Welcome back to the Ettenmoors!

[Ginko]

Im here for its revitalization

Best of luck Orion!

[Brolad]

The CC reduction is horrible, it decreases all CC except for daze grace durations by 3/4 from what they currently are on live. Please reconsider it.



Also full support for what Spilo is saying below. Basically the whole audacity curve is insane.

[Spilo]

0 audacity creep




Max audacity with 36



With the tincture.

---

1. I'm really concerned about messing with incoming damage without doing a global adjustment do damage numbers across the board. Don't get me wrong- incoming damage has been a bloated and ugly bandaid for ages, that made Creeps extremely vulnerable to inc damage debuffs from Freeps (the higher the -inc damage defensive modifier is, the more it hurts multiplicatively when you're hit by an inc damage debuff). However, inc damage needs to be significantly reduced when you also globally reduce the amount of damage Freeps or significantly increase health/healing capabilities. In plain terms, max audacity Creep now is less vulnerable to inc damage debuffs because overall inc damage has been reduced, HOWEVER, this has not been compensated by bigger morale pools/nerfing Freep damage. This is going to be an absolute 1-shot disaster.


2. The commendation cost is... not at all reasonable. One of the main selling points (we were told) is that it's going to be easier to max out audacity, but right now I'm hearing it costs over 115k commendations to hit 36 audacity- in what world is this a significant improvement? If Creepside is going F2P, and you want to monetize tinctures, one quick way to kill it is to make the "gearing" experience this miserable (in addition with an additional mandatory comm buff in the tinctures, combined with delving pots, morale pots, fury pots, food, etc.), which leads me to my next point.

3. The punishment for not having maxed Audacity is unreasonable. It was bad on live, I'm pretty sure it's worse on Beta, which directly opposes the spirit of making it more accessible for lowbies. Right now, if my ballpark estimate math is right, a 0 rank audacity creep takes around almost double damage and dishes out 50% less damage than their 41 audacity counterparts from Audacity buffs alone. Not only did Creeps lose inc damage without proper adjustments, you're now increasing damage inc if you're not capped!

4. The CC reduction is way too high. I get it, CC isn't always fun, but to go from, what, 60% reduction on live to 92% with 41 audacity seems crazy. That's an 80% nerf to CC duration, meaning a 4 second stun on live will last less than 1 second on beta. I really am not even sure CC itself needed a nerf on live- chain CC perhaps, but this is beyond a nerf. This is legitimately making CC completely and utterly worthless.


Overall I'm not at all pleased with the changes- the impression of the "spirit" of the changes seems to have completely missed the mark.

[Neinda]

Thank you Orion for listening to and talking with the player base. You may not get 100 percent agreement (not possible) but you are willing to interact with the customers and not afraid of feedback. It is much appreciated.

[Cordovan]

Please do get on Bullroarer and get us detailed feedback based on your experience. I know we've got PvMP players who like to record video as well, get us that too.

[Hallandil]

Please do get on Bullroarer and get us detailed feedback based on your experience. I know we've got PvMP players who like to record video as well, get us that too.

Any hints on how to access the 50+ new monster skins added to the database?





My someone has been busy!

[Crell_1]

While you're reconsidering the cost of playing a creep, I would like you to reconsider the cost of playing a Freep. I already bought all my monster classes. I'd love to be able to buy a one-off per character for my Freep like I could for my creep!

[Neinda]

Question: Now that the proposed change out there is to prevent people from being in large raid groups, are you adjusting the Moors changes to be more small group and solo content? Not sure how the change to landscape groups will affect all of this. It seems to be changes working against each other. On one hand you are trying to bring life back to the Moors and raids again. On the other hand raids will no longer get credit for anything on landscape. Is the Moors landscape? Will raids still be possible in the Moors?

[darksaiyan]

- freeps get T4 equip and no changes to creep damage output... thank god, that the legendary weapons are still at 475
- CC is useless

tested on both sides a half hour

max mitigation phy and tact, 30% crit
with my RK i did 2 defilers, the first battle took a while no crit luck.... but in the end no chance for him
the second battle was over in under 10 seconds, essence of storm with 710k crit and then a static surge with 925k.... both normal crits... R15 fully buffed
against a BA I got a 130k crit vital target hit..... he was able to get me from 1,4 to 1,05m.... R15 fully buffed and full on tact mit... devasting epic con 600k

tested with my BA...
nearly the same damage output as on live... did a devasting hit with 220k on a champ with vital target...
then a warg an I tried a hunter.... he destroyed both of us, insane incoming damage and we got him to 200k left


again testing it with a new build

[Spilo]

I got cordovan's endorsement... watch at 1.25 speed for maximum rage effect

[Frappy]

I agree. The creeps have always lacked the tools to deal with the power of the freeps. This is an iterative process and I cannot do everyting all at once. If I don't make a stab at getting something together here then the we're on an exit ramp from monster town. I'd rather that not happen.

