Soldiers on the landscape

[Armaius]

I'd like to know more about this (haven't read the whole thread so please let me know if this has already been addressed);



Tokens? How does one obtain the tokens it is going to take for a one hour landscape skirmish soldier session?

You buy them from either the Skirmish Camp or the store.

[PANZERBUNNY]

If landscape soldier isn't needed for any REAL reason why is it being included? We already have pet classes and the game is easy as pie.

Unless they plan on increasing game world difficulty by 50% this addition is a non issue and the time put into making this work could have been put to use on something else.

Has the community really been crying for us to use our skirm soldiers in real world? I never see this brought up.

Quite frankly I would rather have the ability to SPAWN soldiers that will follow you to attack warbands and when they are killed they are gone until you go back and spend whatever currency you need to place them under your command.

I'm interested to see how much lag these warbands of 40-50 mobs plus every player in my party with an extra pet and any pets they already have out for their pet class. Skirms can get pretty hairy as it is.

[hitomo_x3]

in english: 1 hour=100 TP

so who will be the first trying to express how awesome and foresighting
this move of turbine is ones again ...

'not even I was cynical enough to imagine that'

I mean ... hm? where and when did they say you need to rent them?

hey, do you want to schow off to your friends how Lotro is just exactly
like swtor? ... dont hesitate and summon your skirmish buddy as a
companion where ever you want, for only 100TP per hour

solo your ways even through the most grouply oriented content,
only 100TP per hour

just saying ...

[Hecki]

so who will be the first trying to express how awesome and foresighting
this move of turbine is ones again ...

'not even I was cynical enough to imagine that'

I mean ... hm? where and when did they say you need to rent them?

hey, do you want to schow off to your friends how Lotro is just exactly
like swtor? ... dont hesitate and summon your skirmish buddy as a
companion where ever you want, for only 100TP per hour

solo your ways even through the most grouply oriented content,
only 100TP per hour

just saying ...

You can get the soldier in landscape for 1500 marks and 75 medallions, too.

[hitomo_x3]

You can get the soldier in landscape for 1500 marks and 75 medallions, too.

I dont see this as a real option Hecki

[Hecki]

I dont see this as a real option Hecki

And what is a real option in your opinion?

[Wanderv]

I dont see this as a real option Hecki

This IS real option. 100 tp is not. It's obviously.

[telbric]

This is very similar to how DDO handles hirelings. Except they are way more useful there than skirmish soldiers will ever be here.

All in all, it's not really a feature, it's just an additional way to generate some revenue, which is par the course for the F2P model. SWTOR comparisons are completely silly, since this game has never been about companions and isn't about to start.

[Gylve]

While mildly disappointed that I won't be able to have my pocket healer let me keep up the pace of combat, and very annoyed that I blew so many marks and medallions on my soldier in anticipation of this update, I've gotta say I'm pretty happy that soldier use seems limited to TP farmers, people who spend way too much money buying TP and people who don't realize what they could be spending their currency on other than a ludicrously overpriced rented hireling.

So yeah, I'll probably bank the token we'll inevitably get from some epic quest, never use it, and never once have my soldier out on the landscape. /shrug

[Serin36]

This is very similar to how DDO handles hirelings. Except they are way more useful there than skirmish soldiers will ever be here.

All in all, it's not really a feature, it's just an additional way to generate some revenue, which is par the course for the F2P model. SWTOR comparisons are completely silly, since this game has never been about companions and isn't about to start.

IMO, until they have comparable AI to SWTOR, soldiers will be a liability. I can't tell you how many times my herbalist has just stopped healing, and sat there with full power. Or decided she needed to stand right next to me for all of the AOEs...

[Kantaryo]

My warrior sometimes sits there watching the ghost mob killing me and does nothing unless I blow his horn.

[Elenluin-Menelloth]

My warrior sometimes sits there watching the ghost mob killing me and does nothing unless I blow his horn.

