Hunter changes enough to make me quit. Farewell.

[wolfers]

I deleted my account with turbine, thanks for not taking the time to develop hunters, I'm actually starting to enjoy living in the real world again. Thankyou. Both kinhouses, all 17 character slots, my mass wealth of gold and skirmish marks. No more buying stat tombs or milestones. I should take the time to thank Brian "Zombie" for the job well done on royaly shelfing and destroying the hunter RoI project and nerfing hunters down to an average and equal damage dealer with all other classes. Farewell all, hope you have fun with this class more then I did in the new system.

[harkamsu]

I certainly understand your sentiment having felt the same way at one point. The problem is that with RoI, our DPS is now more gear dependent than ever before. If hunters are to be top tier DPS, we have to stack agility and ranged offence. Most of the good loot comes from 12 man skirmishes/Draig, so that already cuts down a lot of potential for more casual players that rarely do 12 man skirmishes, let alone Draigoch. The crafted stuff only takes you so far. The other problem is that to get top tier damage, and I don't just mean high damage (anyone can get high damage, which means anyone can be average), you lose a chunk of morale. The itemization in RoI, at least for hunters, is very limited in terms of stuff that has high agility AND high vitality/morale.

People will tell you that you can gain a lot of morale back from using different jewelry. Sure, you can. But you also end up dropping a chunk of offence, which means you're back down to square one which is right where you left off (AKA: average damage).

It's as if Turbine took the dumb approach to itemization. "Hey guys, let's spike the damage stat and forgot about vitality so that the damage dealers can deal damage and the tanks will have work to do to peel agro of the damage dealers."

And that's only talking about itemization. Nevermind the joke that is Hunter's Art and Split Shot, though Split Shot is just a tad bit more useful since every once in a while you get a tank that clusters mobs around him where you can make use of the AWESOME, AWESOME radius of 2 meters that Split Shot has. <----sarcasm, for you slow people.

[phaiLbuS]

I actually agree with this post... champions got a huge change, so did minstrels, but hunters are still left out in the dust... not cool turbine.

[Ayrolen]

Not sure if serious...

[CedarRiver]

Don't forget ICPR and Crit too. ICPR especially seems bonded to vit/morale so if you want to achieve 1400 icpr again, buh-bye dps. And Crit is all over the place, with a component of that built on fate yet there are few items with Vit/Fate/Agi on them, even among armor pieces. Crit is capped at 25%, yet has anyone attained it yet? Even with captain buffs? I see reports of 16, or 17 percent, but that's about the max.

Shame we can't let ICPR go except they nerfed to #### SoTE last spring and still haven't fixed it.

Thank Frodo for Beneath Care now.

Oh, that's right it's called Improved Beneath Notice now.

But Beneath Care is still accurate.

I wonder if ZC has the guts to actually read these forums.

[Eldrandir]

I certainly understand your sentiment having felt the same way at one point. The problem is that with RoI, our DPS is now more gear dependent than ever before. If hunters are to be top tier DPS, we have to stack agility and ranged offence.

That's only part of the problem, the other problem is we are "On Par" with the other two (or 3 even) top tier dps classes and we bring no real utility. (RoT/Bards vs DNTF, spot heals, bubbles, force attacks, FMs etc)

Shame we can't let ICPR go except they nerfed to #### SoTE last spring and still haven't fixed it.

They nerfed it a second time for RoI. Pre RoI at 65 was 4 tics of 179 power, TRAITED 75 is 4 tics of 139 power. 10 levels and a trait and the skill is even weaker then the pathetically nerfed SoTE they created earlier this spring.

[Mahalikii]

Actually, because we are so OP in PvMP, I move to have DF disabled in the moors.

[harkamsu]

Just responding to the reply above about crit percent. My hunter has 20.7% crit and 8.2% devastate unbuffed. I have 21,738 ranged offence. My gearing isn't complete yet, but by the time I'm done, I should have 6.5k morale. Right now I'm closer to 6k. This is all unbuffed. Buffed, the highest crit I've managed is a hair over 23% and 9.2% devastate.

I do have another set of LIs I'm working on that should bring me closer to 7k unbuffed morale and closer to 23.5-24k ranged offence, but my crit will drop closer to 17% unbuffed and whatever dev that is unbuffed.

I know of at least one hunter with over 25k ranged offence unbuffed, but that person is also closer to 4.4k morale. I don't want to fall below 5.5, but usually hover around 6k until I find the last bits of gear.

[CedarRiver]

That's definately the highest I've heard of. But wow is your morale low. How is your survivability? Talking 3 man and six man instances, maybe the dragon, pvp? Keep in mind, not criticizing the build, just curious about it. How's your icpr too?

[harkamsu]

That's definately the highest I've heard of. But wow is your morale low. How is your survivability? Talking 3 man and six man instances, maybe the dragon, pvp? Keep in mind, not criticizing the build, just curious about it. How's your icpr too?

