One big F for a Guardian

[zaboch]

F

In spite of so many bugs and issues with the class, this was urgent. Good job! Let's kick the class while its already down and one of the worst in the game.

[Rimenuir]

Im just gonna leave this here:

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...n-lower-levels

[FilmoreGraves]

Great sounds like becuase of one person moaning over, from what I can tell, is a non issue the guardians are being nerfed...nice job people. I have played long enough to know turbine/ssg does not need encouragement to nerf and suck the fun out of things.

Maybe the person that complained about it can get all the other classes nerfed too!

[HolyDuckTape]

Guardians have been waiting on fixes/changes for multiple years now, guards are literally the most useless class in the game, especially in this 130 cap and beyond.

Guardian red = dps hasn't even scaled up since 115 like what a total joke
Guardian blue = gets utterly destroyed by current content and especially by better captain tanks
Guardian yellow = gets utterly destroyed by current content and especially by better captain tanks, and woohoow a nerf incoming!

The funny thing is that 2 years ago guardians made a thread about Flash Of Light being overpowered in the LOWER LEVELS, yet ssg didn't listen for 2 whole years, now 1 guy whines about it on the new pvp server and it gets a nerf the next day, with it also coming to live servers soon. What a joke.

The most useless class in the game is now getting a nerf lol, where was ssg when guards have been telling on the forums how issue filled the class was these 3+ years?

Honestly i think it's a very good idea to nerf Flash Of Light on lower levels, cause it is indeed broken. But you're literally gonna nerf the whole thing... how about you fix the level scaling for it. Flash Of Light dmg is too low on cap level atm and now it's gonna become worse. Thank you SSG

[LotroVidz]

Guardians have been waiting on fixes/changes for multiple years now, guards are literally the most useless class in the game, especially in this 130 cap and beyond.

Guardian red = dps hasn't even scaled up since 115 like what a total joke
Guardian blue = gets utterly destroyed by current content and especially by better captain tanks
Guardian yellow = gets utterly destroyed by current content and especially by better captain tanks, and woohoow a nerf incoming!

The funny thing is that 2 years ago guardians made a thread about Flash Of Light being overpowered in the LOWER LEVELS, yet ssg didn't listen for 2 whole years, now 1 guy whines about it on the new pvp server and it gets a nerf the next day, with it also coming to live servers soon. What a joke.

The most useless class in the game is now getting a nerf lol, where was ssg when guards have been telling on the forums how issue filled the class was these 3+ years?

Honestly i think it's a very good idea to nerf Flash Of Light on lower levels, cause it is indeed broken. But you're literally gonna nerf the whole thing... how about you fix the level scaling for it. Flash Of Light dmg is too low on cap level atm and now it's gonna become worse. Thank you SSG

They are fixing 1 op skill that is WAAAY overtuned at low level range.. ffs stop complain about them fixing something broken.

[zaboch]

They are fixing 1 op skill that is WAAAY overtuned at low level range.. ffs stop complain about them fixing something broken.

And yet, all 3 trait lines have other things about them on the complete opposite of spectrum. How many do you want me to list per trait tree?
I welcome the nerf, it was unhealthy for the game, but I fear for the end-game Guard....as shattered as they are.

[LotroVidz]

And yet, all 3 trait lines have other things about them on the complete opposite of spectrum. How many do you want me to list per trait tree?
I welcome the nerf, it was unhealthy for the game, but I fear for the end-game Guard....as shattered as they are.

If you complain about them fixing 1 thing, how would they ever dare to start fixing anything? xD

[HotStuffs]

If you complain about them fixing 1 thing, how would they ever dare to start fixing anything? xD

Guess context should be explained.
For a year and a half (especially considering during Legendary Servers), FOL damage was like this. Reported previously, people said it was fine, despite protests from Guardians themselves.
Now, when the class has fallen from both favour and viability, this change happens because of a half-baked temporary server.
Final nail in the coffin of this situation is that change will be seemingly permanent.
And to re-iterate, don't mind the nerf. But there are a lot worse things on a Guardian that needs more urgent attention rather than a whimsycalities of a FOL.

