and whatever else the old LI systems needed.
Ancient scripts and enhancement runes are what you need and it has to be seen where and how many you get questing through landscape and/or in instances to see how grindy this system is. Maxing out your traceries will take time and keep players busy but will not be needed except maybe high tier endgame. And resets will come with major updates with higher level traceries. No catch up for years of not playing end game. No serious falling behind. No hundreds of scrolls needed to even be able to play landscape. Having already gotten some enhancement runes from epic quests, everything is tied to level. I can't use them, so they are for later characters. But that also means that I don't have to worry about stockpiling in advance for the latest end game.

Does it require rethinking, sure. We are so used to this monster ILI we have that we don't even remember how complicated the whole system is. Some are so used to stockpiling crystals and scrolls(never even maxed these legacies on even one character) to have the perfect top LI right away, maybe even for the 10 next alts. These advantages will be gone.

And before you complain about the new LIs not being maxed right away with the conversion items, play with them. My 110 LM is more powerful now when before.

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Originally Posted by wispsong

...Other then that imo this system is easier to understand for newcomers, you deal with less steps and parts, can choose right away what traceries you need/want, don't have to worry about dps, exchanging traceries, deconstruction, finding relics, scrolls of Delving, crystals of remembrance and whatever else the old LI systems needed ....

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Some of that is not correct. They may have changed names, but many equivalent items have been replicated with different names. Admittedly, initial set up may be easier than under the imbued system. However, once set up, all that was necessary with an imbued LI was to add star-lit crystals and scrolls of empowerment - only two items you ever needed to worry about. Again, admittedly, far too many scrolls were necessary. However, the large number of scrolls under the imbued system was only required to reach max. Many tiers were unlocked for free upon imbuing an LI (depending to an extent on the LI that was imbued) and when max tier was increased, some were unlocked for free. So if you were satisfied with less than the best, over half of the tiers could have been unlocked without requiring empowerment scrolls. The other thing about the imbued system, legacies didn't have a level range which caused them to be disabled when the character levelled too high. You may be able to set up your new LI somewhat more easily than under the imbued system. However, you'll have to do it over again when you level out of the range of the traceries.

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

Three, in this system you basically reinvented the wheel and made it a square....instead of focusing on what was in place and working.

At bare minimum you owe your players some form of compensation for a horrid rollout that is resulting in high levels of frustration for many players. :mad::mad::mad:

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I know this isn't the answer you're looking for, but after hours of nervously working on it, with an alt, because I was too scared to work on my main... I realized how powerful and what a buff this is. Unlike the old system that dictated what traceries / legacies you got, and then made you expensively change that after imbuing, this way you can just pick what you need. I actually was thinking for Beorning that more traceries would be better. There's a lot of skills and abilities that are not touched by the legacies / traceries and I'd love to see them represented and scaled to every level. But there are still modifiers that are generic that are very awesome, like size increases for AoE, dmg and crit increases for AoE, both damage AoE and Heal AoE are included in Word of Power. You can benefit both your Heal AoE and your Bees. I'm not sure I ever had that ability before. If I did, it was too obscure for me to figure out.

I wasn't frustrated, I was being careful, but I am seeing the benefits right away. I'm going back today to work on my main.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Trixie_Me

I am grateful that this underfunded treasure of a game didn't spend unnecessary dev time/money to a one-time event that you will never repeat. I'm grateful that they've done such a good job with the new LIs and that people in-game are so pleased with the results, even if the process is laborious.

Leave it to the forums to complain about a job well done, all things considered.

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It was good they were able to finally get a Legendary Item Revamp out.

How it was handled was beyond subpar and it is pathetic that not even basic Tutorial Instructions were not available in-game with Update 30.3 to help ensure as smooth as a transition as possible.

I personally saw 2 dozen people state that they tried to start messing with the New Legendary Item System, looked at everything, they just gonna stop and log out and some even stating they might need to find a new game or at the very least stay away from LOTRO for a time.



