Bullroarer Update 23 Preview #6: Feedback Thread

[Schaijian]

Bah. The LI tactical legacies weren't properly updated for the new range in U23, so all the tactical classes were suffering. We'll do a quick patch on them to get them up into the proper range, and then follow up to see where they are.

I need to move those values over into the same chart as the rest of the core damage progressions so that they aren't so easily overlooked next time. :/

-Vastin

Please look at champions damage, too. It dropped to the same values runekeepers see at the moment.

[B749]

Bah. The LI tactical legacies weren't properly updated for the new range in U23, so all the tactical classes were suffering. We'll do a quick patch on them to get them up into the proper range, and then follow up to see where they are.

I need to move those values over into the same chart as the rest of the core damage progressions so that they aren't so easily overlooked next time. :/

-Vastin

Actually they've been falling behind since Mordor launch over a year ago, which is why those relics (and their later removal) were such a big deal. Happy to hear it's getting a fix though -- you might also want to look into Tactical Healing Rating (LI main legacy for healing) since that one hasn't been aging well either. Carefully optimistic my Minstrel will no longer hit like a wet noodle despite shiny dps gear!

Edit -- any news on what you plan to put instead of Shield Use Rank on Guardian belts?

[Hephburz-2]

Bah. The LI tactical legacies weren't properly updated for the new range in U23, so all the tactical classes were suffering. We'll do a quick patch on them to get them up into the proper range, and then follow up to see where they are.

I need to move those values over into the same chart as the rest of the core damage progressions so that they aren't so easily overlooked next time. :/

-Vastin

Still no response about landscape currency cap?

[SinordLoresearcher]

Hello again!

Thank you for changing Rune Keeper DPS, it's much appreciated!

I still have two minor problems concerning the quests of the Ered Mithrin line.

1. The slain hart in the quest "Flame in the Mountain" is buried underneath a giant pile of boulders near Stormwall, so it cannot be interacted with to advance the quest.

2. Completing the instance quest "In the Halls of Thikil Gundu" does not count for part of the "State of the Expedition" overall quest (Dori still offers the quest every time and is completable, but it does not count for the latter overall quest.)

Thank you! Can't wait to see what everything will be like at release!

[SinordLoresearcher]

Hello again!

Thank you for changing Rune Keeper DPS, it's much appreciated!

I still have two minor problems concerning the quests of the Ered Mithrin line.

1. The slain hart in the quest "Flame in the Mountain" is buried underneath a giant pile of boulders near Stormwall, so it cannot be interacted with to advance the quest.

2. Completing the instance quest "In the Halls of Thikil Gundu" does not count for part of the "State of the Expedition" overall quest (Dori still offers the quest every time and is completable, but it does not count for the latter overall quest.)

Thank you! Can't wait to see what everything will be like at release!

I would like to amend the second problem.

[Fraushgrish2]

Bah. The LI tactical legacies weren't properly updated for the new range in U23, so all the tactical classes were suffering. We'll do a quick patch on them to get them up into the proper range, and then follow up to see where they are.

I need to move those values over into the same chart as the rest of the core damage progressions so that they aren't so easily overlooked next time. :/

-Vastin

Damn vastin I think I need to make you a brand new thank you thread, but anyway I know this update hasn’t been easy on you and I’m sure the entire Lotro community will agree with me when I say we all appreicate your work and all the effort you put into the game. Just one small thing tho, and I’m not saying that you need to rework the entire pvmp system, all I’m asking for is to bless your pvmp player base by giving them this one change, simply increase the physical mitigation and tactical mitigation of creeps by 85,000 each. It would help a lot, it won’t balance pvmp, but again it would help A LOT

[SinordLoresearcher]

Hello again!

Thank you for changing Rune Keeper DPS, it's much appreciated!

I still have two minor problems concerning the quests of the Ered Mithrin line.

1. The slain hart in the quest "Flame in the Mountain" is buried underneath a giant pile of boulders near Stormwall, so it cannot be interacted with to advance the quest.

