Is Retaking Pelargir Necessary

[Oelle]

It probably has more to do with BB's being quite difficult for some players when they first start them, with zero rank, and skirms having a reputation as being group content. Both are soloable of course, but they do have a different feel to them than any solo questing instance in the game. A questline instance just feels like another quest, whereas a BB or Skirmish doesn't.

Some of the questing instances are significantly harder than either, but, they feel like different game play. So it could just be that. The MC instance is in Cliving, and I know quite a few players that struggled to get passed it. It does not block your progress however, as you can move on without it. The Brockbridge instance doesn't prevent a player moving on either, as many HD zones are started by visiting Gandalf at Edoras, once you hit a certain level. Sure you miss a couple of quests if you don't complete it, but you can still progress. Another thing that you're overlooking is that with many questing instances, if you fail, you can return a little later on, when you're a higher level. Sure you can run a Skirm over level too, but it doesn't apply to BB's.

I enjoy running whole storylines, and do everything on most of my alts (except repeat classes, like my second or third minstrel etc - that are just mules). If I fall at any point, I just keep at it until I get past it (it always works as you learn by failing), so for me, the design works. But, I'm not everyone, and I don't agree that everyone should be forced to play the game, the same way as I play it. It wouldn't hurt my game play at all, if these two things were optional, because, I could still do them.

Tuckborrow skirmish is quite similar to the final quest-instance of ered luin epic story. you go somewhere, step by step, and get attacked inbetween.
In both of them, NPCs help you fighting and talk a bit and praise you for winning in the end. In both cases, the battle only goes on, if you decide to move to the next target. The only difference I see is, that the skirm isnt always the same (as some enemies are random) and it allows any groupsize and you can choose difficulty. What do I miss?

Starting BBs with just the 4 starting points isnt really funny. The introduction/tutorial to BBs doesnt really help either. That's both issues I'd like to get solved.

I just feel that if SSG decides to make things skipable, they should do so for all difficult contents. not just for some parts. Or they just create a tourist-class and people can check the landscapes but dont have access to fighting-quests.

[Arnenna]

Tuckborrow skirmish is quite similar to the final quest-instance of ered luin epic story. you go somewhere, step by step, and get attacked inbetween.
In both of them, NPCs help you fighting and talk a bit and praise you for winning in the end. In both cases, the battle only goes on, if you decide to move to the next target. The only difference I see is, that the skirm isnt always the same (as some enemies are random) and it allows any groupsize and you can choose difficulty. What do I miss?

Starting BBs with just the 4 starting points isnt really funny. The introduction/tutorial to BBs doesnt really help either. That's both issues I'd like to get solved.

I just feel that if SSG decides to make things skipable, they should do so for all difficult contents. not just for some parts. Or they just create a tourist-class and people can check the landscapes but dont have access to fighting-quests.

It's just diversity in players. As far as I'm concerned, they could make the whole game fully optional, and it would be fine. As long as I can play, how I want to play, then what others do wouldn't be a problem. If that meant they could choose to skip all difficult content, or indeed, all of the very easy content, it wouldn't matter to me, or how I play. The more players they keep happy, the better it would be for the game.

As an example. I do some festivals on most alts (but not all alts), and then there is one festival which I really don't enjoy, so only my main does it (because she does everything). I'd hate it if that festival was somehow placed into the game as a mandatory objective, to being able to get to the next one. Likewise, I love skirmishes of all sorts, solo, duo, skraids. Some players don't, and that's ok. BB's, nope, not a fan. I do them, because I have to do them, not because I want to (Pele is the exception). They're not what I consider a problem, as they are over quick enough and then they're done, but it's a bit like going to see your favorite film and being forced to eat salted popcorn when you wanted toffee popcorn. It doesn't spoil the film, but the whole encounter isn't as great as it could have been.

Incidentally, it's worth noting here that most players (myself included) go through BB's a lot anyway, and not because they want to progress the storyline - but for Promo points, so making them optional for the players that care a bit less about min maxing, wouldn't really be a problem. Those of us who want the two trait points, would still do them and keep the numbers up on them.

[siipperi]

I just feel that if SSG decides to make things skipable, they should do so for all difficult contents. not just for some parts. Or they just create a tourist-class and people can check the landscapes but dont have access to fighting-quests.

There is already such feature. They should read the wiki, stop wasting time in game.

This is game, if you can't complete something boo f hoo. That person does not deserve to see the conclusion since they did not do the quest.

[NeoBasilisk]

Take a friend (or even a complete stranger) and complete the BB with one eye closed

[kickman77]

There is already such feature. They should read the wiki, stop wasting time in game.

This is game, if you can't complete something boo f hoo. That person does not deserve to see the conclusion since they did not do the quest.