First Impressions are everything and SSG failed hard here and you don't get a second chance when it comes to First Impressions especially in Gaming.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DKenny

Some of that is not correct. They may have changed names, but many equivalent items have been replicated with different names. Admittedly, initial set up may be easier than under the imbued system. However, once set up, all that was necessary with an imbued LI was to add star-lit crystals and scrolls of empowerment - only two items you ever needed to worry about. Again, admittedly, far too many scrolls were necessary. However, the large number of scrolls under the imbued system was only required to reach max. Many tiers were unlocked for free upon imbuing an LI (depending to an extent on the LI that was imbued) and when max tier was increased, some were unlocked for free. So if you were satisfied with less than the best, over half of the tiers could have been unlocked without requiring empowerment scrolls. The other thing about the imbued system, legacies didn't have a level range which caused them to be disabled when the character levelled too high. You may be able to set up your new LI somewhat more easily than under the imbued system. However, you'll have to do it over again when you level out of the range of the traceries.

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I think I said this before, it is this level range that forces a reset like with the Moria LI where the whole weapon was replaced. And that is needed to prevent this new system to run rogue again. The traceries also overlap which is better then the Moria system. This system, once set up is like essences, you overwrite with better traceries if you find them but don't really have to do much before cap. And you can't stockpile for that either which puts everybody at a relatively same starting point every so often. I just have to play with it and see how it works out for levelling from scratch, at cap etc. Where to get new traceries, ancient scripts, enhancement runes and in what quantities. These are all unknowns and only through play will we find it out. I know the ILI bogged me down and I wasn't going to grind crystals again but my LM LI conversion has me made confident that I can tackle Mordor and beyond. And my mostly purple tracerie are just 330/349.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Harvain

It was good they were able to finally get a Legendary Item Revamp out.

How it was handled was beyond subpar and it is pathetic that not even basic Tutorial Instructions were not available in-game with Update 30.3 to help ensure as smooth as a transition as possible.

I personally saw 2 dozen people state that they tried to start messing with the New Legendary Item System, looked at everything, they just gonna stop and log out and some even stating they might need to find a new game or at the very least stay away from LOTRO for a time.



First Impressions are everything and SSG failed hard here and you don't get a second chance when it comes to First Impressions especially in Gaming.

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This is some awfully heavy weather. Since when has any mmo relied entirely on in game instructions? We check if servers are up on websites, we go to a wiki for advice when stuck on quests, we seek lore online, we read Dadi's guides, we check Twitter to see if the game is back after an update, we check reddit to see if anyone's asked a deep question recently, we check the forums for the release notes....

I agree they should put instructions in there. But maybe they're waiting because they want those instructions to be useful and widely read. How about you learn the system and suggest good concise written ingame instructions they could add?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gripply

This is some awfully heavy weather. Since when has any mmo relied entirely on in game instructions? We check if servers are up on websites, we go to a wiki for advice when stuck on quests, we seek lore online, we read Dadi's guides, we check Twitter to see if the game is back after an update, we check reddit to see if anyone's asked a deep question recently, we check the forums for the release notes....

I agree they should put instructions in there. But maybe they're waiting because they want those instructions to be useful and widely read. How about you learn the system and suggest good concise written ingame instructions they could add?

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Since like ever??? You think all the websites you mentioned existed long before when MMOs first came to be? Also you are forgetting the age range this game has and not all of us are using twitter or reddit. As product owner/developer, if you are introducing a new system you are obligated to explain and show how it works. You don't expect people to run around and figure it out from external resources which could be right or wrong. He put it rightly, it is the first impression. Do you think a new player will be rejoiced from what he will see?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gripply

This is some awfully heavy weather. Since when has any mmo relied entirely on in game instructions? We check if servers are up on websites, we go to a wiki for advice when stuck on quests, we seek lore online, we read Dadi's guides, we check Twitter to see if the game is back after an update, we check reddit to see if anyone's asked a deep question recently, we check the forums for the release notes....

I agree they should put instructions in there. But maybe they're waiting because they want those instructions to be useful and widely read. How about you learn the system and suggest good concise written ingame instructions they could add?

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I spent the better part of October 13th just answering questions people had and probably answered the same several questions dozens of times.

Personally, for me, the New LI System is not hard. I can easily within maybe 2 to 3 paragraphs of 3 to 4 sentences each explain what a Player needs to do with this transition.

There were already instructions in other forms as an overall guideline out there which SSG had available and knew would likely be obstacles to Players.

Taking the time to provide 3 to 5 in-game pop-ups with some Tutorial Information to ensure a Player had visible info both in terms of Pictures & Written Info to help with the transition would have helped ensure a smoother First Impression especially when arguably one of LOTRO's most Key Systems and among it's Oldest Systems was getting such a radical change.



