What is new in the store, armors?????

[Thorsvin]

[Brinswith]

So its ok for players to charge outrageous prices???? Ok gotcha...

i hate to move away from the crux of the matter in this thread which is the addition of something that was never supposed to have seen the light of day. However i feel that i should point out here that high prices on AH goods are only there becasue people will pay that, if they didnt those goods would never sell and this would lead to them being sent back to the seller to be reposted at a lower price. I sell a full set of critted armour for 10x the level of the armour so for example a full set of 22 critted armour will only set you back 220s. I dont call that greed.

[Vellem]

So its ok for players to charge outrageous prices???? Ok gotcha...

Well, I never said it was right or wrong. That isn't the point. To use a familiar argument that people use in regards to the store...Say I put up a level 15 critted purple for 5 gold. That is an outrageous price but no one is forcing people to buy it. You don't need it to play the game.

I was just saying it is wrong to blame the players for saying stat gear needs to be sold in the store because enough of it isn't being sold on the AH. I extended their logic to what you were saying about some stuff on the AH being too expensive to Turbine selling gold so players would have more options to buy things on the AH.

[Ayrolen]

I think this is where the crux of the issue lies. When the ore/ingots/logs/planks/etc. can be sold be sold at a higher value on the AH than the price of crafting and selling gear with those same resources at a reasonable price for a player of that level, there's not much that can be done. It's in the player's interest in-game to sell the resources at a higher value than to craft items to make available on the AH.

I don't particularly care what's in my best interest, financially, in a game. The outrageous prices of raw mats just goes to show how lazy players have gotten. Go gather your own and protest the insane prices!

Also, as the level cap increases and the amount of coin that can be gained/hr increases, for a player that is after increasing their gains at their max, it is not in their interest to obtain lower-tier resources and craft lower tier gear at a reasonable price.

Again with this "in their best interest stuff." I play this game for fun. It's not a job. I'm not supporting my family with the gold I earn in LOTRO. I can't possibly be the only person in this game that is willing to go gather up some low to mid-level resources and toss some stuff up on the AH for reasonable prices once in awhile. I tend to keep most everything on hand in my vault anyway and refill my stock using lower level alts (and gaining some levels in the process). It's a good excuse to log them in.

[Lainalagos]

The high prices on the AH can be remedied in many ways. One that immediately springs to mind is a reverse of the AH where players can 'commision' certain items with the amount they are prepared to pay. A crafter takes the 'contract' and when they fulfill it they get paid.

That is a good, community firendly way of doing it. One that improves the game, and the health of everything around it.

Stat armour, like the new stat tombs, lootbox gamble and so on are nothing but cheap cash grabs, and this is one too many for me. This is one step too far away from the integrity, dignity and depth anything associated with Tolkein deserves. Turbine and WB need to have a think about which side of the War of the Ring they are resembling more and more and more.

For what it's worth, I'm out, I refuse to play a game run by a company that has currently shed all of it's integrity. My last hope is that the player reaction from this will be so negative and so harsh it serves as a wake up call to those who somehow think they are still representing Tolkein's vision in a virtual world. There is no emote for spitting on the ground from a sudden bad taste on the mouth...

[Bryos]

[Fipiara]

I don't particularly care what's in my best interest, financially, in a game. The outrageous prices of raw mats just goes to show how lazy players have gotten. Go gather your own and protest the insane prices!


Again with this "in their best interest stuff." I play this game for fun. It's not a job. I'm not supporting my family with the gold I earn in LOTRO. I can't possibly be the only person in this game that is willing to go gather up some low to mid-level resources and toss some stuff up on the AH for reasonable prices once in awhile. I tend to keep most everything on hand in my vault anyway and refill my stock using lower level alts (and gaining some levels in the process). It's a good excuse to log them in.

I'm not saying I agree or it's what I do, but a lot of players try to maximize the "rewards" for their time spent in game (whether xp, ixp, gold, marks, seals, etc.). It's just the way things are in game, and unfortunately it leads to a lack of critted/dropped purple armor on the AH at a reasonable price.

Anecdotal - a couple of months ago I cleaned up a huge amount of purple dropped gear L9-35 I had stored in an alt's vault (~90 items). I was thinking about vendoring them as I didn't think the stats were all that great and were not worthwhile, but instead threw it up on the AH at a cheap price. I was amazed at how many sold, even things that I thought no one would be interested in buying. Sold over 90% of them in the first day they were on the AH (a couple here and there at various times throughout the day, so it probably was not a single buyer picking them all up). There definitely is a demand out there depending on your server.

