Bad masteries! BAD!

[head0nfire]

Masteries and non-attack gambits like Conviction and Shield Mastery turn on auto attacks. When you want to build a gambit before breaking a mob out of a mez, this sucks. Can we change/fix it please? Ty.

And yes, I know you can always switch targets, but that's just a work around, and sometimes you don't have time to do that. And it wouldn't be hard for Turbine to change this. Burglar tricks and most (if not all) LM tactical attacks already don't enable auto-attacks. Could just copy the coding from those skills and add it into some of ours.

[sunaris]

Masteries and non-attack gambits like Conviction and Shield Mastery turn on auto attacks. When you want to build a gambit before breaking a mob out of a mez, this sucks. Can we change/fix it please? Ty.

And yes, I know you can always switch targets, but that's just a work around, and sometimes you don't have time to do that. And it wouldn't be hard for Turbine to change this. Burglar tricks and most (if not all) LM tactical attacks already don't enable auto-attacks. Could just copy the coding from those skills and add it into some of ours.

wait....you're saying that you are not intentionally breaking mez's? well that's boring

no but seriously, i believe it does so because if you weren't using masteries then, you would have had to shield bash and wardens taunt, both of which start auto attack. So even though it does it quicker you get the same effect.

[Unixbomber]

Have you tried disabling "Skills can enable default attack" in your combat options?
It might help.

[Rainyman]

Have you tried disabling "Skills can enable default attack" in your combat options?
It might help.

It's still an issue. I hadn't noticed it before, but I think it would be preferable if masteries did not affect your autoattack state, as other nondamaging attack skills do.

[Regero]

frankly i have not noticed that masteries or non offensive attacks turn on the auto attack. I am failry certain they dont because in the moors i have often found myself wishing that my masteries WOULD turn on the auto attack, just so that i dont have to worry about hitting my opponent with an attck to turn the auto-attack on.

[Denron]

I've never found that masteries turn on auto attack. I've used conviction on while on mobs I can't be hitting, like the DN fight where the boss heals if you hit him. Also noticed that when I use a mastery while running into a mob I don't start attacking till I hit a real skill.

[Dalthyn]

frankly i have not noticed that masteries or non offensive attacks turn on the auto attack. I am failry certain they dont because in the moors i have often found myself wishing that my masteries WOULD turn on the auto attack, just so that i dont have to worry about hitting my opponent with an attck to turn the auto-attack on.

I've never found that masteries turn on auto attack. I've used conviction on while on mobs I can't be hitting, like the DN fight where the boss heals if you hit him. Also noticed that when I use a mastery while running into a mob I don't start attacking till I hit a real skill.

It does, look again. I just confirmed it by attacking a trash mob, turning off autoattack, and hitting a mastery, then I began autoattacking again automatically.

[sunaris]

you have to be in combat to use the masteries, so i would assume auto attack would be on.

[Dalthyn]

you have to be in combat to use the masteries, so i would assume auto attack would be on.

You can toggle them off in combat. Masteries toggle autoattack back on.

[head0nfire]

Yeah I used to have auto attacks off before SoM, but I've found that with the new combat system we can do more DPS because auto attacks tend to sneak in between our gambits and masteries. It seems kind of wrong that we would have to choose between more DPS and more group functionality

[vodspeedkills]

Yeah I noticed this in DN as well, we made it through the fight thankfully. I didn't even realize that it was me hitting him. Uber noob! Now I just work around it, back up, hit conviction, turn off auto, step forward.

[Dalthyn]

Yeah I used to have auto attacks off before SoM, but I've found that with the new combat system we can do more DPS because auto attacks tend to sneak in between our gambits and masteries. It seems kind of wrong that we would have to choose between more DPS and more group functionality

Well, you can still leave them off and manually target them on when desired. Personally when I need to stop attacking a mob, I just target myself, then hit a previous target keybind when I need to go back to attacking. Yeah, it's two different buttons to toggle it rather than one, but it works great.

[Graalx2]

Ok fine, I'll fix masteries and non-attack skills to not change the auto-attack state. They won't toggle auto-attack on but won't toggle it off if it's already on. It probably won't be in this patch though.

[gildhur]

Why doesn't Turbine listen to their players?!?!

[Forohir]

Ok fine, I'll fix masteries and non-attack skills to not change the auto-attack state. They won't toggle auto-attack on but won't toggle it off if it's already on. It probably won't be in this patch though.

Where were you Graalx when I javelin'd a bug on The Lost One while trying to build Conviction, and my group yelled at me until I cried?! Huh?!

More seriously, uhm--reading the above responses, I do not see any consensus that this is what the players want--even in this thread of like 10 or so responses. Yes, some players advoctated for Masteries to not start auto-attacks, but other players stated they prefer that behavior.

Considering all players have the ability to disable skills engaging auto-attacks, I would think that the proper course would be to leave the behavior as-is.

[Locklear93]

Where were you Graalx when I javelin'd a bug on The Lost One while trying to build Conviction, and my group yelled at me until I cried?! Huh?!