This is pandering in the extreme. I know most of the most committed players to PvMP are creeps and vocal about the perceived imbalances, and to internally justify man-hours on the necessary changes (in both directions) there has to be a return on that investment in terms of player engagement (and possibly in player store sales). BUT I disagree that creeps have 'always' lacked the tools. Over the years it has been a yo-yo based on level cap changes. Creeps are overpowered for a bit, then freeps are over-powered for a bit and the cycle continues. It's generally an upward spiral where first one side then the other screams the louder about thing being 'unfair'.

The audacity choice I would have taken would have been to scrap it rather than double-down on it. The analogy i use is a golf handicap. If you were coming up against a pro golfer, he's starting on say +15 and the amateur new player starts on 0. Audacity says the pro actually starts on -15 and tough on you, new starter!!! Or put another way a chess grandmaster could beat me with two pawns and a bishop, but audacity starts him with 7 queens and 8 rooks. The barrier to entry for a free peoples player with 0 audacity coming across even 2 creeps with 35 audacity (perhaps with an extra +15 from perks) will make PvMP unattractive.

Last comment is to do with the commendations armour currently being barred OUTSIDE of PvMP. This was a balance issue with the release of Gundabad having teal 446 item level gear was more than intended for landscape and a block was swiftly patched in (after we'd spent thousands and thousands of comms) -- and now that the PvE gear from the raid is item level 470+ teals that change should be reverted and we should be able to use PvMP gear anywhere.

[Spilo]

This is pandering in the extreme. I know most of the most committed players to PvMP are creeps and vocal about the perceived imbalances, and to internally justify man-hours on the necessary changes (in both directions) there has to be a return on that investment in terms of player engagement (and possibly in player store sales). BUT I disagree that creeps have 'always' lacked the tools. Over the years it has been a yo-yo based on level cap changes. Creeps are overpowered for a bit, then freeps are over-powered for a bit and the cycle continues. It's generally an upward spiral where first one side then the other screams the louder about thing being 'unfair'.

The tools are references to utility- debuffs, buffs, cleanses, defensive cds, etc. that Creeps have always lacked. Whenever Creeps were stronger, it was because of raw damage or heals (snares, bestial claws, VT, defiler HoTs), which is why well coordinated freep groups have almost always dumpstered Creeps, even when Creeps had slight edge with damage/healing because they used utility that Creepside has never had. This also has historically encouraged heavy FOTM/zerg mentality on Creeps who can just roll a BA/Filer and mash some buttons to do good work- it's not good for either side.

[XPICTO]

Audacity Changes[/COLOR]

Audacity has been reimagined and made more important than ever! Each side in the Ettenmoors now has 36 Ranks of Audacity. Free Players get Audacity through the acquisition of gear, including a new set of armour and jewellery available for ‘Commendations’ at Glân Vraig. Monster Players earn Ranks of Audacity by spending ‘Commendations’ at their Corruptors within Gramsfoot.

Because of the reliance and necessity of Audacity, we have reduced the cost to train Audacity from Ranks 1-24. The reduction reflects the need to move to Rank 25 quickly, overcoming the negative impact to outgoing damage and increased incoming damage. At Rank 25 Audacity, all players reach parity and break even with neither bonus nor negative impact. From 26 to 36, there are incremental gains improving the outgoing damage and reducing incoming damage.

Moving forward, you will need Audacity to survive in the Ettenmoors, and to augment that need we have added new tinctures that increase Audacity by 5 Ranks for 60 minutes of real-time. Tinctures be acquired for either ‘Commendations’ or Mithril Coins at barter NPCs found at the respective main bases. These tinctures stack to ten and have a cooldown of 60 minutes to match their duration. The tinctures are not bound by your Rank in PvMP.


Heal Tagging is Removed

Lastly, the practice known as “heal tagging” is gone. Players outside of fellowship or raids no longer earn infamy/renown or ‘Commendations’ when healing a player who defeated an opponent in the Ettenmoors. To get recognition for the defeat, a player must deal at least 2% of the damage to the target or be part of the fellowship or raid that defeats the target.

There is a known issue with the heal tagging fix right now that we are working and it may not be present in the BUllroarer preview uploaded in the next day or so. We are working to ensure that it is fixed for the next iteration of Bullroarer and certainly for the release of the next live update.
!

I havent got the time to try Bullroarer yet but I have 2 concerns so far:
1. Purchase audacity tinctures with Mithril sounds like p2w. Making PVMP free for all but adding a purchasable buff with real money - me no like. Honestly I am not a fan of the tinctures. Will the cost be too high or too low? As if it stacks to 10 the total audacity will be 35, so why bother purchase audacity ranks when you can purchase tincures with comms/MC./
2. Removing inf/renown gain from healing outside of fellow is good, but this might encourage large groups/raids running around rather than more solo/small group roaming.

I will provide more feedback once I am able to test.

[Saruman_Of_Numbers]

2. Removing inf/renown gain from healing outside of fellow is good, but this might encourage large groups/raids running around rather than more solo/small group roaming.

Orion seems to strategically be dancing around this when someone brings it up, not realizing that people just hate those lagout buttonmash fights.


This isn't Shadows of Angmar anymore..... the game just can't handle more than a 12v12.