2. Completing the instance quest "In the Halls of Thikil Gundu" does not count for part of the "State of the Expedition" overall quest (Dori still offers the quest every time and is completable, but it does not count for the latter overall quest.)

Thank you! Can't wait to see what everything will be like at release!

I would like to amend the second problem. It seems that "In the Halls of Thikil Gundu did indeed advance, but it required me to talk to Dori again at Stanbalk, while the instance completion instantly teleported me to Skarhald. It's a very odd loophole.

[MikeA]

Please look at champions damage, too. It dropped to the same values runekeepers see at the moment.

Tybur already mentioned earlier in the thread that was a bug introduced into this build when they tried fixing the skill delay.

[Vastin]

Damn vastin I think I need to make you a brand new thank you thread, but anyway I know this update hasn’t been easy on you and I’m sure the entire Lotro community will agree with me when I say we all appreicate your work and all the effort you put into the game. Just one small thing tho, and I’m not saying that you need to rework the entire pvmp system, all I’m asking for is to bless your pvmp player base by giving them this one change, simply increase the physical mitigation and tactical mitigation of creeps by 85,000 each. It would help a lot, it won’t balance pvmp, but again it would help A LOT

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

[Siddharta]

50 ignots? Hello?




Also rare necklace and pocket both have 1 essence slot SAME AS teal one. Teal must have 2 essence slots slots, probably a bug.

[Dinara]

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

OMG!!! Thank You! Thank You! Thank You!

[Fraushgrish2]

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

Vastin, I’m gonna ask you a question and I want you to answer this honestly, are you the greatest human being in existence? Ima buy vip just for you BBY

[Saruman_Of_Numbers]

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

This is a sight for sore eyes, TY.

A band-aid to hold creeps together until the freep balance changes are done has been sorely needed.

[Oelle]

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

Thats great, that someone suddenly finds an issue in tactical DPS rating now, after years not seeing it (or simply handling it wrong (relics))... Will you raise it for Mordorlevels, too? Its not only needed in 116+ content, but for 106+.

And always nice to see someone listening.

Now... those landscape token caps... will they stay? What sense is there in having a cap for vendors thats reached before getting max rep with the vendor?

[Hephburz-2]

@Vastin please can you comment at all about these landscape token caps, I know I sound like a broken record but its a serious issue...

[Fraushgrish2]

@Vastin please can you comment at all about these landscape token caps, I know I sound like a broken record but its a serious issue...

Vastin works on the numbers/ under the hood type things of your class. He works on your toons stats and stat curves, but I don't think he deals with the economic side of lotro

[Tybur]

@Vastin please can you comment at all about these landscape token caps, I know I sound like a broken record but its a serious issue...

We have heard your feedback on this, and it is not our intention for you to earn tokens and not be able (have the required reputation) to spend them before reaching a cap. For now, the team is going to increase the cap for Marks of the Longbeards to 400.

[Vastin]

Please look at champions damage, too. It dropped to the same values runekeepers see at the moment.

The champion issue was a specific error introduced when we tried to fix the animation hitching issues they were experiencing - it has already been addressed internally and should be back to normal shortly?

-Vastin

[Oelle]

We have heard your feedback on this, and it is not our intention for you to earn tokens and not be able (have the required reputation) to spend them before reaching a cap. For now, the team is going to increase the cap for Marks of the Longbeards to 400.

Please. If there needs to be a cap for landscape tokens (no player sees a reason here till now), then let it be so high, that all quests combined dont hit it and you only reach it, if you do dailies for weeks after hitting max rep.

[Fraushgrish2]

We have heard your feedback on this, and it is not our intention for you to earn tokens and not be able (have the required reputation) to spend them before reaching a cap. For now, the team is going to increase the cap for Marks of the Longbeards to 400.

During NorthernM, I gathered almost 800 tokens while getting to kindred, considering that NM had 120 quests and while this expansion has 80 (numbers coming from a severlin interview) Considering these numbers and being conservative with how high the cap should be the appropriate cap (of course removing it will always be the best option)would be 650.

And guys...GO HOME it's 6:15 go home get some rest for god sake xD

PS. since you're all making all these last minute changes, will there be a br build 7?

