So the up coming new class is Corsair?

[Cenrandir]

But some people here said that Corsairs were bad people that don't get along with the free people.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV6Soflcabw

[theultimatekyle]

It wouldn't be a corsair if it's a freep. If ssg went that route it would be something like a Mariner, which are common in gondorian, numenorian, or even elf lore (think of earendil and elwing). Ssg probably uses corsair as a name holder in the files that ghyn was looking at though

[Elmagor]

It wouldn't be a corsair if it's a freep. If ssg went that route it would be something like a Mariner, which are common in gondorian, numenorian, or even elf lore (think of earendil and elwing). Ssg probably uses corsair as a name holder in the files that ghyn was looking at though

Also Corsar can be river hobbit

[TesalionLortus]

The initials he found are clearly Corsair but whatever they do I hope it's not actually called that in the final version...

"You're a Corsair, aren't you? My cat is lost! Would you help me find it?" would sound like a completely insane thing to say to someone known as a Corsair and it would happen in every single quest. Corsair, Haradrim, Easterling... these words have bad connotations in the West (and Corsair most likely worldwide, near all shores).

[SophieTheEnchantress]

Considering all of Mister Orion's recent work on the Ettenmoors, one cannot help but wonder if we could see the first new monster play class in 15 years (or so).

Corsair for the Ettenmoors and Mariner for the Free Peoples would make a lot of sense.

Looking at a map of Middle Earth, if Aragorn can bring Umbar to heel, he gains complete control of the sea on the west coast of Middle Earth. This would afford him immense commercial and military advantage against future enemies. Conquering Umbar would also end the schism that currently divides the men of Gondor and eliminate potential contenders for the throne from that region. Almost every story in middle earth begins with our character at a massive disadvantage. Perhaps we will finally take the offense in the manner of Alexander of Macedonia.

It occurs to me that the ocean off Umbar could become a Monster Play area, with corsair and mariner captains fighting one another for control of the sea. That would be daring and unexpected.

My understanding is that Eärendil the Mariner was Tolkien's very first character. He is the first half elf. He is the father of Elrond. He is the guy who convinced the Valar to intervene in Middle Earth and fight Melkor/Morgoth. If the writers are really daring, they could make mariners half elves. I know Radhrain will rebuke me for that last comment, and perhaps I deserve it, but this writing team often bends the background material to suit player desire.

There is much reason to hope for the future of Middle Earth. Do not wring your hands in despair, brave Lords and Ladies. Embrace possibility.

[Radhruin_EU]

If the writers are really daring, they could make mariners half elves. I know Radhrain will rebuke me for that last comment

Say my name and I appear...

You know there were mariners who were just plain old Elves, right? Cirdan's people. No need for to go making up anything crazy.

[theultimatekyle]

Yeah, elves, men, high elves, and even the elusive river Hobbits would all work as mariners

[Wolfhelm]

I really hope that they don't call the new class Corsair (unless of course they are a creep class), as Tolkien always had corsairs as bad guys, cruel sea pirates who haunted the coasts of Middle-earth during the Third Age. Tolkien wrote in one of his letters that the Corsairs "are imagined as similar to the Mediterranean corsairs: sea-robbers with fortified bases"

The Mediterranean corsairs were the Barbary Pirates, cruel and merciless murderers who terrorized European shipping for hundreds of years, robbing, murdering, and capturing men, women and children for the cruel Barbary slave trade. The piracy became so bad that by the late Middle Ages many towns and villages on the Spanish and Italian coasts were abandoned because it was considered too dangerous to live there. This doesn't sound to me like a good basis for a new class of free people.

Hopefully common sense will prevail and the corsair name is just a placeholder for a new class of free mariners.

[TesalionLortus]

Hopefully common sense will prevail and the corsair name is just a placeholder for a new class of free mariners.

They could also have an escaped slave, culturally from Umbar and adjecent lands. But in that case, the name still would need to be different of course, and that class would not even want to be associated with the word "corsair".

[Radhruin_EU]

They could also have an escaped slave, culturally from Umbar and adjecent lands.

How would that fit in with the rationale of the game? Really not seeing it.

[Wolfhelm]

They could also have an escaped slave, culturally from Umbar and adjecent lands. But in that case, the name still would need to be different of course, and that class would not even want to be associated with the word "corsair".

I don't think the class would even need to be from those lands, there would have been plenty of Gondorian people living along the Southern Anduin and on the West Coast of Gondor who would have been mariners. Pelargir and Dol Amroth were major port cities, and there were many other towns along those coasts which would have been inhabited by sea going people.

