Forced emotes - worse than ever

[Dworin]

I used to never do festival emotes, especially on rpers, people playing music, walking, etc. Then people complained, and the timer got changed to 5 minutes - I used to learn them on a friend's account, inside our houses, quickly. Now I have probably 1200 festival items still left - after years of getting them. Everyone and anyone is a target now, when my timer is off and you're near me. I won't pick you out of a crowd (unless you're a friend), or disrupt a group of people, but the timer for learning them is so annoying that I just don't care about your hurt RP feelings anymore. Blame Turbine? Sure - it was a poor fix (why not have an insta-learn a stack of items if you have them on hand?). Blame the rp community? Yes, I do too. I have no sympathy for most complaints about festival items.

And yes, I have removed alts from RP kins on my server because the bickering over things like this (and obviously other drama too) got unpleasant. (In fact the scroll above shows exactly what kind of drama gets started on a regular basis, over minor things, like one word.)

And this is why Turbine needs to act.

[Luinomiel]

I used to never do festival emotes, especially on rpers, people playing music, walking, etc. Then people complained, and the timer got changed to 5 minutes - I used to learn them on a friend's account, inside our houses, quickly. Now I have probably 1200 festival items still left - after years of getting them. Everyone and anyone is a target now, when my timer is off and you're near me. I won't pick you out of a crowd (unless you're a friend), or disrupt a group of people, but the timer for learning them is so annoying that I just don't care about your hurt RP feelings anymore. Blame Turbine? Sure - it was a poor fix (why not have an insta-learn a stack of items if you have them on hand?). Blame the rp community? Yes, I do too. I have no sympathy for most complaints about festival items.

And yes, I have removed alts from RP kins on my server because the bickering over things like this (and obviously other drama too) got unpleasant. (In fact the scroll above shows exactly what kind of drama gets started on a regular basis, over minor things, like one word.)

Wow..

[Anwiga]

Thing is that is the issue, or part of it. It's cosmetic more or less anyway, but it is an attack, a violent act committed on your character. You may find it amusing, I don't. When people go out of their way to attack you, it stops being a prank. When you get hit by a dozen in just a few minutes it is not funny, it amounts to a gang beat down of your character.

The real clincher is there is nothing you can do but tolerate it.

The thing is, no one is going out of their way to hit you with an emote.
They hit you with an emote because it is convenient (since the cool downs are so long). Had you been out of range and someone else in range, the other person would have gotten hit.
It isn't like someone had you on their friends list, saw you in Galtrev, took a stable horse to Galtrev and then ran around Galtrev looking to hit you with an emote. THAT is going out of the way to use an emote.

People tend to forget that emotes are consumables. A person can only have so many consumables on them at once. Most people who do tend to collect 300 for the skill are actually very responsible in using them on people they either know or know won't get their panties in a bunch about forced emotes. Though people who go AFK get hit the most even without known "consent" because the person AFK won't even notice the emote.

I actually haven't synced any music since the release of RoR but me and a few friends would spend a lot of time playing randomly in Bree or Galtrev. Prior to RoR nothing could knock a player out of music mode (not even combat mode). If this is no longer the case, I too hope that music mode return to the state where nothing could knock a player out of music mode.

[Whart]

I used to never do festival emotes, especially on rpers, people playing music, walking, etc. Then people complained, and the timer got changed to 5 minutes - I used to learn them on a friend's account, inside our houses, quickly. Now I have probably 1200 festival items still left - after years of getting them. Everyone and anyone is a target now, when my timer is off and you're near me. I won't pick you out of a crowd (unless you're a friend), or disrupt a group of people, but the timer for learning them is so annoying that I just don't care about your hurt RP feelings anymore. Blame Turbine? Sure - it was a poor fix (why not have an insta-learn a stack of items if you have them on hand?). Blame the rp community? Yes, I do too. I have no sympathy for most complaints about festival items.

And yes, I have removed alts from RP kins on my server because the bickering over things like this (and obviously other drama too) got unpleasant. (In fact the scroll above shows exactly what kind of drama gets started on a regular basis, over minor things, like one word.)