It's too late now for such and doesn't seem likely in the coming weeks for such.

This is just another area the SSG LOTRO Team needs to improve about themselves so they can improve what they do to LOTRO especially if 2022 is gonna be a year where they want to do more work akin to if not to the extent of what they did with the New Legendary Item System.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wispsong

This was something mentioned several times over the years. But as Raninia mentioned one time, if you want the best you should invest in it.

With the right tutorial this conversion would have been a better experience. I went to Rivendell, found the barter/reforger in the room and clicked on her. First there should have been a pop up to guide to Rivendell, second either in this quest or at the barter should have been step to step directions.
Other then that imo this system is easier to understand for newcomers, you deal with less steps and parts, can choose right away what traceries you need/want, don't have to worry about dps, exchanging traceries, deconstruction, finding relics, scrolls of Delving, crystals of remembrance and whatever else the old LI systems needed.
Ancient scripts and enhancement runes are what you need and it has to be seen where and how many you get questing through landscape and/or in instances to see how grindy this system is. Maxing out your traceries will take time and keep players busy but will not be needed except maybe high tier endgame. And resets will come with major updates with higher level traceries. No catch up for years of not playing end game. No serious falling behind. No hundreds of scrolls needed to even be able to play landscape. Having already gotten some enhancement runes from epic quests, everything is tied to level. I can't use them, so they are for later characters. But that also means that I don't have to worry about stockpiling in advance for the latest end game.

Does it require rethinking, sure. We are so used to this monster ILI we have that we don't even remember how complicated the whole system is. Some are so used to stockpiling crystals and scrolls(never even maxed these legacies on even one character) to have the perfect top LI right away, maybe even for the 10 next alts. These advantages will be gone.

And before you complain about the new LIs not being maxed right away with the conversion items, play with them. My 110 LM is more powerful now when before.

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I suspect nearly the entirety of your post will in the future get turned on its head. Even the first line.

This new weapon system is overflowing with future potential monetization. I'm not one to let the cat out of the bag, but whats the difference when I can see the cat jump out over a mile away?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sapienze

I suspect nearly the entirety of your post will in the future get turned on its head. Even the first line.

This new weapon system is overflowing with future potential monetization. I'm not one to let the cat out of the bag, but whats the difference when I can see the cat jump out over a mile away?

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The old system had MC button and monetization spelled all over it as well. Doesn't mean I ever used it. If what the game gives you is not enough to play the game then just stop and play new characters. I already got several enhancement runes and traceries from quest rewards.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Norwal

I agree whole heatedly. This game is becoming a major attempt at a cash grab. My wife and I have been VIP for 10 plus years and that means very little now. We don't participate in raids so getting high-end kit is a grind, we now have to pay for every upgrade and it looks like we now have to pay to have a decent weapon too. I'm nearly at the end of my charity to these new owners.

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So if you don't raid you don't get a decent weapon?

Is it possible to sell your account? Does anyone want to buy one? I just recently paid my VIP bill. I've been playing this game since day one and have invested tens of thousands of hours and thousands of dollars leveling my toons and weapons. I had plans I invested money in to build my weapons... all gone. This is criminal. What were these people thinking? Obviously this game is being developed for the very few at the expense of many. I have NO desire to be forced to learn and invest in a new system while knowing all my effort and funds invested in the old system were stolen from me and burned to the ground... I'm done... looking for a new game... see ya!

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Originally Posted by Sorhabil

So if you don't raid you don't get a decent weapon?

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"Decent" is highly subjective. It won't be a max weapon, unless you spend MC.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sorhabil

So if you don't raid you don't get a decent weapon?

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You can get Legendary Items akin to what Content you are doing.

If you want be doing Entry Level and possible Tier 2 Raiding, you'll build up to such.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wispsong

I think I said this before, it is this level range that forces a reset like with the Moria LI where the whole weapon was replaced. And that is needed to prevent this new system to run rogue again. The traceries also overlap which is better then the Moria system. This system, once set up is like essences, you overwrite with better traceries if you find them but don't really have to do much before cap. And you can't stockpile for that either which puts everybody at a relatively same starting point every so often. I just have to play with it and see how it works out for levelling from scratch, at cap etc. Where to get new traceries, ancient scripts, enhancement runes and in what quantities. These are all unknowns and only through play will we find it out. I know the ILI bogged me down and I wasn't going to grind crystals again but my LM LI conversion has me made confident that I can tackle Mordor and beyond. And my mostly purple tracerie are just 330/349.