Exactly. I stopped raiding because of personal reasons, I don't cry my toons aren't in raid gear, or I didnt see Gothmog die. I understand its not something I can do or choose to do so I do not expect them to change the game to fit my playstyle.

Take a friend (or even a complete stranger) and complete the BB with one eye closed

It is apparently hard in a MMO to make friends. In the past I have suggested this and been hit with "I play solo only" "dont tell me how to play" ect. ect. But yes I agree with you

[Arnenna]

Exactly. I stopped raiding because of personal reasons, I don't cry my toons aren't in raid gear, or I didnt see Gothmog die. I understand its not something I can do or choose to do so I do not expect them to change the game to fit my playstyle.


It is apparently hard in a MMO to make friends. In the past I have suggested this and been hit with "I play solo only" "dont tell me how to play" ect. ect. But yes I agree with you

It doesn't bother me either. What content I can't be bothered with, is just that, and I'm happy to just skip it and go without whatever is behind it. That said, it doesn't bother me either, if that content is optional, or any content for that matter. I have a play style that means I push one character through as much as possible, and the rest, well, they can pick and choose what they wish to do, or not do. That wouldn't change, if they changed the game and made some content optional. It would remain the same, for me.

I much prefer playing with another player or a group. I find it a lot of fun, but I'm quite happy to push solo too, and usually push boundaries when I do. I understand that some players just prefer solo play though, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. It doesn't affect me.

[kickman77]

It doesn't bother me either. What content I can't be bothered with, is just that, and I'm happy to just skip it and go without whatever is behind it. That said, it doesn't bother me either, if that content is optional, or any content for that matter. I have a play style that means I push one character through as much as possible, and the rest, well, they can pick and choose what they wish to do, or not do. That wouldn't change, if they changed the game and made some content optional. It would remain the same, for me.

I much prefer playing with another player or a group. I find it a lot of fun, but I'm quite happy to push solo too, and usually push boundaries when I do. I understand that some players just prefer solo play though, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. It doesn't affect me.

But all the content is optional that was my point. You do not "have" to run the Epic Battles. If you want the reward of seeing the cut scenes and the end of the battle than you do. Its a content / reward deal. That would be like taking gear out of the raid and putting it in lootboxes..... oh wait.

Its like this I have made tons of suggestion threads asking for 1 thing... Draigoch scales in the Skrimish camp. Its not because I want them for the free.... Its because I can run Draigoch till my fingers bleed and still to this day have never ever won the scales. So I always say "Deed gated" because I want people to run the actual content if they want the actual rewards from said content. So to me, seeing the cutscenes ect. is considered a reward for running the content.

Just my opinions on it. I mean come on I can not stomach the Helms Deep battles, but I still run them at least once on each alt.

[siipperi]

This isn't about solo vs group. This is purely about completing the content. If quest is structured around having battle of helms deep, or battle of minas tirith why on earth you should be able to skip the battle itself. This is like completing Battle of the Pelennor epic by not taking part of the fight. Why should you see the ending. If you just want to skip the battle, just go to another zone and time has advanced to another part in story.

This attitude level of "I dont want to do something yet want to see rewards" is astonishing. Just go to youtube/lotro-wiki if you want to see how story goes without playing it...

[Arnenna]

But all the content is optional that was my point. You do not "have" to run the Epic Battles. If you want the reward of seeing the cut scenes and the end of the battle than you do. Its a content / reward deal. That would be like taking gear out of the raid and putting it in lootboxes..... oh wait.

Its like this I have made tons of suggestion threads asking for 1 thing... Draigoch scales in the Skrimish camp. Its not because I want them for the free.... Its because I can run Draigoch till my fingers bleed and still to this day have never ever won the scales. So I always say "Deed gated" because I want people to run the actual content if they want the actual rewards from said content. So to me, seeing the cutscenes ect. is considered a reward for running the content.

Just my opinions on it. I mean come on I can not stomach the Helms Deep battles, but I still run them at least once on each alt.

I'm the same as you, and in fact, I go as far as to say, I do the BB's in HD a lot more than once, because, promo points are tied into them. It's perfectly ok if a player skips the BB, that they don't get to see the cutscene at the end of it, that wasn't what I was getting at. I don't think that's even possible, as the cutscenes are triggered by completion of the battle. I just think if a player doesn't wish to do the BB itself, then that's fine. They should be able to skip it (and hence, not get to see the cutscene that comes with it, or get the points they would gain from it), and then pick up the Epic at the next available quest - after the battle. They can pick up the next book anyway, without doing the battle, so a couple of quests (its usually only one or two at the most, that follow the BB) to vector them to the next phase of story, would be fine IMO.

