Lord of the Rings on Prime

[elvenes]

dangerous come on... nothing will ever change the source material and the canon. The books will always be there, untouched. They are not going to be rewritten and any person who decides to research tolkien's work after this show will see how amazon doesn't have to mean canon. Heck, this game itself is not canon and after mordor is basically MoL's fanfiction, but because it's lotro, it is all well and good? double standards.

What are you afraid of exactly?

You can't dictate how people can or cannot perceive the IP, be it from books or tv shows

[Harvain]

dangerous come on... nothing will ever change the source material and the canon. The books will always be there, untouched. They are not going to be rewritten and any person who decides to research tolkien's work after this show will see how amazon doesn't have to mean canon. Heck, this game itself is not canon and after mordor is basically MoL's fanfiction, but because it's lotro, it is all well and good? double standards.

What are you afraid of exactly?

You can't dictate how people can or cannot perceive the IP, be it from books or tv shows

LOTRO is a Canon/Non-Canon Game, definitely not perfect and never will be 100% to the Lore (because any such Game would have us playing as one of the Fellowship Members only and only for the direct events described in a meaningful manner by Tolkien) and everything else that makes it unique under the LOTR IP.

Perception though can make or break an IP or at the very least lead to a long time of controversy.

Just look at Star Wars for example since the Sequel Trilogy especially and what has happened to that overall IP from it's Lore, Movies, TV Shows, Games, Merchandising and just how folks have discussed the direction various elements of said IP were going in recent years.

That's what I mean by dangerous.

[elvenes]

you just described lotro as this tv show will be. A canon-non canon telling of events. This is why I don't like to see people crucifying Amazon for something we know very little of yet, but defending lotro because "muh middle earth game". That's what I mean by double standard.

Perception doesn't make or break an IP "unanimously", "as a whole" or "just because you say so". Perceiving something is entirely based on individuals, to take the books again, i can read them and interpret them one way, another reads them and interprets them their way (substitute interpret with perceive) now which one of us is right or wrong? there will be plenty who will enjoy this series for what is it, a Middle Earth based show of a fantasy setting many already love and many will be introduced to, without caring what the purists say and good on them for doing so.

[Harvain]

you just described lotro as this tv show will be. A canon-non canon telling of events. This is why I don't like to see people crucifying Amazon for something we know very little of yet, but defending lotro because "muh middle earth game". That's what I mean by double standard.

Perception doesn't make or break an IP "unanimously", "as a whole" or "just because you say so". Perceiving something is entirely based on individuals, to take the books again, i can read them and interpret them one way, another reads them and interprets them their way (substitute interpret with perceive) now which one of us is right or wrong? there will be plenty who will enjoy this series for what is it, a Middle Earth based show of a fantasy setting many already love and many will be introduced to, without caring what the purists say and good on them for doing so.

What do you mean by "double standard"? I personally wasn't even defending LOTRO beyond stating what the game itself is, a Canon/Non-Canon Game under the LOTR IP.

How a large element of an IP can and does affect how everything else within said IP, so if the Amazon LOTR TV Series does well, LOTRO will see benefits. If it doesn't do well, LOTRO will see less benefits.

The LOTR IP already has seen the effects of large media and their take on Tolkien's works with the LOTR Movies and Hobbit Movies which has seen a "Movie Lore" side of Tolkien's work and many games being made reflecting said Movie Lore.

My comments weren't about folks liking any single element of the LOTR IP but how the LOTR IP would be as a whole once said TV Series was airing and what type of reactions would be around everything Tolkien for the short and long term with a Great/Good/Passable Series bringing more folks into everything Tolkien or a Meh/Bad/Awful Series bringing a lot of negative elements to everything Tolkien.

An easy example for such would be how when the Hobbit Movies came out LOTRO got Content connected to it being Instances and the Beorning Class. The Instances were for Story which at the time that LOTRO was nowhere close to telling in a true Story Quest Pack/Expansion form and the Beorning Class while it did become good for Level 50 and below was for the most part abandoned for a good long time before only recently becoming an actual viable Class within LOTRO.