One more for the ignore list I guess.

[Dworin]

The thing is, no one is going out of their way to hit you with an emote.
They hit you with an emote because it is convenient (since the cool downs are so long). Had you been out of range and someone else in range, the other person would have gotten hit.
It isn't like someone had you on their friends list, saw you in Galtrev, took a stable horse to Galtrev and then ran around Galtrev looking to hit you with an emote. THAT is going out of the way to use an emote.

People tend to forget that emotes are consumables. A person can only have so many consumables on them at once. Most people who do tend to collect 300 for the skill are actually very responsible in using them on people they either know or know won't get their panties in a bunch about forced emotes. Though people who go AFK get hit the most even without known "consent" because the person AFK won't even notice the emote.

I actually haven't synced any music since the release of RoR but me and a few friends would spend a lot of time playing randomly in Bree or Galtrev. Prior to RoR nothing could knock a player out of music mode (not even combat mode). If this is no longer the case, I too hope that music mode return to the state where nothing could knock a player out of music mode.

Yes. Consumables that you do not have to use.

Rye is 85, and I have a lot of fun playing him. He's got nice weapons and I'm working hard on his armor and jewelry. He's grand master with the woodworkers guild. And he did it all without using forced emotes. On anyone.

Rye goes to concerts, dances with the ladies, makes jokes and generally helps others around him to have fun. But then here comes player "A" with his bag of consumables he doesn't have to use. Is he interested in helping others in the game have fun? Nope. Selfish, self-centered player whose only interest is in his own fun, and if he has to make other folks have less fun, well, that's too bad. He doesn't care.

Turbine needs to act. They've created a divided community, and only they can fix it. And it's costing them money and customers.

[Methoriel]

Yes. Consumables that you do not have to use.

Rye is 85, and I have a lot of fun playing him. He's got nice weapons and I'm working hard on his armor and jewelry. He's grand master with the woodworkers guild. And he did it all without using forced emotes. On anyone.

Rye goes to concerts, dances with the ladies, makes jokes and generally helps others around him to have fun. But then here comes player "A" with his bag of consumables he doesn't have to use. Is he interested in helping others in the game have fun? Nope. Selfish, self-centered player whose only interest is in his own fun, and if he has to make other folks have less fun, well, that's too bad. He doesn't care.

Turbine needs to act. They've created a divided community, and only they can fix it. And it's costing them money and customers.

*Standing Ovation*

[BowOfFSAndDecay]

Delete all emotes that can be forced on other people, I am tired of kids doing this @#$%. It did not bugg me at first but the other day when I was sitting with a friend minding my own business here comes a little _-_-_- with a emote.

Ban them all. I do not care if people bought them or whatever they did to get them if they are going to use them to harass other players they deserve to lose them.

[maxjenius]

I used to never do festival emotes, especially on rpers, people playing music, walking, etc. Then people complained, and the timer got changed to 5 minutes - I used to learn them on a friend's account, inside our houses, quickly. Now I have probably 1200 festival items still left - after years of getting them. Everyone and anyone is a target now, when my timer is off and you're near me. I won't pick you out of a crowd (unless you're a friend), or disrupt a group of people, but the timer for learning them is so annoying that I just don't care about your hurt RP feelings anymore. Blame Turbine? Sure - it was a poor fix (why not have an insta-learn a stack of items if you have them on hand?). Blame the rp community? Yes, I do too. I have no sympathy for most complaints about festival items.

The pro-opt out side has its share of bad attitudes. I see you're simply trying to balance the scales.

[SalionOfBrothers]

I used to never do festival emotes, especially on rpers, people playing music, walking, etc. Then people complained, and the timer got changed to 5 minutes - I used to learn them on a friend's account, inside our houses, quickly. Now I have probably 1200 festival items still left - after years of getting them. Everyone and anyone is a target now, when my timer is off and you're near me. I won't pick you out of a crowd (unless you're a friend), or disrupt a group of people, but the timer for learning them is so annoying that I just don't care about your hurt RP feelings anymore. Blame Turbine? Sure - it was a poor fix (why not have an insta-learn a stack of items if you have them on hand?). Blame the rp community? Yes, I do too. I have no sympathy for most complaints about festival items.