[Oddessia]

We have heard your feedback on this, and it is not our intention for you to earn tokens and not be able (have the required reputation) to spend them before reaching a cap. For now, the team is going to increase the cap for Marks of the Longbeards to 400.

Thank you for answering!! Im glad the cap has been raised but why is there a cap at all? Like many others have pointed out, we earn a lot of landscape currency (far over 400) before completing an area...and as soon as the next area comes out all that currency is no longer used. All my 115 alts still have hundreds of lothlorien gold leaves, Silver tokens of Amroth, malledhrim bronze feathers and on and on it goes.

Im relieved to have it commented on, but still confused as to why

[Geremir]

Trying to keep up, unfortunately I let myself get buried under a bunch of streamlining work that - while really helpful on the back end - meant I missed a few critical things that slipped late into this update, like this tactical DPS thing.

PvMP cleanup is the other thing I'm working on at this very moment - making sure most of the creep ratings and such are updated to the same scale as the player values, more or less. I also am finally tweaking the keep boss HP to be different for the two sides, given that the damage output of creeps/freeps is highly asymmetrical.

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

On a different note Vastin, Drizzels and me are doing Thikil-Gundu and are on the 2nd boss Fror. One of us got feared over the carpet and the fight resetted, but the boss itself bugged out and won't reactivate. We are hoping that one of the GM's or anyone else could be able to reset the boss for us properly. It took us a bit of time already to get towards the 2nd boss and it would be stupid to start it over again, because the boss itself + his adds were pretty easy to defeat!

I wanna complete the rest of the run, so I can share a private video message for you and some detailed feedback in general about the instance!

Hope for some help shortly!

Sincerely,

Aegiys

[Seodric]

I am also looking at trying to get some more corruption slots for creeps. Won't be in for U23, but I'm hoping I can get those in soon. There really isn't enough statting flexibility for them.

-Vastin

Also a possibility would be to merge tactical and physical mitigations together into one, but more corruption slots would work aswell. Optimally would like for base stats to be STRONGER than the corruptions are though, as a newly created creep with no corruptions have no defences, nor offence with no corruptions. Also would mean creeps can have abit more flexibility traiting different stuff, since basestats still ok'ish. More corruption slots would mean creeps can get good builds anyways tho ofc.


- Please do check over all of the traits, and even offensive skills/debuffs for creeps. For example some of the Warleader Banner buffs/debuffs are still stuck back at level 85 values or something. Spider powerdrain is abit too strong aswell, as it seems toxin powerdrain might be stronger the more mastery you slot. Finesse base need to be stronger, first BR patches creeps had 21%, which was fine. Base armour rating on creeps needs to be higher, base crit def abit stronger, and crit rating from rank 6 through 9 still at level 115 values (with a total of 12500 critical rating).

Also no resist rating at all on my r13 BA with no DoF buff pots:

[NavarreBlood]

Bah. The LI tactical legacies weren't properly updated for the new range in U23, so all the tactical classes were suffering. We'll do a quick patch on them to get them up into the proper range, and then follow up to see where they are.

I need to move those values over into the same chart as the rest of the core damage progressions so that they aren't so easily overlooked next time. :/

-Vastin

Now that RK has been shown some love, it's mini/captain's turn for a dps boost. But I'll wait to see how those changes affect mini/LM dps before renewing my call to up minstrel dps.

At some point are you guys going to run a beta release solely to crowdsource dps and hps parses for all the classes, so you can get a good idea which classes are strong and which are weak relative to your vision for how the classes should rank? That seems like a logical step in the balance process.

[Fureo]

Hey @Vastin,

there are probably things which are more important right now, but just wanted to remind you that we are still missing a fix on the Minstrel traits which should apply a Hot.




Raise our spirits SHOULD get the Hot when you skill the thing in the yellow tree, it does not. Instead it is sharing a weird heal with Improved Chord of Salvation which should have a own Hot aswell if i'm not completely wrong. Both are defenetly not working as intended and they were asked to be fixed a lot when friendlyhat made the rework...


Some Update on that would be cool aswell

~Fureo