Any player, even a valared player can jump to the Camp of the Host and pick up the Epic for Mordor - even if they haven't even seen Bree. I don't see any complaints in here that those players should have visited Angmar, or Minas Tirith. When the game operates that way, it's a bit silly to start getting precious over one, maybe two quests (which usually involve nothing more than talking to Gandalf to move to the next part of the Epic) which come after a big battle. There are no rewards to gain in that, the rewards are inside the battle and you get them by completing it, not bypassing it.

It would work like this . . .

Speak to Gandalf, he tells you to run a BB. You hit skip, and miss the battle. You get no cutscene, you get no rewards, you just speak to Gandalf a second time, and move onto the next quest. Nobody gains anything, but they do lose the benefits of completing the battle. More players happy, more players playing the game.

[kickman77]

I'm the same as you, and in fact, I go as far as to say, I do the BB's in HD a lot more than once, because, promo points are tied into them. It's perfectly ok if a player skips the BB, that they don't get to see the cutscene at the end of it, that wasn't what I was getting at. I don't think that's even possible, as the cutscenes are triggered by completion of the battle. I just think if a player doesn't wish to do the BB itself, then that's fine. They should be able to skip it (and hence, not get to see the cutscene that comes with it, or get the points they would gain from it), and then pick up the Epic at the next available quest - after the battle. They can pick up the next book anyway, without doing the battle, so a couple of quests (its usually only one or two at the most, that follow the BB) to vector them to the next phase of story, would be fine IMO.

Any player, even a valared player can jump to the Camp of the Host and pick up the Epic for Mordor - even if they haven't even seen Bree. I don't see any complaints in here that those players should have visited Angmar, or Minas Tirith. When the game operates that way, it's a bit silly to start getting precious over one, maybe two quests (which usually involve nothing more than talking to Gandalf to move to the next part of the Epic) which come after a big battle. There are no rewards to gain in that, the rewards are inside the battle and you get them by completing it, not bypassing it.

It would work like this . . .

Speak to Gandalf, he tells you to run a BB. You hit skip, and miss the battle. You get no cutscene, you get no rewards, you just speak to Gandalf a second time, and move onto the next quest. Nobody gains anything, but they do lose the benefits of completing the battle. More players happy, more players playing the game.

but the post in question was basically asking to be able to skip the epic battles yet see the story advance which is why I made that post, I am glad we agree though lol

[Mar-Evayave]

Thank you. It is seriously needed. Getting a group for Throne is not as easy for me, and having them available in skirm camp (I mean its been 2 years since they were introduced maybe deed gate them behind the epic battles or something) or dropping more frequently in other instances would make alting much easier

What about adding symbols to the RT barterer? Right now hunters can get both their LIs from doing RTs. Wardens too, I believe. All the rest can only get one, as their second is a class item. And the RT items are bound on acquire, which really sucks. I'd love to see those open up to being sharable and if either a symbol or the class items were added. IIRC, the weapons are 50 brands? Class items should be the same. Symbol should be 30 or 40, considering we also have to get other crafting ingredients in order to make them ourselves.

[kickman77]

What about adding symbols to the RT barterer? Right now hunters can get both their LIs from doing RTs. Wardens too, I believe. All the rest can only get one, as their second is a class item. And the RT items are bound on acquire, which really sucks. I'd love to see those open up to being sharable and if either a symbol or the class items were added. IIRC, the weapons are 50 brands? Class items should be the same. Symbol should be 30 or 40, considering we also have to get other crafting ingredients in order to make them ourselves.

totally agreed
make every bound to account instead of bound to toon and add class items'

Like I said, I still think you should need to run content to get a FA (so even on skirm camp make it deed perhaps behind the epic battles) but make them more available

[Rimenuir]

totally agreed
make every bound to account instead of bound to toon and add class items'

Like I said, I still think you should need to run content to get a FA (so even on skirm camp make it deed perhaps behind the epic battles) but make them more available

I would like that.

While they're at it, add draig scales and cloak clasps deed gated too

[kickman77]

I would like that.

While they're at it, add draig scales and cloak clasps deed gated too

Been asking for that for a while now and everytime I make a thread the same people jump my bones about running the content I mean come on I have well over 100 draig runs and still never "won" the scales. What makes it funny is those same people saying "run the content" are the same people paying for Valar options to skip content. But alas, I always ask once in a blue moon. Hopefully the Dev is still reading this and sees these pleas and gets those things barterable

Draigoch Scales at the Draigoch Armor Vendor (Deed t2c gated) (500 marks 100 medallions each)
Cloak Clasp at Isengard Raid Vendor t2c raid deed gates (100 of those fragments from the raid and isen instances (so still gotta run stuffs to acquire them)