"You cannot equip multiple items with the same socketed essences" - dear SSG, Raininia or whoever

[DKenny]

It also occurs to me, the OP could use a Tracery Removal Scroll and remove the offending traceries. Thusly getting to enjoy their new LIs.

While it would allow the tracery to be removed, and thus allow use of the LI sans redundant tracery, it would still leave a gap and they may not have the resources to replace it with something equivalent. Consuming the tracery for barter currency would likely not yield anywhere near what was used to obtain it in the first place.

[OldPlayerGator]

I wrote a ticket.

Without a solution from SSG, they have at least two customers less.

Removing the Traceries doesn't bring a lot, for where do I get so many Ancient Scripts again to buy new ones? So that doesn't solve anything.

To the players who think this is salty - SSG sells me a product for which I pay. The information should not be "in some guides on the internet". The information should be IN THE GAME.

Registered since 2011. Doesn't know the meaning of a unique item. Can admit no wrong-doing. Well, take care. I cannot be sure SSG will be prompt in following up on your ticket.

Edited: 5 chars with LIs that were partly or fully imbued. 2 chars had maxed imbued ( x4) LIs. I am drowning in scripts. (Currently 39,700/10,000) Now have 2 130s with their 4 LIs done. Also have one lvl 101 with 2 LIs done. Also, replacing the missing traceries would cost 450 script (per tracery replaced) for the purples @121. This is hill worth dying on for a game that has been played for 10 years? Do not get me wrong here. I seriously feel they failed to give us better information. The difference here I think is I want this new system to succeed despite its current flaws. The OP has decided this is the end unless their demands are met :/

[DKenny]

Registered since 2011. Doesn't know the meaning of a unique item. Can admit no wrong-doing. Well, take care. I cannot be sure SSG will be prompt in following up on your ticket.

Edited: 5 chars with LIs that were partly or fully imbued. 2 chars had maxed imbued ( x4) LIs. I am drowning in scripts. (Currently 39,700/10,000) Now have 2 130s with their 4 LIs done. Also have one lvl 101 with 2 LIs done. Also, replacing the missing traceries would cost 450 script (per tracery replaced) for the purples @121. This is hill worth dying on for a game that has been played for 10 years? Do not get me wrong here. I seriously feel they failed to give us better information. The difference here I think is I want this new system to succeed despite its current flaws. The OP has decided this is the end unless their demands are met :/

Well, one could easily flip this around. Given the abysmal communication regarding how the new system / conversion works, is refusing to fully refund the resources that a player mistakenly put into a tracery he cannot use really the "hill" the company wants to die on?

[OldPlayerGator]

I have maintained their communication on this issue was lacking. The main issue with this forum post is the player chose to ignore the UNIQUE tag on their traceries. A 10 year player at that. Even if they noticed it, they decided it was somehow safe to put the same uniques on both LIs. This goes against everything that defines the word and yes, even the usage of unique items in the game. When that player made this simple mistake, they hauled off and blamed SSG entirely for their error. Claimed there was no documentation for this. Yet, there was. The goalposts to meet their demands has changed because us SSG fanboys decided to do a minimum of efforts to you know, read about the new LIs rather than arrogantly assuming that any screw ups we made would wholly be the responsibility of SSG. Denigrating those of us who took this time to step carefully shows the poor attitude of this player not only towards SSG but, towards other players. That reason is why I chose to follow up on this post. Self-entitled arrogance oozes from this player's post. To be honest, the game would be better off without such attitudes poisoning the wells of the player base. But what do I know? I am just a fanboy who like to do a little research and you know, read stuff. With that said, goodbye to this post.

[Calding]

I am confused at the aggression of those who protest that everyone should understand the term "unique use" to obviously mean unique cross all items on your character!

A single LI has multiple slots of the same type. Therefore it would seem understandable that "unique use" meant that you could not slot multiples of the same tracery in more than one of those slots on the LI. And outside of a official announcement about the scope the only way the community really know is by the trial and error of those of us who hit up Bullroarer.
Even trigger essences, in which only one of a type will fire, allows you to slot as many as you want. It is nice that they are trying to prevent you from slotting a tracery that will not function since it is overlapping the functionality of another, but to demean someone for not considering that "unique" meant across multiple items is in my opinion quite unfair.

I also see the mention of other "unique use" items in the game. How many casual players do you suppose come across those to have had previous experience with them? And yes, some casual players do pay for VIP subscriptions.

Not that I am saying that such a big change with the system should not cause people to search out information before diving in, but expecting in game tutorials in a game that use to do that quite commonly is not that extreme and expectation either.