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Well, the difference is the original (Moria) LI system didn't disable your old LI when your character levelled up, it just couldn't be upgraded any further. That's unlike the new LI system where traceries will become disabled when your character levels above the tracery level range. Not so sure about "overlapping". There was an official statement that level 121-130 level range traceries will continue to function up to level 140, but that was an exception. So at lower levels you'll have to get replacements as soon as you out level the level range, or your LI will be crippled. That's not how the original LI or imbued LI systems worked. Not sure why you believe that having to regrind to replace / rebuild traceries will be an improvement over the old system.

I've read that when you enhance your traceries you're actually upgrading the slot on the LI, not the tracery itself. So for example, if you enhance the tracery in slot 1, but not in slot two, then remove and swap the traceries, the previously slot 2 tracery that is now in slot 1 will become the enhanced one, while the formerly slot 1 tracery now in slot 2 will not be enhanced. So if enhancement is tied to the LI slot, not the tracery in it, then won't enhancement simply build up over time? And then there won't really be a "reset" in the sense that you mean, it's simply traceries themselves that will need to be replaced. Whatever enhancement you did, or failed to do, will be carried forward.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Makawulf

Since like ever??? You think all the websites you mentioned existed long before when MMOs first came to be? Also you are forgetting the age range this game has and not all of us are using twitter or reddit. As product owner/developer, if you are introducing a new system you are obligated to explain and show how it works. You don't expect people to run around and figure it out from external resources which could be right or wrong. He put it rightly, it is the first impression. Do you think a new player will be rejoiced from what he will see?

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If you're having this little fun and are this miserable, you should stop trying to play this game. It's obviously not bringing you joy. It's a game. You've suggested an improvement. Good for you.

Why does the existence of a cash option = a cash grab in the minds of some players? Is it the youngest players who think this? The ones who need permission to spend anything? FYI I haven't spent a penny on Mithril to create my new LI's, and they're better than my old ones. You're missing something great.

Edit: They're not even maxed, they're still better than my old ones.

Edit 2: You're missing out... you're missing ouuut! :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gripply

Why does the existence of a cash option = a cash grab in the minds of some players? Is it the youngest players who think this? The ones who need permission to spend anything? FYI I haven't spent a penny on Mithril to create my new LI's, and they're better than my old ones. You're missing something great.

Edit: They're not even maxed, they're still better than my old ones.

Edit 2: You're missing out... you're missing ouuut! :P

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To the extent that that's true now, it doesn't mean it will carry forward that way. Content typically gets balanced against the best available.

When they introduced trait trees with the Helm's Deep, there was a lot of hate. Part of the way they mitigated the hate was by making DPS, pretty much across the classes, OP relative to mobs. As a hunter, being squishy didn't really matter so much because mobs could easily be mowed down before they could come close, even if they couldn't be / you failed to pull them one-at-a-time. But guess what, afterwards it was deemed that DPS was OP, and mobs needed to be buffed. Oh, and then partial BPE was changed such that finesse couldn't completely mitigate the effects, because that "made more sense". Suddenly it wasn't easy / possible to mow down all the mobs before they got to a squishy hunter.

So yeah, your less than max new system LI may be more powerful than your old ones at point in time, however, being less than max might not be so great going forward.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sorhabil

So if you don't raid you don't get a decent weapon?

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You'll find that your new weapon is much more powerful than the old one, on my hunter I got a little over 50% extra dps. Most of the power you get from item level (read: reforges). Don't worry, just try.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jackrabbit4512

Is it possible to sell your account? Does anyone want to buy one? I just recently paid my VIP bill. I've been playing this game since day one and have invested tens of thousands of hours and thousands of dollars leveling my toons and weapons. I had plans I invested money in to build my weapons... all gone. This is criminal. What were these people thinking? Obviously this game is being developed for the very few at the expense of many. I have NO desire to be forced to learn and invest in a new system while knowing all my effort and funds invested in the old system were stolen from me and burned to the ground... I'm done... looking for a new game... see ya!