[galrodan]

Orion seems to strategically be dancing around this when someone brings it up, not realizing that people just hate those lagout buttonmash fights.


This isn't Shadows of Angmar anymore..... the game just can't handle more than a 12v12.

1v1*

Mulatic
R14 Reaver
Arkenstone

[Nanganark]

Bullroarer U33.1 Preview #1; My suggestion and Thoughts

Freep-Side:

* Freep's Armor will get put into Inventory, after Game Crash and log out / back in to the Moor's. (without leaving the Ettenmoors).

* Ettenmoors aren't Free2Play for the Free People.

* Brawler: Rank-Buff isn't working for them.

* Hunter: Needs a Upgrade like Warleader Mobilise Skill 55% Run-Speed.

* Remove or reduce the log out lock from Freep to Creep side. (There's no reason anymore for it, because many of the players have like 5+ accounts to spy).

* Ettenmoors access only with level 135 or 140. (What need lvl 20s to do in the Moor's?; Nothing -> Training-Dummies are all over Middle-Earth).

* Armour/Jewellery Uprgrade prices. (Is there a price decrease possible? 115'000 Commendations only T4 without Upgrade is way to much; Upgrade from T3 -> T4 costs also 46'000 Commendations).

Monster-Side:

* [Tincture of the Sauron's Will] let the player use it with Audacity Rank 36 + 5 = 41 = More Buff Bonuses. Works on both Sides. (This Item let's player overcap the acutual Audacity Cap of 36).

* The Audacity cost is to high from 1-36 a player needs 115'000 Commendations. (maybe a little lowering this? or let Monster Player start with 24 or 25 Audacity?).

* [4 Awards of Audacity] items only for new Monsters. (All and good, but a little unfair to player's who've done the Intro already, don't you think so? Monster-Player, who've done the Intro should have these Items in Inventory).

@SSG_Orion i've sent you this already with pics on Discord. But Posting it here without Pics in the Forum

[Nanganark]

1v1*

Mulatic
R14 Reaver
Arkenstone

yea it's a truly sad situation

[Ksellos]

New audacity is insanity. CC just doesn't work. This completely destroys some of the classes.

[SingularityNow]

The audacity choice I would have taken would have been to scrap it rather than double-down on it.

Personally I don't care about freep problems but I don't like this audacity armor because before it, while there were 6, 10, 12 freeps out there that were god mode raider armor, the rest were in garbage and were killable. So you just killed the bads and then overwhelmed the good ones with numbers. After Audacity armor, all the bads because EQUAL to the raider. Instead of a bunch of 2's and a few 10's, we wound up with everyone being 7's. This seems like doubling down on that because with all these greenies running around the freeps are going to generate their comms in LOADS they'll get that full audacity gear way before the creeps will have their audacity ranks and the creeps will never catch up, the population is dwindle before that happens.

I don't care about Spilo's set up fights and his raider buddy killing him in duels. Those guys play for a week and then spend the next 11 months in another game. This game needs to be balanced around open world raid vs raid fighting and I dont see how making creeps grind comms to be effective when they're already underpowered is going to help anything. As a creep still questing for maps, I don't think maybe Orion appreciates the impossibility of questing as a lowbie on an OVERPOPULATED server. It's not's not realistic at all. We'll never generate the comms to be effective. If you think we will, you're not playing the game we are.

[darksaiyan]

so sad... did not even used my bubble

[Spilo]

I don't care about Spilo's set up fights and his raider buddy killing him in duels. Those guys play for a week and then spend the next 11 months in another game. This game needs to be balanced around open world raid vs raid fighting and I dont see how making creeps grind comms to be effective when they're already underpowered is going to help anything. As a creep still questing for maps, I don't think maybe Orion appreciates the impossibility of questing as a lowbie on an OVERPOPULATED server. It's not's not realistic at all. We'll never generate the comms to be effective. If you think we will, you're not playing the game we are.

throws me under the bus then agrees with me in the same breath- nice!

[SingularityNow]

throws me under the bus then agrees with me in the same breath- nice!

I still remember you and Adapting and others advocating what we have right now. And I never see you playing. It's not shade, it's just reality.

[Spilo]

I still remember you and Adapting and others advocating what we have right now. And I never see you playing. It's not shade, it's just reality.

What did I advocate that's the current state of balance? Creep brands? PvP gear? Good luck with the rest of anything else- typical scapegoat fantasy. Of course I don't play now, do you think what we have now is fun and good?

[SingularityNow]

What did I advocate that's the current state of balance? Creep brands? PvP gear? Good luck with the rest of anything else- typical scapegoat fantasy. Of course I don't play now, do you think what we have now is fun and good?

Are you saying you didn't want pvp gear? I thought you did. My bad if so.

[Spilo]

Are you saying you didn't want pvp gear? I thought you did. My bad if so.

I did for greater accessibility and less imbalance with PvE gear, but PvP gear isn't to blame for waht we have now- lack of creep utility, ineffective defense against inc damage buffs, and champions are why we have what we have now. ALL of which I advocated heavily for.