Update 17.1 Beta & Load test Release Notes - PRELIMINARY AND NON-FINAL - BULLROARER ONLY

[Gandalphor]

• Instances - Osgiliath - New Bounty Quests Added! Completing Sunken Labyrinth or Ruined City on Tier 2 at Level 100 will now award 1 Morgul Crest upon defeat of the final boss. Completing the Dome of Stars on Tier 2 at Level 100 will now award 2 Morgul Crests upon defeat of the final boss.

About this... Is this only about the crests or can we expect something more? New loot?

[Stephen1981]

does anyone know if anymore performance improvements were made to minas tirith

[Ethrildar]

About this... Is this only about the crests or can we expect something more? New loot?

Does it say "and new loot!" ? No. So it's fairly safe to assume there's no new loot...

A little common sense goes a long, long way. They're just undoing the change they made a short while ago where doing the "challenging" content granted an additional crest, which they removed for a reason I don't know.

[bondar]

[*]In the Merry Swan in Minas Tirith, Lord Forlong's hair is now colored a proper raven black.

...but I just read in the LOTR chapter, Minas Tirith, describing Forlong as: "a man of wide shoulders and huge girth, but old and grey-bearded, yet mail-clad and black-helmed" so why not leave him with grey hair to match his beard?

[Navarro11]

My personal opinion about this is simple. I'm GONNA STOP PAYING VIP RIGHT NOW. And no, it's not only a QQ. I don't play a lot of pvp those days (primary thanks to turbine's ideas about needing a lot of ASOE to upgrade weapons). But when I play (2h or so each day of the weekend) creeps are always more than freeps, get over it, this is a pvmp map with a lot of people, and now even more and more with server merges, it's not about 1 vs 1, I have seen a lot of times the minority buffs on freeps during my play, and 90% of the fights there were a lot more creeps than freeps, it's understandable, CREEPS ARE FREE, just pay the class and you have it forever, no farm after farm to get weapons, gear, essences, virtues, tomes...and on and on...

Creeps will always be more than freeps, and doing what you are doing you are just making a lot of subscriptors to stop paying, I pay to play moors and I think I'm not the only one, there's no new PVE content needed to pay, no raids, no instances, just farm to get your gear and go to have fun in PVMP. Why should I keep doing that if my hunter that I have been playing for 5 years keeps dying again and again in warg packs 5+ with almost no cd on skills, macros and hips + sprint on first hits??

Yes, some freep classes need nerfs, and i say SOME, not all. And yes, some creeps classes need more DPS, and I say some NOT ALL (I have seen BA hitting me for almost 9k with all mits capped, audacity maxed etc...) If I am 30k morale thats also 3-4 shots

SOLUTION: stop paying VIP, dont play game or just rol a creep with 200k morale pool

[Gutterat]

Thank you for these PvMP changes.

It was needed.

Agreed. Nice one devs. And Navarro, if I was you I'd check out the BAs, you probably got hit with VT which has a long cooldown, so you wouldn't get hit 3 times by it. Also, most creeps AND freeps have maxed audacity, haven't you? If your so worried about your morale, use essence jewellry and armour which would give you an extra 43k just by using stuff from the ettens. We've seen champs and guardians with 240k, but that was obviously DA stuff from PVE land. A good hunter can deal with a group of wargs fairly easily, trust me . If you're having such a hard time perhaps it would be best to do what you intend, PvMP obviously isn't for you, you need to spend a lot more time than 2 hrs to accomplish anything.

' Slacker! Send him to the sofa pits!'

[Ethrildar]

Agreed. Nice one devs.

lol.

you probably got hit with VT which has a long cooldown,

lol.

most creeps AND freeps have maxed audacity, haven't you?

lol. Audacity provides max incoming damage reduction at rank 1, so max audacity wouldn't make a difference in this case.

We've seen champs and guardians with 240k, but that was obviously DA stuff from PVE land.

