Update 9 Loot

[RockX]

Oh, and I did see a teal earring linked in GLFF from a group that beat the LT T2C in BG. Level 85 teal earring for a Might class, yet worse than the two level 75 teal earrings I've been wearing for months now, and it wasn't even close.

What specific level 75 earrings are you referring to?

I'm aware the amounts of power may be considered high on much of the DG gear.

[Saelyth.]

What specific level 75 earrings are you referring to?

I'm aware the amounts of power may be considered high on much of the DG gear.

I wonder if at some point the Fornost loot table will be updated. Nobody ever does that instances in my server (riddermark). Seems like the revamp did nothing if the loot is not good enough.

[ChromiteSwiftpaw]

I ran Sammath Gul Tier 2 Challenge twice last night. First time I was tanking on my guardian. We got through everything and not one single armor/jewelery loot item for anyone. All we got were relics, runes and bounties. That was EXTREMELY disappointing because we could faceroll The Foundry at 75 and be guaranteed a Cyan piece of loot at the end.

Second run I was on my hunter and we didn't get past Gorothul for some reason. Anyhow, the first and second boss chests had no loot as well. Just bounties, runes and relics.

At least one person should be getting something EVERY time we loot a chest. I haven't seen that happen yet.

[RicardoFurriel]

What specific level 75 earrings are you referring to?

I'm aware the amounts of power may be considered high on much of the DG gear.

Trenaloch and the Limlight rep earring. (Thx my.lotro. )

PS: Thx for the replies btw RockX. For the first time in years I feel someone is genuinely interested in the players feedback. Cheers for that

[Lestache]

What specific level 75 earrings are you referring to?

I'm aware the amounts of power may be considered high on much of the DG gear.

One is the Empowered Anduin Victor's Earring (teal).

The other is apparently Trenalloch. (Thanks, Ric. :P )

Edit to add: Trenalloch isn't even a best-in-slot earring. Those who run skirmish raids will likely have a better item there (in fact, the level 75 version of the Might-focused skirmish raid earrings might be better).

[Laire]

I ran SG t2 challenge yesterday.

One person got a Riddermark crystal off the first boss. There was nothing else. I didn't even get a relic.

Relics, at the least, should come off every boss. After the awesome loot tables of the old SG, where people almost always rolled for one item off Gorothul or the last guy, this was really disappointing.

Good medallion haul, but everyone needs to win something more than simply bounties. I was under the impression that, when this system first came out, it would be a good thing because *Everyone* would win at least *something*, that something not simply being gold. At the moment, I am disappointed by its current implementation.

Thanks for reading.

[Bendin]

Amusing how people complain about rewards. Like its only thing why they play game. So what? &&&& rewards? At least enoy chalenge and play like it is. But no people never happy.

Do keep in mind we're talking about content we ran in 2009 till our eyes were bleeding(long dearth of content Mirk->Abscence). So yea if there's not a reason other than nostalgia to go back; many won't, thats just human nature however amusing you may find it.

[RockX]

Trenaloch and the Limlight rep earring. (Thx my.lotro. )

PS: Thx for the replies btw RockX. For the first time in years I feel someone is genuinely interested in the players feedback. Cheers for that

So, two things.

1) Indeed, yay MyLotro! Silly me for not thinking of it.

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

[Bendin]

So, two things.

1) Indeed, yay MyLotro! Silly me for not thinking of it.

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

Aloha, In the interium while you guys get the auto loot streightened out; any chance of getting an updated http://lorebook.lotro.com/wiki/Item:Martyr's_Fortitude set (I luv's me some bubbles) using the useless(or at least subpar) Battered ring of Rohan, or through some other mechanic?

[stockboy]

I agree that the purple drops are nothing special, altho they do drop on T1 which is quite easy so I guess that's fine. I ran Iorbar's Peak and Goblin Town T2C (failed challenge both times) and never saw any teal drops. We ran Warg Pens T2C (completing challenge) and everyone got 1 bounty. If we complete challenge I would like to see at least one person get a teal drop.

Also, one group in glff ran Iorbar's Peak T1 and the warden got the legendary drop. So they do drop on T1, I thought this was odd, figured they would only drop on T2C.