[elvenes]

then you should have been more specific in your first post, because none of this distinctions were in there, just "this could be very dangerous for all things lotr". Anyway, I've said my piece, and I hope Amazon delivers a good show

[Harvain]

then you should have been more specific in your first post, because none of this distinctions were in there, just "this could be very dangerous for all things lotr". Anyway, I've said my piece, and I hope Amazon delivers a good show

I feel that "this could be very dangerous for all things LOTR" pretty much spoke for itself.

Hopefully it is a good TV Series but various major IPs have been making choices that have hurt their IP's in the short/long term whether it's Game of Thrones and the decline of the Seasons as it wrapped up, Star Wars and all the various elements especially since the Sequel Trilogy, Harry Potter and mostly just J.K. Rowling making "creator comments" and many other examples.

The LOTR IP just might be the latest and biggest victim in terms of how much this Series is gonna cost in total pending how things go.

[Pontin_Finnberry]

and what showrunners say
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv...on-1235077310/

“This is a title that we imagine could live on the spine of a book next to J.R.R. Tolkien’s other classics. The Rings of Power unites all the major stories of Middle-earth’s Second Age: the forging of the rings, the rise of the Dark Lord Sauron, the epic tale of Númenor, and the Last Alliance of Elves and Men,” said showrunners J.D. Payne & Patrick McKay. “Until now, audiences have only seen on-screen the story of the One Ring — but before there was one, there were many… and we’re excited to share the epic story of them all.”

[Pontin_Finnberry]

Also the title reveal trailer done with all Practical Effects, and a few touch ups in editing.

[Harvain]

Now it's just a matter of if this show is going to live up to the Hype or is it going to be or become an epic fail.

[Radhruin_EU]

Now it's just a matter of if this show is going to live up to the Hype or is it going to be or become an epic fail.

Early days yet, it's not on until September. Now we've had a title reveal the next thing will be a teaser trailer, I guess.

[Halphast]

I think we need to let go of the fantasy that a movie or TV show will bring our favorite books to life in the way we imagine them to look/sound/feel.

This WILL be an adaptation. It WON'T match what you expect 100%.

Try approaching the show as "How will they adapt the story into an interesting and fun tv show?" rather than "I really hope they do X, Y, and Z exactly how I imagined it while reading the books!"

The Wheel of Time tv series was a major departure from the books, and was really polarizing (for a while there were ONLY 5-star and 1-star reviews with no in between). But they brought on Brandon Sanderson (who wrote the last 3 books) as a consultant and he thought they did a superb job making an enormous novel into an 8-episode tv show. I mostly agreed (except for episode 8). So I'm going to try to take that same approach to "LotR/Rings of Power." Will it be a good show on its own merits? What will they change, and will it tell the story in an enjoyable way? Rather than "oh please god don't let them change anything"

[Pontin_Finnberry]

I think we need to let go of the fantasy that a movie or TV show will bring our favorite books to life in the way we imagine them to look/sound/feel.

This WILL be an adaptation. It WON'T match what you expect 100%.

Try approaching the show as "How will they adapt the story into an interesting and fun tv show?" rather than "I really hope they do X, Y, and Z exactly how I imagined it while reading the books!"

The Wheel of Time tv series was a major departure from the books, and was really polarizing (for a while there were ONLY 5-star and 1-star reviews with no in between). But they brought on Brandon Sanderson (who wrote the last 3 books) as a consultant and he thought they did a superb job making an enormous novel into an 8-episode tv show. I mostly agreed (except for episode 8). So I'm going to try to take that same approach to "LotR/Rings of Power." Will it be a good show on its own merits? What will they change, and will it tell the story in an enjoyable way? Rather than "oh please god don't let them change anything"

Of course it will be an adaptation, I don't think anyone here is asking it to be more closer to the books, but that they want a great TV series out of it, that's somewhat true to the themes of Tolkien, just like the Peter jacksons LOTR films, yes stuff changed but they were well made and told a great story for the screen, and was the most awarded film series in history, I think most just want it to be as good as what they have seen before, and not a series that isn't that great.

[Harvain]

I think we need to let go of the fantasy that a movie or TV show will bring our favorite books to life in the way we imagine them to look/sound/feel.

This WILL be an adaptation. It WON'T match what you expect 100%.

