Attack on Bree - [EU]. Can the [US] have something like this

[dropdeax]

http://youtu.be/GCu5aua2Lnw

Please

[whheydt]

It's been suggested before. There are a myriad of reasons why this is a bad idea. Search the forums for previous threads.

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

[djheydt]

It's been suggested before. There are a myriad of reasons why this is a bad idea.

Yes. To begin with, there's lag. And then there's the Dreaded Lag Beast. And then there's the Lag They Were Saving Up for Judas. And .....

[Gwenryth]

Seems the Codies-GM's weren't afraid of lags, the epic F2P-Beta-"Events" were a lot of fun
We also had an attack around Lhanuch, where Thorog shows up, and lots of enemies attacked the front door.
Later we rushed through the Ettenmoors, GM's on both sides, big mobs on both sides, it was incredible funny!
Lags weren't as bad as assumed, my PC wasn't the newest one at this time, but with the layer-system it ran smoothly.

[Yula_the_Mighty]

Turbine used to do events like what CodeMasters did. Somewhere along the line, Turbine decided that it was not a good use of their limited dollars. They stopped doing all the live events. I do not think we had anything since 2008 around the time of Volume 1, Book 14 when Turbine did the Amarthiel events - the attack on Trestlebridge - the riddle challenge - the best or worst dressed characters...

IMHO - Since 2010 when Warner Brothers spent tons of dollars buying Turbine, free stuff is way down the priority list. WB is going to want revenue to pay off the cost of buying Turbine. There is operating cost penalty for the F2P model. Now Turbine has all these folks playing the game that are paying very little per customer or nothing at all.

These low paying and free customers are not putting dollars in the basket to pay for live events. I suppose Turbine could restrict the live events to VIPs. Attack Bree in a layer that no Free or Premium character can enter. No idea how much that would cost to develop. Anybody's guess as to how well received this kind of restricted feature would be by the Free and Premium folks.

[BrianDavion]

. Anybody's guess as to how well received this kind of restricted feature would be by the Free and Premium folks.

pitch forks and torches, and rightly so, some premium members have paid more into this game then a lifetimer and thus would likely feel unfairly excluded.

[Crell_1]

Anybody's guess as to how well received this kind of restricted feature would be by the Free and Premium folks.

Free: This is an epic experience, and should be free in because of the philosophy of keeping the epic story free! (Ignore the Vol 2 Epilogue, it doesnt exist!) I'm going to take all my friends with me to <insert competitors game> if you wont let us participate!
Premium: Why wont you sell us tickets to the event layer at some reasonable amount of TP char/account/visit?
VIP: Finally, some added value to our subscription.
Lifer: ...A return to the glory days!

Personally: I'd be somewhere between the VIP/Premium response.. If I thought it was going to be epic enough and routine I might maintain a subscription just for that, but I'd like to see someway for everyone to in theory be able to join the event (even if it was highly cost intensive.)

[Celt_Ainvar]

I think they should make a PVMP areas like Moors But With Bree and other Areas. It will not be on the Same Plane as Normal Bree. Like Moors you have to Port there. I think it would make lotro alot of money.

[0Pinger]

Seems the Codies-GM's weren't afraid of lags, the epic F2P-Beta-"Events" were a lot of fun
We also had an attack around Lhanuch, where Thorog shows up, and lots of enemies attacked the front door.
Later we rushed through the Ettenmoors, GM's on both sides, big mobs on both sides, it was incredible funny!
Lags weren't as bad as assumed, my PC wasn't the newest one at this time, but with the layer-system it ran smoothly.

Which they stopped even with layering it still crashed servers. When they did run events they always set a low player count per layer and Never announced them, they learnt that lesson after they crashed the servers pre-layers.

[Arvaen]

Some folks deal with as much lag every bloody day in the 'Moors. Of course there would be lag. But ya know what? It would be fun. The Amarthiel events were certainly some of the most exciting things I've ever participated in playing this game. You can only run an instance so many times before it becomes a boring grind. Live events provide an ever changing scenario because a real person is behind it. The events wouldn't even have to happen all that often, just once in a long while would be nice. They stopped doing that sort of thing long before F2P launched though. I guess Turbine lost some of their concept of fun.