I've seen a cappy with 126k, and that's a class that can stack morale insanely more than any other class. You have not seen a champ with 240k.

A good hunter can deal with a group of wargs fairly easily, trust me .

lol.

If you're having such a hard time perhaps it would be best to do what you intend, PvMP obviously isn't for you, you need to spend a lot more time than 2 hrs to accomplish anything.

lol. Looking at what you've written above, I don't think PvMP is for you, either; clearly you've spent less than 2 hours in the moors yourself.

'Slacker! Send him to the sofa pits!'

Lmfao sofa pits. SULPHUR pits you buffoon.

[Navarro11]

Agreed. Nice one devs. And Navarro, if I was you I'd check out the BAs, you probably got hit with VT which has a long cooldown, so you wouldn't get hit 3 times by it. Also, most creeps AND freeps have maxed audacity, haven't you? If your so worried about your morale, use essence jewellry and armour which would give you an extra 43k just by using stuff from the ettens. We've seen champs and guardians with 240k, but that was obviously DA stuff from PVE land. A good hunter can deal with a group of wargs fairly easily, trust me . If you're having such a hard time perhaps it would be best to do what you intend, PvMP obviously isn't for you, you need to spend a lot more time than 2 hrs to accomplish anything.

' Slacker! Send him to the sofa pits!'

You have absolutely no idea of what you are saying xD. PVP isn't for me sure, 5 years playing hunt and Captain General . ANd of course, a hunt can deal easily with a 5 warg pack macroed that on first hit hips or sprint hhahaha, dont make me laugh. And the most stupid thing you have said, guardians and champs with 240k morale loool. Screenshots please

[Gutterat]

lol.

Lmfao sofa pits. SULPHUR pits you buffoon.

You really need to lighten up. Every creep I have ever played with refers to it as the sofa pits. Its called humour. As to the rest, there really is no point in answering.

[Spilo]

My personal opinion about this is simple. I'm GONNA STOP PAYING VIP RIGHT NOW. And no, it's not only a QQ. I don't play a lot of pvp those days (primary thanks to turbine's ideas about needing a lot of ASOE to upgrade weapons). But when I play (2h or so each day of the weekend) creeps are always more than freeps, get over it, this is a pvmp map with a lot of people, and now even more and more with server merges, it's not about 1 vs 1, I have seen a lot of times the minority buffs on freeps during my play, and 90% of the fights there were a lot more creeps than freeps, it's understandable, CREEPS ARE FREE, just pay the class and you have it forever, no farm after farm to get weapons, gear, essences, virtues, tomes...and on and on...

Creeps will always be more than freeps, and doing what you are doing you are just making a lot of subscriptors to stop paying, I pay to play moors and I think I'm not the only one, there's no new PVE content needed to pay, no raids, no instances, just farm to get your gear and go to have fun in PVMP. Why should I keep doing that if my hunter that I have been playing for 5 years keeps dying again and again in warg packs 5+ with almost no cd on skills, macros and hips + sprint on first hits??

Yes, some freep classes need nerfs, and i say SOME, not all. And yes, some creeps classes need more DPS, and I say some NOT ALL (I have seen BA hitting me for almost 9k with all mits capped, audacity maxed etc...) If I am 30k morale thats also 3-4 shots

SOLUTION: stop paying VIP, dont play game or just rol a creep with 200k morale pool

[reverendmaggot]

I always wondered why they dont go deeper into the PvMP part since all freeps are VIP and its still one of the best ways to get money for them.