[Flaxie]

There were at least two Corsairs who were (kind of) good guys. Jajax and his brother, last seen leaving Gondor in a small boat.
If they make it home they could possibly convince more of their people to side with their honorable Free People friends, especially
as their fleet has been defeated and the ships taken by Aragorn.

[Kaeneth]

Assuming it's not a Monster Play class then I really hope they'd go with Mariner over Corsair. Being a Corsair would be very strange for the Free Peoples, but being a Mariner would be much more fitting. In either case I'm curious as to how they would turn that into a class. Dps/debuff options? Maybe dual wield/light shield and medium armor?

[theultimatekyle]

Assuming it's not a Monster Play class then I really hope they'd go with Mariner over Corsair. Being a Corsair would be very strange for the Free Peoples, but being a Mariner would be much more fitting. In either case I'm curious as to how they would turn that into a class. Dps/debuff options? Maybe dual wield/light shield and medium armor?

Well, looking at precedent, all light armour classes have been casters of some kind, which doesnt sound like what a mariner would do., and we already have 5 heavy armor classes in game, so I think medium agility would be a good bet.
Theres also no light shields in game with agility as a main stat, so shields are probably out. I'd imagine itll be dual wield, probably with a crossbow/bow for stats.

As far as play style, we already have a surplus of healers, standard dps, and tanks. What we're running low on is group dps support (only red cappy fills this niche right now) and CC/debuffs (we have LM, yBurg, and technically yHunter even though its not an effective class atm). So if theyre going to fill holes in our raid rosters with this class, maybe we can expect one of its lines to be group dps support and the other line to be a CC line? Kinda like a red cappy mixed with a yellow burg. They could even be a medium ranged class, with a healthy mix of melee and ranged skills.

[elvenes]

it's deffo not monster play because in the files there's also their new LIs. ain't no monster class that uses LIs, and if the devs ever even try to hint at the idea of monster LIs, you can be sure people will riot, the forums explode, and ssg's building be launched in outer space XD

[CloudCastle]

I only see vague references as to what this thread is actually referring to, but it sounds like someone mined some data off of Bullroarer? Honestly, if it is Corsair I'm disappointed. I hope SSG can win me over but right now Corsair is not lore friendly for a freep class and I can't see how Mariner will work in a game where 95% of your time is spent on land. I also think we have an overabundance of melee classes already. I think there's a bigger gap in ranged classes or caster classes, which is what I would have preferred to see.

[Plidak]

it's deffo not monster play because in the files there's also their new LIs. ain't no monster class that uses LIs, and if the devs ever even try to hint at the idea of monster LIs, you can be sure people will riot, the forums explode, and ssg's building be launched in outer space XD

Ye forums will explode for 2 days, then all go back to normal.
Have seen it before

[SophieTheEnchantress]

Say my name and I appear...

You know there were mariners who were just plain old Elves, right? Cirdan's people. No need for to go making up anything crazy.

There you are, Mister Rathruin! Please pardon my misspelling of your name.

As it so happens, I am well aware that many elves of the not half variety served as mariners. Yet, I cannot always deny the urge to draw forth a hat pin and lodge it in an unsuspecting behind.

[Arabani]

You are forgetting one very important thing-story wise there is only one Beoring/High Elf/Hobbit/Stout-Axe/etc who went through the events. So fitting in one realtively good and kind corsair is not an issue at all.

[TesalionLortus]

How would that fit in with the rationale of the game? Really not seeing it.

How? I dunno, but having an outright "Southern culture" styled kinda like a Corsair would only work if they do something like that to tell you they're the good guy harmed by their own people and seeking refuge in the West dedicated to fight evil. And then name them by their unique ethnicity or some pride moniker of a freed slave. Otherwise what? Welcome my dear Corsair, would you gather some apples for me? I can see it in your eyes, you want to fight evil! (and also rob me !)

There were at least two Corsairs who were (kind of) good guys. Jajax and his brother, last seen leaving Gondor in a small boat.
If they make it home they could possibly convince more of their people to side with their honorable Free People friends, especially
as their fleet has been defeated and the ships taken by Aragorn.

Kind of good guys in this case translates to proud plunderers and murderers (that's their profession/culture) but with more honor than most Corsairs (especially those under Black Numenorean influence), willing to strike back against the overlords of Umbar who would bring them to ruin under Sauron or occasionally help the good guys/team up with them, not just for personal gain but because they were sympathetic towards them. They're basically Jack Sparrow of Middle-earth... did Jack ever surrendered to the authority of a foreign king or his lackeys? Or was always to be trusted? No. Jajax nor his brother wouldn't work as a basis for a class walking around Middle-earth and helping everyone out with self-interest (and never harm anyone, or never steal anything).