[BrianDavion]

I think they should make a PVMP areas like Moors But With Bree and other Areas. It will not be on the Same Plane as Normal Bree. Like Moors you have to Port there. I think it would make lotro alot of money.

ahh yes because PVPers are just quietly waiting in droves for the perfect open world PVP content. ignore the mass failure of every PVP driven MMO to date please! he speaks truth!

[Arvaen]

ahh yes because PVPers are just quietly waiting in droves for the perfect open world PVP content. ignore the mass failure of every PVP driven MMO to date please! he speaks truth!

Putting aside the countless arguments that have been made about the open PvP idea (which isn't exactly what was the suggestion)...

Ignore the massive failure that this game is becoming in many people's eyes!

[Celt_Ainvar]

ahh yes because PVPers are just quietly waiting in droves for the perfect open world PVP content. ignore the mass failure of every PVP driven MMO to date please! he speaks truth!

Funny but that not what I suggested BrianDavion. Yes there are Games that have PVP. Let me Put into Steps

1 You Log on
2 You go to Stable Master
3 Like the Moors You Traval Bree monster Play

Note Bree Monster play would not have the same features as Bree Meaning No AH, Store and such. No NPC in it. No low level toons.

Or the other Option they could do. Make a few pvmp Servers. Start off low

1 you can move one of your toons over TP required. Give the User 24 hours or so on Monster play. You dont get XP or Destany Points. Like beta nothing you do on this server go back to your Server.

2 Have it where For Or every few hours It a differnt area. like Bree, Shire, Moria. So it not the HUGE lotro map and it block by the Invisable Wall into other areas. Also have a limit of people per area. Let say 50 Creeps, 50 Freeps. For how many lotro areas there are and some areas can be broken down more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_Zla...layer_embedded

[BrianDavion]

Ignore the massive failure that this game is becoming in many people's eyes!

how is not haveing events a failure? someone at turbine proably did a cost vs benifits anylasis and realized that the events well fun the costs and hassles inherant in open world events simply do not justify the breif fun.

Let's say there's a two hour event in the open world for a second,

first of all there's the endless troubles with lag etc because the whole server is gonna rush it (let's face it the Moors likely only ever have a tiny fraction of a server in em at any given time) so this is gonna lead to inevitable complaints and "TURBINE YOU SUCK I COULDN'T MAKE THE EVENT DUE TO LAG" posts.

then there's the pay question, I dunno how much a GM gets paid by turbine, for all I know they're volenteers for free, but I have heard the 15 dollar an hour figure tossed about elsewhere so figure thats 15-30 bucks in pay alone to run an event (also it means 1 GM whose not answering tickets and thus slightly reduced response time in that area) these things add up. I'm not saying it is or isn't worth it but turbine may simply have concluded this.

[Arvaen]

how is not haveing events a failure?

It's not the lack of events precisely that has people angry with Turbine, it's multitude of things. Lack of communication, their extreme focus on selling everything they possibly can in the store with little to no regard for opinion of the people who are paying, no real semblance of new or innovation game mechanics, the endless grind that they simple reset with each expansion... Many people have their own concerns. Holding an occasional live event couldn't hurt, might even breathe some life back into this game.

Let's say there's a two hour event in the open world for a second,

first of all there's the endless troubles with lag etc because the whole server is gonna rush it (let's face it the Moors likely only ever have a tiny fraction of a server in em at any given time) so this is gonna lead to inevitable complaints and "TURBINE YOU SUCK I COULDN'T MAKE THE EVENT DUE TO LAG" posts.

It's not really that uncommon to have over 100 people raided up in the 'Moors at one time on my server. No less than there are in Bree most of the time, and that town commands it's own instance. Why couldn't the same potentially be done for a PvMP zone (doesn't necessarily have to be Bree, anywhere would be nice).

then there's the pay question, I dunno how much a GM gets paid by turbine, for all I know they're volenteers for free, but I have heard the 15 dollar an hour figure tossed about elsewhere so figure thats 15-30 bucks in pay alone to run an event (also it means 1 GM whose not answering tickets and thus slightly reduced response time in that area) these things add up. I'm not saying it is or isn't worth it but turbine may simply have concluded this.

