Soldiers on the landscape

[Yula_the_Mighty]

If you’re correct, and if the folks in this thread who think that there will be a TP charge for summoning a landscape soldier are also correct, then this will be the official demarcation of where a store purchase became necessary to simply play the game with a reasonable modicum of success.

I doubt there will be a cost to use your soldier on that landscape.

The cost will be the need to spend time growing your soldier by doing content that awards the necessary marks and medallions. We are going to be forced into doing the Epic Line to unlock the Skirmish instances. You will need the solo Skirmishes to get the barter currency. If you are a grouper, you have to potential of doing the group instances - Skirmish or Classic.

To me the big issue is the Free and Premium players. They will not have have access to the VIP rental skirmish or classic instances. They will have to wait until they get to Moria and unlock the 2.5.5 Skirmishes. If I remember correctly all they get is two Skirmishes and Great Barrows.

To me it is going to be an annoyance. Another thing I have to do. I do not know how many more times I can do Battle in the Tower before pulling out another tuft of fur.

[Grhysli]

With 8 different characters there is no way I am going to have a fully leveled skirmish soldier for each of them!
I refuse to put that kind of grind in on characters that are essentially crafting alts albeit max level.

I have 1 main character that will have a max level skirmish soldier
All the others will have to make do with level 10 or so soldiers LOL

[Silverangel]

With 8 different characters there is no way I am going to have a fully leveled skirmish soldier for each of them!
I refuse to put that kind of grind in on characters that are essentially crafting alts albeit max level.

I already have the same problem but with grinding LI's for those alts. Is that any different?

I think you nailed the solution that would work for me too, though--allow Skirmish Soldiers to learn crafts. That would be a happy thing. And then Turbine could consider not calling them "skirmish soldiers" any more, which at this point is kind of demeaning. Lol. A re-branding might go places.

In any case, you can be sure the store will be there to help you level up those soldiers. I personally doubt that soldiers will be made mandatory or that the landscape will be made more difficult beyond anything it's ever been.

[Ferthcott]

I think you nailed the solution that would work for me too, though--allow Skirmish Soldiers to learn crafts. That would be a happy thing. And then Turbine could consider not calling them "skirmish soldiers" any more, which at this point is kind of demeaning. Lol. A re-branding might go places.

Careful, someday we might wake up to our skirmish go-suicide pets equipped with class story and mithril-flake-gift-spam romances, that would be unheard of

[Khafar]

What is being suggested in this thread would be a game changer, and in an ugly way. If quests will be designed to be significantly more difficult because of the assumption that everyone will be using a landscape soldier, and the use of that soldier will require a Store purchase, this to me would be a deal breaker.

True, but I seriously doubt they'd do that. Announcing that skirmish soldiers would be available for use on the landscape and conveniently "forgetting" to mention that they're Store-only would be incredibly stupid, practically begging for the next PR disaster... and making the game either unplayable or unfun for a large set of players. Store-only skirmish soldiers would be a grotesque gameplay advantage for those who used them, probably moreso than selling First Age weapons would be. I simply don't believe that Turbine would do that.

Guess we'll see come March, when I expect they'll be putting this out on Bullroarer.

Khafar

[xandervix_tog]

If your soldier can go off and vendor all your trash loot like they can in TOR, that would be worth it. I'll probably summon mine just for that.

[Khafar]

If your soldier can go off and vendor all your trash loot like they can in TOR, that would be worth it. I'll probably summon mine just for that.

Yeah, I do enjoy that. I also enjoy sending my companions in TOR off to do "crew skills" (aka "crafting") for me while I play. It costs some credits to send them off on missions, but I get the things they find/mine/produce, and I get the crafting advancement.

In any case, here's to hoping Turbine makes some breakthroughs in terms of pathing and behavioral AI, moving skirmish soldiers from an "annoyance" for many players to an "unqualified asset".

Khafar

[xandervix_tog]

In any case, here's to hoping Turbine makes some breakthroughs in terms of pathing and behavioral AI, moving skirmish soldiers from an "annoyance" for many players to an "unqualified asset".

Khafar

I agree! Let's hope so

[Zvim666]

I think it is a great idea, it just opens more content up and will allow players to do the easier fellowship quests, people mostly skip them at present, would open up more content.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Make it so when your skirmish soldier dies you need an item to bring him back to life. Something needs to be done to make people THINK about using their soldier and NOT using their soldier.

If they keep the soldier gate to certain areas and only SOME areas added in the future I'll stay with the game otherwise this may be the straw to break the back of the game.

The game is easy enough without ANOTHER helping hand.

Also..what is this "game play advantage" people are speaking of if they had specific soldiers in the store? Who exactly are you competing against in this carebear game?