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Probably. It is also very much against TOS, so if the buyer gets caught he'll get a permaban as a bonus.
Maybe you can gain interest from a certain magician on the Indian subcontinent ...

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Originally Posted by DKenny

Not so sure about "overlapping".

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Neither am I, but the way I understood it is this: in the future you should see drops of LI stuff for your level cap and the next, so by the time you near current cap you will be already hoarding towards the next cap.

Quote:

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I've read that when you enhance your traceries you're actually upgrading the slot on the LI, not the tracery itself. So for example, if you enhance the tracery in slot 1, but not in slot two, then remove and swap the traceries, the previously slot 2 tracery that is now in slot 1 will become the enhanced one, while the formerly slot 1 tracery now in slot 2 will not be enhanced.

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Confirmed on BR 4, haven't tried on live yet.

I like the change, but only because I'm the type to put up with a lot of jank and bad UI and minimal instructions if I think the bones of something are solid with good customization. (In other words, I play Dwarf Fortress)

Pros: It's way easier now to get a functional LI on an alt. Starlit crystals have essentially been replaced by basic gold costs when you reforge. Empowerment runes are far less important than empowerment scrolls, and though you need more of them, I'm absolutely swimming in them already. Having legacies and relics and titles turned into traceries which are repainted essences (that have the functionality(!) of being able to carry set bonuses) is good design. Tracery replacement scrolls from your standard weekly mission quest are easier to come by than relic removal or imbued legacy replacement scrolls. Class traceries not being tied to weapon vs item is great.

Cons I overlook: UI is still beta and it's awful because of it. All the MC buttons are annoying--but you dont need to spend MC so whatever. There are no real instructions--I understand it fully only because I played the beta and frankly because I take to things easier/am more savvy about game systems than most LotRO players.


It does feel like 1 step forward for LIs, 2 steps backwards for class balance. The latter is far far more important to me as a player

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DKenny

Well, the difference is the original (Moria) LI system didn't disable your old LI when your character levelled up, it just couldn't be upgraded any further. That's unlike the new LI system where traceries will become disabled when your character levels above the tracery level range. Not so sure about "overlapping". There was an official statement that level 121-130 level range traceries will continue to function up to level 140, but that was an exception. So at lower levels you'll have to get replacements as soon as you out level the level range, or your LI will be crippled. That's not how the original LI or imbued LI systems worked. Not sure why you believe that having to regrind to replace / rebuild traceries will be an improvement over the old system.

I've read that when you enhance your traceries you're actually upgrading the slot on the LI, not the tracery itself. So for example, if you enhance the tracery in slot 1, but not in slot two, then remove and swap the traceries, the previously slot 2 tracery that is now in slot 1 will become the enhanced one, while the formerly slot 1 tracery now in slot 2 will not be enhanced. So if enhancement is tied to the LI slot, not the tracery in it, then won't enhancement simply build up over time? And then there won't really be a "reset" in the sense that you mean, it's simply traceries themselves that will need to be replaced. Whatever enhancement you did, or failed to do, will be carried forward.

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The exception with the 121-130 level range is that you can level your tracery into the next range, not that it keeps working into the next range. All traceries work into the subsequent level range, and aren't disabled there.

The advice to just "keep doing what you normal do concerning ILIs before the update" was some of the worst advice anyone could offer. Making an extra two 412 item level ILS made a huge difference. Not publishing details of the LI conversion will have suckered plenty more.

The returns we did get show how poorly understood was the grief we had suffered with ILIs. The huge potential damage increase of IoLs makes a mockery of current content difficulty/balance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DroboTheDwarf

First and foremost you can tell there was very little user input asked for or taken on this, it appears to be an internal decision to make legendries as monetizable as possible. There are opportunities to spend MC everywhere you look.

Second, There has been little to NO guidance or what to do once you actually click the appraise button. There are no guiding prompts in game, nothing explaining what to do after. There is a website link that explains things at a very high level but not enough to keep users from wasting their appraised currencies.

Three, in this system you basically reinvented the wheel and made it a square....instead of focusing on what was in place and working.

