Feedback: New Player Tips for Guardians

[Frelorn]

Over the next few weeks we will be focusing on the classes in our Tell the Community Team threads. In keeping with that theme, we want your help. If you could give one tip to a new player about playing the Guardian class, what would it be?

[karnage320]

Guardians are Tanks, not a DPS class (except in the moors ) -- know your role in the group. Too many Guards think they need to do tons of damage, this is not true. Let DPS classes do DPS, and keep aggro off your healers at all times -- your group will thank you.

[lilearthdragon]

Positioning, positioning, positioning!

One of the pillars of being a good guardian is all about player positioning relative to the mob. In a group, you want to face the mob away from the group. This way any frontal AoE the mob does is only hitting you the tank, and the fellow will only get damaged by full 360 AoEs.

A nice side effect of this, is that the fellowship (especially burglars) will do more damage to a mobs backside.

[Drarin]

Don't wrestle with other guardians. If another guardian is doing fine tanking, don't feel like you have to compete with them. Be ready in case of emergency and watch for those who break off and attack other fellowship members. Your job is to protect your fellowship members, not to take the most damage.

[findorin-gilrain]

Take time out as you level to really learn how your skills attract and keep the attention of monsters and enemies and understand that your job in a group is to do exactly that. (This is not at all intuitive for many new Guardians unlress they have already played the sterotypes in other MMOs)

Also I try to tell new Guardians that it really is fun to stand your ground to big bosses and hordes of monsters and let them bash on you really hard

[Jaunt]

Test, test, test.

If you think getting power back on parries is good, test how many parries you get in the average fight, and how much power you get back. If you think returning damage on blocks is good, see how much damage it is, and how often you block, and what kind of increase to your dps it is. If you think Guardian's Threat vastly increases your thread output, test it and make sure. It was broken for two years before I finally found it and it was fixed.

Test, test and test some more. I know it sucks to have your class's main mechanic an invisible number you can't see, but that just makes the numbers can see all the more important. There are a lot of bad guardians, and you have no easy way to tell the good ones from the bad ones. You have to come to your own conclusions, and if you rely on gut feelings, you're going to be one of those bad guards.

[anwar]

If you group, you are the tank or an off-tank.

When you get close to level cap, absolutely everyone expects a tank and no one cares much about your dps except in that it helps you hold agro.

Don't forget to watch your healer, if he's getting beat on, he can't keep you up. Have a backup, a group member's name to yell out to help the healer, if are you on a really tough one and can't risk losing agro to help him.

You have to remind your group to give you a few seconds to get agro...remember most players spend almost all their time solo and tend to forget the nuances of teamwork.

[Ivaneus]

Your Block chance gets checked first; so until you max your agility and/or hit level cap, use Guardian's Parry!

[rawlingsst7]

Be aggressive. There's no such thing as having too much threat. Especially in AOE situations, use as many skills as you can, as fast as you can. Don't slack off for a minute unless you're out of power. At higher levels you'll have lots of ways to restore power, so get into the habit of using it! Don't rely on Challenge to keep aggro, use those skills! A lot!

[Dom12]

Your Block chance gets checked first; so until you max your agility and/or hit level cap, use Guardian's Parry!

As I said in the other thread you posted this in, this is wrong.

...BPE in this game is additive - there is effectively one roll for BPE. Think of it this way:

You have the following:
Block chance 15%
Parry chance 10%
Evade chance 7%

Per incoming hit, you roll (1-100)
1-68 : you get hit
69-75: Evade
76-85: Parry
86-100: Block

It's not quite that simple, but that's the short version of how BPE works.

[Jaunt]

Dom is correct. And the reason we know this is...yep, you guessed it. Somebody tested it. Just goes to show that testing is vital to knowing what's actually going on.

[Ryvick]

Most important tip of all: Do not worry about dying, Guards die; sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. Death helps us learn how not to die in the future.

[Ivaneus]

As I said in the other thread you posted this in, this is wrong.

Dom is correct. And the reason we know this is...yep, you guessed it. Somebody tested it. Just goes to show that testing is vital to knowing what's actually going on.

Well thanks for telling me, better to only be wrong twice than wrong forever.

I still advise using Parry Stance.

[Drogo1]

I still advise using Parry Stance.

I also advise that, but only because once you have To The King (TTK) you can open a whole lotta Conjunctions for your fellow using the Parry response chain.

Also second the many "Remember Threat, not Damage, is your priority - learn a rotation that includes as many threat skills as possible for tanking situations and realize that tanking in a fellowship is a very different experience from adventuring solo...

[lestat86]

Threat is your friend. Learn how to tank in a group and grab and keep agro. There's nothing more important for a guardian to learn. In end game its super important to be able to hold agro on mobs of up to 8 bad guys without having to rely on an off-tank.

[ebmusicman38]

Positioning, positioning, positioning!

One of the pillars of being a good guardian is all about player positioning relative to the mob. In a group, you want to face the mob away from the group. This way any frontal AoE the mob does is only hitting you the tank, and the fellow will only get damaged by full 360 AoEs.