[CraZYMuffin-IPC]

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

From my limited experiences so far on live, my runs have so far been "we got nothing" (or rather, "I got nothing"). Ran the 3 new 3-mans and SG all T2C. We managed to get 1 teal guard earring from Iorbar's Peak and a Warden's cloak from SG (neither of which are getting used). Compared to the past, this is far less teal loot for the effort.

After hearing what others have to say, it sounds like other groups are doing even worse then us.

I just hope that if (when) the loot gets adjusted, it doesn't get over-adjusted. (from past experiences, it usually does)

[Mystarr]

Some results and then some comments

RESULTS

T1 Goblin King - So so Marks/Money. No items - Relics are MUCH worse than running lvl 65 Stoneheight

T2 Goblin King - So so Marks/Money. 2 purple items that none of us kept. Relics MUCH worse than running lvl 65 Stonehieght

T2C SG - LOTS of Marks/Medallions/Seals. Relics MUCH worse than running lvl 65 Stonehieght. 2 purple items that were worse than what we already had. The LM got the super rare Gold LM boots

COMMENTS
Completely random loot is NOT fun. Players say they like random drops but what they really mean is that they want to always walk away with something decent for their effort and then occasionally they want to get something awesome. (NOTE: Players don't really value marks that much)

Example of what players are expecting: You finish an instance on T2 challenge and

- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a nice teal
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a symbol
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets gold item
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a rare deco item
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a tier 9 relic
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a stat scroll
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a relic removal scroll
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a starlight crystal
- Everyone gets decent runes/relics/marks AND at least one person gets a rare recipe
- Etc

Players don't want COMPLETE Randomness.

Complete Randomness can be cruel.

Players want Random Niceness.

PS - You cant give this loot with no locks or players will just figure out the easiest instance and farm it to the exclusion of everything else. You have to give each instance a drop like this once a week (or twice a week etc) so players will have a reason to run all the instances (Like the current locks on skirmish teal drops)

[chulic]

So, two things.

1) Indeed, yay MyLotro! Silly me for not thinking of it.

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

Well i could add my story so far.

Run about 3-4 times all 3men t1 and some on t2, what i dont understand how come i was always a person that didnt get neither purple, teal or ever relics in the end, all i got EVERY time was veteran gold, some rune xp and ofc medallions and marks. So for me that was really bad experience and im considering not to play new 3mens again. Now if could we only had guaranteed 1 teal per challenge and on t1 guaranteed at least 1 purple, usualy t1 have nothing while t2 have like 20% for teal of less, for me in both scenarios was 0 items recived.

On other hand, thanks for good drops of mob npcs in new instances, such as hides,ore,legendary 3rd age and similar items that drops.

Please improve stats on teal jewlery, or put bigger % on teal/purple of t1 & t2 instances, so at least we get some satisfaction in playing them.


EDIT:

As nice person above stated, how can relics and runes xp from new lvl85 challenges be worst then sth/ncf t2 runs from lvl65 area?
Also at least give t5-t6 relics and maybe some 120 000 xp runes like or better then in Roots of fangorn t2 or toO. After all this is lvl85 instances, and players need t9s and millions and millions of xp runes, so help us get them instead we go farm enedwaith instances.

[Lestache]

Regarding T2 Stoneheight:

Has anyone run it since the update? Does it still drop a lot of relics and ixp, or is it subject to the new loot rules as well? If it's the latter, I can see it not being nearly as productive as it was before.

[chulic]

Regarding T2 Stoneheight:

Has anyone run it since the update? Does it still drop a lot of relics and ixp, or is it subject to the new loot rules as well? If it's the latter, I can see it not being nearly as productive as it was before.

I just did ncf t2 and sth t2, everything is same, it's not auto loot, thanks God! It's same runes-relics number as before. Im happy they didnt nerf them. If they did i would quit game

[avengingbananaslug]

We ran a T2 SG and no one got any equipment, crystals or symbols. Just bounties and I got 1 relic. Another group said same thing happened to them. It's ok medallions I guess but harder than foundry by far and should be better loot. It's a fairly fun 6 man and I would enjoy running it more but not until drops are better.

[Camath0rn]

I ran a bunch 3 mans yesterday and SG t2 Challenge.

1. The difficulty level on the t2's was great. SG wasn't a face roll. Everyone had fun.

2. 50% of the time the entire group got nothing from the chests I opened yesterday. It seemed there would either be nothing, or everyone would get 1 relic/rune. I feel as though perhaps those should be a constant in every chest, maybe with a chance to get both.

