Constructive Feedback Thread for Recent PvMP Changes

[LegendOfKamikazee]

I have read some of the early comments on other threads on this forum regarding MPvP and quite simply they are not helpful and some not even respectful. As a very long-term player I for one am glad a dev is daring to make changes to the Ettenmoors despite historically having a toxic atmosphere. On balance over the last 6 months recent changes haven taken us in the right direction to more balanced and fun fights.

I'm sure Orion has a Beorning thickened hide by now with regards to the moaners, but to save him from wading through lots of useless posts for feedback I thought it be good to have a thread for constructive feedback only.


Creep run speed/map change

I personally like this change as it seems to help create more opportunities for smaller fights. Forcing creeps to run round the map a bit more certainly helps add more danger and chances for ambushes. Encouraging fights round different parts of the map is clearly a positive thing for gameplay and may have the added bonus of helping lag?

45% run speed (instant skill) + 10 min cd map vs 68% run speed (induction) certainly each has its own advantages but seems a decent enough trade off. Creeps will have to use maps more tactically.

Be interesting to see other feedback on maps as the weeks go by.

Suggestion: Possibly we could reduce the CD to say 8 mins.


OC/EC

I think this change is universally approved. Not heard any player complain?


NPCs tougher

Another great change overall.

Suggestion: Tir/Lug/Tol tyrant/CG to be made even tougher still as they still die relatively quickly. With maps on CD more often it may take creeps a bit longer to arrive and defend a keep.


Blessings

The idea in principle is a good one, we now can choose between a more offensive build, a defensive build or one in the middle, however the balance is off a tad on some of the blessings.

After playing on a few classes, it is apparent the blessings work better for certain classes. For example on my BA a Khjarn glass cannon build was good, nice DPS but had only 16% mitigations, however 40 metre range meant was a worthwhile tradeoff.

On Reaver it was more of an issue. High mitigations to survive getting into melee range and high crit chance are important to utilise gut punch/defeat responses. The Tarkrip blessing doesn’t have a high enough crit chance imo nor do any of the defensive builds that give the higher mits. Offensive blessings with good crit chance but no mits doesn't work as well on a melee class ) I can slot the White Hand balanced blessing but it still not quite the right fit.

Suggestion: Have a blessing skill added/amended to have both high crit chance and high mits but at the expense of other stats, ie less morale/phys mastery. This gives another playstyle option that I'm sure will suit other creeps.


Corruptions


I think overall they are ok except for the physical/tactical mitigation corruptions. I would like to see stronger bonuses (at least double)

Suggestion: Increase set bonuses. 2 set bonus from 1% to 2%, 4 set bonus from 2% to 4%.


Infamy/Renown

There is certainly less renown/infamy now gained from kills due to less buffs. Is that an intentional change?

Suggestion: If not then amend Lug/TR be increased to provide 20% instead of 10%.


Troll/Ranger Play


Not yet tested, be good if other players can provide feedback and any suggestions,


DoF

DoF is still accessible to freeps to escape from creeps. Sure this is just a minor bug that will be changed shortly.


Overall

I think the changes are positive and we are heading in the right direction for a better PVP experience. Fingers crossed we start to see action more round the map.


Please provide constructive commends/feedback - thanks

[UselessSmurf]

Undo all PvMP changes save for EC/OC.

Can the blessings and give players 6 more corruption slots like people asked for. The End.

[DSBoomer]

PVP was doing quite well on Arkenstone over the past few weeks. I've been playing this game since release and everything appeared more balanced (with some exceptions) than it has at anytime before this latest update. I fear we've just gone backwards again. I was on long enough to train my blessing (weaver) and update my corruptions only to be damn near one-shot by a burg. Homeboy took almost half my health the second he popped out of stealth. Then a champ finished me off with a 400K BS with 56% crit def. I realize I need to find the blessing/corruption lineup that works best but it's all waste if certain classes (burg/champ) can blow us up with little effort and/or skill regardless of the blessing. I hope I'm wrong and everything evens out in the end but I'm not very optimistic. We need a developer that plays creep side exclusively

[-Ben-]

I appreciate that you're trying to find some positives here, and there are some - namely OC/EC & NPC's, but I was just hit for 440k & 390k by a Guardian whilst using the White Hand clan, 4 physical mit corruptions & all available pots both in-game and store-bought, on one of the higher-mit creep classes.