[Abiyah]

Anecdotal - a couple of months ago I cleaned up a huge amount of purple dropped gear L9-35 I had stored in an alt's vault (~90 items). I was thinking about vendoring them as I didn't think the stats were all that great and were not worthwhile, but instead threw it up on the AH at a cheap price. I was amazed at how many sold, even things that I thought no one would be interested in buying. Sold over 90% of them in the first day they were on the AH (a couple here and there at various times throughout the day, so it probably was not a single buyer picking them all up). There definitely is a demand out there depending on your server.

One of my characters is a burg, and I pickpocket a lot of purple stuff. The stats aren't anything great, not as good as crafted same level stuff, so I sell it for pretty cheap, but not insanely low. And it sells. But now, with the stuff available in the store, will the sales continue? I would hope so, as players tell Turbine a big "NO" with their wallets, but I realize there are plenty of players who will buy just because it's the easy way.

[Ayrolen]

Anecdotal - a couple of months ago I cleaned up a huge amount of purple dropped gear L9-35 I had stored in an alt's vault (~90 items). I was thinking about vendoring them as I didn't think the stats were all that great and were not worthwhile, but instead threw it up on the AH at a cheap price. I was amazed at how many sold, even things that I thought no one would be interested in buying. Sold over 90% of them in the first day they were on the AH (a couple here and there at various times throughout the day, so it probably was not a single buyer picking them all up). There definitely is a demand out there depending on your server.

That's always been my experience as well, both on Crickhollow and on Elendilmir, where there are a lot more people capable of making their own gear. Heck, there have even been a few times over the last couple of years where I knew a kinmate could make something for me if I just sent them a mail and asked them to do it the next time they logged in, but being the creature of instant gratification that I am, I went to the AH instead with the intention of dropping a few hundred silver a piece on a set of gear. It's frustrating when I'm reading to do that and I'm met with absolutely nothing or maybe a few non-crit things here and there.

One of my characters is a burg, and I pickpocket a lot of purple stuff. The stats aren't anything great, not as good as crafted same level stuff, so I sell it for pretty cheap, but not insanely low. And it sells. But now, with the stuff available in the store, will the sales continue? I would hope so, as players tell Turbine a big "NO" with their wallets, but I realize there are plenty of players who will buy just because it's the easy way.

The store isn't the easy way for the vast majority of people who play this game because it's free. Chances are if they're playing for the sole reason of the game being free, they aren't going to whip out their credit card to buy a bunch of TP either. And as a VIP who gets 500 free points a month, the last thing I want to spend my TP on is gear that I can make myself.

[Lord_Fear]

Just adding my disapproval on this also. I already cancelled my sub a few months back from the lack of PVMP attention. But this is just another step in the wrong direction IMO. They should just come out with the raid/pvmp gear in the store and get it over with. Everyone knows it is coming.

[k3nn3th]

A few quick things, if I may.

It's lower level gear. Many players have given us feedback that there is a sparcity of gear on the AH at these levels and they wanted an alternative. We're trying to accomodate that.
So, I applaud your decision to kick start the gear market on your server. Options are what it's all about.

How many capped solo players have "given you feedback that there is a sparcity" of level 75/end-game/fellowship-level/raid-level gear "available to them"?

If level 20s with fifty-five levels worth of gear improvements ahead of them can complain that there is a "scarcity of gear on the AH" when they can easily get gear from questing, grouping, skirming or crafting (or finding a capable crafter, you know, this being an MMO and all) - whats to stop level 75s from "giving you feedback" (/Turbine claiming that they received feedback from them) about the same thing?

"I can only play for X amount of time a day/Can't find anybody to group with/Am for whatever reason unable to participate in group content (and if level 75 - and have already completed all of the solo content)".
"I can't find X item on the AH"
"I can't find a crafter to make me X"
"I am for whatever reason incapable of crafting in LOTRO"

Any of the above can be claimed by anybody.

The difference is, a level 75 character who has done all of his/her solo quests and TRULY cannot participate in any group content - has no choice but to be content with what he or she has obtained via quests from levels 1-75, craft something his or herself/find a crafter, or "take what they get" as far as what they can find on the AH.