More seriously, uhm--reading the above responses, I do not see any consensus that this is what the players want--even in this thread of like 10 or so responses. Yes, some players advoctated for Masteries to not start auto-attacks, but other players stated they prefer that behavior.

Considering all players have the ability to disable skills engaging auto-attacks, I would think that the proper course would be to leave the behavior as-is.

This. Don't remove player choice to fix a problem we can fix ourselves.

[Rainyman]

Where were you Graalx when I javelin'd a bug on The Lost One while trying to build Conviction, and my group yelled at me until I cried?! Huh?!

More seriously, uhm--reading the above responses, I do not see any consensus that this is what the players want--even in this thread of like 10 or so responses. Yes, some players advoctated for Masteries to not start auto-attacks, but other players stated they prefer that behavior.

Considering all players have the ability to disable skills engaging auto-attacks, I would think that the proper course would be to leave the behavior as-is.

/smackhead

The change is good. Think about it. When you're doing a mastery, you are preparing an attack, not performing anything damaging. If for example, you are queuing up WT on a mezzed creep in the moors. You will toggle your autoattack and break the mezz before WT is built. Having ONE additional auto-attack isn't worth the trouble it might cause with CC, especially since autoattack would be enabled by WT or the first damaging skill you use. Having "skills enable auto-attacks" enabled is preferable in every situation because you don't have to toggle it every time you enter combat. Disabling it is a solution to a problem that should not exist with the option enabled.

If wardens had a decent mezz skill, you would be able to understand. It's like (for an LM) if Ancient Craft enabled autoattack.

In general, I think most skills should follow, and do follow:
Mezz/root/fear: disable auto-attack
Stun/CJ: enable auto-attack
Damaging: enable auto-attack
Non-damaging: auto-attack unaffected (do nothing)



On that note: Ambush ought to enable autoattack. Currently it does not.

[speaksoftly]

In general, I think most skills should follow, and do follow:
Mezz/root/fear: disable auto-attack
Stun/CJ: enable auto-attack
Damaging: enable auto-attack
Non-damaging: auto-attack unaffected (do nothing)

This. I agree, masteries shouldn't enable AAs, if you want AAs started up, but can't get close enough to stab your target, just toss a javelin at them. People shouldn't have to disable auto-AAs so that non-damaging attacks remain non-damaging.

[Rdeacon]

Dang, Graal works fast. Maybe I can get him to make lore-master offensive skills (like Burning Embers) enable auto attack.

[Telcharan]

At present, to use masteries without activating auto-attack people need to shut off the auto-attack options in combat options, and then turn it on again later if they want it, which is highly inconvenient. If this was fixed, to turn auto-attacks on while using masteries, people would have to...use javelin-toss. Or any other combat skill. At most, slightly inconvenient. I'd go with the second option.

[AshtrayX]

At present, to use masteries without activating auto-attack people need to shut off the auto-attack options in combat options, and then turn it on again later if they want it, which is highly inconvenient. If this was fixed, to turn auto-attacks on while using masteries, people would have to...use javelin-toss. Or any other combat skill. At most, slightly inconvenient. I'd go with the second option.

I agree with this. The second option sounds way better to me.

[Sandriell]

Where were you Graalx when I javelin'd a bug on The Lost One while trying to build Conviction, and my group yelled at me until I cried?! Huh?!

More seriously, uhm--reading the above responses, I do not see any consensus that this is what the players want--even in this thread of like 10 or so responses. Yes, some players advoctated for Masteries to not start auto-attacks, but other players stated they prefer that behavior.

Considering all players have the ability to disable skills engaging auto-attacks, I would think that the proper course would be to leave the behavior as-is.

My guess is that this is less about changing it for what the player (OP) wants and more about changing it to bring it in line with how other class' skills work. Consistency is good, mm'kay?

[sunaris]

Ok fine, I'll fix masteries and non-attack skills to not change the auto-attack state. They won't toggle auto-attack on but won't toggle it off if it's already on. It probably won't be in this patch though.

I think i'm fine with this idea, but would understand why it enables auto attack. I'm pretty easy to please, unless you're a champ.....

[head0nfire]

Ok fine, I'll fix masteries and non-attack skills to not change the auto-attack state. They won't toggle auto-attack on but won't toggle it off if it's already on. It probably won't be in this patch though.

Thanks Graal, we appreciate this

P.S. You responded to this thread with a yes/no answer, which automatically makes you the best dev right now. The big Turbine bosses should give you a raise

[Corlagon]

My solution is simple for certain situations. I turned off auto attack but I also have my F key set to toggle auto attacks off and on. So when Im in DN for example if I want to Conviction heal someone in combat with masteries without attacking the mob, I simply don't target the mob. So even if it turns on auto attack with the masteries it won't matter I won't be attacking anything. Its a slow way to build Conviction but If you can't attack the mob for a portion of the fight it's not like your doing anything else anyway.