3. Opening a total of maybe 12-15 chests on t2 through out the day I saw 2 teal pieces and a starlight crystal (not for myself but among everyone's loot). Since these are tradable I think its a decent drop rate. Though purple items maybe could be increased.

Just my 2 cents, hope it helps.



PS. Allowing people to farm the skull and bonepile quests in SG for about 50 medallions each is not a wise move. You can clear the instance and then run in and out as many times as you wish. Its also annoying having these quests reset if you have to go out to repair. Please make them daily.

[leangorn]

I have made two SG t2c ; noone got any equipment and i see ( for the two try ) only 5 relics and two crystals

personnally i think it s very poor for loot

[mrfigglesworth]

So, two things.

1) Indeed, yay MyLotro! Silly me for not thinking of it.

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

advantage of remote looting:
no wasted time passing out loot after fights (especially important with ML+raids).
no chance of lm rolling on might item. (Just an example)


disadvantage of remote looting:
less chance to get teal items
bunch of items popping up on screen had more of a lottery feel, as in more exciting than RNG (i know they're the same thing but they feel very separate).


Here's a problem with the DG istances itemization: The only upgrade most people see are gold items which are extremely rare, since all teal/purple DG drops are (as xrockx says) worse than the RoR teal/purples. Since gold items are VERY rare drops, it's going to leave the majority of the population feeling like they aren't getting anything out of it.

here's a fix for DG instances itemization: higher chance for ridder crystals, crystals of remembrance, tarnished symbols, stat tomes, and more runes/ relics dropping.

BTW i think marks/meds for SG are awesome, and plan on running SG a lot with BG and SH just for those.....Which makes me pretty much never want to run the new 3 mans.

[Vandervahn]

What specific level 75 earrings are you referring to?

I'm aware the amounts of power may be considered high on much of the DG gear.

As are parry or ICPR on much of the might loot we´ve seen since Isengard outside of skirms. I´ll not even jump into the difficulty of getting crit now that Agility has (gladly) lost its stupid miss chance component. You´re not gonna get champs off of the Fervour stance train just by throwing us inferior loot

Aloha, In the interium while you guys get the auto loot streightened out; any chance of getting an updated http://lorebook.lotro.com/wiki/Item:Martyr's_Fortitude set (I luv's me some bubbles) using the useless(or at least subpar) Battered ring of Rohan, or through some other mechanic?

You know, the clickies were great and all, but this inevitably led to complete cookie cutter builds. Everyone ran around with the same armor and 3-5 jewel pieces, the only variation was in bracelets.

Rockx, if you bring clicky jewels again, I´d like to advise against making the rest of the stats/set bonus stats equally powerful to other loot so that we´re virtually forced to run with the same stuff all over.

[FundinStrongarm]

I'm disappointed with some of the findings from this thread. I think a tweak with someone getting something good is in order for T2C modes.

I ran 1 lowly T1 Iobar's Peak and one of the people got a Crystal. I thought that was pretty lucky for sure. Hearing T2C SG yields less saddens me a little.

[Gwyndor]

So, two things.

1) Indeed, yay MyLotro! Silly me for not thinking of it.

2) It's a brand new system, so I'm exceedingly interested in player's feedback to help find that sweet spot between "we got nothing" and "we got everything". We all knew going into using Remote Looting in instances there'd be some kinks to work out.

And us customers are likewise very appreciative of your feedback. But this "sweet spot" you mention... Is there any need to reinvent the wheel here?

Could you not simply employ the same system, and same kind of loot table and drop probabilities as the old level 65 SG? (with level 85 equivalent gear ofc...) Maybe its not that simple. But from what I recall everyone seemed quite happy at level 65 with both the quality of the Flask, Ril-Mir, and purple gear like the Tolloch earring etc, and their drop rates (and don't forget the symbol as well, hint hint) - so this, imo, would be a good template to look at recreating.

cheers

[RJFerret]

Totally random loot is bad. Totally consistent loot is bad (less exciting). The key is the middle ground.

There's a reason kins eliminate random, and use a ladder or DKP system. A great example was the loot in Draigoch, if random, a third of the group makes out like bandits, another third gets piddling, and final third gets nothing for spending all that time. On our runs, everybody got something, and people get to choose what they want/need most, regardless of a company's specific "you shall only build your character this way" design.