Soldiers don't attack Echo of Death unless told to, because of the +100% incoming damage debuff.
http://lorebook.lotro.com/wiki/Skirm...#Echo_of_Death
http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Death%27s_Echo

[Fudoshin]

Soldiers don't attack Echo of Death unless told to, because of the +100% incoming damage debuff.

That makes sense, although I think it's 25% chance to reflect 100% damage, but whatever it is I can see the point. What I can't see is why Herbalists just stop healing too, it's not just echo either but other mobs probably for a similar reason. I've never bugged it I assume plenty of people have as you can work around it fairly easily...but as someone said, it is frustrating when you are dying and our Herbalist is standing there doing squat with full power.

[GalateaOrea]

While mildly disappointed that I won't be able to have my pocket healer let me keep up the pace of combat, and very annoyed that I blew so many marks and medallions on my soldier in anticipation of this update, I've gotta say I'm pretty happy that soldier use seems limited to TP farmers, people who spend way too much money buying TP and people who don't realize what they could be spending their currency on other than a ludicrously overpriced rented hireling.

So yeah, I'll probably bank the token we'll inevitably get from some epic quest, never use it, and never once have my soldier out on the landscape. /shrug

I wasn't sure how useful soldiers would be on the landscape and I'm glad I spent little time or marks on my soldiers since the announcement. At 100 TP an hour, this will indeed be limited to those who have more money than sense. And it is a good reminder that from now on one must evaluate announcements from Turbine with an eye to what they are going to charge for features. When I read the news, it never occurred to me that we would be charged for this new feature. To me, that doesn't make it a new feature, rather it makes it another Store item. Hopefully in the future, Turbine will be clear about which things being added to the game are actually new features and which are Store items.

[Counsel]

looking forward to seeing how this works out. one obvious thing it's going to do is make the game much easier and less challenging, unless they are going to increase mob stats. I hope they don't make the game easier because I like the challenge for building up my alts

I used to play GuildWars... You know that 'guy' who ran missions, knew the game, had the titles, ... Heroes were loved by those that played ... occasionally. Heroes were loved by those who ran missions because it let them earn gold. Yet, it has downsides...

Background...

I started with a Captain on El. I was ? 50 when skirmishes were released, and I remember saying, "Oh, great... Everyone can now summon a herald." Everyone laughed.. "No," they said, "this is only in skirmishes..." Oh, so every other class gets a specific Captain skill, but ONLY in skirmishes... Class-slip, is what I call this--wardens that want heavy armor, Hunters that want to heal, ...

1. This game, and many others, are MMORPGs... Think about that. Multi-player. Less grouping will occur with all the 'extra help.' See GuildWars...

2. Sure, detract from the Captain class yet again. I complained about skirmish summoning, in general. I said it would, one day, lead to in-game summoning--everyone laughed. Now, everyone says "only in low-populated areas..." or "only in certain areas..." Now, I laugh... Just wait...

3. I've made it to 75 ONLY doing the 'required' skirmishes -- those required by epics or to do elite instances. I had NO trouble making it by myself or in a group. So I don't understand the "make it easier to solo" explanation when it isn't hard now (and wasn't hard before areas were nerfed (like Annuminas--from lvl 50 to lvl 35). The game isn't hard, but it should require some effort...

4. The fellowship should be promoted, not ousted for a hero group. "Fellowship of the Ring" should mean something in this game, and I wish (although it won't happen) everyone would learn to educate other players about playing (how to tank, how to LM, etc.) if they aren't doing well in the fellowship instead of simply criticizing ... We can be better than other MMORPGs... Again, fellowships with other live individuals should be promoted. If LOTRO becomes a 'buy your heroes in the store' so that you can do Draigoch, ... Really? Don't let it go the way of GuildWars where 1/2 of the players never did 1/2 of the 'epic' quests to get anywhere (they just let someone else run it...). Encourage people to play in groups--this will lead to more buying--not less.