[Khafar]

Also..what is this "game play advantage" people are speaking of if they had specific soldiers in the store? Who exactly are you competing against in this carebear game?

The comparison is always going to be to other players. If it weren't, the "convenience, not advantage" comment they made about the Store was completely nonsensical. If all that mattered was my own gameplay, I should be able to buy all First Age weapons, raid armor, and a fully leveled character in the Store if I wish. You don't see that happening, and we shouldn't see Store-only skirmish soldier access to the landscape either.

Khafar

[Chanah]

This is a near-certainty, IMO. In fact, I'll be surprised if they don't eventually wind up making some previous content more difficult so that players using skirmish soldiers on the landscape don't find it all way too easy.

Worse, once it becomes a de facto standard for players above a certain level to be using skirmish soldiers, it will soon thereafter become a de facto standard for players above a certain (higher) level to be using fully leveled up skirmish soldiers everywhere. The content inflation will continue.

If the skirmish soldiers in LOTRO were as smart and useful as they are in TOR, this wouldn't really bother me all that much. Those don't have pathing problems, they're pretty good in whatever role you assign to them in combat, they don't aggro stuff gratuitously, they're more configurable, and they can even do useful stuff like selling your vendor trash for you, no matter where you happen to be (they run off for about a minute). Unfortunately, that's not entirely true here. If Turbine doesn't step up their game on their "pet" AI, I could see this being a very real net negative to the game for many players. We're not really "required" to do skirmishes beyond those few in the epic storyline, and many don't. This could turn out quite differently - either the game will be way too easy for some players, or way too hard for others.

Khafar

Oh yes. I don't play TOR, but heroes in Guild Wars are also configurable, and do quite well - you're far better taking them along to instances than you would be pugging it with strangers. Whilst my herbalist simply stops after the jailhouse fight in Thievery & Mischief and stands in the middle of the yard, doing nothing. I have to dismiss and resummon her to get to the next area, and even then she's apt to wander off, or stop healing even when there isn't a scary lieutenant around. And herbalists are probably the best soldiers in terms of not screwing things up that LoTRO has.

I do not look forward.

[Kerin_Eldar]

they really need to improve the pathing of our teh melee soldiers becasue it is just horrable.

Welcome to the world we Loremasters have lived in for nearly 5 years.

[Arlecchino79]

Soldier on landscape is a total fail imo, because :

1) This is supposed to help ppl questing when leveling a new pg from 1 to 85... but... who have the marks to train a soldier before reaching the cap with a new pg?

2) Player that was at cap for 2-3 month or more have powerfull gear and skilled soldier... and simply don't need any help questing from 75 to 85.

This would end in a more difficult questing for new players (that already have hard time with their bad equip) and in a more easy questin for veterans player (more boring than usual...)

Soldier in plainscape is a failure imo... (they're a failure also in raid skirmish imo...)

[PANZERBUNNY]

The comparison is always going to be to other players. If it weren't, the "convenience, not advantage" comment they made about the Store was completely nonsensical. If all that mattered was my own gameplay, I should be able to buy all First Age weapons, raid armor, and a fully leveled character in the Store if I wish. You don't see that happening, and we shouldn't see Store-only skirmish soldier access to the landscape either.

Khafar

I could see F2P players having to use points. Other subs will probably get it when it is introduced. No different than other free content added to the game.

It isn't something absolutely needed in the game and I hope it never will.

[Uron]

I don't skirmish and don't have the marks nor the desire to level up a soldier. I think I'll be fine though, assuming the mobs aren't Elite level

[Midwinterman]

looking forward to seeing how this works out. one obvious thing it's going to do is make the game much easier and less challenging, unless they are going to increase mob stats. I hope they don't make the game easier because I like the challenge for building up my alts

[Traur]

I am giddy as a school boy for this, I have a near fully leveled herbalist for my champ and frankly the idea of having a solid pocket healer who also provides buffs and power while I shing shing my way to victory against hordes and hordes of orcs is just juicy enough to turn my dwarf dreams from PG-13 to completely x-rated.

[Warriorpoetex75]

the "convenience, not advantage" comment they made about the Store was completely nonsensical.

Khafar

It is. They are slowly starting to sell 'Advantage' rather than simple 'Convenience'.

I wouldn't be surprised if they make it free for VIP and make F2P buy it. Heck, at this point I wouldn't be surprised if EVERYONE has to buy it, but I don't think they'll do that.

[Warriorpoetex75]

Soldier on landscape is a total fail imo, because :

1) This is supposed to help ppl questing when leveling a new pg from 1 to 85... but... who have the marks to train a soldier before reaching the cap with a new pg?