[Atonu]

If only we had met one relatively friendly and rational corsair who had had his entire crew wiped out by rival corsairs and, upon hearing that Aragorn may soon be headed towards the very people whom he seeks revenge on, perhaps is in the market for training up a new crew.

Edit: One thing you have to consider is that a class in LOTRO isn't a job, its more like a skillset. Jajax training up people in the way of corsair fighting to get his revenge doesn't mean they will take to the seas as pirates. Its just if you wanted to get revenge on the people whom you feel betrayed you, its likely you'd train up your new crew in the skills needed to battle on the enemy's terms.

Also 100% its not a new MP class. If it was going to be, they would have made that clear. PVMP is a tiny subgame within a game, the amount of backlash from suggesting a new class and then limiting it to a tiny portion of the game would be inconceivable as a developer without making sure everyone was clear on that fact from the start.

[TesalionLortus]

If only we had met one relatively friendly and rational corsair who had had his entire crew wiped out by rival corsairs and, upon hearing that Aragorn may soon be headed towards the very people whom he seeks revenge on, perhaps is in the market for training up a new crew.

Edit: One thing you have to consider is that a class in LOTRO isn't a job, its more like a skillset. Jajax training up people in the way of corsair fighting to get his revenge doesn't mean they will take to the seas as pirates. Its just if you wanted to get revenge on the people whom you feel betrayed you, its likely you'd train up your new crew in the skills needed to battle on the enemy's terms.

A class/race can start at lvl 1 back in Eriador, how does it correspond to Jajax anyway? Besides... Jajax got his revenge already. What he and his brother want now is freedom of Umbar (which to them would still mean piracy, just not under the current rulers and something more like the Court from the third movie of the Pirates of the Caribbean -roughly) Aragorn would want to bring Umbar back under Gondor and finally end piracy and evil practices like that. There is no common interest whatsoever. There can only be a shaky alliance at best, as long as their goals align, but Jajax would still be a patriot of his own country and profession, in his own right, not Gondorian puppet to be installed in their client state. (Unless Aragorn has no problem with a client state that he allows to do piracy as they will as long as they contribute to his new rule where due... but I doubt that :DDD)

[elvenes]

it will work in the way the devs will make it work. I'm sure they have already thought about it, wether the "muh lore" crowd likes it or not

[Radhruin_EU]

There were at least two Corsairs who were (kind of) good guys. Jajax and his brother, last seen leaving Gondor in a small boat.
If they make it home they could possibly convince more of their people to side with their honorable Free People friends, especially
as their fleet has been defeated and the ships taken by Aragorn.

A couple of not-so-bad Corsairs for storytelling purposes isn't the same as making a whole thing out of that. You can tell that the Corsairs were meant to be really bad sorts by the summary way the story deals with them at Pelargir whereas elsewhere genuinely not-so-bad sorts like the Dunlendings or Haradrim slave-soldiers are treated sympathetically. The parallel to the real Barbary Corsairs is obvious, those guys were a menace for centuries, infamously ruthless, and only finally dealt with by full-on attacks on their home ports (much like Umbar needs to be retaken here to finally put a stop to it).

It would, for example, have made way more sense to have playable Dunlendings (as they were related to the Bree-folk) than it would for there to be playable Haradrim.

[Atonu]

A class/race can start at lvl 1 back in Eriador, how does it correspond to Jajax anyway? Besides... Jajax got his revenge already. What he and his brother want now is freedom of Umbar (which to them would still mean piracy, just not under the current rulers and something more like the Court from the third movie of the Pirates of the Caribbean -roughly) Aragorn would want to bring Umbar back under Gondor and finally end piracy and evil practices like that. There is no common interest whatsoever. There can only be a shaky alliance at best, as long as their goals align, but Jajax would still be a patriot of his own country and profession, in his own right, not Gondorian puppet to be installed in their client state. (Unless Aragorn has no problem with a client state that he allows to do piracy as they will as long as they contribute to his new rule where due... but I doubt that :DDD)

The same way Beornings and High Elves correspond? Ultimately its a game, so there doesn't have to a firm lore reason for doing quests, it makes no sense that we are both saving the world and delivering pies at the same time anyway. "Bandits are attacking us but here, deliver this food" Like I said, a class is a skillset and no matter what skillset, you'd need practice to get to a point where you'd be strong enough.