Aside from the fact that you could have: directed these low-levels to any relatively on-level F2P quest/the Instance Finder/GLFF - if you really were concerned with gear availability at level 20-ish you could've put those exact items that are coming out on the Store, available from some random barterer/NPC instead, with mark or copper/silver costs, or made them quest rewards for a current (or hell, new) level 20 quest.

A new player at level 20 needs to learn about skirmishes/marks/skirm camp bartering for gear/experiencing group content - not waste their first batch of TP on pieces of armor that they will "out grow" (Sapience) and replace with quest rewards within a few hours of game play.

Level 20ish characters don't need "options".
They have every piece of level 20-75 gear ahead of them. Even a solo-only level 20 player has quest rewards and skirmish barter-able gear upgrades available to them for EVERY LEVEL on the way to 75.

What was the goal in this, if not solely to snake some cash from new players who don't understand how utterly worthless these armor pieces are/will be to them in the blink of an eye?

*Obviously you will not claim that you wanted their money.

*Clearly you are not ignorant of the fact that there is PLENTY of easily-acquired gear available to level 20's (or whatever levels this gear is for) in-game and you are also aware that you could have put the gear in question in-game rather than in-store if you so desired.

*Which leaves us with? - You must indeed be testing the community's reaction to putting stat-giving gear available for purchase in the store.

Halted experience is an option. If you want to stop your character in their lower 20s (about the max level of the gear in question) then that's your choice. Like I mentioned above, it's all about options. Now you'll have more.

"I can't find X item on the AH"
"I can only play for X amount of time a day/Can't find anybody to group with/Am for whatever reason unable to participate in group content and have already completed all of the solo content"
"I can't find a crafter to make me X"
"I am for whatever reason incapable of crafting in LOTRO"

I don't see how the above complaints justify any gear on the store - but clearly since the first one was enough for you, you tell me - what about the rest?

75s can complain about everything listed above just as much as level 20s can - and if they have completed the solo content of the game have no way to "go up" and improve their gear via quests and skirmishes unlike level 20s.

Soooo....

If "more options" is your excuse for putting level 20ish stat-giving gear on the store for level 20 players (who have endless opportunities or "OPTIONS" for gear ahead of them... ) at what point will you "get feedback" from players who are 75 and decide to give them "the option" to buy level 75 stat-giving fellowship/raid-level gear from the store (since for some, grouping isn't an option - and they want "more options" too)?


/No stat-giving gear on the LOTRO store.

[Abiyah]

The store isn't the easy way for the vast majority of people who play this game because it's free. Chances are if they're playing for the sole reason of the game being free, they aren't going to whip out their credit card to buy a bunch of TP either. And as a VIP who gets 500 free points a month, the last thing I want to spend my TP on is gear that I can make myself.

How much longer, though, will this be the case? Subscriptions are going bye-bye; one of the exit survey questions points to that. With subs gone, no more 500tp per month. And with subs gone, so are a lot of the current customers. Which really looks to be the aim of this exercise-- get rid of the old guard and introduce a new player base that will already have the store there to buy their gear.

And we all know the game is not truly "free", not if you are really into playing it.

[Ayrolen]

And we all know the game is not truly "free", not if you are really into playing it.

We do? I've been here since 2006 and I actually haven't spent a cent on it since Mirkwood came out because my RoI expansion was a gift. Even so, I don't pay for anything, other than expansions and I actually could have gotten RoI for free using my free TP had I not gotten it as a gift.

[DarkCntry]

We do? I've been here since 2006 and I actually haven't spent a cent on it since Mirkwood came out because my RoI expansion was a gift. Even so, I don't pay for anything, other than expansions and I actually could have gotten RoI for free using my free TP had I not gotten it as a gift.

That's because you don't actually exist..

[Ayrolen]

That's because you don't actually exist..

You figured out my secret!

[dadiro95]

/No armor in the lotro store

[SabrielofLorien]

We do? I've been here since 2006 and I actually haven't spent a cent on it since Mirkwood came out because my RoI expansion was a gift. Even so, I don't pay for anything, other than expansions and I actually could have gotten RoI for free using my free TP had I not gotten it as a gift.

Slight problem here:

• I actually haven't spent a cent / I don't pay for anything
• [I] pay for ... expansions
• I actually could have gotten RoI for free using my free TP
• my RoI expansion was a gift.