[DKenny]

I am confused at the aggression of those who protest that everyone should understand the term "unique use" to obviously mean unique cross all items on your character!

A single LI has multiple slots of the same type. Therefore it would seem understandable that "unique use" meant that you could not slot multiples of the same tracery in more than one of those slots on the LI. And outside of a official announcement about the scope the only way the community really know is by the trial and error of those of us who hit up Bullroarer.
Even trigger essences, in which only one of a type fill fire, allows you to slot as many as you want. It is nice that they are trying to prevent you from slotting a tracery that will not function since it is overlapping the functionality of another, but to demean someone for not considering that "unique" meant across multiple items is in my opinion quite unfair.

I also see the mention of other "unique use" items in the game. How many casual players do you suppose come across those to have had previous experience with them?

Well, IMHO, it is suggestive that you cannot have multiples of the same on one LI. However, it may not be so obvious that you cannot have them on two different LI and then use both LI at the same time. Especially since it allows you to put them on different LI without warning if they're not equipped. But if they had simply sent a mail to each player containing a link explaining it all, there would perhaps be less excuse. But given that players don't necessarily use the forums, or access external guides and such, and simply tried to muddle through in game, it might be fair to at least allow an "undo", where all resources spent on an item can be refunded.

[Dovakhim]

I wrote a ticket.

Without a solution from SSG, they have at least two customers less.

Removing the Traceries doesn't bring a lot, for where do I get so many Ancient Scripts again to buy new ones? So that doesn't solve anything.

To the players who think this is salty - SSG sells me a product for which I pay. The information should not be "in some guides on the internet". The information should be IN THE GAME.

Dear devs, I greet you, as I might every morning from now onwards until this is resolved.

I hope you are hard at work to repair the results of your ill-begotten too-fast roll-out of the new LIs, and have nearly disappeared from the forums due to this.

Enjoy your morning (?) coffee.

[Soyovar]

As a more casual player who was excited to see the update to the LI system, the same thing happened to me. I assumed when I saw "unique item" that it was insinuating I could not stack them on the same LI. Without any sort of in-game guide, the lack of clarity led to a disappointing situation where I have no more Ancient Scripts to design a new LI, no Reclamation Scrolls to convert and remove traceries, and not nearly enough Mithril Coins to unslot them. I think the comment above about "greed" is misguided; after trying to line up all traceries with my old LI's, certain options were not available, which led me to choose the ones I thought aligned best with my play-style. I'm not mad, just disappointed.

[maartena]

I don't think I have ever had a "unique" essence. But good to know.

There was a series of class specific tier 7 Essences that could be earned in Central Gondor. These had certain bonuses that some classes still use today, but you can only have ONE slotted anywhere, not "one in every item", which is something the OP seems to think was the case....

https://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Ess...pecific)_Index

[maartena]

Without any sort of in-game guide

Correct me if I am wrong, but was there ever a "in-game guide" to the imbuement system? I remember having to read up on it on a web page outside of the game to ensure I made the right choices and in the right order. (add scroll of delving and crystal of remembrance first, then level up, then see if you need to replace legacies the way you want them, then applying as many scrolls as you have, and THEN finally imbueing it, and leveling it up further, etc....)

For as far as I know, there was no, and there still is no "in game guide" to the imbuement system. Or did I miss that, and can the above information readily be found in the game?

I always just had to revert to an external guide until I got used to the system and knew it by heart. Did you have a different experience?

[Pontin_Finnberry]

It has been this way as far back as Eriador Regions levels 1-50 that unique use or just unique items means that you can only use ONE of that item not two or more, its an old system that has been in game for many years... this isn't anything new.

[wispsong]

Correct me if I am wrong, but was there ever a "in-game guide" to the imbuement system? I remember having to read up on it on a web page outside of the game to ensure I made the right choices and in the right order. (add scroll of delving and crystal of remembrance first, then level up, then see if you need to replace legacies the way you want them, then applying as many scrolls as you have, and THEN finally imbueing it, and leveling it up further, etc....)

For as far as I know, there was no, and there still is no "in game guide" to the imbuement system. Or did I miss that, and can the above information readily be found in the game?

I always just had to revert to an external guide until I got used to the system and knew it by heart. Did you have a different experience?