5. Now that everyone can summon a hero in landscape, can the captain summon 2? Talk about mixing playstyles. Minis that want to tank, wardens that want to guard, ... We don't need to make each class a solo-monster. Again, team-work is needed in life and should be needed in the game. Give my poor captain a bone! ;p

6. Now I really won't know whether to invite that mini/tank/etc to an instance since they have never done it and have no experience in a group... Nobody has taught them how to fellow correctly. While many/most may have kinships, the need for the learning how to group is essential for end-game or other instances. Soloing the game and 'making it easy' degrades the end-game experience for everyone. Yes, just my opinion.

Look, I know LOTRO and WB want to make money. I know it benefits the players if LOTRO and WB make money. Yet, it does nobody any good to melt down the lore or game 'to make it easy' or making the fellowship education more difficult (or occurring later in the game). I'm afraid that the rewards for hard work will disappear. Want the Cloak that players could only get after finishing Volume I? Just go to the store... :P Don't 'give' stuff away, or you may lose those that really keep this game alive--those that work at it.

In summary... Keep classes and their duties separate and distinct. Update classes to focus on their core duties, and don't, please, dumb down the game or make it so easy 'at early levels for solo players' so that they lack the knowledge once they hit 50... I'd actually recommend making more, not less, in-game instances at lower levels that required fellowships so that we wouldn't complain in GS, DG, ... when 'that person' doesn't know how to play their class in a fellowship. So, fellow more, hero less...

[guguzza71]

Using tp to play with soldiers which is essesntially a get through a quest easier button bothers me. Even worse I would not want to waste valuable medallions on them when I have multiple alts that need those medallions for gear.

[uw1975]

And it is a good reminder that from now on one must evaluate announcements from Turbine with an eye to what they are going to charge for features. When I read the news, it never occurred to me that we would be charged for this new feature. To me, that doesn't make it a new feature, rather it makes it another Store item. Hopefully in the future, Turbine will be clear about which things being added to the game are actually new features and which are Store items.

QTF.

I think we were all surprised as we thought everyone could have benefited from this feature. (technically we could all benefit, but I'm sure you get my point).
This is NOT a feature, but mainly a Store item (do not start with the 75 Medallions and 1500 Marks, as this is an outrageous price only a few if ever will pay).

For one, I do not think I would use it, if nothing else because Skirm soldiers, especially my dumb Bannerguard, are already worthless in skirmishes, I can't believe what will be their usefulness outside skirmishes (except random aggroing). Let's hope at least this feature will encourage the devs to fix soldiers' pathing.

[Ellyllon]

Well, I *was* excited about my skirmish soldier. Now, I'm back to, "I really have come to hate the LOTRO store, & myself for using it so much." I'm sure there's fine print somewhere that says they never, ever, once, truly, ever said it would be free, but come on. This is just like the never ending season of political talking points, & I, for one, am deeply, truly, wildly sick of it.

I didn't think anything could break my affection for this game & this world, but it's fading fast.

[Khafar]

At 100 TP an hour, this will indeed be limited to those who have more money than sense.

I disagree. People will use them when they need a boost for some reason... not as part of their normal gameplay. They're essentially a 1-hour "buff" that can be summoned and dismissed as you need it. Used judiciously, you might be able to use your soldier for 20 battles, spread out over weeks.

When I read the news, it never occurred to me that we would be charged for this new feature.

Me neither, but having it be ubiquitous (free) concerned me because it would change the balance of the game everywhere, and could easily lead to content inflation that would eventually require every player to be using a soldier -- with all the attendant server lag and general annoyance at the stupid pathing/behavioral AI. Because they're not free, Turbine cannot really change game balance based on them. That's actually a good thing, IMO.