Try approaching the show as "How will they adapt the story into an interesting and fun tv show?" rather than "I really hope they do X, Y, and Z exactly how I imagined it while reading the books!"

The Wheel of Time tv series was a major departure from the books, and was really polarizing (for a while there were ONLY 5-star and 1-star reviews with no in between). But they brought on Brandon Sanderson (who wrote the last 3 books) as a consultant and he thought they did a superb job making an enormous novel into an 8-episode tv show. I mostly agreed (except for episode 8). So I'm going to try to take that same approach to "LotR/Rings of Power." Will it be a good show on its own merits? What will they change, and will it tell the story in an enjoyable way? Rather than "oh please god don't let them change anything"

Of course it will be an adaptation, I don't think anyone here is asking it to be more closer to the books, but that they want a great TV series out of it, that's somewhat true to the themes of Tolkien, just like the Peter jacksons LOTR films, yes stuff changed but they were well made and told a great story for the screen, and was the most awarded film series in history, I think most just want it to be as good as what they have seen before, and not a series that isn't that great.

Folks don't want Game of Thrones 2.0: The LOTR Edition & especially not a GoT Season 8

If they can avoid these 2 elements & avoid trying to push Real World & Modern Issues, the Series should do well.

If they push elements that don't belong, that'll quickly erode the Series.

[DavidmeetHal]

I tried watching Wheel of Time with an open mind with the mindset that it was it's own show with it's own plot with nothing related to the books except for the IP, and as a stand alone show, I hated it. And that makes it hard for me to have any hope for the LOTR series coming up.

And staying true to the books has nothing to do with how I feel.

[LadySelene]

Wheel of Time is just so... I don't know how to explain it. A general approach to fantasy series nowadays, create a good visual and no one should care about nonsense happening all the time? Like they don't even try to pretend their characters LIVE in the world they're filmed in.

Moiraine destroying the village inn to hurl boulders at trollocs - like she's playing a LM and all her other AoE skills are on cooldown. There most probably were people hiding in the inn, kids, elderly and all. Dead, because of her?
Whitecloaks question Moiraine and don't care a bit about two other girls, then ("a month later") they see one in a middle of a gypsy crowd and immediately "seize her!" Like they still remember an insignificant girl they met on the road?
A barmaid chasing Rand and Mat and literally NO ONE follows her - hey, obviously they run to avoid paying, grab them, earn a free drink?
Siuan, the Amyrlin, is supposed to be smart and she channels openly (getting her hut burnt and herself exiled), instead of sitting down in the boat and pretending she's doing something else. The hut burns without fire or smoke, that'll do, no one will care.
Women channeling in plain sight, though if YOU were to do some far-ranged battle magic, you would hide on the wall, no one would see what caused the lightning which strikes from the sky.
And the finale, Rand (level 1 fighter with a OVERPOWERED 1st age LI, who only randomly clicked skills before - after all, everything dies on landscape) should PvP an experienced top-league channeler and an evil guy. Outcome, who wanna bet?

All that sh... that GoT seasons 7 and 8 suffered from, started in WoT straight from Season 1. They just squeeze unexpected or shocking plot twists into the narrative, never caring if they fit the logic, the characters' development, etc.

I wouldn't call myself a die-hard fan of the book (even though I had once a healer named Moiraine in another MMO, and my very 1st char I've created was named Rand, I was going to play him and call him "wool-headed idiot" ;-) - it has flaws, but there is so much of an epic potential, and now we have THIS for an adaptation, so - no hope.

I'm not anticipating Amazon LOTR series, after their "stomach-this-who-cares" WoT.

[Laurelinarien]

Agreed with the last 2 posters.. now that we have the technology to make fantasy worlds come to life, more often than not the content is severly lacking and it's all about the looks.

[Boraxxe]

Agreed with the last 2 posters.. now that we have the technology to make fantasy worlds come to life, more often than not the content is severly lacking and it's all about the looks.

Yes.
It is amazing how great a stupid and meaningless story can look.

Edit:...Imagine if you will...

An oil portrait by Rembrandt of Alfred E. Newman in one of his classic "What, me worry?" poses.
"Represented" beauty without art is a problem.