Similarly, in the beginning, Lord of the Rings: Online could have been the best PvP MMO out there. There is nothing more epic than the Battle in Middle Earth and Turbine could have made oodles of money off this game had PvP not been broken since the start. The amount of people who like to PvP in MMOs who will outright laugh in your face if you mention LotRO is a clear indication that something is wrong. If Turbine added 1 or 2 devs dedicated to PvP, they'd make back the cash it costs to pay those employees if those two devs fixed PvP and brought players back. We all know a large portion of PvP-only players per server have left, and more follow every year. They loved the game, but the PvP sucks because of imbalance, bugs, exploits, stupid mechanics (I'm looking at you, autoflips), but I would be willing to bet all my gold that a good portion of them would return if PvP was more enticing for both sides.

[Nexcris]

Similarly, in the beginning, Lord of the Rings: Online could have been the best PvP MMO out there. There is nothing more epic than the Battle in Middle Earth and Turbine could have made oodles of money off this game had PvP not been broken since the start. The amount of people who like to PvP in MMOs who will outright laugh in your face if you mention LotRO is a clear indication that something is wrong. If Turbine added 1 or 2 devs dedicated to PvP, they'd make back the cash it costs to pay those employees if those two devs fixed PvP and brought players back. We all know a large portion of PvP-only players per server have left, and more follow every year. They loved the game, but the PvP sucks because of imbalance, bugs, exploits, stupid mechanics (I'm looking at you, autoflips), but I would be willing to bet all my gold that a good portion of them would return if PvP was more enticing for both sides.

totally agree

[reverendmaggot]

My personal opinion about this is simple. I'm GONNA STOP PAYING VIP RIGHT NOW. And no, it's not only a QQ. I don't play a lot of pvp those days (primary thanks to turbine's ideas about needing a lot of ASOE to upgrade weapons). But when I play (2h or so each day of the weekend) creeps are always more than freeps, get over it, this is a pvmp map with a lot of people, and now even more and more with server merges, it's not about 1 vs 1, I have seen a lot of times the minority buffs on freeps during my play, and 90% of the fights there were a lot more creeps than freeps, it's understandable, CREEPS ARE FREE, just pay the class and you have it forever, no farm after farm to get weapons, gear, essences, virtues, tomes...and on and on...

Creeps will always be more than freeps, and doing what you are doing you are just making a lot of subscriptors to stop paying, I pay to play moors and I think I'm not the only one, there's no new PVE content needed to pay, no raids, no instances, just farm to get your gear and go to have fun in PVMP. Why should I keep doing that if my hunter that I have been playing for 5 years keeps dying again and again in warg packs 5+ with almost no cd on skills, macros and hips + sprint on first hits??

Yes, some freep classes need nerfs, and i say SOME, not all. And yes, some creeps classes need more DPS, and I say some NOT ALL (I have seen BA hitting me for almost 9k with all mits capped, audacity maxed etc...) If I am 30k morale thats also 3-4 shots

SOLUTION: stop paying VIP, dont play game or just rol a creep with 200k morale pool

Are you crying because you're dying solo... on a Hunter, to multiple players? Because that is how things SHOULD be. You shouldn't be able to roll a Warden and tank 12-14 Creeps. But you can. As for the morale issue, which is beating a rotting corpse of a dead horse at this point, have you never once in the 5 years of playing parsed your damage and compared it to a Blackarrows? My Improved Swift Bow does ~11k on Tier 2 Challenge mobs in PvE, while STILL having t2c capped mitigations, critical defense. My Rank 12, fully damage traited Blackarrow has no mitigations traited and his Screaming Shafts skill hits a Freep for ~1000 each hit, maybe. Do you not see why Creeps have larger morale pools? Because Freeps hit harder. My Rank 13 War-leader with full audacity gets hit by top geared Runekeepers for 23k DoT ticks if they crit. I only have 119k morale. With just ONE RK hitting me, that would take ~7 hits to kill me assuming not all DoTs crit. ONE RUNEKEEPER. Factor in that Freeps generally carry around multiple Runekeepers who trait fire, then all the CC stopping me from healing through it. That is why Creeps have larger morale pools. Because Freeps hit harder. It is very simple grade school math.

