Tolkien Trivia, Revived

[Morthaur]

Where was the dome of stars?

[aleczander]

Top of Minas Tirith? I can't remember a name besides ecthelion right now...

[Arasilion]

Where was the dome of stars?

Do you mean "who" because that's what Elrond's name translates to.

[Boraxxe]

Where was the dome of stars?

Looks like there were 2 structures referred to by that name.

1. In Valinor created by Varda (Elebereth).
2. In Osgiliath where a palantir was stored.

[aleczander]

Oh yes, i remember, the dome was collapsed during the siege of osgiliath right before the LOTR started

[Boraxxe]

'This is sharper than thy tongue. Try but once more to usurp my place and the love of my father, and maybe it will rid the Noldor of one who seeks to be the master of thralls.'

Who said the above, and who was being addressed?

[Vilnas]

Feanor to Fingolfin.

[Boraxxe]

Feanor to Fingolfin.

Right and right.

Who was being referred to as thralls?

[Vilnas]

Wasn't he referring to the Noldor as being thralls to the Valar? As I recall this all grew out of Morgoth's campaign of lies designed to make the Noldor restless in Valinor and resentful of the Valar for keeping them from their rightful destiny as masters of their own realms in Middle-earth. I believe Feanor began speaking out against the "yoke" they suffered under the Valar, although I don't recall whether he was to the point of pressuring his father Finwe to do something about it. I guess he must have, because Fingolfin was quietly urging their father against doing anything rash (or maybe he was simply asking Finwe to try and restrain Feanor). Feanor came upon Fingolfin speaking alone with Finwe (although as I recall there was nothing sneaky about the encounter on the part of Fingolfin) and it led to Feanor drawing a sword on Fingolfin and speaking those words. I think that was the first time an elf threatened another with a weapon in Valinor, and it earned Feanor a stern reprimand from the Valar (which in turn led to a festival being called to patch things up, which led to Morgoth and Ungoliant having easy access to the Two Trees, Finwe being slain in defense of the Silmarils, etc.). In the end, the entire history of the Noldor and Middle-earth in general would have been much happier if their best and brightest hadn't been such a complete a$s.

[Boraxxe]

Yes, you remember it correctly.
Something that has always sort of bothered me about this part of the tale: It is told that Melkor taught the Noldor of arms and "spoke to them concerning weapons" and that they began to make swords, axes and spears.
It seems strange to me that the Noldor would just take up this smithying when there had been no mention of the use of such tools up to that point. Why would folk that had never been exposed to fighting take so easily to weapon smithing?

[Vilnas]

I agree. I understand that they were excellent craftsmen, but I have a hard time understanding how they were persuaded, in the absence of any manifest threat, to take up the production of tools the sole purpose of which was violence against either their peers or their mentors. Perhaps the point can be saved by assuming that Melkor convinced them that the weapons would be needed when they returned to Middle-earth to take up their destiny.

[Morthaur]

You make one magic talking sword and it gets lonely, or you get sick of talking to it , ("talking swords are pretty one dimensional in their needs") so you make it a friend, then some talking dagger children, pretty soon you have yourself a whole armorey of talking swords looking for a fight.

[Cutholen]

High princes were Feanor and Fingolfin, the elder sons of Finwe, honoured by all in Aman; but now they grew proud and jealous each of his rights and possessions. Then Melkor set new lies abroad in Eldamar, and whispers came to Feanor that Fingolfin and his sons were plotting to usurp the leadership of Finwe and of the elder line of Feanor, and to supplant them by leave of the Valar; for the Valar were ill-pleased that the Silmarils lay in Tirion and were not committed to their keeping. But to Fingolfin and Finarfin it was said: 'Beware! Small love has the proud son of Miriel ever had for the children of Indis. Now he has become great, and he has his father in his hand. It will not be long before he drives you forth from Tuna!'

And when Melkor saw that these lies were smouldering, and that pride and anger were awake among the Noldor, he spoke to them concerning weapons ...

So first Melkor persuaded Feanor and Fingolfin that the other was plotting against that which was theirs by right. Then he casually mentioned a way they could retain what was theirs against the plots of the other.

[seltin97]

What was the sindarin for Misty mountains. interesting to note its not an EXACT translations. Bonus if anyone knows the correct quenya.(I dont.)

[Boraxxe]

What was the sindarin for Misty mountains. interesting to note its not an EXACT translations. Bonus if anyone knows the correct quenya.(I dont.)

Hithaeglir

Couldn't find any quenya for it.

[Boraxxe]

What would you find beyond the Merlock Mountains?

[Cutholen]

Mewlips, but only if you go on through the spider-shadows, the Marsh of Tode, and the wood of hanging trees. Also, you find gore crows.

[Boraxxe]

Ok, I'll have to give it to you....even if you didn't mention the gallows-weed....

/beginskulking

[Cutholen]

Who or what was the oldest living creature on Middle-earth at the end of the third age, and approximately how old was she/he/it? Bonus points for giving both possibly correct answers on the age, and explaining why they differ.

[sir-rinthian]

Who or what was the oldest living creature on Middle-earth at the end of the third age, and approximately how old was she/he/it? Bonus points for giving both possibly correct answers on the age, and explaining why they differ.

That would either be Treebeard (unless the trees he spoke of count as living creatures), or Tom Bombadil.

I'm inclined to say the latter, as Tom has memories of times seemingly before Morgoth left the earth and came back as a dark lord, making him older then the ents. Treebeard is definitely the oldest of the 4 normal races though, since Tom doesn't exactly fit in any of them.

[aleczander]

That would either be Treebeard (unless the trees he spoke of count as living creatures), or Tom Bombadil.

I'm inclined to say the latter, as Tom has memories of times seemingly before Morgoth left the earth and came back as a dark lord, making him older then the ents. Treebeard is definitely the oldest of the 4 normal races though, since Tom doesn't exactly fit in any of them.

"Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn (presumably Treebeard)
He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless - before the Dark Lord (Melkor) came from Outside."
Don't know exactly how long the first six ages of the world came to..

[sir-rinthian]

(presumably Treebeard)

Unless he was speaking mataphorically, (and tolkien didn't seem to be a metaphor fan) he can't have meant Treebeard. After Treebeard found Merry and Pippen, he told them that there are trees in Fanghorn Forest that are older then he is. The question remains, do trees count as living creatures in this case? If so, Treebeard assuredly is not the eldest, wheras Tom is older then the trees that are older then Treebeard.

[Boraxxe]

Could Sauron or Gandalf (or perhaps, Saruman) be older than Tom?

[sir-rinthian]

Could Sauron or Gandalf (or perhaps, Saruman) be older than Tom?

Of course they're older then Tom (unless he's a Maia...) They may not have all been on Middle-earth as long, but they've existed since before Middle-earth was even given shape.

[canadian_wizard]

QUESTION: Name the swords of the following;

- Gandalf
- Aragorn
- Elrond
- Arwen

BONUS: Provide Elvish translations of their respective owners' names/titles.

Bon chance!


--canadian