Well, you do pay for expansions. If you have free TP, you paid somehow, somewhere, sometime. I get free TP I'm a founder and lifer but I PAID for those subs so they were not "free". And someone thought enough of you to pay for you to have the expansion. It might not have come out of your wallet, but Turbine doesnt care who coughs up the $$.

So, you did pay, you do pay and you continue to pay. Not even founders/lifers go without paying.


TANSTAAFL - There aint no such thing as a free lunch - nor Turbine Points.

[IronJake]

I disagree with adding armour to the store, as has been posted previously it starts a very dangerous trend. There is no need for it. I am a founder/lifer and have been playing consistently and know the store and F2P is the way to go for Turbine but this would be the line they shouldn't cross. This is wrong.

[Ayrolen]

Slight problem here:

• I actually haven't spent a cent / I don't pay for anything

If you'd actually bothered to read before hitting Reply, you'd see that I said "I actually haven't spent a cent on it since Mirkwood came out."

Well, you do pay for expansions. If you have free TP, you paid somehow, somewhere, sometime. I get free TP I'm a founder and lifer but I PAID for those subs so they were not "free". And someone thought enough of you to pay for you to have the expansion. It might not have come out of your wallet, but Turbine doesnt care who coughs up the $$.

So, you did pay, you do pay and you continue to pay. Not even founders/lifers go without paying.

You can keep calling it whatever you want if it makes you think you've won some sort of internet argument on semantics, but paying $200 on a Lifetime expansion almost 5 years ago means that I'm not paying anything right now. Since I don't pay anything per month, the 500 TP that Turbine puts into my count is FREE.

Also, didn't you say you were quitting several pages back? Since you're on a lifetime sub, you can leave at any time, right?

[SabrielofLorien]

While we are in here and before the thread vaporizes...

Hypothetical Question:

IF suddenly someone from Turbine, showed up here and said "

OH That was a blunder. We won't do that. I don't know how that got out. It was internal testing only. We will not be having armour with stats/buffs in the store."

Or something along those lines. Would you believe them???

I think my ability to believe anything from Turbine has been permanently damaged. I recall the first time in Beta when we saw they had Rep Horses in the (new) Store. Many including myself, screamed and ranted and were labled trolls but we railed against it. Then Turbine said "we will not put horses in the store... we promise." And I felt safe. But after Beta closed - Horses were on the menu.

My belief in Turbine has been completely shattered. Like an abusive spouse - "Dear I'll never do THAT again, I promise...." Woe unto thee, Turbine.

[Darmokk]

Why is this a big deal? Überpotions with 5x the self-heal rate compared to the best in-game potions have been in the shop from f2p day 1. Stat tomes appeared shortly thereafter. Of course only for low levels where nobody cares. At first. Are we up to top level stat tomes yet? Sorry I don't know.

Ah I get it. Those who were fooling themselves can't any longer. Is that it? Is that what makes people upset now? And it's only for low levels where nobody cares.

[k3nn3th]

Why is this a big deal? Überpotions with 5x the self-heal rate compared to the best in-game potions have been in the shop from f2p day 1. Stat tomes appeared shortly thereafter. Of course only for low levels where nobody cares. At first. Are we up to top level stat tomes yet? Sorry I don't know.

Ah I get it. Those who were fooling themselves can't any longer. Is that it? Is that what makes people upset now? And it's only for low levels where nobody cares.

I'd be willing to bet those low levels will care about their wasted money/TP if they buy that armor and you know.. level up a few times.

Stat tomes are up to T7.

[GottaHaveOne]

I think it is just paving the way for higher gear and raid gear that can be store bought. I still remember Turbine saying they wouldn't put armour and crafted items on the store...but they continue to do so. I have toons for all the crafting and willing offer items to kinmates and friends. I think this is also sad because of the way the are just "sneaking" it into the store....
SAD

[Degu]

Turb never misses a chance to throw some fresh grease on that slope, eh?

[AmazingX]

This is a bad idea, will hurt both the players and turbine. I wonder if they realize that the only people who would get such gear of the store are people who get all their tp from deeding. They should end this before it takes a single step further. I doubt raid gear will ever be made available, but still I know it's a worry for everyone

Advice to Turbine: Sell cosmetics of the raid gear sets, particularly the old sets like rift. People will eat it up, you get moneys, everyone's happy. Don't sell stuff that you're supposed to play the game to earn.