I've done tons and tons and tons of 12 man raid skirms. I've done Draigoch. I don't notice any lesser survivability in those. I've only dabbled in PVMP a tad, so I can't help you there, though I do know I put down the hurt on creeps. I managed a 9.4k Heartseeker dev in S:P on one of the Tyrants in Isendeep (think that's what the place was called). I also popped a 5.9k crit on one of the melee class creeps that I forget the name to.

ICPR is 882. It's lower than what I like, but I realized this when I changed LIs. The crit set up was something I built up long term for PVMP. I'm just now getting into it since I'm nearing completion of most of the gear I wanted to grind out.

The other set of 75 SAs I'm building is more for raiding.

EDIT: When I did Draigoch, I had closer to 17% crit and 6% dev, closer to 1300 ICPR, and closer to 22.5k ranged offence. 6.5k morale is more than satisfactory for me given the damage I put out, not to mention crit frequency.

[CedarRiver]

I've done tons and tons and tons of 12 man raid skirms. I've done Draigoch. I don't notice any lesser survivability in those. I've only dabbled in PVMP a tad, so I can't help you there, though I do know I put down the hurt on creeps. I managed a 9.4k Heartseeker dev in S:P on one of the Tyrants in Isendeep (think that's what the place was called). I also popped a 5.9k crit on one of the melee class creeps that I forget the name to.

ICPR is 882. It's lower than what I like, but I realized this when I changed LIs. The crit set up was something I built up long term for PVMP. I'm just now getting into it since I'm nearing completion of most of the gear I wanted to grind out.

The other set of 75 SAs I'm building is more for raiding.

EDIT: When I did Draigoch, I had closer to 17% crit and 6% dev, closer to 1300 ICPR, and closer to 22.5k ranged offence. 6.5k morale is more than satisfactory for me given the damage I put out, not to mention crit frequency.

Yeah, that's why I was asking about instances more than skirms or the drag, both of which I could definately see 6k-ish being plenty. In proper instances though, like Annuminas or Hall of Night, where they're a little better built to put pressure on the party, I wonder how you'd do. Or imagine Lost Temple scaled up for example where there's lots of AOE and/or dot damage, things you can't necessarily avoid just by aggro managemnet/cc.

[opurt]

I deleted my account with turbine, thanks for not taking the time to develop hunters, I'm actually starting to enjoy living in the real world again. Thankyou. Both kinhouses, all 17 character slots, my mass wealth of gold and skirmish marks. No more buying stat tombs or milestones. I should take the time to thank Brian "Zombie" for the job well done on royaly shelfing and destroying the hunter RoI project and nerfing hunters down to an average and equal damage dealer with all other classes. Farewell all, hope you have fun with this class more then I did in the new system.

All-righty-then, have a nice life. Laters!!!

[harkamsu]

I should've read more carefully. My mistake.

I have done no 3 mans since RoI. I did lib/school way too much in the past that I have zero desire to do them again for a long time. I did LT, but LT doesn't scale to 75 does it? It's also 6 man.

[wolfers]

I'll give all you hunters one last thing to think over, maybe help you join me today.

Did you get aoe as good as champions got single target damage?

Are you able to fill a second role in a fellowship like a champion can fill the role of tank, or the runekeeper can fill the role of Healer?

They got the same amount of dps as you single target. Yet here you are, not able to AOE things to death or fill a second role in a fellowship. Come join me, Life is good, the Air outside is good.

[wolfers]

Maybe today you can get a hunter to tank for you in fellowship.

Maybe today you can get a hunter to crowd control instead of that loremaster or burg.

Maybe today you can get a hunter to Heal for your fellowship for the win.

[Beschutzer]

Maybe today you can get a hunter to tank for you in fellowship.

Maybe today you can get a hunter to crowd control instead of that loremaster or burg.

Maybe today you can get a hunter to Heal for your fellowship for the win.

..But it is Not this Day!



I see in your eyes the fear that would make me Rage Quit!

[wolfers]

If I was a dev, and I am not, I would have in the very first stages of RoI development I would have thought about how the other classes secondary roles and how giving them top tier would affect the hunter.. then I would at the very least throw the hunters a bone, its the very least, maybe something even as simple as allowing them to start fellowship manuvers as often as a burg, to increase thier worth to the fellowship.

Not even a bone.... How sad.

So join my rage quit and enojoy the outside. Because your dev doesnt care about your class, quit now and join me.

[ppspankalot]

If I was a dev, and I am not, I would have in the very first stages of RoI development I would have thought about how the other classes secondary roles and how giving them top tier would affect the hunter.. then I would at the very least throw the hunters a bone, its the very least, maybe something even as simple as allowing them to start fellowship manuvers as often as a burg, to increase thier worth to the fellowship.

Not even a bone.... How sad.

So join my rage quit and enojoy the outside. Because your dev doesnt care about your class, quit now and join me.

You should have just made your OP and then zipped it. Now you are sounding like, "Misery likes company".