And yes, I have removed alts from RP kins on my server because the bickering over things like this (and obviously other drama too) got unpleasant. (In fact the scroll above shows exactly what kind of drama gets started on a regular basis, over minor things, like one word.)

Like the other person said, wow. Well just FYI, I do not RP. Are you the person that hit me in the Wold yesterday while I was turning in a quest? Could you post the names of you charcaters so I can add them to my ignore list, please.

Only you can stop the drama, Only use them on people that say it is ok . I am not your emote dummy.

You can only use on every 5 minutes, I can be hit over and over again non-stopped.

[dwarf88]

Let me first preface this with my stance on the matter, I have absolutely no problem with forced emotes whatsoever. But as a solutions oriented man, I have racked my brain for an answer to end this great travesty of our time.

Simply put, there is only one.

The Turbine store.

This is the only solution to the problem because Turbine will not act unless they make a profit. So why not embrace this and make it a call to action. They either could sell a permanent forced emote opt out or more realistically what they will do, looking at their recent trends, is sell a forced emote opt out buff per hour. While the per hour buff is not the greatest option, it would at least help protect organized events such as these.

And judging by the amount of threads and anger over forced emotes, I do not understand why Turbine has not already cashed in on this goldmine. Call me crazy, but I predict many more people buying forced emote opt out than some tomes for their warsteeds.

Maybe this was Turbine's plan all along.

Na, they are not that smart!

[manstan]

The thing is, no one is going out of their way to hit you with an emote.

Yes actually they are. I've had people come off the road and in to the woods for no other reason then to hit me with an emote.

They hit you with an emote because it is convenient (since the cool downs are so long). Had you been out of range and someone else in range, the other person would have gotten hit.

An how is that any better.

It isn't like someone had you on their friends list, saw you in Galtrev, took a stable horse to Galtrev and then ran around Galtrev looking to hit you with an emote. THAT is going out of the way to use an emote.

See Reductio ad absurdum

People tend to forget that emotes are consumables. A person can only have so many consumables on them at once. Most people who do tend to collect 300 for the skill are actually very responsible in using them on people they either know or know won't get their panties in a bunch about forced emotes. Though people who go AFK get hit the most even without known "consent" because the person AFK won't even notice the emote.

And what makes you think that? Just because it says my character is AFK is no reason to believe I am not setting right there. More over the worst possable use of the emotes happens while characters are AFK.

I actually haven't synced any music since the release of RoR but me and a few friends would spend a lot of time playing randomly in Bree or Galtrev. Prior to RoR nothing could knock a player out of music mode (not even combat mode). If this is no longer the case, I too hope that music mode return to the state where nothing could knock a player out of music mode.

No it is nolonger the case.

What I find interesting is even after Turbine tried to get people to quite with the forced emotes all the time, that just makes people try all the harder. Turbine screwed up putting them in the game, turbine screwed up making them a deed, turbine screwed up putting the cool down on them in attempt to stop the greifing; if anything it made it worse and I'll point to rhegan post as proof. Turbine needs to "man up", take responsibility for their screw up and fix it.

[Anwiga]

Yes. Consumables that you do not have to use.

Rye is 85, and I have a lot of fun playing him. He's got nice weapons and I'm working hard on his armor and jewelry. He's grand master with the woodworkers guild. And he did it all without using forced emotes. On anyone.

Rye goes to concerts, dances with the ladies, makes jokes and generally helps others around him to have fun. But then here comes player "A" with his bag of consumables he doesn't have to use. Is he interested in helping others in the game have fun? Nope. Selfish, self-centered player whose only interest is in his own fun, and if he has to make other folks have less fun, well, that's too bad. He doesn't care.