[zaboch]

If you complain about them fixing 1 thing, how would they ever dare to start fixing anything? xD

the fine line between feedback and complaining is difficult to see sometimes

[HolyDuckTape]

They are fixing 1 op skill that is WAAAY overtuned at low level range.. ffs stop complain about them fixing something broken.

I'm all up for fixing it on low levels cause it is indeed overtuned but i'm not up for them nerfing the whole thing on every level including cap level, that's just ridiculous.

The way they have worded it and knowing ssg, they will most likely instead of fix it on low levels just straight up nerf the whole thing. Cap level guards are already trash and they have been pushed away from blue line cause it's useless and pushed away from red line cause it's trash, all guards got pushed to play yellow line instead and now they are nerfing our final trash but atleast somewhat useful once in a blue moon line.

[robbie1435]

I want to start off my post by stating that I am by no means an expert in the guardian class, nor have I ever been. I don't like playing tanks (despite the fact that I like to think all of my toons can do so), so I tend to stray away from guards and wardens.

I think there is a point to be made, however, that this guardian nerf is ultimately doing more harm than good. Why? Because everything that isn't at level cap is unbalanced. I've just returned to LoTRO from a multi-year hiatus. But even when I was still active, it was very clear that a lot of the changes made over the years have come at the cost of player characters being significantly overpowered while leveling up. Especially in pre-lvl 50 regions. From trait trees to big battle gear, from LIs to the new virtue system, to the Beorning class.. All of these things have, while permitting for relatively balanced play at the late- and end-game stages, have completely thrown off the balance in the older zones.

If SSG is going to make this nerf, then they're going to need to make it it's own update out of fairness to other classes. Either they rebalance all of the content from lvl 1 to AT LEAST 85, or they leave this single, insignificant 'issue' alone. In fact, I would argue that instead of nerfing any classes in response to pre-lvl 85 issues with balance, that they instead should be buffing enemies and bosses. This would be the easiest way to restore balance to the corresponding content.

Unfortunately I fear that, as always, SSG is going to nerf players characters due to an insignificant event that likely won't matter after next month.

[Braer]

That Army of One dude posted hundreds of hours of videos exploiting dungeon bosses with FOL on a legendary server. SSG didn't just ignore it, they made him an official streamer for a while.

The players have told SSG where all the class bugs are, but someone must be dropping them into a bin and denying a bug. Is there no management with any proven game experience?

Ignoring the one bug report because only one person has noticed the bug doesn't mean it doesn't effect everyone on the server. But 20 people feeling the need to move a bush off of a path and it's patched...

After CS confirms a bug and sends it on does the bug trail just disappear? Who owns it CS or another? I'd love to see a "no action taken" report. Someone needs to be doing oversight.


Edit: I've just looked at the thread linked above, noticed a name or two Cord has since removed - Keep raising a denied issue and get banned for trolling. Dumbing down the forums along with the game.

[pikeperch]

I have no words... Nerf a class because of a TEMPORARY LOW LEVEL EVENT!!!!! What next?? Beorning healing is so strong in the pvp server that they will probably nerf it and it will be completely broken and useless in level cap endgame XD I can't even......

[Vastin]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

[Aeviternus]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Hah weird, it's almost like you could gather valuable information from PvMP, like Burglar survivability being overpowered (still), and yet that somehow also flies under the radar... and has, for months/years, along with many other issues.

[Morellian]

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

This is fantastic to hear, thanks so much for letting us know!!

Does this mean Guardians' shield rank will soon have a use again? Pretty please?

[Belechael]

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

I play all classes at cap and I have to admit that among all of them the Guardian is the most neglected. The amount of redundant and/or broken skills, legacies, traits etc is staggering...