[infinitewhimsy]

You have absolutely no idea of what you are saying xD. PVP isn't for me sure, 5 years playing hunt and Captain General . ANd of course, a hunt can deal easily with a 5 warg pack macroed that on first hit hips or sprint hhahaha, dont make me laugh. And the most stupid thing you have said, guardians and champs with 240k morale loool. Screenshots please

Only a moron would try to equate rank with competence. Then again, you also think BA's 4 shot 30k Freeps...so...you've clearly earned that r15.

[Ethrildar]

You really need to lighten up. Every creep I have ever played with refers to it as the sofa pits. Its called humour. As to the rest, there really is no point in answering.

Haha couldn't you tell by how much your post made me laugh that I'm pretty light-hearted?

Sofa pits? That's not humour, that's an inside joke that to somebody on the outside just makes you look as stupid as you evidently are.

Your post on the other hand? Now THAT'S humour. I'd give you a sticker but you didn't know you were being funny.

[MythicDude]

In the Merry Swan in Minas Tirith, Lord Forlong's hair is now colored a proper raven black......

You have no idea how it's been bothering me!!!! Thank you SOOOOOOOOO much Turbine for fixing this very important issue that I'm sure many have been deeply concerned with for far too long now.

That said, I still have to stand still to cast 99% of all my skills when on foot, but for some reason I can cast all my skills when bouncing along on a horse. This seems pretty.... well STUPID don't you think? I'm coordinated enough to read my lore book, and cast my skills on a horse bouncing along at 20-30 mph, but I'm too clumsy to read that same book and cast that same skill when walking or running on my own two feet? REALLY?

Don't you think it's about time LM's got some mobility like EVERY SINGLE OTHER CLASS in the game? I get how important hair color is, but perhaps a little love elsewhere would be more appreciated.

MM

[Ethrildar]

In the Merry Swan in Minas Tirith, Lord Forlong's hair is now colored a proper raven black......

You have no idea how it's been bothering me!!!! Thank you SOOOOOOOOO much Turbine for fixing this very important issue that I'm sure many have been deeply concerned with for far too long now.

That said, I still have to stand still to cast 99% of all my skills when on foot, but for some reason I can cast all my skills when bouncing along on a horse. This seems pretty.... well STUPID don't you think? I'm coordinated enough to read my lore book, and cast my skills on a horse bouncing along at 20-30 mph, but I'm too clumsy to read that same book and cast that same skill when walking or running on my own two feet? REALLY?

Don't you think it's about time LM's got some mobility like EVERY SINGLE OTHER CLASS in the game? I get how important hair color is, but perhaps a little love elsewhere would be more appreciated.

MM

I think, from looking at your requests, you're lost and in the wrong forum. This is a u17 patch, addressing PvMP concerns and some bugs not noticed before U17 itself was released. You're looking for the suggestions forum.

[gripply]

In the Merry Swan in Minas Tirith, Lord Forlong's hair is now colored a proper raven black......

You have no idea how it's been bothering me!!!! Thank you SOOOOOOOOO much Turbine for fixing this very important issue that I'm sure many have been deeply concerned with for far too long now.

That said, I still have to stand still to cast 99% of all my skills when on foot, but for some reason I can cast all my skills when bouncing along on a horse. This seems pretty.... well STUPID don't you think? I'm coordinated enough to read my lore book, and cast my skills on a horse bouncing along at 20-30 mph, but I'm too clumsy to read that same book and cast that same skill when walking or running on my own two feet? REALLY?

Don't you think it's about time LM's got some mobility like EVERY SINGLE OTHER CLASS in the game? I get how important hair color is, but perhaps a little love elsewhere would be more appreciated.

MM

Go outside with a book in a wooded area and try reading and running, preferably someplace with those 4 foot spiderwebs between trees. If you've ever hiked you know why this isn't likely.

Not saying it couldn't be lore-explained like... LM's might have some kind of shadowfax skill to float over terrain, but the web in the face and 2 inch spider will distract you some. That spells miss chance to me.