[AConyl]

Agreed with the last 2 posters.. now that we have the technology to make fantasy worlds come to life, more often than not the content is severly lacking and it's all about the looks.

To speak honestly, this was an issue even in TTT and ROTK. After the huge success of FOTR, I believe Jackson was given more leeway with budgeting, and spent a lot of that on CGI. Thus we got amazing battle scenes and sweeping landscape shots, and neglected plot/character development. The Hobbit had this issue even worse, with entire portions of the movie borne by CGI artists. Now with even more evolved CGI and a budget of $400 MILLION, how can anyone resist the temptation to splash that on astounding visuals? My worst fear is that the series will have all the flaws of the Hobbit, and completely miss the spirit of Tolkien's work that made it so enjoyable - a compelling plot, grand themes and a wondrous world. And Tom Shippey left the production about a year ago, so I am not keeping any hope.

[Boraxxe]

To speak honestly, this was an issue even in TTT and ROTK. After the huge success of FOTR, I believe Jackson was given more leeway with budgeting, and spent a lot of that on CGI. Thus we got amazing battle scenes and sweeping landscape shots, and neglected plot/character development. The Hobbit had this issue even worse, with entire portions of the movie borne by CGI artists. Now with even more evolved CGI and a budget of $400 MILLION, how can anyone resist the temptation to splash that on astounding visuals? My worst fear is that the series will have all the flaws of the Hobbit, and completely miss the spirit of Tolkien's work that made it so enjoyable - a compelling plot, grand themes and a wondrous world. And Tom Shippey left the production about a year ago, so I am not keeping any hope.

You are right on the money there with what happened with the Jackson.

I have hopes that Amazon is not an ego-driven operation.
I don't have huge hope, but I have hope.

[Pontin_Finnberry]

More Promoting the show from Lord of the Rings on Prime Twitter https://twitter.com/LOTRonPrime

Edit: you can see all 23 posters here as well for easy browsing of them all https://www.polygon.com/22915948/lor...acters-posters

Here one image for tease they posted many

[rodin12]

I am very happy with the series to see all the places and lands of middle earth again But what will happen to the eternal racial issue in lotro? The elves, men and dwarves are going to be warriors and wizards and the hobbits are servants of the field or at this time there will have to be characters of all races in all positions and professions as in some current series that racial segregation ended a long time ago, gentlemen

[Pontin_Finnberry]

Some more content drop Vanity Fair has released some nice images and article to read https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...ies-first-look

[Harvain]

The Actor playing Elrond has a chin nearly as pointy as their elven ears and this is stated about them: "Elrond (Robert Aramayo) is a politically ambitious young elven leader."

What?

Well first real images of various Characters and even early information definitely is giving the "Game of Thrones" vibes they were apparently aiming for.

May Eru show mercy on the LOTR IP heading into the rest of 2022.



Edit: And just for their version of Elrond. Elrond is described as dark-haired, well the actor definitely is lacking that.

Unless they plan on as he gets "older" in the Second Age his hair turns dark, as I can speak from personal experience of being born a blonde I naturally transitioned to having more of a brown-blonde mix to finally having black hair.

But eh. Getting the "Based on True Events but mostly not to what happened" vibes more and more.

[Pontin_Finnberry]

Edit: And just for their version of Elrond. Elrond is described as dark-haired, well the actor definitely is lacking that.

Looks like he has dark brown hair to me and thats fine as its dark, hard to tell in first shot cause the sun is very bright, but you see it more clearly in second shot where it says hes in Lindon with Galadriel

[Pontin_Finnberry]

It has been a long debate about what rights amazon has, well It is confirmed Amazon does NOT have rights to any other works, only The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers and The Return of the King, the writers of the article were able to answer that question in live chat today with fans, as they had a quote from the Showrunners themselves they also noted there was more to say that didn't make it into article but that we would get more next week from the Showrunners.

Edit: Quoting what was exactly was said on the live twitter chat today:

J.D. says, We do not have the rights to the The Sillmarilion, to the Unfinnished Tales, to The History of Middle-Earth, neither of the volumes to those other books, we have the rights solely to Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, Return and the Appendecies, and thats it. and so and The Hobbit.