At bare minimum you owe your players some form of compensation for a horrid rollout that is resulting in high levels of frustration for many players. :mad::mad::mad:

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You had a whole month to check and read up about this, how do you think most people that love this feel? Great most people check BR out, and it worked in their favor, now i spent a lot of yesterday explaining how the new system works, and no MC is fine, your high standards, and your criticizing something that they talked about a year ago was getting placed, and now you think we need compensation sure, I would agree on that feeling but, the way it works is simply we do not need compensation at all, the appraisal process could add more traceries items but it doesn't no big deal I gain 20% more dps and 40% more morale i am fine, I love the new system I spent the week in BR seeing how it will work and plan accordingly, and this system btw is not made for 5th graders, so, take your frustration somewhere else.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gripply

Why does the existence of a cash option = a cash grab in the minds of some players? Is it the youngest players who think this? The ones who need permission to spend anything? FYI I haven't spent a penny on Mithril to create my new LI's, and they're better than my old ones. You're missing something great.

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Yeah that kind of take really is the worst. They have no idea what's going on to even say that, just a knee jerk reaction at MC buttons.

Bad monetization in an MMO is when you have to pay to get boosts & gear you can't acquire (at a realistic rate) by playing. You could level that charge at the monetization for solvents (from spring 2020 to W3P release, anyway) and for +5% w/e buff tomes, which are attainable at a trickle by playing the game. But these empowerment runes, traceries, even tracery replacement scrolls, you can get by playing and the MC is merely for shortcuts.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Braer

The advice to just "keep doing what you normal do concerning ILIs before the update" was some of the worst advice anyone could offer. Making an extra two 412 item level ILS made a huge difference. Not publishing details of the LI conversion will have suckered plenty more.

The returns we did get show how poorly understood was the grief we had suffered with ILIs. The huge potential damage increase of IoLs makes a mockery of current content difficulty/balance.

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Indeed it was horrible. I was helping as many people as I could in streams and in discords for the prep work before the update. We had really poor communication and just outright BAD advice and I was trying to make it so people didn't get left out in the cold.


This is what I made that I was sharing around to help people prepare their NON imbued third agers:

Quote:

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With the information we have currently, here's what I recommend doing BEFORE Update 30.3/October 13th Patch:

1) For every character able to use LIs (level 51-130) equip third age LIs into non populated tabs.
2) Apply a Scroll of Delving to them to allow them to get to level 70 instead of the default 60.
3) Dump LI Experience into them and reforge them until they are level 70/completely reforged.
4) Do not apply Star-lits or Crystals of remembrance to them. They do nothing for the payout on an unimbued LI.
5) If your "extra tabs" of third agers are level 100, do NOT imbue them. You get a lesser payout of Cyan Enhancement Runes when imbuing them.
6) Also, make sure your MAIN Imbued LIs (first agers/whatever you use) have the experience maxed. The more experience in your LIs the more Ancient Script you get in return as well as enhancement runes.
7) If you care about a well set up bridle... set it up NOW. Come the 13th you will not be able to mess with or reforge/decon third age bridles to get legacy scrolls for them.
8) If you have a ton of Ancient-ithil coins from Throne of the Dread Terror it MIGHT be a good idea to cash them out for Scrolls of Empowerment or Star-lits. We do NOT know what we'll get for them in return for a barter as SSG is not telling us but these coins will be mostly useless now. You will only be able to convert them to Morgul Crests and barter for level 101 Enhancement Runes and Tracery boxes across the way at the Pelennor instance vendor.

NOTE: When the patch goes live and if you are at or near level 120, do NOT convert your old LIs until you reach level 121+. Level to 121-130 because converting LIs give you the exact same amount of components in those level ranges. (i.e. don't immediately convert a level 120 valar'd character's LIs. Level one level to 121 and then do it. The reason why is because if you are level 120, it'll give you level 116 enhancement runes rather than the level 121 enhancement runes.

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This is what I made that I was sharing around to help people prepare their imbued third agers (did this one on Stine's Twitch Stream):

Quote:

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So if you have a ton of Ancient-ithil coins, Star-lits, Scrolls of Empowerment, Heritage runes, etc.. and want to know what to do to prepare for the maximum payout with minimal effort to use up those resources, do this:

Minimal Imbued Steps:
1) Get a third ager
2) Apply scroll of delving
3) Apply crystal of remembrance (if you have them)
4) Apply Stat legacy (Tier 4 agi/vit/might/will/fate etc..) to the crystal of remembrance blank spot (saves 2 empowerment scrolls)
5) Max out experience to 70 and reforge it all the way
6) Apply points to max out the DPS/Healing/main legacy (first on the list) on the LI. Only this one counts.
7) Imbue the item
8) Apply 15 Star-lits to get the dps/healing/main legacy stat to Tier 54
9) Apply SoEs to get every legacy to Tier 54
10) Apply heritage runes to max out experience

This gives the following return:

Minimal Imbued Total: 5400 Ancient Scripts, 270 Purple Enhancement Runes, 36 Cyan Enhancement Runes, 9 Shattered Traceries
vs.
Max Unimbued Total: 3600 Ancient Scripts, 150 Purple Enhancement Runes, 50 Cyan Enhancement Runes, 5 Shattered Traceries
Maximum Imbued Total: 5400 Ancient Scripts, 270 Purple Enhancement Runes, 86 Cyan Enhancement Runes, 9 Shattered Traceries

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...rtImbuedLI.png

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Originally Posted by ChromiteSwiftpaw

Indeed it was horrible. I was helping as many people as I could in streams and in discords for the prep work before the update. We had really poor communication and just outright BAD advice and I was trying to make it so people didn't get left out in the cold.


This is what I made that I was sharing around to help people prepare their NON imbued third agers:



This is what I made that I was sharing around to help people prepare their imbued third agers (did this one on Stine's Twitch Stream):

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I was only guessing what I needed to do from the BR feedback, only got more accurate details after the event, so I lucked out at getting over the 408 cut off and the 8 Fragment returns. Pulled an all-nighter getting my 32 ILIs count up to 52 First Ager ILIs, I was doing Dol Dailies for Delving Scrolls too... then a load of clicking. The 5 minute to shutdown a blessed relief and the sleep of the dead... Woke after the hotfix announcement.

Those out in the cold are going to stay that way because any easy access to Ancient Scripts will bring Raid Farms. Until SSG address the Raid Farm mechanic with some technical expertise rather than numpty thinking that's not going to happen.

Whilst I realise that updating all the quests to provide specific updated rewards will take some time, why couldn't the two most basic rewards in the game have been updated … Legendary Item Experience and Runes of Legend.

Almost every post Level 50 quest awards Legendary Item Experience which now does nothing. Runes continue to drop frequently and are also useles but because of a possible future trade-in I don't want to trash.

Surely by now the Item Experience reward could have been:

Modified to increase enhancement on the new LI's
Replaced with something as simple as Ancient Script or Enhancement Runes (although this could be a problem as they are level bound)
Simply removed (as it does nothing)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NacMac

Whilst I realise that updating all the quests to provide specific updated rewards will take some time, why couldn't the two most basic rewards in the game have been updated … Legendary Item Experience and Runes of Legend.

Almost every post Level 50 quest awards Legendary Item Experience which now does nothing. Runes continue to drop frequently and are also useles but because of a possible future trade-in I don't want to trash.

Surely by now the Item Experience reward could have been:

Modified to increase enhancement on the new LI's
Replaced with something as simple as Ancient Script or Enhancement Runes (although this could be a problem as they are level bound)
Simply removed (as it does nothing)

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I was thinking about this today and realized that it's probably because of bridles. They have ADDED things to quests instead of REPLACING things because it's probably safer to do that for now. Deeds also provide XP Heritage Runes, even in the most current content. I'm only guessing that this is to help us convert them to something useful when Gundabad is released. We won't be able to Appraise and get a big rush of Enhancements or Scripts ever again.

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Originally Posted by Makawulf

Since like ever??? You think all the websites you mentioned existed long before when MMOs first came to be? Also you are forgetting the age range this game has and not all of us are using twitter or reddit. As product owner/developer, if you are introducing a new system you are obligated to explain and show how it works. You don't expect people to run around and figure it out from external resources which could be right or wrong. He put it rightly, it is the first impression. Do you think a new player will be rejoiced from what he will see?

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You clearly never played EQ because that is EXACTLY how it worked. If you wanted to craft something you ( or someone else who shared their info ) would put ingredients in your crafting kit and hit the combine button. If it worked you now had a recipe. If it didn't then you knew that combination was not a new recipe. Lots of trial and error and discovery. No one is "obligated" to hold your hand in an MMO. Explore, ask questions, make use of the community resources. Did you even read the patch notes??!! This stuff was very straightforward.