[gripply]

The key to balancing pvp is not simply increasing the creep damage and morale pools, while there are still issues there (mostly with their damage not with their morale) these are easy changes that turbine has chosen because as I said they are easy and involve a simple change rather than any actual class or game mechanic change. To truly balance PVP they need to get to the root of the problem which is not entirely the stats. There are classes on both sides that need some serious mechanic fixes if there is ever hope of a balanced pvp. <snip>>>>>

Captain - Over the last few updates they have become quite the powerhouse damage class with high crits and decent bleed damage they are the epitome of a support class being turned to a damage class with the simple retrait. Blue line is also very solid in these updates they are a very good support healer and a decently built class. Yellow captain, everyones favorite trolls, Since the 95 lvl cap nerf yellow captains among decent pvpers are nearly non existant. This nerf was well deserved, I was one of those people who abused exemplar and and bubble I would know... but I think they nerfed it a bit much. It has nothing these days, cant heal at all outside of yourself and it is simply a cd bot, toss your bubble, in harms, and, banner and come back in a minute or 2 to do something again. They need to find some way to make these yellow captains feasible small group and raid healers. increase the healing, increase the buffs or in some way make their defensive buffs worth using again. The yellow captain banner of +30% inc healing would also go a long way in terms of helping freeps not become immune to healing.
<snip>>>>

These are just my thoughts feel free to point out how wrong you think I am below - Balathan-1

I don't think you're wrong basically because I don't PVP, PVMP or whatever. Your comments may be perfectly valid as it relates to PVP, I wouldn't know. Not because I'm not VIP, but because I dislike all forms of PVP in all games on principle.

I did want to correct that at least in PVE I can heal others in yellow trait. I have one heal and its cooldown is reasonable. Rallying Cry is also an AoE heal that procs on the fellowship.

However, on PVE, what the captain needs is a viable tank yellow trait line. With the imbuing away of maximum targets, and durations, we are the weakest tank in the game. We also have no single target force attack that is ranged. Simply making Routing Cry a force attack and giving us a force attack duration legacy would fix that. Get rid of the silly heal buff to Last Stand and give us a force attack duration that has an imbued max of 10 sec or something. 5 at level 25. Give us back our max aoe targets. We only have 2 (aoe targets, and one is a frontal) for crissakes. My guard who isn't even 100 yet has *******15******* challenge targets!!!!! I'm limited to 5.

Pulling mobs at range I have the following options:

1. herald pull
2. noble mark
3. routing cry

Pick one and make it a force attack on ME. So if you just made the herald transfer threat to me, that would work. No I don't want him to "challenge" the mobs himself, he's just there to dps. I've played necromancer in EQ2 and I'm perfectly capable of doing pet pulls. But the threat can't be on the pet. I also need a button that transfers his threat to me.

Or give me a unique throwing weapon. Didn't I have throwing axes or hatchets or something a log time ago? Fine bottle of wine might be amusing... Captain's special vintage... smash. And of course, it should be a single target forced attack and have a legacy to buff it.

Unless you plan on dumping the entire idea of tanking as a cappy PVE. I suppose we could just be the official powerlevel class.

With enough might it's viable as an endgame solo setup, but then what do you do? You haven't stacked up tactical mastery for heals on your essences. You end up with armor swap hell.

[Ethrildar]

what the captain needs is a viable tank yellow trait line. With the imbuing away of maximum targets, and durations, we are the weakest tank in the game.

give me a unique throwing weapon. Didn't I have throwing axes or hatchets or something a log time ago?

This is just mindblowing...

1) Cappy tank is THE ULTIMATE single-target boss tank in the game without exception. It's the only utility tank, and it's utility is solid as a rock.

They need to un-nerf Exemplar, the nerf they put on it went way too far. And they need to up bubble so it's back to 90%, still not stacking with other effects (same as WL bubble).