Run buff - it's okay, but not at the cost of our map CD's. It's not enough to catch horses and too much for pursuing freeps that are on foot.

Dare I say it, but this is possibly worse than it was before the previous patch where creeps had to be buffed significantly to prevent then leaving in droves. We then had a period where tweaks needed to be made, but overall there was more balance than there had been in years. This update has just torn to pieces any shred of balance that existed for all of, what, 4 weeks?

Creeps needed another 6 corruption slots, and that was pretty much it for the time being. Instead we now have this overcomplicated system that nobody asked for and an overall nerf to stats. Corruptions seem pointless. 14k physical mit and 7k tact mit from a corruption... what is the point in even slotting them?

Why is it that the players can scream from the rooftops the updates that need to be made, and time and time again we end up with somebody who probably doesn't PVP, let alone play creep, coming up with #### that nobody asked for and clearly does not work in any way, shape or form.

So much of this update is totally unnecessary, and coming in with sweeping changes is no way to fine tune what was essentially, up until yesterday, a pretty good platform for balanced PVP.

[DSBoomer]

I appreciate that you're trying to find some positives here, and there are some - namely OC/EC & NPC's, but I was just hit for 440k & 390k by a Guardian whilst using the White Hand clan, 4 physical mit corruptions & all available pots both in-game and store-bought, on one of the higher-mit creep classes.

Run buff - it's okay, but not at the cost of our map CD's. It's not enough to catch horses and too much for pursuing freeps that are on foot.

Dare I say it, but this is possibly worse than it was before the previous patch where creeps had to be buffed significantly to prevent then leaving in droves. We then had a period where tweaks needed to be made, but overall there was more balance than there had been in years. This update has just torn to pieces any shred of balance that existed for all of, what, 4 weeks?

Creeps needed another 6 corruption slots, and that was pretty much it for the time being. Instead we now have this overcomplicated system that nobody asked for and an overall nerf to stats. Corruptions seem pointless. 14k physical mit and 7k tact mit from a corruption... what is the point in even slotting them?

Why is it that the players can scream from the rooftops the updates that need to be made, and time and time again we end up with somebody who probably doesn't PVP, let alone play creep, coming up with #### that nobody asked for and clearly does not work in any way, shape or form.

So much of this update is totally unnecessary, and coming in with sweeping changes is no way to fine tune what was essentially, up until yesterday, a pretty good platform for balanced PVP.

What he said!

[DickDastardly]

What he said!

what he said too

[DeadRydd]

Pl I'm not very optimistic.

What he said 10xover

[Marrochir]

I agree with your write-up, and I can add a bit on your lack of info on trolls/rangers.

Troll Session Play is incredibly broken right now, they've got an incredibly large HP pool (which I think is fine) and enormous damage that is also overtuned. I've been hit for a 1.3 million rock throw on 60% mitigation capped Guardian. What makes it so broken is that Defilers can keep the troll easily alive with their healing making them pretty much unkillable. With the current state of Defiler's I'd probably reduce the incoming healing of trolls and do a nerf to their damage.

Defilers themself are also far too powerful, they can survive with incredible ease right now and it takes multiple Freeps to take one down. It very much ruins fight if you're roaming without a healer and you have to fight Creeps with Defiler(s). Either reduce their healing by a lot, make interrupts more meaningful or make them go out of power and punishing.

[Kate00]

I agree with your write-up, and I can add a bit on your lack of info on trolls/rangers.

Troll Session Play is incredibly broken right now, they've got an incredibly large HP pool (which I think is fine) and enormous damage that is also overtuned. I've been hit for a 1.3 million rock throw on 60% mitigation capped Guardian. What makes it so broken is that Defilers can keep the troll easily alive with their healing making them pretty much unkillable. With the current state of Defiler's I'd probably reduce the incoming healing of trolls and do a nerf to their damage.