I don't think I have ever seen an in-game guide for the ILI. Nor one for the LI except the intro which does not explain everything. The only problem I had was finding the appraisal button since I did not look in the panel. I also bought one tracery twice and discovered I could not slot it so I disenchanted. Since I wasn't sure which traceries could be slotted double I just tried before I bought all. As far as I know, word of heraldry and words of power OR craft can be slotted more then once. The one that can has a multiple bonus on some traceries. So I know when I see it. Overall it is a lot easier then the LI/ILI since you can choose the best traceries for your class/spec right away and don't depend on RNG. Just have to see how it works out concerning the next level of traceries and if there really is a reset.

[Dredre999]

Yeah jump into something without understanding it and what? just wing it? How's that working out for ya? There have been numerous posts about this already so you obviously either, didn't understand what unique means, didn't read on the forums, or just winged it. I see a lot of issues with the new LI but this is kind of obvious or easy enough to ask in chat. Arkenstone has been answering questions in chat repeatedly over any issues people have.

[DKenny]

There are critical differences to how the imbued LI system was rolled out vs. this new LI system. Imbued LI only existed at the then level cap 100. It was only later, with subsequent level cap increases, that characters could have them at different levels. Then, the existing LI system, which started with Moria, was in no way crippled. Players continued to obtain and level up LI under the old system, until they reached level 100. A player could even obtain, set up and level up an old LI at level 100, and continue to use it at level 100 without worrying about imbued LI. While you can continue to use old LI with the introduction of the new LI system, you cannot change your existing LI in any way. Then, with the introduction of imbued LI, the structure of the LI didn't change that much. Some legacies got converted to a different legacy, but most stayed the same. So if you had a fully max LI set up the way you wanted and imbued it, it wouldn't be a disaster. You could just fill up legacy tiers unlocked for free with ixp and then go about getting star-lit crystals and empowerment scrolls to unlock the remaining tiers up to max. With this new system, you basically completely destroy your existing LI upon conversion and you have component parts (all with new names) that you have to use to construct a new LI. IMHO the argument that there was no in game imbued guide so it's OK that there's nothing for this new LI system, isn't a very strong one.

[Birg]

While it would allow the tracery to be removed, and thus allow use of the LI sans redundant tracery, it would still leave a gap and they may not have the resources to replace it with something equivalent. Consuming the tracery for barter currency would likely not yield anywhere near what was used to obtain it in the first place.

Besides that, how will we obtain Tracery Reclamation Scrolls in the future. For now, we can get them from converting the retired essence reclamation scrolls. Requiring the player spend LP to replace items that were suppose to be a given as part of the conversion.
IMHO, there should be at least a period of time to refund items. Just like if you sell something at a vendor, you can buy it back without a penalty, at least before you log out and back in.

[Soyovar]

It has been this way as far back as Eriador Regions levels 1-50 that unique use or just unique items means that you can only use ONE of that item not two or more, its an old system that has been in game for many years... this isn't anything new.

I think the point is that the game never allowed you to apply them before. I work full-time, married with two kids, and haven't played consistently, and don't keep up too much with the game, although I've spent plenty of money on it over the years. Like I said, just a disappointing turn of events, so I'm sharing my experience since it reflected OP's.

[Soyovar]

Correct me if I am wrong, but was there ever a "in-game guide" to the imbuement system? I remember having to read up on it on a web page outside of the game to ensure I made the right choices and in the right order. (add scroll of delving and crystal of remembrance first, then level up, then see if you need to replace legacies the way you want them, then applying as many scrolls as you have, and THEN finally imbueing it, and leveling it up further, etc....)

For as far as I know, there was no, and there still is no "in game guide" to the imbuement system. Or did I miss that, and can the above information readily be found in the game?

I always just had to revert to an external guide until I got used to the system and knew it by heart. Did you have a different experience?

It feels like you're saying that because they did a poor job providing an explanation for a core gameplay system previously, I should have expected more of the same, and was foolish to believe otherwise. Maybe. I never used an external guide to build my old LI's though, and never felt like I had to.

[wispsong]

It feels like you're saying that because they did a poor job providing an explanation for a core gameplay system previously, I should have expected more of the same, and was foolish to believe otherwise. Maybe. I never used an external guide to build my old LI's though, and never felt like I had to.

Don't need an external guide now either. Yes, I would have liked an in game explanation once I got to the barter/reforger in Rivendell. But that is the only problem I have with the conversion. Once established the system is way easier to understand then the old one. Words of Masteries are our old legacies, most of which we couldn't double. The others make up relics. At least that's how I see it and with relics we always had to be more careful. Heraldry is a nice boost to our stats and determines our role.