Yes, you did have throwing hatchets, and.. Whoa shocker.. You still do!? Go buy some or make some, and use them if you need other ways to pull. Or use your legs... Or one of the three things you mentioned you have? Or a 4th which you also have that I'm not gonna tell you about.

The problem with yellow cappy tanks is that the people playing them mostly fail at the game. The class is just fine for the most part. +2-3 aoe targets would be nice.

[Laerien]

I fear for the playerbase when I see a change reverting after a half dozen (or less) forums complains.

The PvP balance in this game cannot be done by the freeps side (except for some specific skills maybe too OP for PvP ) unless it does not affect PvE. You cannot pretend to revamp the whole game around your warg.

If creeps are weaker the balance have to be done buffing creeps not nerfing freeps (again: except some specific skills). That's a no brainer.

It would be more easier for devs to focus on equating* one side (creeps) than the buff>nerf>revamp neverending story I've seen all this years in all games I've played.

*classes in PvP are never equal, however is it possible to reach certain level of fairness.

[siipperi]

I fear for the playerbase when I see a change reverting after a half dozen (or less) forums complains.

The PvP balance in this game cannot be done by the freeps side (except for some specific skills maybe too OP for PvP ) unless it does not affect PvE. You cannot pretend to revamp the whole game around your warg.

If creeps are weaker the balance have to be done buffing creeps not nerfing freeps (again: except some specific skills). That's a no brainer.

It would be more easier for devs to focus on equating* one side (creeps) than the buff>nerf>revamp neverending story I've seen all this years in all games I've played.

*classes in PvP are never equal, however is it possible to reach certain level of fairness.

So what if it affects pve? It would be only good thing. Remove bolstering our courage trait, remove prey on the weak, remove bring on the pain trait and make it yellow line passive, remove beorning composure trait from red, remove warden light dot bonus, nerf overflowing confidence on RK etc etc. None of these are needed and only make those classes absurdly OP and are total game breakers on both pve and pvp.

[Gutterat]

Similarly, in the beginning, Lord of the Rings: Online could have been the best PvP MMO out there. There is nothing more epic than the Battle in Middle Earth and Turbine could have made oodles of money off this game had PvP not been broken since the start. The amount of people who like to PvP in MMOs who will outright laugh in your face if you mention LotRO is a clear indication that something is wrong. If Turbine added 1 or 2 devs dedicated to PvP, they'd make back the cash it costs to pay those employees if those two devs fixed PvP and brought players back. We all know a large portion of PvP-only players per server have left, and more follow every year. They loved the game, but the PvP sucks because of imbalance, bugs, exploits, stupid mechanics (I'm looking at you, autoflips), but I would be willing to bet all my gold that a good portion of them would return if PvP was more enticing for both sides.

Agree with everything you say, good post. I only play creep, have done for 7 years. I rage-quit a while ago when I think it was the L85 udpdates that really killed oUr server (Laurelin). We tried to keep it going but it really was a lost cause. I think the problem is that LoTRO is ostensibly a PvE game with a bit of PvP thrown in. However, the system is probably the best out there. A lot of friends (and me) tried GW2 Archeage etc. etc, in the search to find something as good as Lotro, but returned to the fold. I mean, you can still do it but creepside you need a seriuosly balanced raid with a top quality leader to even dent the current setups. A lot have returned but again since the L100 updates a lot of people (mainly creeps) are leaving (again). Since the player transfers the Moors are banging again and Turbine really have a good reason to cater for us.

Nobody would want ANY freep classes to be nerfed, just give me warg a bit of protection against the 7k bleeds *howl*

Waiting for Monday since 2007.....

[Banaticus]

Also love the crafting workspaces finally being added.

I've seen this done in other MMORPG's and it leads to the same thing. You never see anyone else craft, and it makes the world seem that much more empty. It makes the game feel dead.