A nice side effect of this, is that the fellowship (especially burglars) will do more damage to a mobs backside.

Already stated but just want to emphasize this!! Positioning is key, it also helps it keep track of whether or not mobs are aggroed on you. If you are tanking multiple mobs and all but one are facing you....there's a good chance that the one not facing you is aggroed on someone else.

I find it helpful to put both Main Tank and Main DPS as target assists. It makes it easier for them to focus on the same target. Just be sure to let the group know to follow DPS not Tank

[oldbustedjorn]

So many tips!

There are lots of tips about skill rotation but many have been mentioned.

The biggest thing I would advise is to be a team player. You want to control most if not every mob that you are attacking, but it doesn't always need to be that way. Sometime having a champ off-tank a few mobs can be beneficial. Communicate with your fellowship so they know what you can do!


(Oh and if you don't feel like you're able to control aggro in a situation, please post in the forums so we can help you. Guard tanking is so much fun!)

[micmanguy01]

If you're thinking of making a guardian, you want 3 things. High morale (health), high block rating, and high parry rating. Usually in that order. All of your best moves require you to first block or parry an enemy attack before you can use them.

1 Vitality gives you +5 morale.
1 might gives you +2 block rating and +1 parry rating
1 agility gives you +1 parry rating


EDIT:
When choosing your race, the following traits can be unlocked that effect block and parry.
Dwarf: Shield Brawler +2% Block chance
Man: Balance of Man +1% to Evade, Parry, and Block
Elf: Eldar's Grace +75% Parry chance for 10 seconds, 1hr cooldown

[oopsies]

Avoidances, melee/ranged/tactical defence and incoming healing cap at 15% but +% buffs will put you over that cap.

[GeneralPayne1234nil]

Tip #1. 2-handers are for soloing.
Tip#2. 1-handers and a shield are for groups of anysize for you to take aggro and keep the other fellow members safe.
Tip#3.NEVER under any circumstances-believe tht a Guard is a DPS.

[oldbustedjorn]

Tip #1. 2-handers are for soloing.
Tip#2. 1-handers and a shield are for groups of anysize for you to take aggro and keep the other fellow members safe.
Tip#3.NEVER under any circumstances-believe tht a Guard is a DPS.

Another tip from a guardian...

2-handers are for OP, whether soloing or times when block stance isn't needed.
1-handers are for block stance, parry stance and guardian's threat stance, and best used when main tanking or if off-tanking something that hits hard.

There are plenty of times when switching to OP + 2H is a good strategy, not just when soloing. If you are building the perfect raiding group and want to faceroll things as fast as possible - don't run a guard as DPS. If you are in a group that has an MT and you are also in the group, you can run OP as DPS. Will you do as much DPS as a hunter, champ or RK? Probably not. Doesn't mean you can't contribute. Make sure to use stagger from the back of mobs to debuff them! If you think outside the box a little you don't need the perfect group every time.

[Xcal]

So what stat's should a guardian tank be looking for and what priority should you place on them compared to each other?

[Gartyn]

Hey Folks! New to the game and already love it. Long time WoW player here, so i decided to jump on the free wagon again.

As a tank what stats are most important. I have looked but not been able to determine which to be best.

I see Morale (Health)
Might
Agility

As a tank you want to get the most Health as possible, but you want to hit your caps as well. Where should a good focus be for stats?

I remember in WoW Defense could reach a cap to where you could not be destroyed by mob bosses.

Is there such a thing here?

[oaxaca_dan]

I also advise that, but only because once you have To The King (TTK) you can open a whole lotta Conjunctions for your fellow using the Parry response chain.

Also second the many "Remember Threat, not Damage, is your priority - learn a rotation that includes as many threat skills as possible for tanking situations and realize that tanking in a fellowship is a very different experience from adventuring solo...

wait, what? have I been oblivious to something this whole time (7 months). What skills/attacks open up conjunctions? I thought the only way to do it with some degree of predictability was with Turn the Tables.

What have i missed all this time?

Thanks!

[oldbustedjorn]

wait, what? have I been oblivious to something this whole time (7 months). What skills/attacks open up conjunctions? I thought the only way to do it with some degree of predictability was with Turn the Tables.

What have i missed all this time?

Thanks!

Prepare to have your mind blown...

1. Turn the Tables: When you're stunned, using TtT will knock down the opponent and start an FM
2. Fray the Edge: Stackable debuff of sorts that increases random FM chance by 1%, but that number increases each time it stacks up to a max of 6% normally. There is a trait that will increase this % to 30%, iirc. However, it is not easy to stack 5 or 6 fray the edge debuffs and it takes forever. Not reliable.
3. To the King. This legendary will start an FM (if in a group), every time it crits. The best non-burglar FM skill in my opinion.

Keep in mind that if a mob has FM immunity (either permanent or temporary) that TtK won't produce an FM.