[WeirdJedi]

Correct me if I am wrong, but was there ever a "in-game guide" to the imbuement system? I remember having to read up on it on a web page outside of the game to ensure I made the right choices and in the right order. (add scroll of delving and crystal of remembrance first, then level up, then see if you need to replace legacies the way you want them, then applying as many scrolls as you have, and THEN finally imbueing it, and leveling it up further, etc....)

For as far as I know, there was no, and there still is no "in game guide" to the imbuement system. Or did I miss that, and can the above information readily be found in the game?

I always just had to revert to an external guide until I got used to the system and knew it by heart. Did you have a different experience?

There wasn't a tutorial or anything remotely hinting that you can imbue your legendary items when it came to doing quests or venturing through the region. However, there was a "Tell me about the Imbuement Process" chat bubble on the same person that would take you through the process. When you clicked on it, there was a full page explaining almost everything in RP-fashion. He talked about how the process was permanent and had - what I recall - a sentence in bold, colored text to make sure to distribute all your points into your old legendary item before going through the process. He even mentioned how the legacies would change and you could preview what they would change into before making any final decisions.

[Soyovar]

Don't need an external guide now either. Yes, I would have liked an in game explanation once I got to the barter/reforger in Rivendell. But that is the only problem I have with the conversion.

That's essentially the point I'm making. In-game explanation would have prevented the issue. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask SSG to consider improving their implementation of the new system. I think OP's original post was poor form, but the point they were trying to make is still valid.

[Oldwiley]

Here's a video teaching people how to replace the word unique in English with 11 other words that don't mean unique.



funny old world

[Starsmith]

Besides that, how will we obtain Tracery Reclamation Scrolls in the future. For now, we can get them from converting the retired essence reclamation scrolls. Requiring the player spend LP to replace items that were suppose to be a given as part of the conversion.
IMHO, there should be at least a period of time to refund items. Just like if you sell something at a vendor, you can buy it back without a penalty, at least before you log out and back in.

You can get Tracery Reclamation Scrolls from weekly mission Legendary Item boxes.

[auximenes]

You are probably relying on the issue that about 200€ of RL money have been paid for a service removed by no ingame guide here because this is too small a thing to go to court over.

I'm sorry you're having a hard time with the new system. I have to ask though, how is it that all of your RL money been wasted? Can't you just use another 200 Scripts to get a new Tracery that you can use? The Appraise function offers a ton of Scripts, I've not even cashed in all of mine on my main and I have 2 new LI's that are much stronger than what I had before and I still have tons of Scripts left to fill them out more once I decide on what to put in every slot.

[Frisco]

We have an in-game guide for the Harvestmath Festival, ffs. How easy would it be to have made an item that acts like a simple text file and explains at least the *basics* of ILI appraisal/conversion and creating new LIs?

Appraise/Convert as few of your old LIs as necessary as you go if you have them, since currency given is dependent on character level, not LI level. Barter in Riv for a new LI or get one from Volume 2. Reforge/rename it. Barter level-appropriate traceries. Mastery and Power traceries are unique, the others aren't. Drag and drop yellow/purple/teal enhancement runes to the traceries in that order to increase their stats.

I feel like you could add a few words to that and make it pretty and even so the pixel count probably wouldn't overwhelm the server hamsters.

[Dovakhim]

http://www.containsmoderateperil.com...y-item-systems

...

Edit: BTW, this guy isn't me. I cite the (for me) most relevant excerpts:

"What makes this situation even more frustrating is that it was utterly predictable. SSG has a track record of ignoring player feedback, committing to deadlines and launching broken updates. This course of action always ends in a community management disaster which is further exacerbated by the developer's tone deaf, highhanded approach to dealing with PR problems and their total inability to learn from past mistakes. I and many other long time LOTRO enthusiasts find the latter to be the most egregious offense. The way the company seems to deliberately set itself at odds with its players (who are also customers) and then blithely walks inexorably into a problem of their own making is staggering. Ultimately, such behaviour sends a very clear message. There is clearly a conflict of interests somewhere in the chain of command and it is proving detrimental to the games evolution and customer relations."

...

"I shall also be watching very carefully how SSG handles this situation because my patience is finally exhausted with them and their cavalier attitude. If I cannot replace my LI with something comparable then I see no reason to keep playing. As a paying customer, I don’t like downgrades of service or having something taken from me. For years players have debated the future of LOTRO and pondered its fate. I believe that SSG have reached a point where their actions are directly harming the game and alienating players. They’ve been warned time and time again about the consequences of their actions. If things go ill for them, then they are the architect of their own demise and deserve no sympathy."