Really? You're saying that a company who runs a world wide MMORPG, under the Tolkien IP, with the support of Warner Brothers can't pay or spare 29 people for 2 hours once every 6 months or so? I suppose that's not terribly surprising.

[whheydt]

Or the other Option they could do. Make a few pvmp Servers. Start off low

Turbine has run "special rules" servers, in the sense that there is underlying code supporting the special rules, not in the sense of enforcing tighter rules on names and such as is done on RP servers.

Some salient characteristics stand out...

1. The cost of hardware and operations is the same as for a normal server,

2. The support costs (personnel, programming) is higher,

3. Such servers have far fewer people playing on them than normal servers,

4. The costs in terms of having to fix exploits is far higher than on a normal server.

The bottom line is: More expensive, less revenue.

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

[whheydt]

then there's the pay question, I dunno how much a GM gets paid by turbine, for all I know they're volenteers for free, but I have heard the 15 dollar an hour figure tossed about elsewhere so figure thats 15-30 bucks in pay alone to run an event (also it means 1 GM whose not answering tickets and thus slightly reduced response time in that area) these things add up. I'm not saying it is or isn't worth it but turbine may simply have concluded this.

"GMs" in the sense of the first line guys that handle tickets are low paid. However, those aren't the people that run events. They haven't the skills, they don't have access to the tools, and they're too low on the totem pole to be allowed the discretion of what to do when.

The people that run events are much more senior. It's senior CSRs and developers. They're paid a whole lot more than GMs. Not only is there the cost of having these people run the events, but it takes them away from their normal duties, impacting the work the company wants them doing.

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

[NaughtyMistress]

I would like to see live events put back into the game. The Amarthial event was exceptionally amusing, with kins having captains stationed all over the place in hopes for a showing where we could all be summoned to.

I do understand that Turbine is a business, and the main goal of any business is to make copious amounts of money. I also understand that running live events is not always cost effective in and of itself. However, making your customers happy usually goes a very long way in recovering costs, as they will often be more willing to spend money with you.

Live events could be limited to once every few months. They could be open to everyone, or restricted to VIP's(with or without having F2P and premium players present after purchasing 'tickets'). They could even be small events, such as the random spawning of NPC bosses in places they don't normally spawn(this has been done before and I believe, requires no special coding) or large GM-run events such as we have experienced in the past.

Either way, I believe it would be nice to have live events again. It would certainly help with some of the "I'm tired of the same old thing every expansion" attitude.

[Nymphonic]

Yes. To begin with, there's lag. And then there's the Dreaded Lag Beast. And then there's the Lag They Were Saving Up for Judas. And .....

I'm on a low cost DSL. I lag even when I'm alone in Trollshaws, I can only imagine being in Bree with something like this happening. And no, I'm not trying to ruin everyone else's fun, by saying if I can't play, no one can. I'm just saying an event like this would shut me down for the evening until the even was over.

pitch forks and torches, and rightly so, some premium members have paid more into this game then a lifetimer and thus would likely feel unfairly excluded.

I can vouch for this. Being a lifetimer, I haven't paid one penny since Mirkwood and play 6 or 7 nights a week.

Oh, and NaughtyMistress, I love your sig at the bottom!

[Celt_Ainvar]

Turbine has run "special rules" servers, in the sense that there is underlying code supporting the special rules, not in the sense of enforcing tighter rules on names and such as is done on RP servers.

Some salient characteristics stand out...

1. The cost of hardware and operations is the same as for a normal server,

2. The support costs (personnel, programming) is higher,

3. Such servers have far fewer people playing on them than normal servers,

4. The costs in terms of having to fix exploits is far higher than on a normal server.

The bottom line is: More expensive, less revenue.

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

Let see 29 Servers. There alot of Freeps and Creeps that would like to do monsters play in the whole lotro area. If it setup so you can buy Time on this one or two servers monster play. Let say 2, 4, 8 hour or even 24 Hours on a Log on Timer. Meaning for 24 Hours you can play for 24 Hours on that servers. I bet you people would complain because there would be a waiting list. Because the servers would be full.

So I think you have it wrong. Expensive yes. But More Revenue yes.