Turbine needs to act. They've created a divided community, and only they can fix it. And it's costing them money and customers.

That's just the way you play, as an RPer. Some people are completionist. These consumables are a part of the game that have an "end goal" and therefore can be completed. Some people are just silly by nature and in game think nothing of this silly aspect.

Anwiga is a level 84. She is a guilded, master eastement scholar. Had an FA weapon and shimmering cloak in the days of RoI (not so long ago). She likes to sync music with her friends when she isn't raiding. She likes to have fun at festivals (even when her raiding party is raiding!). She likes to use emotes because she thinks they are funny. But here comes Rye's clone, he doesn't like people using emotes on him and yells and cries and throws a tantrum. So Anwiga sighs and only uses emotes on people she knows don't mind.

Do you know what Rye's clone just did there? He forced his gameplay style on Anwiga just as he doesn't like Anwiga forcing her's on him. How hypocritical of him. And because of him, and others like him, Anwiga has two bags full of consumables that she rarely gets to use just in case Rye's clone pops a blood vessel in anger. Here's hoping that Anwiga runs into the people she met at the festivals sometime soon! New content sure does fill up inventory bags quickly.

[Iorothiel]

So many ways to beat a dead horse. I like how we're back to the mindset of "everyone is a violent raging hooligan who should die."

What, I'm exaggerating? Well, so are you. Opt-out is still the only reasonable solution and we've devolved back to crying for blood.

Granted, as a completionist, can't just stop doing a deed. But yknow, if you can deny my existance, I can deny yours, too.

I should stop posting in these threads, but god forbid turbine think we don't have a side, too. I know my posts are becoming bitter and increasingly angry on the subject, but for the love of god...turbine, when will you give these guys their opt out? Who is griefing who anymore? ><

[Zerfinite]

That's just the way you play, as an RPer. Some people are completionist. These consumables are a part of the game that have an "end goal" and therefore can be completed. Some people are just silly by nature and in game think nothing of this silly aspect.

Anwiga is a level 84. She is a guilded, master eastement scholar. Had an FA weapon and shimmering cloak in the days of RoI (not so long ago). She likes to sync music with her friends when she isn't raiding. She likes to have fun at festivals (even when her raiding party is raiding!). She likes to use emotes because she thinks they are funny. But here comes Rye's clone, he doesn't like people using emotes on him and yells and cries and throws a tantrum. So Anwiga sighs and only uses emotes on people she knows don't mind.

Do you know what Rye's clone just did there? He forced his gameplay style on Anwiga just as he doesn't like Anwiga forcing her's on him. How hypocritical of him. And because of him, and others like him, Anwiga has two bags full of consumables that she rarely gets to use just in case Rye's clone pops a blood vessel in anger. Here's hoping that Anwiga runs into the people she met at the festivals sometime soon! New content sure does fill up inventory bags quickly.

It is the instigator who has to think whether what (s)he wants to do is acceptable or not, not the victim. Forced emoting is not acceptable to many, so you as the forced emoter should do the wise thing and either ask or don't do anything. One's playstyle should not affect the other indeed, but you as the instigator are the one who makes the first decision. If you say "screw your playstyle, I'm going to force an emote on you!", of course the player you're forced emoting says "if you don't care about my playstyle, then screw your playstyle as well!".

[manstan]

Nice fairy tail Anwiga, now back to reality. Or virtuosity if you will.

I think some people are way over estimating how people react to these, I find them annoying, and aggravating, nothing more. Certainly nothing like you describe in that fairy tail. If it angered me to that point I'd quit playing. Not liking something is not the same as going ballistic because of it.

So it's ok for you to force my character to do an emote, but it is not ok to try to stop you?
How about this, lets make it fair, when you hit me with an FE your character is now target-able, I can attack it, but all you can do is run, die, or log off. Does that sound fare? It's not infringing on your ability to hit me with an FE and I can respond in a fashion that suits my game play style. Sound fare to you? Sounds great to me.

What this boils down to is you saying your game play style is panking people.