I was lucky yesterday, at least getting a relic and vendor trash purple from each I did.

Another group had two people get nothing, while the third got a teal item PLUS a tome of vitality. That sucked for all of them. The "winner" felt badly. The others felt badly too. It gets socially awkward too, it would be gracious to gift one of those items to another, but how do you pick between the two who were screwed by random? Then their response, "no, I won't accept it, it's yours, you won it". If they did accept, then they feel obligated to the gifter.

Simple solution? Have remote looting implemented if the loot rule is set to roll/pass or need/greed, but have master looter in effect if the group chooses to use master looter.

Don't take control away from players please! Intelligence is better than random every time.

[DutchEZmoder]

I did Iorvar's Peak T2 CM yesterday. Only bounties, and in the end i got a &&&&ty cloak that i sold in globallff. Everyone else also got bounties, only the captain got a &&&&&& ring too.

Sammath Gul T2 CM today, everyone got bounties on every boss. Just the final boss (CM) dropped 1 rune and 1 relic for 2 different people. The rest got bounties.

So, i won't run any instance again. I will just login on raiding days with my kin to do BG, and that's it. Thanks Turbine for the free instances, i can see they are free, since not a lot of time was spend on them.

[Kosomok]

Well, Remote Looting is certainly new territory for us.

When making your "loot is horrible" statements, what are you looking at? Rare quality gear? Incomparable? Legendary? Did the RNG not give your group anything tangible? Did it give everyone something?

That a Rare quality piece would be worse off than something from Hytbold is expected. Nor can every piece be perfectly statted for the way a specific player wants it. The Incomparable drops should be on par with your current equipment, if not slightly better. The Legendaries should be better -- especially if they match up to your playstyle / skills you make use of.

Running on T2 and doing Challenge will also impact your drop rates, especially for the Legendary quality equipment (which is very rare to begin with).

I did SG T2CM last nite and the reality was that the instance was stupid hard in relation to what dropped. The hard part wasn't the bosses (we pretty much pwned the bosses), it was the trash--specifically any pull that a Brute was in. Its hard to deal with a multiple mobs putting out 15k+ a hit... but that is a balance issue.

The issue is that you may make a run and nobody will actually get anything worthwhile. In 4 chests we only got two items. The rest was bounties and relics and IXP runes. The two items were a purple pocket item (and, frankly, purple items aren't worth using on a progression raid toon so we all kind of went, meh) and a relic removal scroll. While it was nice to get the scroll (yay, me!), it isn't actually inspiring loot.

Having a run where 6 people get two items in 24 randoms (6 ppl x 4 chests) is demotivating. Not sure what can be done about that though. I am hoping that our BG run is more rewarding... because the reality is that people (and especially raiders) do not do scaled content for the experience or the "challenge" we do it for the loot.

Also did Iorbar T2CM and only 1 item dropped (another basically useless purple).

A few things:

1) Nobody REALLY considers IXP runes, relics or bounties to be rewards. They are background stuff that, unless its a T7 or T8 relic drop, nobody really cares--at least, nobody who I run with. I have more relics and IXP runes than I can shake a stick at and bounties are just another way to hand me cash (which I have nothing to really buy with, anyway).

2) Pretty much any purple item from a scaled instance is useless. Its usually worse than what anyone in there is already wearing.. basically its like getting a bounty, only it doesn't give me as much cash.

3) Store items are semi-ok (stat tomes, relic removal scrolls, etc)--but the reality is that they still aren't sexy. I don't go into an instance hoping that a relic removal scroll will drop for me and I go meh when it does drop.

4) Items people actually want: Symbols, crystals, cosmetics (especailly warsteed stuff), USEFUL gear (bling that is at least equivalent to what I am wearing going in, with maybe a different (buts still useful) stat mix... hell put the skraid stuff in the 6 mans--doing one of these 6 mans is at least as hard as doing a skraid, given that I have often 6 or 7 manned skraids.

5) EVERYBODY needs to come away with something that they can go ooh over at the end of the run--it doesn't need to be a great teal item, but it should at least be interesting or useful or entertaining--and NOT a relic or IXP rune or bounty. Sorry but those don't have any oooooh factor.