I agree I'd like to hear which items are free for VIPs and which will cost, but I disagree that "new features" and "store items" are (or should be) a disjoint set. The multiple bind milestones are sold in the Store, but they were a new and useful feature I was quite happy to pay for. The error Turbine makes is in terms of improperly setting expectations. If they'd said that skirmish soldiers on the landscape were going to be like DDO's hirelings, we'd have known what to expect: limited use, paid via gameplay time (gold, skirmish marks, whatever) or "points". By not saying that up front, they've disappointed people who built up their expectations based on incomplete information.

In hindsight, it seems pretty obvious they'd go this way, given that this game's F2P was modeled after DDO. Live and learn.

Khafar

[Aztec_Soul]

Well, I am quite disappointed. I had envisioned myself equipping my banner while having my reliable archer soldier with me, just as I do in skirmishes. However, I do understand how much of a change permanent landscape soldiers would be to one's playstyle during questing. Not everyone wants it, so having it as an option with a price is something to be expected, I suppose.

Personally, I won't be spending any TPs on the temporary skirmish soldier 'buff'. I will simply continue to lead my fellow archer pet through the new regions. Now, if I had my way, I would rather have prefered the soldier be implemented as a 'hired' hand. For example, we pay weekly in-game currency for upkeep on our house. Having a similar upkeep panel for our soldier of choice to ensure his/her availablity at optional calls would have been something I'd have liked.

Skirmishes will at least be a place for me to continue soloing T2 battles with a banner and solider together. Perhaps that will remain my only bit of flexibility with that setup.

[Brethwyn_EU]

Now, if I had my way, I would rather have prefered the soldier be implemented as a 'hired' hand. For example, we pay weekly in-game currency for upkeep on our house. Having a similar upkeep panel for our soldier of choice to ensure his/her availablity at optional calls would have been something I'd have liked.

Ah, a sellsword! A mercenary! Now that is a great idea. Except... Turbine won't get any money from it. Silly Turbine.

[Aztec_Soul]

Ah, a sellsword! A mercenary! Now that is a great idea. Except... Turbine won't get any money from it. Silly Turbine.

Such a feature is already free in skirmishes, and Turbine makes money from other sources through its store. Yet, given the amount of people actually buying lootbox keys there, one would think that such a trend is actually acceptable by the consumers. Silly me...

[Ellyllon]

.... By not saying that up front, they've disappointed people who built up their expectations based on incomplete information.


Khafar

The lovely load screen that shows your soldier beside you, along with the original announcement, is also rather misleading. I'm not sure I *need* a soldier, and I would probably have paid to unlock the feature, but they'll get my TPs when they pry them from my icy cold fingers before I'll pay to get my Zap for an hour. That's just soooo, sooooo wrong.

[Killien]

In hindsight, it seems pretty obvious they'd go this way, given that this game's F2P was modeled after DDO. Live and learn.

Khafar

For those of us who know nothing about DDO it's not that obvious at all. This would be the first time I feel well and truly duped.

I'd like some clarification on this point too; The advert re: Soldier on Landscape says - "This new feature allows you to summon your faithful skirmish companion in the field." I bought and used two refund scrolls to rebuild my Skirmish Soldiers on two toons with this exact sentence and feature in mind. From what I'm reading in the Bullroarer forums now, the soldiers we'll be summoning are not our faithful skirmish companions at all, but new soldiers we have to level up all over again. Can someone confirm or deny?

This was a feature I'd been really looking forward to, but the implementation of timed useage sucks the life out of it for me. It was always going to be an option for players to summon or not. Those people who didn't want soldiers didn't have to summon them. Period.

I also don't buy the argument that permanent companions would see Turbine scaling content to suit a 1+1 team rather than solo. There is nothing stopping Turbine from doing that anyway, with or without the soldier on landscape feature, but how many times have we seen players post they have a hard enough time with on level content as it is? Making the landscape content more difficult is purely counterproductive, and I can't see them upping it.

[Ellyllon]

I'm not able to access the store in beta or get my soldier to check. It helpfully lingers on the page, suggesting I buy more time, however. If it's not my own soldier, I'm going to be beyond peevish. I'm going to start throwing plastic furniture around a la The Room.