"Anwiga has two bags full of consumables that she rarely gets to use"

You're the one that bought them, no one forced them on you like you want to force them on others.


I'm still wondering when having consideration for your fellow players went out of style.

[Anwiga]

Nice fairy tail Anwiga, now back to reality. Or virtuosity if you will.

I think some people are way over estimating how people react to these, I find them annoying, and aggravating, nothing more. Certainly nothing like you describe in that fairy tail. If it angered me to that point I'd quit playing. Not liking something is not the same as going ballistic because of it.

So it's ok for you to force my character to do an emote, but it is not ok to try to stop you?
How about this, lets make it fair, when you hit me with an FE your character is now target-able, I can attack it, but all you can do is run, die, or log off. Does that sound fare? It's not infringing on your ability to hit me with an FE and I can respond in a fashion that suits my game play style. Sound fare to you? Sounds great to me.

What this boils down to is you saying your game play style is panking people.

"Anwiga has two bags full of consumables that she rarely gets to use"

You're the one that bought them, no one forced them on you like you want to force them on others.


I'm still wondering when having consideration for your fellow players went out of style.

You want FEs to start spars?
That would be AMAZING!!!! (for real, that would be awesome! "I challenge you to a duel! *black silk glove*).

Try to stop me all you want. I don't mind a toggle at all, actually. I'm just saying consumables aren't bad at all. It's what people make of them. In one of the other threads there were people saying that emotes physically hurt them (causes headaches), so yes I do think that emotes bother people so much that they'd pop a blood vessel and yet still play, that isn't an exaggeration.

And further, I do have consideration for other players. That is the reason I have two inventory bags of consumables (as a complentionist on that one toon, I need to hit that 300!). If I didn't have consideration for other players then I wouldn't wait until I see a person who I know doesn't mind consumables, I would just run around emoting people until I ran out and I would have gotten the deed ages ago.

[Laerien]

Who is griefing who anymore? ><

A very "kind" community isn't it? Actually this thread concentrate a lot of hate from those who are supposed to be the "good" guys.

Btw, one of the consumables, the jar of bugs, seems to be broken. It cant be used, it says "your action was interrupted". Maybe Turbine was testing something that wasnt finished when RoR launched.

[Iorothiel]

I'm still wondering when having consideration for your fellow players went out of style.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but didn't she mention that the reason she still has them is because she's tiptoeing around the people who explode into a violent rage whenever they so much as see one in the vicinity?

[manstan]

If I didn't have consideration for other players then I wouldn't wait until I see a person who I know doesn't mind consumables, I would just run around emoting people until I ran out and I would have gotten the deed ages ago.

And that is whom that line refers to, players with no consideration. I thought the double spacing was an indicator it was a separate comment from the rest of the post. My bad if people didn't realize that.

Naa, the bugs are bugged lol Known issue.

"You want FEs to start spars?
That would be AMAZING!!!! (for real, that would be awesome! "I challenge you to a duel! *black silk glove*). " Anwiga

If this game gets any more PvP I'm out, I don't do PvP. It's supposed to be us against them, when we start fighting with each other they win. And as far as I'm concerned FEs are a PvP attack I can't retaliate to. But this would just make a bad situation worse, the FEers would just pick on way lower level characters.

In another post I mentioned about the game many people quit because it was PVP and you couldn't advance past the first gate with out getting ambushed. Similar thing is happening here, people are waiting at unavoidable ambush points to FE people. During festivals I wont use the stables in the shire at all. In fact it's gotten to where I want to avoid the shire completely during festivals.

That was also my RP point, someone hitting you with the black glove is a challenge to spar. If once some one used it and the game autoed to sparing, do you think that would change peoples minds about using it? As it stands they can pretty well treat your character like a sparing dummy and there is nothing you can do about it.

And I'm a bit of a completionist, but I know I can't do it all, not even going to try, especially if it is something I consider rude behavior, or putting upon my fellow players. I don't want to aggravate my fellow players any more then I want to be aggravated by them.