I don't like the hunter changes/nerf or what ever else you want to call it, but I'm not going to cry like a little Nancy about it either.

[wolfers]

You should have just made your OP and then zipped it. Now you are sounding like, "Misery likes company".

I don't like the hunter changes/nerf or what ever else you want to call it, but I'm not going to cry like a little Nancy about it either.

You are right my dear good sir. The more I think of this, the more it starts to get to me, This is my FINAL GOODBYE.

GOODBYE.

[ChromiteSwiftpaw]

I'll give all you hunters one last thing to think over, maybe help you join me today.

Did you get aoe as good as champions got single target damage?

I dunno, I don't play a champ so I don't know how high they hit for. I do know that we DID get an AoE option that can do some tremendous damage, though.

They got the same amount of dps as you single target. Yet here you are, not able to AOE things to death or fill a second role in a fellowship.

Uh.. I guess you haven't really been playing your hunter in the expansion. We ARE able to AoE things to death. I guess you haven't been clued in on the new little rocket system we got...

Come join me, Life is good, the Air outside is good.

The air is too hot outside at the moment, no thanks :-P Maybe when it starts to rain/get cloudy more I'll enjoy it.

Granted, there are changes I do not like.. like the medium armor nerf and the passive skills nerf and the split shot sillyness, but there are other things that we got that I have a lot of fun with and enjoy.

[Vandervahn]

Hehe. A person that pulled a pure DPS class up to 75, complaining that he has a pure DPS class. Good times.

In regards to itemization, I hope you guys realize that there´s a lot coming up on the horizon with the new instances and according items, also a skirmish camp makeover. The Skirm raid drops are not the end of the stick. and no class at the moment has it exceptionally easy to build as they like.

Maybe Turb will miss the income. I dont think the community has lost a too valuable member now.

I actually agree with this post... champions got a huge change, so did minstrels, but hunters are still left out in the dust... not cool turbine.

I dont get these gripes. I can understand that you may envy these classes because they gave Chimps and Minstrels a lot of new toys to explore and play with, but you should not forget that both classes were in kind of a rough spot before, as well as Captains. If you look at pre-RoI Vids and screenshots of good Chimps, there´s a reason why we´re always hauling around 10-20 different sets of jewels and armor, and thats because our in-built mechanics were tedious. Not Fun. Fun now.

[Tullaian]

TBH I don't really get the angst. Hunters are a DPS class were improved in their primary role. If you had told anyone pre-ROI that we could have 25% crit and 25k RO they'd have wet themselves with excitement.

Hunter AOE which people in this thread mentioned got a huge boost. You can almost perma-spam rain of arrows now I've had 15 shot strings and my crit isn't at the new cap. In 12 man skirmishes it puts your dps up through the roof in particular. Previously hunter AOE was so marginal it is now worth particularly traiting and LI'ing for in the appropriate situations.

CC hasn't gotten any worse and with the ability to switch stances not being tied to traits you can even toss a few yellows in there if needed and be the primary cc for a run , just that there is no real need for cc atm with so little level 75 content.

Surviability and mitigation did go down , probably truth be told in a fair fashion as at 65 you just let things wail on you and could ignore them. RoI briefly changed that with some of the signature mobs actually killing people.. *gasp*. But, even with that minor change as dps has gone up the threat has gone down again. While I used to have to trap and kite an overseer at Isengard I can mow him down now before he gets to me just like the old days.

I didn't play in the moors pre ROI so can make no comment on pvp but since starting pvp I'd have to say the hunter does feel incredibly underpowerd in any soft of 1v1 2v2 contest but I'm also hugely inexperienced wtih pvp in LOTRO.

Minstrels getting better doesn't bother me, its nice when people like loggin in their minstrels and playing , the champ changes meh I can understand the angst hunters and champs are always comparing themselves and it looks like with their new skills and the heavy armour buff they came out 'ahead' this time around but I don't think it is so clear cut that champ>hunter regardless of circumstance.

Glass half full maybe.. dunno but I haven't found the changes in ROI so confronting that I'd stop playing the hunter as a main.

[Jeunefie]

Good luck in real life... No need to come back here to write back or what so ever, since this can lead to personal health issues...

[Phaedrah]

1 less hunter out of 10 billion, you will be missed.

[Calem]

Am still not sure if the OP is serious, regardless, best wishes if you do leave the game.

IMHO and based on parsing information shared in these forums, Hunter DPS is still top tier on single targets, in addition AOE DPS on a Hunter has been significantly improved when you trait for no cooldown repeatable Rain of Arrows in S:P when you land at least one critical. Still sharing in top tier single target DPS together with highest levels of critical hit repeatable AOE DPS seems to counterpoint the OP claims.

I am enjoying Hunter more than ever before together with the itemization choices of more DPS or more survivability as required for PvE, PvP, instance and/or group setups. I wish to thank the Developers for a Ranged DPS class with crowd control versatility that is enjoyable to play at all levels.