[BrianDavion]

"GMs" in the sense of the first line guys that handle tickets are low paid. However, those aren't the people that run events. They haven't the skills, they don't have access to the tools, and they're too low on the totem pole to be allowed the discretion of what to do when.

The people that run events are much more senior. It's senior CSRs and developers. They're paid a whole lot more than GMs. Not only is there the cost of having these people run the events, but it takes them away from their normal duties, impacting the work the company wants them doing.

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

true I was lowballing it,

[whheydt]

So I think you have it wrong. Expensive yes. But More Revenue yes.

Take it up with the Blizzard exec who said in an interview that PvP servers cost 30% more to run than normal servers.

Now consider that back when AC1 showed the number of people logged in on each server, you'd see about 2500 on each of the "white" servers and maybe 500 on Darktide...the PvP server.

Taking those two data together, you're asking Turbine to spend 30% more on a server for 20% of the people on a normal server AND to maintain the code base and do the required testing to do it. Works out to a minimum of 6.5 times the cost per player. Are you willing to commit to between $650 and $1200 per year?

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

[Celt_Ainvar]

Take it up with the Blizzard exec who said in an interview that PvP servers cost 30% more to run than normal servers.

Now consider that back when AC1 showed the number of people logged in on each server, you'd see about 2500 on each of the "white" servers and maybe 500 on Darktide...the PvP server.

Taking those two data together, you're asking Turbine to spend 30% more on a server for 20% of the people on a normal server AND to maintain the code base and do the required testing to do it. Works out to a minimum of 6.5 times the cost per player. Are you willing to commit to between $650 and $1200 per year?

--W. H. Heydt

Old Used Programmer

Let take a look at AOC server list Just looking on a few sites.

Frostfell
Harvestgain
Leafcull
Morningthaw
Solclaim
Thistledown
Verdantine
Wintersebb
Darktide

Yes I can see 8 servers. Cost of one pvp I can see they could be wasting there money it dont look like they have much of a player base.

Let take a look at Lotro server list.

Arkenstone
Brandywine
Crickethollow
Dwarrowdelf
Eldar
Elendilmir
Evernight
firefoot
Gilrain
Gladden
Imladris
Landroval
Laurelin
Meneldor
Nimrodel
Riddermark
Silverlode
Snowbourn
Vilya Windfola
Withywindle
Anduin
Belegar
Gwaihir
Maiar
Morhond
Vanyar
Estel
Sirannon

Wow I see almost 3x then the servers then AC1. They can start out as a beta test and the waters. See how many People would go for it. Out of 8 servers. There has to be more then 500 Players pvmp. On the server I am on. We have a good 25 to 75 in in the Moors. Let say the low end 50 per servers x 29 servers. Wow would be 1450 pvmp. Charge turbine points. To buy access to that one server. Then Also Charge for pvmp Armour and so on Pots and such. Ya I can see how lotro would would be making money not losing it.

Please note AOC Dont have Turbine points yet.

[Polar-cy]

If you think codemasters did good events you should check in youtube the russian lotro.Invasion in eregion or forochel.With this hardware they are using that even now 50vs50 you get 4s skill lag i would pass on open world events,instead of spending money to make new pvp areas i prefer first to upgrade the hardware.

[ImirielOfTheNorth]

Let take a look at AOC server list Just looking on a few sites.

Wow I see almost 3x then the servers then AC1. They can start out as a beta test and the waters. See how many People would go for it. Out of 8 servers. There has to be more then 500 Players pvmp. On the server I am on. We have a good 25 to 75 in in the Moors. Let say the low end 50 per servers x 29 servers. Wow would be 1450 pvmp. Charge turbine points. To buy access to that one server. Then Also Charge for pvmp Armour and so on Pots and such. Ya I can see how lotro would would be making money not losing it.

Please note AOC Dont have Turbine points yet.

You must be playing on a very low populated server for only 25-75.

And yes, it would be nice to see some random events. They let loose on Bullroarer, and although I understand that is a beta server, it would be nice to see some fun stuff on other servers.
I wasn't around for Amarthiel and the random attacks on Trestlebridge, but that would definitely break the monotone of end-game in this game. I've gotten to the point where I can't even stand questing, or running instances, need something new.