Defilers themself are also far too powerful, they can survive with incredible ease right now and it takes multiple Freeps to take one down. It very much ruins fight if you're roaming without a healer and you have to fight Creeps with Defiler(s). Either reduce their healing by a lot, make interrupts more meaningful or make them go out of power and punishing.

you have to be kidding. have you seen bears, rks, and minis? no one should be able to kill a healing class 1v1.

[Marrochir]

you have to be kidding. have you seen bears, rks, and minis? no one should be able to kill a healing class 1v1.

Both Freep and Creep healers are overtuned, Defilers just stand out more as they are relatively more powerful than the other healers.

Eventually a healer even in a 1v1 should die, due to lack of CDs & out of power in my opinion. Power is not relevant enough, they can just keep casting and not care. Interrupts are also not impactful enough, if you compare it to other tab-target MMOs such as WoW you get locked out of your magic-class for a couple of seconds. There is a DR on this lock to prevent being indefnitely being locked out.

Even in a 3v1 it takes far too much effort to bring down one defiler.

[Kate00]

Both Freep and Creep healers are overtuned, Defilers just stand out more as they are relatively more powerful than the other healers.

Eventually a healer even in a 1v1 should die, due to lack of CDs & out of power in my opinion. Power is not relevant enough, they can just keep casting and not care. Interrupts are also not impactful enough, if you compare it to other tab-target MMOs such as WoW you get locked out of your magic-class for a couple of seconds. There is a DR on this lock to prevent being indefnitely being locked out.

Even in a 3v1 it takes far too much effort to bring down one defiler.

if healers died in 1v1s there would be no point to raiding on either side in pvp or pve. this is just a ridiculous notion.

[Marrochir]

if healers died in 1v1s there would be no point to raiding on either side in pvp or pve. this is just a ridiculous notion.

No it's not, all other MMOs I've played have killable healers in 1v1 too. Making healers go OOM is nothing ridiculous after some time.

[jbach46]

I agree with your write-up, and I can add a bit on your lack of info on trolls/rangers.

Troll Session Play is incredibly broken right now, they've got an incredibly large HP pool (which I think is fine) and enormous damage that is also overtuned. I've been hit for a 1.3 million rock throw on 60% mitigation capped Guardian. What makes it so broken is that Defilers can keep the troll easily alive with their healing making them pretty much unkillable. With the current state of Defiler's I'd probably reduce the incoming healing of trolls and do a nerf to their damage.

Defilers themself are also far too powerful, they can survive with incredible ease right now and it takes multiple Freeps to take one down. It very much ruins fight if you're roaming without a healer and you have to fight Creeps with Defiler(s). Either reduce their healing by a lot, make interrupts more meaningful or make them go out of power and punishing.

up til now the trolls hardly did damage, and were too easily killed, I recall tossing big rocks at freeps and no damage showed... hitting them across the area, knocking them around, nothing... maybe its time a BIG troll does BIG damage... just a thought

[jbach46]

you have to be kidding. have you seen bears, rks, and minis? no one should be able to kill a healing class 1v1.

I second what she said

[Areyekuwe]

I second what she said

Why do people even want to kill healing class unless in a raid? If you meet a healer in the landscape 1v1, you would know that they may not be able to harm you too much. Since their forte is to heal.

Now running out of heals and dying? That is just: LOL (how about a fight in general that is long? - Could be fun, all lotro fights can be timed: you failed to kill your target fast enough, so you die.) Makes no sense at all. And yes there are MMOs where characters age and die of old age or when and if they die, then never come back. Oh, and in real life people also die at the end. But this is the game and this is a good monetization model: you build your characters up and as long as they are not actually defeated, they do their thing.

Otherwise Guardian could just get tired of caring the big shield, run out of power and die in front of defiler (defiler's slime has affected guardian's breathing passages, thus fatal asthma).