[Anwiga]

I thought the double spacing was an indicator it was a separate comment from the rest of the post.

Now you're just chopping up my posts to make me look like the bad guy (i can do that too!)
I see myself more in the light of an anti-hero. I'm not one of the "good guys" but I'm certainly no bad guy either!

[Elemiire]

First I would like to say, I love the emotes. I am a collector and really like them and enjoy them. I don't mind others using their emotes on me. With that being said, I do know there are times not to use them. I would never use them on anyone playing music, crafting, etc. There is a time and place to have fun with them in my opinion. I do hope lotro fixes them where they are off limits to some activities and I wish you and your band the best.

This. I bought all my 300 silk gloves for my minstrel when the festival was up and I still have something like 200.

I mostly use them on friends / kinnies and people that I know won't mind. I know that doesn't solve anything for the people annoyed by it, but at least I -and I'm sure others- try to be sensible.

However, you are right. Emotes should not work on people already performing an action such as dancing / playing music / any other emote.

Edit: I fully support the idea of an 'opt out' option to forced emotes. It wouldn't ruin my fun and I would respect people that don't want to be on the receiving end.

[Equendil]

Making the deeds much easier to complete, or removing them entirely and making the skills directly available for barter during the festivals would go a long way towards addressing the issue.

I mean, adding deeds (with a dangling carrot) for using 300 consumables and then a long cooldown between uses that makes it nearly impossible to advance the deeds significantly without using the consumables whenever possible ... Well, obviously enough, that's going to result in people using consumables whenever they're off cooldown on whoever happens to be around, 300 times.

Edit: also would probably be a good idea to make the champ/minstrel/cappy forced emotes group only.

[doctorwhofan]

Probably already know or it has been mentioned, but the forced emotes are on a deed. Which makes it worse. I wish we could turn them off ala options panel.

[manstan]

Now you're just chopping up my posts to make me look like the bad guy (i can do that too!)
I see myself more in the light of an anti-hero. I'm not one of the "good guys" but I'm certainly no bad guy either!

Does that edit work for you?

Thing is, you all may have this sort of consideration, but my experience tells me you are a small sub group of emoters. If everyone had that sort of consideration we wouldn't be here now and emotes wouldn't be an issue.


Just because I am snide, pessimistic, and argumentative, doesn't mean I'm not actually a nice guy; just real jaded by life in general. Truth be known I play LOTRO because it is what I want to do, not what some one else wants me to do. I do enough dancing to someone elses tune in real life, I certainly don't appreciate it in game.

"I am not amused"


Equendil, my question is why have them as a skill at all? Are they really good for anything aside from annoying your fellow players?

[Anwiga]

(keep in mind as you read this, that I am not against a toggle. though removing emotes entirely would make me very sad).

RPers should be in favor of FE. Hear me out.
Not because of what they do, but because of how it makes them feel.
They hate forced emotes, and forced emotes cause squabling and "PvP" situations. But LoTRO can't be a straight up us VS. them situation. Even the writers knew that. Look at the Duneldings. They fight among each other all the time (even kill each other!). People can't be split into two clean simple groups. Why would a world following the story of many different peoples have "protagonists" all bunched up in one group? (not like we're out right killing each other)

As for why have emotes at all if they annoy people?
You can say the same thing about every aspect in the game, that isn't a well thought out response.

Why have player music in the game at all? All it does is annoy people.
Why have crafting in game? All it does is annoy people with its time wasting farming.
Why have PvP (moors) at all? All it does is annoy people (and some other argument I can't think of)
Why have RP toggle at all? All it does is annoy people who don't RP (the majority of the player base doesn't)
Why have group quests? All it does is annoy people by making them work together.
Why have solo quests? All it does is annoy people by forcing them to do something without their friends.
Why have raid content? All it does is annoy people who can't raid (lack of friends/kin/a good computer, etc.)
Why have solo rewards equal to raid content? All it does is annoy people who do raid.
Why have different classes at all? All it does is annoy people who want to do everything.
Why have...

I think you get it by now.