Very happy to hear that, Vastin.

[zaboch]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Thank you for this change, it's actually welcome. Guardian is still more than capable on the Tournament server so it's not bad at all.

HOWEVER, please scale up various things starting from 75 up. So many obsolete traits and bonuses that needs attention or just outright replacing.

[Omen_Kaizer]

I dont know anything about Guards, but since Beornings are being dragged into this:

Yes, bears are laughably OP for landscape content, especially low level. But Composure/Hearten doesnt make them OP as either tanks or single-target healers in endgame grouping. We can fix one without unnecessarily nerfing the other. Just do the old "Improved XYZ" skill trick. Make Hearten 4 pulse & 20s cd, and create Improved Hearten as what Hearten currently is and available at lvl 76 or whatever.

[Tiyafar]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Utterly laughable.
You just discovered yellow guardian after how many years of just forgetting about the trait tree, and only now due to it being strong on this joke of a temporary PvP server?

Will that update be on the same "level" as slapping focus costs on yellow hunter traps + Lingering wound? If so don't touch the class and rather leave it alone to continue to rot in peace.

[HolyDuckTape]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Thank you! Guardians will need a ton of changes to become relevant again tho and i definitely don't see them getting a main spot on t3 remmorchant even after the changes. Content itself is also at fault here. And ofcourse Captain tanks will always remain the best tanks and will replace guards 100% of the time if no big changes are gonna happen and if captain won't be slightly looked at.

[Thurinuor]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

+1!

We all have to deal with nerfs. But we will get buffs as well. Lotro benefits from this balancing work. And thats for what we asked for years. So I am grateful! Thx! <3

[Braer]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Go ask why Cordovan banned the very people who gave you good intel on this and countless other issues besides. You've been metaphorically jamming your own radar so you don't have to see or listen. The same people would tell you the LS servers would be a joke because stat changes would destroy most raid mechanics. That went under the radar? You can't exclusively listen to the people who are taken in by the SSG hype, the fact they are must surely question their input and at worse enable the less then thorough implementation.

A guy exposed just how broken the LS Moria content was but instead of listening you had someone try to stalk him to discover what exploit he "must" be using. Now ofc you are going to be paranoid because none of you are on the ground, in game, looking beyond your blinkered view point. It's always covering other's back not addressing issues in game and in the office. The default Turbine/SSG siege mentality had a recent rl parallel, protestors wanting a good thing for everyone yet seen by an imbecile as a personal threat to be bashed.

Thanks for talking with us though and being responsible. Now please list all the Guardian bugs CS has passed on so we can be sure you have the correct details to start from, no point changing a class before addressing the bugs.

[Bhorn_EU]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

Just fix Shield Rank Use, it's been beyond useless for three years, and possibly a vitality / morale trait somewhere, think it's the only class that doesn't have one.

[throinmor]

FoL was changed because it was very clearly broken at lower levels.

You can blame the ongoing PVP event if you wish, but the fact is that competitive play is very good at highlighting specific issues like that, which otherwise tend to fly under our radar because people tend not to comment on the low level game very much.

On the plus side, Guardians ARE due for an update soon, so I'll be looking at their general balance. I'm also going to be trying to improve the role of BPE in the game as a whole, so they will likely benefit from that as well.

-Vastin

I don´t use to write in forums, but due to the news of guardian and beo nerf due to pvp ( in line with all the recent nerfs like burglar and RK ) i will quit playing with my two vip accounts. You have been unable to really fix & balance PVP but still listening creeps and now other freeps in Bombadil server, that were angry due, mainly, to their lack of ability, but you still making stu*** changes, tested only once, and without listen the feedback of all the people in the forums. Every change that you change to fix pvp (and only pvp, don´t use cheap excuses ) affects a lot of things more, and you really don´t care.

We may undersntand the changes in that server, but really, seems that your compass is totally broken and you (SSG) are tottally disoriented.

bye