2) Player that was at cap for 2-3 month or more have powerfull gear and skilled soldier... and simply don't need any help questing from 75 to 85.

This would end in a more difficult questing for new players (that already have hard time with their bad equip) and in a more easy questin for veterans player (more boring than usual...)

Soldier in plainscape is a failure imo... (they're a failure also in raid skirmish imo...)

You don't even get skirmishes till 20 in the first place. And ALL the content is super easy solo.

I'm guessing this is being done because they plan to make higher level content more difficult and the use of a soldier would be extremely helpful. If so, I can say right now that I'll be trying it without a soldier... I miss challenges. If not, then having a soldier would be pointless anyway. Either way, I think it's silly.

[Esselnor]

You don't even get skirmishes till 20 in the first place. And ALL the content is super easy solo.

I'm guessing this is being done because they plan to make higher level content more difficult and the use of a soldier would be extremely helpful. If so, I can say right now that I'll be trying it without a soldier... I miss challenges. If not, then having a soldier would be pointless anyway. Either way, I think it's silly.

Or you know to help with those fellowship quests that no one seems to want to do. I'm looking at you Angmar.

[Warriorpoetex75]

Or you know to help with those fellowship quests that no one seems to want to do. I'm looking at you Angmar.

OK... yes... Angmar.. *scowls*. I like Angmar... but I admit a soldier would be welcome there at times.

So let me rephrase. MOST content is easy solo.

[Eric7339]

1) This is supposed to help ppl questing when leveling a new pg from 1 to 85... but... who have the marks to train a soldier before reaching the cap with a new pg?

I disagree. I only had one alt who had not reached lvl 20 before the currency changes, a lvl 18 burg. I leveled him to 20 just to do a test. Just doing the training skimish will get the soldier one wants to rank 2 (lvl 24). After just one tuckbough skirmish I had a rank 3 (lvl29) archer, attribute and skill. After doing 2 more, I have a rank 5 (lvl37) one for my lvl 21 burg.

If anything it is too easy to overlevel a soldier at low levels. Even if the Lt kill deeds are nerfed it would still not be hard to keep an on level soldier. I am going to wait till the next update to test this, but my guess is I can just order my archer to attack a camp of 4 orcs my level and eat popcorn while he kills them.

My 2 coppers

[Jeffor]

If you’re correct, and if the folks in this thread who think that there will be a TP charge for summoning a landscape soldier are also correct, then this will be the official demarcation of where a store purchase became necessary to simply play the game with a reasonable modicum of success.

There are a lot of casual players in this game. I’m one of them. I don’t know if store purchases are “necessary” to either raid or PvP because I don’t do either, so I’ll let that issue be addressed by players who participate in those events.

For me, as of now it’s not necessary to buy anything from the Store to effectively play the game. I’ve leveled three toons to 75 without buying a thing from the Store. It’s not like I had a difficult time of it, either. My champ and LM didn’t get killed at all while leveling from 65 to 75, and I don’t consider myself to be a particularly good player.

What is being suggested in this thread would be a game changer, and in an ugly way. If quests will be designed to be significantly more difficult because of the assumption that everyone will be using a landscape soldier, and the use of that soldier will require a Store purchase, this to me would be a deal breaker.

Talented players might enjoy the challenge and be able to survive without a soldier, but the more casual players of lesser skill (such as yours truly) would be herded to the Store in what would be, IMHO, a most decidedly unacceptable manner. It would cause me to stop paying the monthly subscription fee that I have paid for the past 50 consecutive months.

Will Turbine be this foolish? I prefer to think they won’t be, but I’ve always been an optimist. Stay tuned. We should find out soon.

If there is a TP charge to summon a skirmish soldier then I will never once use them on the landscape; simple as that. Furthermore it would be incredibly icky to balance content based on a pet we would have to pay to use. I hope they don't make us pay RL money for this feature.

Also, TOR pets are nice but they do, in fact, go off on their own frequently and attack what they want. Their pathing problems are nil because if the pet gets out of range they just appear beside you. They don't path, they just port if you get out of range. Perhaps they could do that with skirm soldiers.

Again, though, if they make us pay TP to do this I will never use the feature out of principle and if they balance content off of skirm soldiers then I will avoid said content like the plague.

[Warriorpoetex75]

Again, though, if they make us pay TP to do this I will never use the feature out of principle and if they balance content off of skirm soldiers then I will avoid said content like the plague.

I think if they made content a bit tougher but not too tough to do without a soldier I'd be happy. Even if they don't make anyone pay for it, I think it would be silly to balance content off of skirm soldiers since skirmishes are supposed to be optional.