Two-word Tolkien Trivia

[BIGeyedBUG]

Old Man Willow is not the answer. (I'm curious though, what sense were you guessing at for "mongrel" there?)

[Vilnas]

Well, I haven't been particularly comfortable with the "mongrel" component of any of my guess, which have been focused on the "flycatcher" side of the puzzle. I am taking "mongrel" to mean something in the nature of "not pure bred" or "devolved from the original line" or even stretching it to "deviating from the original form." It was in the latter category that I was attempting to shoehorn Old Man Willow (in comparison to a Venus Flytrap).

However, I think I now have something that may capture the mongrel side and arguably works for the flycatcher side:

Gollum climbing headfirst down the cliff in Emyn Muil.

Doesn't one of rangers of Ithilien (maybe even Faramir) refer to Gollum as a mongrel creature? If so, then that is a clear hit and the spider climb should be enough for the flycatcher reference.

[Morthaur]

Doesn't one of rangers of Ithilien (maybe even Faramir) refer to Gollum as a mongrel creature? If so, then that is a clear hit and the spider climb should be enough for the flycatcher reference.

I believe Gollum was described as a gangrel creature which is an old scots term for a wandering beggar.

[Vilnas]

I believe Gollum was described as a gangrel creature which is an old scots term for a wandering beggar.

Ah! I am sure you are correct. In that case I do not think my answer fits at all.

[BIGeyedBUG]

Well, I haven't been particularly comfortable with the "mongrel" component of any of my guess, which have been focused on the "flycatcher" side of the puzzle. I am taking "mongrel" to mean something in the nature of "not pure bred" or "devolved from the original line" or even stretching it to "deviating from the original form." It was in the latter category that I was attempting to shoehorn Old Man Willow (in comparison to a Venus Flytrap).

However, I think I now have something that may capture the mongrel side and arguably works for the flycatcher side:

Gollum climbing headfirst down the cliff in Emyn Muil.

Doesn't one of rangers of Ithilien (maybe even Faramir) refer to Gollum as a mongrel creature? If so, then that is a clear hit and the spider climb should be enough for the flycatcher reference.

Gollum is not it.

"Mongrel" in the context of Old Man Willow is interesting, in that one of the more poetic uses of the word has the meaning "of uncertain provenance". Invoking the word that way, I suppose I could answer my own riddle with "Ungoliant". But that is neither the answer, nor the sense I'm using in the clue.

Dang, I thought I had it there for a second.

[Morthaur]

Mongrel Flycatcher - Eol

In Australia the word mongrel used to be free of its mixed race conotations, and meant a despicable person although often jokes would start with "there was this mongrel you see" and we ended up with having sypathy for the subject of the joke, so I guess it could mean an unfortunate person. Anyway Eol who may have been Sindarin or Avari sits like a spider in the wood of Nan Elmoth and traps Aredhel and seems to force her into marriage, a throroughly despicable spider. Eol was also described as being twisted and bent like a dwarf from forge work (and probably rickets from an aversion to sunlight) so could satisfy a modern usage of mongrel too. Oh I just rembered like a spider he has a poisoness sting aswell.

[BIGeyedBUG]

Not Eol, though I enjoyed the explanation.


Here's a hint: flycatcher ≠ spider.

[Morthaur]

Brambles of Mordor?

[darkoutcast]

Mongrel Flycatcher = A bird or type of bird of mixed heritage, ergo Earendil. We already know of his lineage, and then had the flying Vingilot to make him a Flycatcher proper. He even snagged one of the greatest bugs of them all, Ancalagon.

[BIGeyedBUG]

Mongrel Flycatcher = A bird or type of bird of mixed heritage, ergo Earendil. We already know of his lineage, and then had the flying Vingilot to make him a Flycatcher proper. He even snagged one of the greatest bugs of them all, Ancalagon.

Very close.

[darkoutcast]

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

[Vilnas]

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

Wow, what a great question and answer. If this isn't the "correct" solution, it is nevertheless amazing. I've decided the two-word riddle format is my favorite.

[BIGeyedBUG]

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

Nicely done. (And incidentally, the nightingale, poetically signified by Beren's name for her, Tinúviel, is often classified as a type of flycatcher bird.)

It's your serve, D.

[darkoutcast]

I hadn't been so clever as to remember Tinuviel as nightingale. Like Vilnas said, what a wonderful riddle. I hope mine will be regarded nearly as well.

incendiary genealogy

[BIGeyedBUG]

incendiary genealogy

The seven sons and inheritors of the destructive legacy of Feanor, the Spirit of Fire, and burner of the ships at Losgar?

[darkoutcast]

That is actually the runner up answer. After I made my post, I thought of that and considered modifying my clue. However, I believe my answer still stands as the ideal one.

[seltin97]

Hmm... inciendary genealogy... Im stumped if it is not the sons of Feanor. What has to do with fire? Something about Balrogs,Maybe?

[scaliper]

Perhaps incendiary in the context of making people hate eachother, as in the relationship between Feanor and Fingolfin?

[darkoutcast]

Another clever thought but half of the first answer was closer. Not all the way there, mind. Just closer.

[scaliper]

Another clever thought but the first answer was closer to the mark.

Then perhaps we can go in the opposite direction and say Miriel and Feanor, the Birth of Feanor(both are really the same in my mind) or even the line of Miriel(which is the same thing but more general as it includes the seven sons)? Miriel named Feanor due to his fire consuming much of hers, after all.

[darkoutcast]

Closer figuratively, not literally. i.e. Not Feanor, although his end may be ringing a bell.

[scaliper]

Closer figuratively, not literally. i.e. Not Feanor, although his end may be ringing a bell.

Hmm...If we want to take the end of Feanor at face value, I might just go with the War of the Jewels, but that seems way to general for me. Although we could also say that his manner of death might be the point, and that would make more sense, but I can't think of a good answer in that line of thought. I'll be back once I think of one.

[Mister_Underhill]

Perhaps Denethor, last Steward of Gondor, burning himself and trying to do the same to his barely-living son, Faramir?

[darkoutcast]

Growing ever closer. This clue may seem strange until you stumble upon the proper passage. Then, I hope, any grudge borne will be satisfied.

[Vilnas]

I'm going to suggest something in connection with the Kinstrife, in hopes that someone with access to the books has a flash of inspiration and can hit up on the correct answer (I'm stuck at work and won't be able to check until later this evening). I deny all credit if this turns out to be a useful lead.

*Edit: Did Osgiliath burn during the Kinstrife?